Author Topic: [NeoLemmix] SubLems  (Read 1229 times)

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Offline Colorful Arty

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[NeoLemmix] SubLems
« on: June 07, 2020, 08:14:45 pm »
Looking for a relatively easy pack to ease you into the world of custom Lemmings levels? Want something with a similar flavor to the original Lemmings? Looking to get better at solving levels and picking up tricks? This is the pack for you.

This is SubLems! One of the first levelpacks I ever made, and it's finally been ported to the new formats of NeoLemmix! This pack was originally made for SuperLemmini, back when NeoLemmix was still in its infancy. By popular demand, I ported it to NeoLemmix with some issues, since a few levels couldn't be ported so new ones had to be made. Porting to the new formats also took time, since many levels were scrapped for various reasons. But now it's complete, and I think the result is worth it.

SubLems contains 110 levels spread across 6 ranks with 10 levels in the first rank and 20 in each rank after that. The game starts off incredibly easy, similar to that of the original Lemmings, and steadily increases in difficulty as the pack goes on. The learning curve is steeper than the original game, and by the end it definitely exceeds the difficulty of the original game, but it's probably one of the easier packs out there, so it should be beginner-friendly. The levels should also teach you some of the tricks needed to solve the really tough custom levels. None of the NeoLemmix-exclusive skills are used in these levels, and the only NeoLemmix-exclusive objects that are used are pickup skills, so this pack should give you an experience close to the original game.

This port also features several new levels, since many levels were replaced either because I didn't like them, or they had too many backroutes, so this pack will be a new experience even for people who played a previous version! :)

Download SubLems here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/quuy050td1edjky/SubLems.zip?dl=1

Each level in this pack has its own unique music. All music should be safe to use for Youtube videos; please let me know if one of the tracks causes a copyright issue, and I'll try to change it for a future update.

Here's a breakdown of each rank:


Newbie

This is the tutorial rank! I don't count this as one of the official ranks in the game, it's here to teach you the basic mechanics of the game, such as the 8 main skills and the release rate. I recommend playing this rank even if you already know the basics, because the levels should hopefully be pretty, the music is nice, they're really short, and at least one of the levels in this rank returns in a future rank. ;)


Scaling Mt. Jerry


Sweet

The first official rank! Sweet is full of easy, inviting levels for you to savor. Taking the skills you learned in Newbie, you get to run wild with them and solve simple levels in this rank. The levels here are meant to be pretty and easy, although they do get a bit more challenging at the end. You will also learn some more advanced basics in this rank, keeping with the tutorial theme of the previous rank in a way. Enjoy the eye candy as put what you've learned to the test.


Tri-color masterpiece


Scary

While the levels start out relatively simple, similar to the Sweet rank, this is where the challenge starts to come in. The environments you face are harsher and frightening, traps start popping up in abundance, skills are getting more limited, and some levels won't have open-ended solutions, forcing you to solve real puzzles now. You'll also have to start thinking creatively with the skills you're given.


It's a hot one


Chaotic

And now, the chaos begins. Levels get even trickier in this rank, and multitasking will become mandatory. You'll have to act quick to save your Lemmings from unfortunate demises, and the puzzles get trickier still. Expect your brain to start working a bit harder in this rank, and the pause button will become your best friend as well. Also, keep a close eye on that clock, because from here on out, you'll have to work fast...


The legendary bash of Crystal Cove


Insane

This is where the gloves come off, and the puzzles aren't holding back anymore. Time is getting really tight. The levels are getting meaner in design. Skills are highly restricted. Some very advanced tricks will be needed. Even the music is getting more frantic. Your brain will be kicked into overdrive in this rank, and by the end, you'll have gotten your first glimpse into hell.


Blame it on the chain


Hellish

Here we are: the final rank. Here, the puzzles hold nothing back, and everything you've learned up until now will be needed to solve these levels. Even experts may have trouble with some of these levels. I've saved the most devious puzzles for last, and the most epic music as well. Prove yourself here, and you'll be able to take on some of the tougher levelpacks out there. But first, you'll have to plunge into the nightmare that is hell...


Labyrinth of Lucifer
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Strato Incendus

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2020, 09:12:44 am »
YES! Thanks for putting in the effort to convert this, Arty! :thumbsup: You know how much I admire the linear difficulty curve of this pack, and it's definitely the type of beginner-to-intermediate-level content that New Formats so desperately needs, in order to bridge the gap from the very easy packs to the ridiculously hard ones.

I might have to try beating this pack again in New Formats now, and see whether any of the levels have changed.

Just one question: Is the Retro rank still a thing in this version?
My packs so far:
Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
Paralems (Old Formats), a more flavour-driven one, 150 levels
Pit Lems (Old Formats), a more puzzly one, 100 levels - Let's Played by nin10doadict
Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

Offline Colorful Arty

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2020, 01:57:22 pm »
Thanks for the kind words Strato!

