[REVIEW/FEATURE COMPARISON] NeoLemmix, SuperLemmini and Lix

[WillLem]

Since I first joined the Forums as a SuperLemmini user, I've had an opportunity to become familiar with (and an extensive user of) NeoLemmix and Lix as well. Existing as lovingly designed and maintained engines for playing Lemmings games on a modern PC, these three engines all have something to offer which is unique to them, and however you like to enjoy Lemmings, it's worth giving them all a try.

I've decided to write a review of each, highlighting what I believe to be the pros and cons. This post therefore reflects my own opinion, but will hopefully help new forum users to find a particular version that will best suit their current preferences, and maybe even discover something new as well.

It's possible to enjoy the game on multiple platforms, and I would personally recommend doing so in order to keep your general Lemmings-playing skills as sharp and versatile as possible!

NeoLemmix

NeoLemmix

NeoLemmix is a forward-thinking, feature-rich and popular platform. It is widely regarded as one of the best ways to enjoy the game on a modern PC. It features its own dedicated level editor, a wide array of helper tools, and extensive customisation options, all of which make it a facile and versatile engine with which to enjoy creating, sharing, and solving puzzles. This one is a must-have for any Lemmings fan!

NeoLemmix is developed and maintained by namida, an active community member who responds directly to feedback and implements suggestions where appropriate and agreed by the community.

Pros:

• Extensive and freely-available library of custom content, created and maintained by the Lemmings Forums Community
• Platform-specific Editor, allowing the player to create and share their own levels, packs, and graphics style sets. The NeoLemmix Player also allows customisation of everything about your pack from the levels themselves, to the logo and scroller text displayed in the menu
• An exciting array of objects including the standard Traps, Water and One-way Walls and extending to Teleporters, Updrafts, Lockable Exits, Zombie Lemmings, and more
• 19 Skills to choose from including the classic 8 and featuring Jumpers, Swimmers, Platformers (which build horizontally), Fencers (which mine diagonally upwards), and more
• Comprehensive replay features, including fine editing of replays in-game and "Insert Mode", which allows the player to perform actions and assignments alongside those already existing in the replay. Replays can also be saved and shared
• Fully customisable Hotkey/Mouse commands
• Advanced (and optional) player-assist tools, including Forwards/backwards Framestepping, Skill Preview Shadows, Skill Queueing, Splat-height Ruler, Direction-select and Clear Physics Mode
• Player records displayed for each level
• Customisable in-game graphics, including Cursor and Panel
• Low and High-resolution modes (only affects graphics - physics is always Low-res)
• High Quality Minimap
• A range of options to suit the Player to your preferences
• Optional online features to keep graphics style sets up to date
• Free and open-source

Cons:

• It's a very complex and nuanced engine which takes considerable time to get used to (it's worth it, though!)
• Frequent updates, whilst good for keeping the engine maintained and adding requested features, must be performed manually and can be a chore to keep up with (again, it's worth it!)
• Its focus on innovation rather than nostalgia can be off-putting for some
• No option for Timed Bombers
• No multiplayer
• Windows-only native compatibility (can run on Linux and Mac via WINE, an open-source Windows Compatibility Layer)

Latest version available here.

SuperLemmini

SuperLemmini

SuperLemmini presents an old-school, familiar version of Lemmings modelled closely after the Amiga version whilst implementing the lush, high-resolution Lemmings for Windows '95 graphic sets. Its emphasis on original-game nostalgia combined with its implementation of more modern features makes it an attractive option for those looking for a simpler way to enjoy the game.

SuperLemmini is developed and maintained by Tsyu, an active community member who responds directly to feedback and implements suggestions where appropriate and agreed by the community.

Pros:

• Freely-available library of custom content, created and maintained by the Lemmings Forums Community
• Modelled after the Amiga version, whilst adding Fast-Forward and Restart buttons and upgrading the graphics
• Represents original-game nostalgia, keeping to just the original 8 skills and a familiar, execution-focused gameplay style
• Replays can be saved and shared
• Simple, attractive and intuitive user interface
• The SUPERLEMMING level works at its intended speed!
• Optional player-assist tools, including Forwards Framestepping, Direction-select and Assign-Whilst-Paused
• Player records displayed for each level
• Customisable in-game graphics, including Cursor and Panel
• High-resolution graphics and physics
• Cross-platform (compatible with any OS that can run Java RE)
• Free and open-source

Cons:

