Author Topic: [NeoLemmix] SubLems  (Read 1215 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Colorful Arty

  • Posts: 797
  • You are so loved!
    • View Profile
    • Colorful Arty's Youtube Page
[NeoLemmix] SubLems
« on: June 07, 2020, 08:14:45 pm »
Looking for a relatively easy pack to ease you into the world of custom Lemmings levels? Want something with a similar flavor to the original Lemmings? Looking to get better at solving levels and picking up tricks? This is the pack for you.

This is SubLems! One of the first levelpacks I ever made, and it's finally been ported to the new formats of NeoLemmix! This pack was originally made for SuperLemmini, back when NeoLemmix was still in its infancy. By popular demand, I ported it to NeoLemmix with some issues, since a few levels couldn't be ported so new ones had to be made. Porting to the new formats also took time, since many levels were scrapped for various reasons. But now it's complete, and I think the result is worth it.

SubLems contains 110 levels spread across 6 ranks with 10 levels in the first rank and 20 in each rank after that. The game starts off incredibly easy, similar to that of the original Lemmings, and steadily increases in difficulty as the pack goes on. The learning curve is steeper than the original game, and by the end it definitely exceeds the difficulty of the original game, but it's probably one of the easier packs out there, so it should be beginner-friendly. The levels should also teach you some of the tricks needed to solve the really tough custom levels. None of the NeoLemmix-exclusive skills are used in these levels, and the only NeoLemmix-exclusive objects that are used are pickup skills, so this pack should give you an experience close to the original game.

This port also features several new levels, since many levels were replaced either because I didn't like them, or they had too many backroutes, so this pack will be a new experience even for people who played a previous version! :)

Download SubLems here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/quuy050td1edjky/SubLems.zip?dl=1

Each level in this pack has its own unique music. All music should be safe to use for Youtube videos; please let me know if one of the tracks causes a copyright issue, and I'll try to change it for a future update.

Here's a breakdown of each rank:


Newbie

This is the tutorial rank! I don't count this as one of the official ranks in the game, it's here to teach you the basic mechanics of the game, such as the 8 main skills and the release rate. I recommend playing this rank even if you already know the basics, because the levels should hopefully be pretty, the music is nice, they're really short, and at least one of the levels in this rank returns in a future rank. ;)


Scaling Mt. Jerry


Sweet

The first official rank! Sweet is full of easy, inviting levels for you to savor. Taking the skills you learned in Newbie, you get to run wild with them and solve simple levels in this rank. The levels here are meant to be pretty and easy, although they do get a bit more challenging at the end. You will also learn some more advanced basics in this rank, keeping with the tutorial theme of the previous rank in a way. Enjoy the eye candy as put what you've learned to the test.


Tri-color masterpiece


Scary

While the levels start out relatively simple, similar to the Sweet rank, this is where the challenge starts to come in. The environments you face are harsher and frightening, traps start popping up in abundance, skills are getting more limited, and some levels won't have open-ended solutions, forcing you to solve real puzzles now. You'll also have to start thinking creatively with the skills you're given.


It's a hot one


Chaotic

And now, the chaos begins. Levels get even trickier in this rank, and multitasking will become mandatory. You'll have to act quick to save your Lemmings from unfortunate demises, and the puzzles get trickier still. Expect your brain to start working a bit harder in this rank, and the pause button will become your best friend as well. Also, keep a close eye on that clock, because from here on out, you'll have to work fast...


The legendary bash of Crystal Cove


Insane

This is where the gloves come off, and the puzzles aren't holding back anymore. Time is getting really tight. The levels are getting meaner in design. Skills are highly restricted. Some very advanced tricks will be needed. Even the music is getting more frantic. Your brain will be kicked into overdrive in this rank, and by the end, you'll have gotten your first glimpse into hell.


Blame it on the chain


Hellish

Here we are: the final rank. Here, the puzzles hold nothing back, and everything you've learned up until now will be needed to solve these levels. Even experts may have trouble with some of these levels. I've saved the most devious puzzles for last, and the most epic music as well. Prove yourself here, and you'll be able to take on some of the tougher levelpacks out there. But first, you'll have to plunge into the nightmare that is hell...


Labyrinth of Lucifer
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Strato Incendus

  • He who usually only makes it up to rank two
  • Posts: 1116
  • #Team SliderFor20thNeoLemmixSkill
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2020, 09:12:44 am »
YES! Thanks for putting in the effort to convert this, Arty! :thumbsup: You know how much I admire the linear difficulty curve of this pack, and it's definitely the type of beginner-to-intermediate-level content that New Formats so desperately needs, in order to bridge the gap from the very easy packs to the ridiculously hard ones.

