Author Topic: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Very Easy - Hard] [GRAPHICS UPDATE]  (Read 3176 times)

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Offline Strato Incendus

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2020, 11:50:44 am »
Nice job, Armani! :) That looks pretty much exactly like what I had suggested in the thread for new sprite ideas: black hair, red clothes, and a slightly darker skin tone than the standard white of default lemmings. So it seems like my "clich├ęd perception" wasn't too far off... ;)

I like the addition of the long hair, though! :thumbsup: That would require hand-crafting new sprites from scratch, obviously. The rest could be achieved by just using a recolouring scheme. But we can discuss the further details of that in the thread linked above.

Back to the topic of this thread:

@WillLem: I've played the first 11 levels yesterday evening, I'll upload my replays once I've completed the first rank. ;) So far, I'm enjoying it a lot! :thumbsup:
My packs so far:
Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
Paralems (Old Formats), a more flavour-driven one, 150 levels
Pit Lems (Old Formats), a more puzzly one, 100 levels - Let's Played by nin10doadict
Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

Offline WillLem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2020, 03:32:58 pm »
The record for Falling Forever is now 13.82 seconds! ;P

Offline namida

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2020, 07:54:49 pm »
Played some more...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

My impression so far: You've got some very good level ideas here, and the music you've made for this pack is incredible, but this pack's quality is severely harmed by the frequency of elements that are designed to (or at least, very obviously have the effect of) mislead the player, or purely to add length to a level with no actual solution value (some padding can be good, but there are cases here - "Worra Lorra Lemminas" and "The Unnecesserially Tall Pillar" in particular - that are blatantly excessive). Unfortunately, I don't feel that I want to continue with this pack unless / until these issues are resolved. (But on the flipside - I definitely do hope these things do get fixed, because I would like to continue with this pack - as mentioned, there are some good ideas in here, they're just held back because it's never clear whether any given level will be fair or not.)
« Last Edit: March 11, 2020, 11:53:13 pm by namida »

Offline IchoTolot

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2020, 09:28:54 pm »
Got around to resolving the Pandemonium rank. Replays attached. :)

Offline namida

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #19 on: March 12, 2020, 09:07:56 am »
(Earlier post)

I must apologize about the comment about the entrances specifically - upon looking at the levels now, in the latter level, either a bug was causing the 1 not to be visible, or I completely overlooked it. It also doesn't help that the direction arrow obscures the 1 either... but what to do about that is a subject for another topic (which I'll open shortly).

In the former, it's hidden behind terrain. I'm fairly sure in this case it wasn't intentional, but there would be no harm in moving the entrance downwards a bit so it's visible.

I do still stand by the rest of what I said - but that includes the positive parts! You've definitely made some nice levels, it's just that there's a few not so great ones in there too - as well as some that are mostly good, but have certain details that could be improved.

Since that does leave nothing wrong with Sensational 16, it's only fair I at least solve that one. It's a pretty nice level!

Offline WillLem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2020, 04:26:53 pm »
@Namida Thank you again for taking the time to play through the pack so far, and for offering suggestions to improve it. I really appreciate the feedback. Oh - and well done on the talisman solution for Escape From Crystal Mountain! :thumbsup:


My impression so far: You've got some very good level ideas here, and the music you've made for this pack is incredible

Thank you for this comment! I am primarily a musician, it just so happens that I've found an outlet for it making Lemmings levels. :lemcat: I might make a full pack of tunes for people to use in their packs if I get more good feedback on the music.

this pack's quality is severely harmed by the frequency of elements that are designed to (or at least, very obviously have the effect of) mislead the player, or purely to add length to a level with no actual solution value ( "Worra Lorra Lemminas" and "The Unnecesserially Tall Pillar" in particular - that are blatantly excessive)... I definitely do hope these things do get fixed, because I would like to continue with this pack - as mentioned, there are some good ideas in here.

I assure you (and anyone reading this!) that there is no intention whatsoever to be misleading in this pack.

You have already retracted your comments regarding this which is great, thank you for that; but just in case it's an issue with NL or the Editor I have attached screenshots to show that I wasn't using overlapping entrances in the levels you mentioned. I think it's just because the numbers were obscured by terrain and/or directional helper arrows. I'd suggest that the number could maybe go the top left of the entrance hatch, and be made so that it's always visible in front of terrain or other objects.

Regarding the custom shimmery/sparkly teleporters: I will make it so that these have a different colour for IN and OUT in V1.01 so that this is made clearer.