• No platform-specific level Editor, so level creators must use a defunct NeoLemmix Editor which can be very clunky and unintuitive, and is no longer actively maintained
• Tsyu is not regularly maintaining the platform at present, and only makes sporadic updates and appearances on the Forums
• Limited range of options (although the important stuff is all there)
• No option for Timed Bombers (although Tsyu plans to re-introduce this feature in a future update) - SuperLemminiToo adds an option to play with Timed Bombers enabled
• Hotkeys are non-customisable (although Tsyu plans to introduce this feature in a future update)
• A copy of Lemmings for Windows '95 is required from which to extract the resources - you can get it here. - SuperLemminiToo removes the need to extract WinLemm resources
• No multiplayer

Latest version available here.
SuperLemminiToo is strongly recommended as a recent alternative, at least until original SuperLemmini is updated

Lix

Lix

Lix is a modern and attractive Lemmings-style game featuring new characters, the Lix, providing the game with an interesting new flavour. Its built-in Editor and Online Multiplayer support make it an ideal option for those wanting to play with others directly, or enjoy creating their own levels.

Lix is developed and maintained by Simon, an active community member who responds directly to feedback and implements suggestions where appropriate and agreed by the community.

Pros:

• Freely-available library of custom content, created and maintained by the Lemmings Forums Community
• Built-in Editor, allowing the player to create and share their own levels, packs, and graphics style sets
• Online Multiplayer mode, upon which members of the community regularly schedule play sessions
• 14 Skills to choose from - some familiar, some new and exclusive to Lix
• Comprehesive replay features, including fine editing of replays in-game and "Replay Tweaker", which allows the player to perform actions and assignments alongside those already existing in the replay. Replays can also be saved and shared
• Fully customisable Hotkey/Mouse commands
• Optional player-assist tools, including Forwards/backwards Framestepping, Skill Queueing, Splat-height Ruler and Direction-select
• Customisable in-game graphics, including Cursor and Panel
• High-resolution physics & graphics
• A range of options to suit the Player to your preferences
• Cross-platform (natively compatible with Windows, Linux and Mac)
• Attractive GUI
• Free and open-source

Cons:

• The original Lemmings games are not available for this platform by default
• The Editor can be somewhat clunky and frustrating to use
• No option for Timed Bombers
• No Release Rate control, so this particular strategic tool is missing from the game (there are other ways to regroup the Lix such as using Jumpers and Walkers, but these can be somewhat fiddly)
• Whilst similar to Lemmings in gameplay style, it's aesthetically different enough that some players may find it too unfamiliar for their liking

Latest version available here.

[ericderkovits]

Of course I have other emulators to play lemmings too.

1) NES Lemmings (using fceux) current rom L1
2) SNES Lemmings (I use snex9x-64, although other ones are availiable) current roms L1(european, japanese, USA), L2 The Tribes
3) SEGA Mastersystem  (I use fusion) (L1), Game Gear (L1), Genesis Megadrive(Genesis L1 MD, L2 The Tribes)
4) PPSSPP (PSP L1, including 36 special levels)   
5) small lemmings app(L1, L2, L3, plays Amiga versions)   

These 5 are the current emulators for Lemmings I have

[namida]

Lemmix should be among the primary engines listed, more so than Lix in particular which specifically intends to avoid using copyrighted assets and thus isn't ideal for playing the official games. If anything, it should be the highest on the list, as it's very accurate to an official version, while running nicely on modern PCs with little effort.

[Simon]

It's hard to have timed bombers as an option because it affects physics.

Assume it's a feature of the level, i.e., the designer decides whether the exploders are timed. Downside 1 is that exploders will have inconsistent/unexpected behavior between levels. Downside 2 is that 90 % of players will rage when they must time the exploders and cannot deactivate the feature player-side. I would be annoyed enough to write a script that passes through the levels and deactivates timed exploders.

Assume it's an option for the player. Then the player will be unable to solve the handful of levels where you must assign exploder within the first 5 seconds. It will not be obvious in which levels this is; the levels cannot be marked, that marking would be a spoiler.

Same reason will hold for variable/fixed spawn interval during play, this cannot be a player option, it must be a level option. Or just cut the poor man's fast-forward and don't have those fiddly levels in the first place.



The "obvious" reason for why Lix doesn't play L1 levels isn't so obvious to me. I don't ship Lemmings assets to avoid takedown notices from copyright henchmen, this part is obvious. Nonetheless, 2009 trough 2015, the C++ codebase contained code to load L1 and L2 assets, the user merely had to dump his copyright-restricted Lemmings tilesets and levels into certain Lix directories.

Supporting L1/L2 tilesets made sense in 2009: Matt and geoo designed tilesets for Lix only after 2011. Lix needed more tilesets than my early programmer art. NL wasn't around, Lemmix was awkward to use, and Lemmini wasn't popular on Lemmings Forums.

D Lix doesn't load L1/L2 assets anymore, even though I could require the user to dump them in. The reason is that I don't see the need to load L1/L2 assets: We have other tilesets by now. NL plays L1 levels about as close to DOS L1 as Lix would. And NL has the L2 tileset conversions.



Why is hi-res listed as a positive and unconditional untimed bombers listed as a negative? Both deviate from DOS/Amiga Lemmings 1, and hi-res is a can of worms on top during developement, so easy to introduce unintuitive solutions (Lix 2x1-pixel rule for solidity).

-- Simon

[IchoTolot]

Let's just say that quite a few of the pros and cons are really biased.

"No option for Timed Bombers"       This cannot really be categorized as it depens on the person if it's a pro or a con.

"The SUPERLEMMING level works at its intended speed!"   Again, this might be a con for some.

"Represents original-game nostalgia, keeping to just the original 8 skills and a familiar, execution-focused gameplay style"  The same thing here.

"Modelled after the Amiga version" This is only a pro if you actually like the amiga port.

"Its focus on innovation rather than nostalgia can be off-putting for some"     When you state "for some" then why it's listed purely under con?


Advice:  Rather than making a pro and con list - simply make a neutral feature list. As a lot of points highly depend on the user if they are a pro or a con.

[WillLem]

Of course I have other emulators to play lemmings too.

I think emulators can be taken as read, really, tbh. What I've done is group them all together under a category simply titled "Emulators." Rather than give links, I'll let anyone who wishes to play the games this way do their own Googling, as there are so many of them.

Lemmix should be among the primary engines listed... If anything, it should be the highest on the list

This isn't necessarily a post about playing original Lemmings (1991), it's more about playing the game of 'Lemmings' generally. This post aims to bring attention to (and compare) the platforms which are most ideal for that.

Assume it's a feature of the level... Downside 1 is that exploders will have inconsistent/unexpected behavior between levels.

How so? If they're always the same number of seconds, then it's perfectly consistent. Maybe I've misunderstood?

Assume it's an option for the player. Then the player will be unable to solve the handful of levels where you must assign exploder within the first 5 seconds.

Solution: have "Timed Bombers" and "Instant Bombers" as separate skills.

Same reason will hold for variable/fixed spawn interval during play... just cut the poor man's fast-forward and don't have those fiddly levels in the first place

There is way more to Variable RR than it just being a "poor man's fast-forward." It's a valid, legitimate strategical tool which can often lead to alternative solutions - great for challenges, for example. My solution to LEMTRIS (which holds the current time record of 01:16.65) is made possible due to variable RR. And it's no more or less fiddly than using Walkers and Jumpers to achieve the same thing.

The "obvious" reason for why Lix doesn't play L1 levels isn't so obvious to me.

What I meant here is that the platform doesn't offer the original levels by default like many of the others do, and even if it did, Lix is a very different game in many ways. To be fair, it would be very interesting to try out the original levels in Lix and see how they're different.

I've modified the OP accordingly.

Why is hi-res listed as a positive and unconditional untimed bombers listed as a negative?

Because, from a user perspective, high-res graphics are generally more pleasing than low-res ones, and the presence of Timed Bombers in a Lemmings game is something which many Lemmings fans expect to see.

"Modelled after the Amiga version" This is only a con if you actually like the amiga port.

I think you mean to say "this is only a pro" - possible typo?

"Its focus on innovation rather than nostalgia can be off-putting for some"     When you state "for some" then why it's listed purely under con?

Because this would be a con to those people. Just as all of its innovative features have been listed as pros, i.e. there may be some people who would regard the presence of player-assist tools to be a con which makes playing through levels far too easy, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be listed as pros. They are pros to people who appreciate the fact that they remove the execution difficulty from the game.

Advice:  Rather than making a pro and con list - simply make a neutral feature list. As a lot of points highly depend on the user if they are a pro or a con.

Fair comment. It took me a while to write this post so I'm not going to make any major changes to it right now, but I will absolutely consider simply designing it as a list of features/benefits rather than presenting those features as pros or cons.

That said, things like lack of Multiplayer or cross-platform Compatibility is a fairly widely accepted mark against any video game for which these features may be desirable, so - to some extent - these features can only be presented as such, i.e. you can't really list "No Multiplayer" as a beneficial feature, and not mentioning it all means you're presenting less information.

I may even present it as a review topic, making it clear that it represents my own opinion.

My main aim with this post is to help people to find the platform that's right for them, so I do need to try and sell each platform on its merits whilst also pointing to what some players may consider a detraction. I believe my post has already achieved this, but it could possibly benefit from further refinement.

[Simon]

Assume it's an option for the player. Then the player will be unable to solve the handful of levels where you must assign exploder within the first 5 seconds.

Solution: have "Timed Bombers" and "Instant Bombers" as separate skills.

Okay, you want the level author to force it onto the player.

Then people will rage how they must time, convert the maps by script to untimed, or just skip the maps with timed bombers.

The fundamental effect is that timed exploder as separate skill will generate levels that are completely against what NL and singleplayer Lix are trying to do, ease execution. The engines don't play chess either and it's not listed as a negative. (irrelevant no matter how this would be listed, I apologize) I'd expect untimed bombers in every level to be as good or as bad as e.g. the replay tweaker.

Because, from a user perspective, high-res graphics are generally more pleasing than low-res ones

Nearly everybody uses lo-res if they have the choice. And bad choices during development have a direct impact on users.

I wager that most Lemmings fans expect lo-res. You accept the lack of meeting expectations as a sole reason to list purely untimed bombers as a minus. Therefore I'm still baffled that hi-res-only is a positive for Lix.

-- Simon

[Simon]

The engines don't play chess either and it's not listed as a negative

I retract this and apologize; this irrelevant no matter how this would be listed. The point is: I'd expect untimed bombers in every level to be as good or as bad as e.g. the replay tweaker.



If you plan to rewrite with these points as neutral, there are many more such things that aren't universally good or bad either:

Pacing of physics changes that might require maintenance work from level authors. NL is more aggressive with patching physics bugs. Lix has left even subtle physics bugs in for 3.5 years for fear of breaking netplay in Debian that updates only every 2 years. That's no good either, and I should find a strategy to not break netplay for any old version whenever physics bugs appear.

Standalone program to edit maps or built into the game. I believe standalone program is superior, but it's not 100 % clear-cut. It's extra work for the devs to maintain two programs in two languages/over two different gui libraries that can't easily share code.

NL needs proprietary tooling to build itself, Delphi. The Java Runtime is beh as a dependency, can't just ship the game binary and DLLs, always have to tell people to install Java. And D is uncommon, hard to encourage people to send patches for Lix.

NL is the most popular and that's usually good enough a reason to learn it first. You get more content, and more people will play your own content later.

A good bunch of people will look at Lix and see that it's not Lemmings and that's already enough deterrent. Today, with so many forms of entertainment competing, the survival instinct tells us to, for each option, quickly find something that we don't like about it, and then ditch the option without looking back.

-- Simon

[namida]

NL needs proprietary tooling to build itself, Delphi

I would note that there is a free edition of Delphi available nowdays. I haven't specifically checked if NL will compile on it; but the version being used for NL development currently is only one minor version behind the latest free edition (10.3 vs 10.4) and I don't believe it uses any features that the lower-tier versions do not support; there also would be no licencing issues with using the free edition as far as I can tell. Longer-term I do hope to port to Lazarus (open source Delphi clone, though code compatibility is not perfect in particular due to RTL differences), or even better, rewrite in something more mainstream (most likely C#), but realistically that is likely a long way away, if it ever happens at all - it would be more likely that I would look at that after everything else is "final", so that I'm only reproducing known existing features, not having to leave room for new ones.

[WillLem]

Okay, you want the level author to force it onto the player.

Not necessarily. Player-side option would be most ideal, but - as you've correctly pointed out - logistically difficult to implement (but not impossible).

Therefore I'm still baffled that hi-res-only is a positive for Lix.

It's a positive because it makes for an attractive interface. Take it as a compliment!

I retract this and apologize; this irrelevant no matter how this would be listed. The point is: I'd expect untimed bombers in every level to be as good or as bad as e.g. the replay tweaker.

Understood, no worries. It's a valid point, worth making.