I might have to try beating this pack again in New Formats now, and see whether any of the levels have changed.

Just one question: Is the Retro rank still a thing in this version?
My packs so far:
Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
Paralems (Old Formats), a more flavour-driven one, 150 levels
Pit Lems (Old Formats), a more puzzly one, 100 levels - Let's Played by nin10doadict
Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

Offline Colorful Arty

  • Posts: 797
  • You are so loved!
    • View Profile
    • Colorful Arty's Youtube Page
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2020, 01:57:22 pm »
Thanks for the kind words Strato!

No, the Retro rank is not present in this version, for two main reasons.

1) I didn't really like that rank; there were really only two levels that come to mind that I actually think are good.
2) That rank uses the new skills, and I want this pack to only use the original 8.

That said, SubLems may be getting a DLC rank or two in the future. If I end up using new skills in the DLC rank, I'll bring back the Retro rank as well. ;)
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Strato Incendus

  • He who usually only makes it up to rank two
  • Posts: 1116
  • #Team SliderFor20thNeoLemmixSkill
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2020, 04:44:29 pm »
Ah, good to know - I remember some of the Retro levels being the most difficult ones in the pack. But I hadn't consciously noticed that it was the only rank containing NeoLemmix skills. Of course, I know the pack was originally made for SuperLemmini, and thus didn't include any new skills at all - I just thought this had also been true for Retro.

I'm already curious about the bonus DLC rank! :thumbsup:
My packs so far:
Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
Paralems (Old Formats), a more flavour-driven one, 150 levels
Pit Lems (Old Formats), a more puzzly one, 100 levels - Let's Played by nin10doadict
Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2020, 08:47:23 pm »
I just tried the pack last night and I’m already on chaotic 3 Death Chamber which has stumped me for now. It’s a great pack! And very good for someone like me who’s never beaten a level pack or even the original lemmings for that matter.. kinda embarrassing actually..
Edit: So, I solved Chaotic 3 but I think this may be a backroute but I'm not positive... and I want to know!
« Last Edit: June 17, 2020, 10:38:12 pm by Shmolem »

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2020, 10:36:09 pm »
I just tried the pack last night and I’m already on chaotic 3 Death Chamber which has stumped me for now. It’s a great pack! And very good for someone like me who’s never beaten a level pack or even the original lemmings for that matter.. kinda embarrassing actually..

No need to be ashamed. There's no requirement that the original games must be played and beaten before taking on custom level packs. It's definitely recommended, but not mandatory. Most of the people in the forums here have at least beaten L1 and ONML and hence are armed with knowledge of the game mechanics to take on custom level packs, but this is by no means required. Most of the new skills and objects in Neolemmix were borrowed from the other games besides L1 and ONML (e.g, fencer and platformer from L2: The Tribes, teleporters from Lemmings Revolution), but there are some skills and objects that aren't taken from any of the original games (e.g, disarmer and splat/anti-splat pads), and so the original games aren't going to be much help with familiarizing you with the new things. For this, we point you to the Neolemmix Tutorial Pack that Icho is currently making, where it teaches you what the new skills and objects in Neolemmix do.

You're already more than halfway through Arty's pack, and I'm in agreement that you're doing really well in this pack. I originally played this pack when Arty made it for Superlemmini. In that engine, only the classic 8 skills are used and hence just L1 stuff. I may tackle this pack for Neolemmix sometime in the future, but as I have already beaten this pack on Superlemmini, I most likely will not get around to doing so for a while. There's definitely some difficult levels ahead of where you're currently at, but the pack as a whole has a nice difficulty curve, where it starts off very easy and gets harder as you progress, but the levels aren't hard in the extreme. Really, the only level I got stuck on the longest in this pack was Hellish 16. In addition, as you have definitely seen, so many of the levels in the pack are really well-designed aesthetically. They're really amazing to look at.

Hints for Chaotic 3 (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2020, 10:41:56 pm »
Thanks kaywhyn! I think I did it the intended way based on what you said in your hint but you can download my replay I put in the post above just to see.

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2020, 10:58:27 pm »
Thanks kaywhyn! I think I did it the intended way based on what you said in your hint but you can download my replay I put in the post above just to see.