Regarding hidden objects: I will discontinue this practice from here on, except in very particular cases (if I'm remixing Lost Something?, for example) or if I'm hiding pickup skills in Christmas prezzies (which is an acceptable bit of fun, I think!). And, I will of course make the existing hidden teleporters in Backroute To The Future fully visible in V1.01.

Regarding the Lemmina count/size of Worra Lorra Lemminas and The Unnecessarily Tall Pullar respectively: I will reduce the size of both of these levels again, and will reduce the number of Lemminas in the former.

Regarding the Wraparound levels: I have made it as clear as possible in both of these levels that Wrap effect is being simulated, and have used invisible teleporters merely as a tool to achieve this effect. I'm not convinced that this constitutes misleading design, as the visible effect is that the Lemmings walk out one side and come back in the other. I have designed the levels in such a way that the effect is obvious and expected, for instance using the gelato terrain on both sides in the first level, and by titling the levels "Wraparound", thus referring specifically to the effect. Nobody else who has played these levels so far has had a problem with this.

However, I want you to know that I value your advice and feedback and I would love for you to continue playing the pack, so for V1.01 I will add a fully visible custom object graphic for these levels which makes it clear that the player should expect this effect to happen.

V1.01 can be expected once I've received some more feedback from the Tricksy and Pandemonium ranks, as there will no doubt be stuff I'll have to fix in these as well. Off the top of my head, I don't think there are quite as many of these potentially problematic elements in these ranks - certainly no more hidden objects or invisible teleporters - so please do continue with the playthrough and I'll be sure to consider/implement any further advice that you provide.

Offline WillLem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #21 on: March 14, 2020, 03:09:15 pm »


Offline WillLem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2020, 03:11:06 pm »

Just realised after watching Armani and IchoTolot's replays for the Pandemonium rank this morning that The Cherry Cola Conundrum is a great example of a level where a large number of lems is justified:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

:lemcat:

Offline WillLem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2020, 02:49:31 am »
Quick question for anyone who's played this pack so far:

Do all the sprite recolourings work for you, in either/both resolutions?

i.e. The Lemminas' clothes should change from Carnation Pink/Wild Watermelon to:

Cornfield Yellow when they're in the cursor/being selected
Medium Spring Green when they're athletes
Lavender Purple when they're neutrals

...whilst the hair remains Electric Blue in all cases.

And the zombies should be:

Skin: Mantle Green
Clothes: Catalina Blue
Hair: Locust Grey

Let me know either way, many thanks! :thumbsup:

Offline Armani

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2020, 10:38:37 am »
Quote
Save Us! - I've looked as closely as I can at this solution, and I can't figure out how you managed to stop the Lemminas from walking over the unfinished stackers... ???

Assign first lemminas a stacker and then assign second lemminas a stacker at the exactly same position as the first one. Then Second lemminas will immediately turn around since she has no place to put down stacks :P

Quote
Quick question for anyone who's played this pack so far:

Do all the sprite recolourings work for you, in either/both resolutions?

i.e. The Lemminas' clothes should change from Carnation Pink/Wild Watermelon to:

Cornfield Yellow when they're in the cursor/being selected
Medium Spring Green when they're athletes
Lavender Purple when they're neutrals

...whilst the hair remains Electric Blue in all cases.

And the zombies should be:

Skin: Mantle Green
Clothes: Catalina Blue
Hair: Locust Grey

Yes all sprite recolourings work perfectly for me in both low/high resolution.:D

Offline namida

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #25 on: March 19, 2020, 05:08:38 am »
Since WillLem has assured me the rest of the pack doesn't contain any more troll levels, I've continued a bit.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

These seem pretty good so far. I'll continue tomorrow, most likely.

Offline namida

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2020, 04:16:05 am »
Continuing on... (click to show/hide)

These continue to be pretty good levels. Some require a bit more precision than they probably need to - although this could be that I've just found really precise backroutes - but this is a much lesser concern than misleading elements, it's more a "nicer if it isn't required" thing than "avoid at all costs".

Offline namida

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2020, 11:51:15 pm »
And let's finish off Tricksy.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Well, WillLem's statement that there's no more troll levels is holding true so far - there's a couple of levels that weren't to my personal taste, but nothing outright trollish. And there were definitely some great levels in here, too! Let's see if Pandemonium continues this pattern...

Offline namida

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #28 on: March 22, 2020, 02:26:04 am »
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline WillLem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemminas (64 Levels) [Difficulty: Very Easy - Hard]
« Reply #29 on: March 22, 2020, 02:49:33 am »

Keep this feedback coming, it's really helpful. I've already made significant tweaks to make V1.01 a much-improved version of the pack.

If anyone else has any replays/comments, your feedback is encouraged and welcome.

All best,

WillLem :lemcat: