Author Topic: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design  (Read 5064 times)

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Offline IchoTolot

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #120 on: September 13, 2020, 12:11:27 pm »
Quote
The eyes drill holes into your soul.

Agree.

I think the best fix here is not to have them look directly at the player and rather at other lemmings or the scenery. ;P

Otherwise it seems excellent! :thumbsup:

Offline WillLem

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #121 on: September 14, 2020, 12:03:57 am »
Yes, this last new resizing of the menu cards looks great :thumbsup:

Again though, one row would definitely be better and it would be good to see at least one other logo before making any decisions. Otherwise, it's definitely looking to be on the right track. Great work!

Offline zanzindorf

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #122 on: September 14, 2020, 01:12:07 am »


Changes:
* Changed eyes, hopefully less soul piercing :lem-mindblown:
* Fine tuned anti-aliasing in a few places.
* Swapped the gold talisman to the front.
* Adjusted text, made it a little more bold, hopefully easier to read.

Attached are the following:
* Menu images which can work in the current version (tested in V12.9.4)
* The first five rank text images in gfx/menu are padded with empty pixels to force it to work in the current version (as Namida suggested :thumbsup:), but also included are the unpadded versions in the "Unpadded Steps 1-5" folder.
* Alternate rank images for "Rank 1-5" (as suggested by Simon), "Oh No: Crazy - Wild", "Original: Fun - Mayhem", and "Redux: Gentle - Lunatic". All of these haven't been tested thoroughly, so if you notice anything off, let me know. All of these alternates are in the gfx/menu folder.
* Separated layers of each graphic, including the logo. This is good for testing out your own font or text on the existing buttons.

Also, just noting, by submitting these, I'm not saying this is the finished product, or that more alternate ideas shouldn't be posted, I'm just posting these source files in case anyone wants to mess around with them, or try and fine tune things on their own. I'm still happy to continue making changes if needed. Having all the layers separated out makes collaboration easier and faster, so I thought It'd be good to throw it out there. I'm still thinking of alternate logo ideas like WillLem suggested, I just haven't come up with anything.

One idea I had was "NeoLemmix" text in the style of the Psygnosis logo:



I really like it's 80s rock band ascetic, and it's retro computing vibe, though such a design might require a completely different set of menu buttons as well, which is interesting to think about.

Another thought I had was something that incorporates the blue "home" sprite that's currently used for the NeoLemmix Editor executable, the one that's themed after the marble style home sprite. I'm not entirely sure how to incorporate that though.

Offline mantha16

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #123 on: September 14, 2020, 02:18:29 am »
those eyes are definitely less seriel killery

Offline namida

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #124 on: September 14, 2020, 03:16:13 am »
The NL editor icon is the exit from the namida_lab style.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #125 on: September 14, 2020, 05:15:32 am »
Looks good.

I'd like to second Simon's suggestion to rename "Step" to "Rank". I believe "Step" was chosen because of CustLemm, but "Rank" is the term that is actually in use.

Offline namida

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #126 on: September 14, 2020, 07:18:56 am »
Looks good.

I'd like to second Simon's suggestion to rename "Step" to "Rank". I believe "Step" was chosen because of CustLemm, but "Rank" is the term that is actually in use.

Hm. Tough question. "Rank" is also a term that NL has been trying to move away from, because NL allows more complex arrangements (eg. groups within groups, or packs that don't divide the levels into ranks, etc). But "rank" is still very ingrained in Lemmings culture in general, and the vast majority of packs do follow a traditional structure. Agree that "Step" isn't a great word to use, though.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #127 on: September 15, 2020, 02:28:34 am »
NL allows more complex arrangements (eg. groups within groups, or packs that don't divide the levels into ranks, etc).

If I recall correctly, the current handling for a pack that doesn't divide the levels into ranks is to treat it as a single pack with only one rank. Perhaps we could hide the rank card on such packs (and modify the layout accordingly)? But how is the former situation handled right now in the menu? I'm not sure of any packs off the top of my head that use this feature.

Offline zanzindorf

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #128 on: September 15, 2020, 03:29:51 am »
I'm not sure of any packs off the top of my head that use this feature.

WillLem's Amiga Lemmings Project uses that feature I think: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4947.0

It's organized like this:
-Original Lemmings
        -The Original Ranks, and a rank for the 2P levels
-Oh No Lemmings
        -Oh No Ranks, and a rank for the 2P levels

For me, for this pack, the player handles this on the menu by cycling through the original ranks if "Original Lemmings" is selected in the level selector menu, and cycles through the Oh No ranks if the "Oh No Lemmings" is selected in the level selector menu. It kinda acts like two level packs nested into a single level pack, which you pick via the level selector menu.

Offline namida

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #129 on: September 15, 2020, 10:24:24 pm »
Quote
But how is the former situation handled right now in the menu? I'm not sure of any packs off the top of my head that use this feature.

The menu flattens it into a linear order. Children come first, so eg if we have the following structure:

Packy McPackface
> Fun
>> Semi-Fun
>> Kinda-Fun
> Tricky
> Taxing
>> Super-Taxing
> Mayhem

...the menu would flatten this to Semi-Fun, Kinda-Fun, Fun, Tricky, Super-Taxing, Taxing, Mayhem.

This is actually part of why I proposed getting rid of the rank sign - because it doesn't lend itself well if situations like this were to arise.

Quote
For me, for this pack, the player handles this on the menu by cycling through the original ranks if "Original Lemmings" is selected in the level selector menu, and cycles through the Oh No ranks if the "Oh No Lemmings" is selected in the level selector menu. It kinda acts like two level packs nested into a single level pack, which you pick via the level selector menu.

I haven't specifically looked at it, but if both are marked as a "base" pack, this becomes a purely organisational thing for the level select menu, and each of them would still act as their own individual pack outside of that.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #130 on: September 16, 2020, 04:44:53 am »
In that case, I'd say change Step to Rank or cull Rank from the menu completely. Because most packs either use ranks in the traditional sense, or have no ranks at all, I'd say the current system of flattening more complex structures is probably fine. Many larger packs use ranks, so I think it does have a place on the menu in these packs. Then, if a pack doesn't use ranks at all, we could hide the graphic if we want.

Offline IchoTolot

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #131 on: September 16, 2020, 07:01:44 am »
I'm ok with changing Step to Rank.

I am against culling of the rank sign though. The signs add a big personal tough to a pack and I think a removal would also lead a bit to confusion among new players as they still are used to simply select the rank and press play.

If something has to go, I would rather disallow those complex structures than removing the signs.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #132 on: September 16, 2020, 08:44:27 am »
If something has to go, I would rather disallow those complex structures than removing the signs.

I fully agree.

Offline Strato Incendus

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #133 on: September 16, 2020, 11:10:34 am »
Quote
I'm ok with changing Step to Rank.

I am against culling of the rank sign though. The signs add a big personal tough to a pack and I think a removal would also lead a bit to confusion among new players as they still are used to simply select the rank and press play.

If something has to go, I would rather disallow those complex structures than removing the signs.

I also completely agree with IchoTolot here. No culling of the rank signs, especially since people spend so much time coming up with creative new rank names and making signs for them! ;)
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Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
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Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

Offline namida

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Re: [PROPOSALS][PLAYER] New menu design
« Reply #134 on: September 17, 2020, 12:23:07 am »
To be clear, I consider "cull the rank sign" to be utterly rejected at this point. I'm simply mentioning that the possibility of such structures, is what lead me to even propose it in the first place.