Yea pretty much the same way I did it, except

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2020, 11:14:07 pm »
I find chaotic to be strange, like after level 3 I easily breezed through levels and now I’m on level 11

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2020, 11:36:55 pm »
That's the tricky thing about level packs in that it's often very difficult to judge the difficulty of levels on your own, which is why feedback for the level pack author is helpful. Any input you provide will certainly be helpful for Arty to patch up backroutes and rearrange levels according to what most perceived as too difficult for its position or vice versa. I myself am not speaking from experience, as I have never made any levelpacks and I most likely don't intend to, as I am much better at solving levels than making them, but this is what I have observed from years of visiting this forum and playing and beating so many custom level packs. Unless the goal is to stump players with hard levels one after another and risk frustrating the player and possibly having the person give up early on the pack long before completing it, expect some easy breather levels in between the hard levels as well. Also remember that having skills leftover is not necessarily a bad thing in a pack like Sublems. Sometimes, the author intends the levels as anyway you want ones, i.e, find any solution that works, especially in the very early ranks. They're much rarer in later ranks, where leftover skills generally means it's a backroute, but not always. The any way you want levels in later ranks still show up on occasion. There were plenty of them in L1 in all the ranks.

Keep it up Shmolem! You'll have this pack beat in no time. :)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2020, 12:24:16 am »
There we go, you were right about people having hard time judging difficulty of levels because I just got through Chaotic 11 and then level 12 hits me and I have no clue where to even start with solving it.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2020, 03:42:26 am »
As this example pack shows, the difficulty of individual levels tends to be wobbly and jump all over the place, even within the ranks. In general, levels in the later ranks tend to be harder than the ones in the earlier ranks, but that doesn't mean all levels in the later ranks are hard ones. There can still be easy levels in a late rank and then all of a sudden you get hit with a level with a huge spike in difficulty, and similarly a rank can begin with several hard ones and then all of a sudden the next one is much easier. While early ranks tend to have easy levels, there can still be at least one hard level. Another common thing you will usually see is that levels at the beginning of the next rank tend to be easier than the levels at the end of the previous rank. Not always, but it's pretty common to see this.

Yes, I absolutely agree with you that Chaotic 12 is indeed a hard level. As a matter of fact, I don't think this level was originally part of the pack when I played it in Superlemmini, and so I'm seeing this level for the very first time. However, it is possible, although it took me almost a good 35-40 minutes before I solved it. In some of my early attempts, it was a, "I would had had it if I had just 1 more builder!" It is, indeed, possible with just the 8 builders provided.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2020, 04:33:07 am »
Believe it or not, I never actually tried building up with the eight builders because I knew it wouldn’t be that simple. I tried having three climbers go up, build over the exit and use the three diggers to make a wider space and then bash to the other side and try building up but that wouldn’t work because the climbers would go up the snow pillar and die from falling too far and I don’t think I had enough builders to get up from there anyway.

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #13 on: June 18, 2020, 06:34:34 am »
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2020, 07:57:43 pm »
I’m still stumped to be honest. I tried making the left side wider with the diggers but that didn’t work I still don’t have enough height to get all the way up.

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2020, 09:11:04 pm »
Keep trying. It does work. It's difficult because there's a lot of precision involved, at least for me there was. Try adjusting the digger positions and minimizing the number of builders used to seal the gaps in each direction. This was why several of my early attempts, I kept saying, "If I had just one more builder I would had had it." However, the level is 100% possible with the skillset given.

Offline Colorful Arty

  • Posts: 797
  • You are so loved!
    • View Profile
    • Colorful Arty's Youtube Page
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2020, 03:33:51 am »
The level in question is not that precise at all. If you're struggling with making it precise enough, you're probably doing it wrong. That said, I will move this higher up in the rank after hearing this feedback. ;)
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2020, 08:53:21 am »
You're right, of course. It was pretty much self-inflicted then, although it definitely seemed and felt like there was a lot of precision, but there is a few pixels leeway. I'm not seriously playing the pack atm, just helping Shmolem with levels he's stuck on, so you should wait for further feedback from him. It might be a while before I may play this pack for Neolemmix, since I have already beaten this pack on Superlemmini quite a while back. Chaotic 12 does seem to be a level that wasn't originally in the pack in Superlemmini, as it didn't seem familiar to me when I loaded the level.