If you plan to rewrite with these points as neutral

I've actually re-written the OP as a review, stating clearly that I'm expressing my own opinions about the engines, which other users may or may not find useful in their own quest to seek a Lemmings-playing engine which fulfils their own preferences. A neutral stating-of-the-facts is not really my style, I'm too darn opinionated

[WillLem]

I've opted to re-write this topic as a review, stating my own opinions on the three engines, since I think this is more useful than attempting to present the features without any bias at all: players will either agree with what I've written, or not, and they will either have a similar view to me, or not. Either way, hopefully it will help people to figure out which engine is best for which features/gameplay style/etc.

All have their merits, that's the bottom line. I have all 3 side by side on my desktop, and I love them

[namida]

(NeoLemmix) Windows-only compatibility

This is not completely true. It's only natively built for Windows, but it is possible to run on Mac and Linux via a tool called WINE (which is similar to, but on a technical level not actually, an emulator). Hopefully an actual Linux build will exist in the future (Mac is probably not going to happen, sadly - my Mac Mini is now too outdated to run the newest Mac OS, and I have zero intention of buying a new Mac anytime soon).

[WillLem]

It's only natively built for Windows, but it is possible to run on Mac and Linux via a tool called WINE (which is similar to, but on a technical level not actually, an emulator)

Updated the OP accordingly, and provided a link to WINE.

[Dullstar]

Because, from a user perspective, high-res graphics are generally more pleasing than low-res ones

Nearly everybody uses lo-res if they have the choice. And bad choices during development have a direct impact on users.

I'd disagree with both of these claims. Ideal graphics res depends on the art style a lot - compare the art of Celeste and Hollow Knight, for example. Celeste's art is intentionally low-res, while Hollow Knight's art is much higher res. The resolution of those games is part of their visual identity. Hollow Knight would be a very different-looking game in low-res, and Celeste would be a very different-looking game in high res. The change would probably not improve either of them - at the very least, they'd lose their current visual identity.

Most, if not all high-res modern-ish lemmings engines take their graphics from the Windows 95 version, which I'd say is a little unfortunate, considering it's not a particularly well-done remaster. The Mac version also uses high-res graphics, but they're much better looking. I should do a proper review of what it is I don't like about WinLemm's graphics sometime.

The problem with slapping high-res graphics on top of an existing engine in a game where individual pixels matter is that it creates a mismatch between low-res graphics and high-res physics. And, of course, upscaling well is hard when the entire library of graphics is low-res and nobody wants to redraw them in high-res, especially when the game, for many of us, has a low-res visual identity.

Edit Simon: Java discussion moved to: Dullstar's Java Rant

[WillLem]

Ideal graphics res depends on the art style a lot

Yes, this is definitely true.

However, take a game like Mario: traditionally, it's a low-res game. However, the game and its artwork are undeniably better in high-res. New SMB is exactly what the franchise needed, IMHO; now, those who prefer low-res Mario can moan about how it's all gone cartoony (which allows them to love the old-school stuff even more), and those who prefer high-res Mario can, well, enjoy high-res Mario! It's a WIN-WIN.

The examples you gave, as you say, rely on their resolution (to some extent) for their identity, so that's a slightly different argument. I generally agree with you here by the way, resolution definitely matters one way or the other, but it's another of those things that comes down to personal preference, so it's basically impossible to quantify meaningfully. Case in point...

Most, if not all high-res modern-ish lemmings engines take their graphics from the Windows 95 version, which I'd say is a little unfortunate, considering it's not a particularly well-done remaster. The Mac version also uses high-res graphics, but they're much better looking

I disagree. The Mac graphics look...wierd, to be honest. They're a different shape to the originals, the Fire exit looks more like a hamster than a demon (likely intentional, tbf) and it's almost too high-res. Lemmings benefits from being pixellated to some extent.

The problem with slapping high-res graphics on top of an existing engine in a game where individual pixels matter is that it creates a mismatch between low-res graphics and high-res physics

As the only NL user who actually plays in high-res: I'd say that this makes absolutely no difference to the gameplay whatsoever. Even with fine-detail stuff like Bash-cancel staircases, splat height falls, single-Builder-brick stuff and anything else you could care to mention, it all works perfectly fine in high-res. I rarely, if ever, get a sense that there is any kind of separation between what I'm seeing vs. what's going on under the hood.

Edit Simon: Java discussion moved to: Dullstar's Java Rant