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2020, 08:44:58 pm »
I’m getting to the point of one more builder would’ve had it and I’m trying so many different angles and starting points and what-not but every time I end up back at a point where if I had one more builder I would’ve got it. Why game Why?
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 08:57:52 pm by Shmolem »

Offline Proxima

  • Posts: 3979
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2020, 08:58:41 pm »
Yes, I have to say I think kaywhyn gave you some bad advice here.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2020, 09:19:36 pm »
Yes, I have to say I think kaywhyn gave you some bad advice here.

I wouldn't consider any solution that works to be bad advice. Rather, the left route was the first one I thought up of and apparently has almost too much precision in order to work, but it does work, so I self-inflicted the precision on myself. I've been known to overcomplicate my solutions while others have found much easier ways to do the same level or vice versa. I just looked at the map again and indeed it never occurred to me to try the position you mentioned in the spoiler. I haven't tried it yet, but certainly seems a lot easier to pull off. Again, I'm not seriously playing the pack atm, and so I'm not really spending much time on any of the levels, whether it's one I've seen before or not. This level that's giving Shmolem trouble is one that wasn't originally part of the pack in Superlemmini, and so this is the first time I'm seeing the level. It's also been a few years since I've beaten the pack, but I beat it on Superlemmini, not Neolemmix. It's probably going to be a long time, if ever, before I take on the Neolemmix version of the pack for real.

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2020, 09:20:17 pm »
I did it! Literally on the first try doing the middle thing! Next level now..

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2020, 09:23:09 pm »
I did it! Literally on the first try doing the middle thing! Next level now..

Great job, Shmolem! :thumbsup:

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2020, 09:29:44 pm »
Chaotic 13 is definitely interesting.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2020, 09:47:35 pm »
Indeed, these levels without constructive skills tend to be quite interesting imo. The fact that it's impossible to get higher without them means you either to have to rely on climbers or the terrain or miners in order to get up. This is yet another level I haven't seen before, because this too wasn't originally part of the pack in Superlemmini, which I first played the pack in. However, this level is much easier.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #25 on: June 21, 2020, 09:59:11 pm »
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2020, 10:02:44 pm »
That was what I originally tried as well, but it won't work. So,

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2020, 10:05:11 pm »
I think I know what your saying! I’ll try it right now. Edit: Yep! I got it. Edit 2: Solved Chaotic 14 as well, here's the replay if you're curious to see my solution.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 10:30:19 pm by Shmolem »

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2020, 11:11:40 pm »
Nice job. I knew you could do it. I think what you're seeing is Chaotic definitely living up to its name. Don't worry. It's quite common to breeze through the first few ranks with little to no problems, but then all of a sudden you start getting stumped starting with the 3rd or 4th rank. It happens to me all the time, so it's not like I'm someone who doesn't ever get stuck on a level. If you take a look at https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4894.0, which organizes the packs I have completed, currently playing, and ones I'm thinking of playing, sure, it tells you that I have completed 50 packs, but what it doesn't tell you is how long I've been stuck on some of the packs in order to get to 50 packs completed. Before making the switch over to Neolemmix from Lemmini and Superlemmini and before beating Lemmings Reunion on Lemmini, I say the hardest pack I've completed was Pimolems. Once I've made the switch to Neolemmix, so far I say the hardest I've completed is Lemmings Stampede. I'm currently playing through two packs much harder than anything I've completed, United and Nepsterlems. Right now, I'm about halfway through both packs, but I'm still really far from completing them.

So really, I definitely think you have what it takes to solve levels. Perhaps Chaotic is where you really have to start thinking outside the box. That's a nice solution to Chaotic 14. However, it's definitely more complicated than how I did this level.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2020, 11:14:26 pm »
AND I solved Chaotic 15! I think I can make it through this pack but it might take me a bit. To be honest I’m usually one to make things more complex than they have to be.

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2020, 09:46:25 am »
That's perfectly fine. Take as much time as you need. I prefer to make my solutions as simple as I can, although I myself, like you, sometimes overcomplicate them. Many solution videos I watched had me going, "Wow, I feel so dumb that I didn't see that before, because my solution is way more complicated." Sometimes, though, it's the other way around, where I felt the person in the video who solved the level did his or her solution more complicated than the way I did mine. In any case, I don't consider myself a puzzle solver at the level of the experts here, just good enough that I'm able to beat difficult packs on my own given enough time. In the 50 packs that I have beaten, I did it all without looking up solutions before I have beaten the levels myself first and without hints, as I myself don't like asking for hints, so I allow myself to be stuck and stay stuck however long it takes, until I either finally figure it out or I just jump between different packs. That can probably be something you can do, where it definitely helps to get away from a level you're stuck on for a time, as the time away will allow you to start anew and with a clear mind. I know it has helped me tremendously from time to time with the more difficult levels.

I know you can beat this pack! :)

Offline Colorful Arty

  • Posts: 797
  • You are so loved!
    • View Profile
    • Colorful Arty's Youtube Page
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #31 on: June 23, 2020, 09:31:40 pm »
I'm glad this pack is garnering interest. :)

Nice solution to Chaotic 14! Completely different from every other solution I've seen, but still a perfectly valid one! Nice job using all of the skills. :)

It seems Chaotic 12 is causing a lot of people trouble. I'll move that higher in the rank. Perhaps I'll also make it more obvious the left side won't work. ;)

Chaotic 13 it seems kaywhyn found a backroute to. Easily sealed though, and you found the intended solution in the end if your comments mean what I think they mean.

Good luck with this pack Shmolem! I can already tell you that Insane and especially Hellish will be really difficult, as there are a few really evil levels in there. Don't be afraid to skip around the ranks a bit if you get really stuck on a level, although I'd save the boss fights for after you've beaten every other level in the rank. If you need help, don't be afraid to ask. I'm happy to give hints wherever I can! ;)
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #32 on: June 23, 2020, 09:45:34 pm »
Sweet, 100th post! ;)

My solution for Chaotic 13 (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: June 23, 2020, 09:56:17 pm by kaywhyn »

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #33 on: June 23, 2020, 11:41:32 pm »
I’m on Chaotic 19! The lack of destructive skills is a bit difficult. I’ve been debating where I use the basher specifically. And I’m not sure if I should build over some of the big structures or go through most of them. Edit: Replays!
« Last Edit: June 23, 2020, 11:48:04 pm by Shmolem »

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #34 on: June 24, 2020, 02:49:15 am »
I remember this Sandopolis level being in Superlemmini with the exact same title. However, I just checked, and this level is named Sandopolis Act 1 in Superlemmini. Despite this one being Act 1 while the Neolemmix level is Act 2, they both have the exact same layout. Another thing I just checked is the Sweet rank in Neolemmix, and both Act 1 versions in each engine have the exact same amount of skills: 20 of everything except builders, where there's 30.  Interestingly enough, there is also an Act 2 level in Superlemmini that's in the Chaotic rank, but the difference is that the level is only a screen wide and the level only shows the right side of the level, with the pyramid at the left edge and then everything else in the level is new. Thus, I'm seeing the harder version of Superlemmini's Act 1 level for the first time in Neolemmix. I just solved Chaotic 19 in Neolemmix, so it is 100% possible.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: June 24, 2020, 03:27:49 am by kaywhyn »

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #35 on: June 25, 2020, 07:13:11 pm »
Yeah this really looks like a trial and error type level. It’s kinda overwhelming because there are so many different ways you could potentially do things it’s hard to know where to start. The very beginning where the lemmings are trapped is annoying because it forces you to use one of your
already limited destructive skills. I also notice that by the end of the level I don’t have enough builders to clear that last little part.

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #36 on: June 25, 2020, 08:24:48 pm »
Large levels have the tendency to be overwhelming, especially when skills are very limited. These often are difficult levels, and most of the time they do a great job of appearing to be a difficult level but sometimes they're simpler than they appear to be. Conversely, small levels tend to look easy but they can be deceptively difficult. From experimenting it sounds like you have eliminated one of the paths. However, it sounds like more thinking out of the box is required for the beginning.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

  • Posts: 75
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #37 on: July 01, 2020, 10:28:52 pm »
My main problem now is that I’m running out of builders closer to the end.. it feels like you’ll have plenty of them but in reality you don’t. I guess it’s all down to where the builders go at this point

Offline kaywhyn

  • Posts: 183
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #38 on: July 02, 2020, 02:31:57 am »
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Swerdis

  • Posts: 49
    • View Profile
Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #39 on: July 28, 2020, 03:14:44 am »
Hey Arty,

playing through your SubLems pack at the moment, I finished the Insane rank recently and I thought I give you some feedback. I will restrict myself on the levels of that rank. Generally said, I enjoy this pack pretty much so far. The learning curve isn't too steep and the difficulty, at least to this point, moderate. Not many levels caused me real problems. Moreover, I absolutely love the fact that every level got it's own music. I didn't like all of the tunes, though, but that's normal.

1. Things are heating up!

No problems here at all since I used the same solution as in its predecessor. I don't know if this is really intended.

2. Ice cream dream

This is a great level! One that could well be a major obstacle for a novice player. I also had to think a little about it, especially how to do all the things necessary in the right order.

3. Lemmings about town

Though it was clear from the beginning that climbers play a major role here, this was not an easy one. I especially liked the way how to turn the Lemmings in the end, preventing them from climbing the steel wall.

4. Polly Pimple

The 50 climbers didn't fool me. A very nice one that didn't take me too much time. Which was a good thing since my wife found the music in this level very annoying ;)

5. Mini level marathon

I am not the biggest fan of taking the original levels as basis for new ones, nor do I like disjunct unions. So this one was not a level for ME - but I give you credit for forcing the player to rethink the original solutions - because, by using them, this level can not be solved.

6. Block-O-Tron mark II

A very short one. I don't know if this works really well as an one-of-each-skill-level since I only used half of the skills available. But maybe it's a backroute (I'm not so sure, though)

7. The Greater Lemming Caper

A very nice variation of the original concept. One of my favourites of this rank, though not particularly tough to beat.

8. BridgeWorks

Another favourite of mine. It was a bit fiddly to work this out, but then it went surprisingly well. Some "inside knowledge" about the Neolemmix mechanics is necessary here - this level could very well be big roadblock for untrained players.

9. Next stop... Lemming penthouse

While I'm not a big fan of time limits, it's absolutely appropriate in this level since it's part of the puzzle. I personally like levels like this one - when several Lemmings have to prepare the path for others simultaneously by doing different things. The first NeoLemmix packs I ever played - Namidas Lemmings Plus I and II - contained these "No Time to Die"- Levels which worked in a similar way. That's what I felt remembered here.

10. Failure after failure...

That's a very good level as well. I like the way the miners have to be used here - the solution was pretty funny. I also like the title of this level!

11. Crazy Christmas Crossing

This one took me a while. Not because the solution was so hard to find - but because of the pixel precision necessary here. Nice concept!

12. Play it like a flute!

At least for me, this was one of the hardest levels of this rank. Maybe that's because it's not a type of level I'm particularly good at - symmetrical stuff with lots of hatches. In the end I found a solution. But I can imagine there are more than this one. Again, a very nice title! (I like good level names)

13.  The best-laid plans

The return of the mice :) In my first attempts, I tried a lot of pointless stuff here. Then I realized that this level should be solved in a straightforward way and that it was actually designed around timing. So I just had to find out the best moment to release the crowd - to make them land safely in the digger's hole in the end.

14. Firewall of fame

My intuitive first decision to bash all the way through at the bottom turned out to be right.

15. Blame it on the chain

At first I had no clue at all how to save this level - it seemed pretty impossible to me. I tried it to the left exit, to the right exit and to the central exit form the left side with no success at all. But then, as you can see from the video, I found a way by not using a climber at all. So I guess I backrouted it unless the climbers are red herrings.

16. Lemmings of the Lost Ark

I already played this level in Lemmings Redux with a different skillset and I found your version easier. Some pixel precision was necessary, though.

17. Farewell, my Lemmings

I guess, every rank needs a breather ;) Nice basic idea (I would never have come up with this), but totally easy to figure out.

18. No time for Lemmings!

When I saw the skillset I knew immediately that I could solve this level - then it took me longer than I thought. This level is a playground for using skills in an unusual manner - stretching bridges, mining upwards and so on - and it gives the player a lot of leeway instead of requiring pure pixel precision. Maybe that's why I like this level very much.

19. Balance Beam Bunker

This level looked pretty awe-inspiring in the beginning, even increased by the music. But then it wasn't that bad. The biggest difficulty was to bring exactly two Lemmings to the other side.  But, after playing so many packs, we know how to trap a crowd by now :)

20. Boss Battle 4: Molten Monster

This monster looks really good. And I like the concept to finish every rank with a Boss Battle. The level itself isn't that great in my opinion - just as the Boss Battle in the previous rank. At least for me, searching hidden exits is not fun - but I know that this is a matter of taste.

The hardest level in your pack for me so far ist still "A matter of traps" in the chaotic rank. But I think this will change when I play the final rank which will happen soon. I'll give feedback then. Thanks for the pack, I enjoy it.

Bye, Swerdis.

All solutions can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/user/Vidusaka/

« Last Edit: July 28, 2020, 04:59:31 am by Swerdis »