No, the Retro rank is not present in this version, for two main reasons.

1) I didn't really like that rank; there were really only two levels that come to mind that I actually think are good.
2) That rank uses the new skills, and I want this pack to only use the original 8.

That said, SubLems may be getting a DLC rank or two in the future. If I end up using new skills in the DLC rank, I'll bring back the Retro rank as well. ;)
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Strato Incendus

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2020, 04:44:29 pm »
Ah, good to know - I remember some of the Retro levels being the most difficult ones in the pack. But I hadn't consciously noticed that it was the only rank containing NeoLemmix skills. Of course, I know the pack was originally made for SuperLemmini, and thus didn't include any new skills at all - I just thought this had also been true for Retro.

I'm already curious about the bonus DLC rank! :thumbsup:
My packs so far:
Lemmings World Tour (New & Old Formats), my music-themed flagship pack, 320 levels - Let's Played by Colorful Arty
Paralems (Old Formats), a more flavour-driven one, 150 levels
Pit Lems (Old Formats), a more puzzly one, 100 levels - Let's Played by nin10doadict
Lemmicks, a pack for (very old) NeoLemmix 1.43 full of gimmicks, 170 levels

Offline Shmolem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2020, 08:47:23 pm »
I just tried the pack last night and I’m already on chaotic 3 Death Chamber which has stumped me for now. It’s a great pack! And very good for someone like me who’s never beaten a level pack or even the original lemmings for that matter.. kinda embarrassing actually..
Edit: So, I solved Chaotic 3 but I think this may be a backroute but I'm not positive... and I want to know!
« Last Edit: June 17, 2020, 10:38:12 pm by Shmolem »

Offline kaywhyn

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2020, 10:36:09 pm »
I just tried the pack last night and I’m already on chaotic 3 Death Chamber which has stumped me for now. It’s a great pack! And very good for someone like me who’s never beaten a level pack or even the original lemmings for that matter.. kinda embarrassing actually..

No need to be ashamed. There's no requirement that the original games must be played and beaten before taking on custom level packs. It's definitely recommended, but not mandatory. Most of the people in the forums here have at least beaten L1 and ONML and hence are armed with knowledge of the game mechanics to take on custom level packs, but this is by no means required. Most of the new skills and objects in Neolemmix were borrowed from the other games besides L1 and ONML (e.g, fencer and platformer from L2: The Tribes, teleporters from Lemmings Revolution), but there are some skills and objects that aren't taken from any of the original games (e.g, disarmer and splat/anti-splat pads), and so the original games aren't going to be much help with familiarizing you with the new things. For this, we point you to the Neolemmix Tutorial Pack that Icho is currently making, where it teaches you what the new skills and objects in Neolemmix do.

You're already more than halfway through Arty's pack, and I'm in agreement that you're doing really well in this pack. I originally played this pack when Arty made it for Superlemmini. In that engine, only the classic 8 skills are used and hence just L1 stuff. I may tackle this pack for Neolemmix sometime in the future, but as I have already beaten this pack on Superlemmini, I most likely will not get around to doing so for a while. There's definitely some difficult levels ahead of where you're currently at, but the pack as a whole has a nice difficulty curve, where it starts off very easy and gets harder as you progress, but the levels aren't hard in the extreme. Really, the only level I got stuck on the longest in this pack was Hellish 16. In addition, as you have definitely seen, so many of the levels in the pack are really well-designed aesthetically. They're really amazing to look at.

Hints for Chaotic 3 (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2020, 10:41:56 pm »
Thanks kaywhyn! I think I did it the intended way based on what you said in your hint but you can download my replay I put in the post above just to see.

Offline kaywhyn

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2020, 10:58:27 pm »
Thanks kaywhyn! I think I did it the intended way based on what you said in your hint but you can download my replay I put in the post above just to see.

Yea pretty much the same way I did it, except

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2020, 11:14:07 pm »
I find chaotic to be strange, like after level 3 I easily breezed through levels and now I’m on level 11

Offline kaywhyn

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2020, 11:36:55 pm »
That's the tricky thing about level packs in that it's often very difficult to judge the difficulty of levels on your own, which is why feedback for the level pack author is helpful. Any input you provide will certainly be helpful for Arty to patch up backroutes and rearrange levels according to what most perceived as too difficult for its position or vice versa. I myself am not speaking from experience, as I have never made any levelpacks and I most likely don't intend to, as I am much better at solving levels than making them, but this is what I have observed from years of visiting this forum and playing and beating so many custom level packs. Unless the goal is to stump players with hard levels one after another and risk frustrating the player and possibly having the person give up early on the pack long before completing it, expect some easy breather levels in between the hard levels as well. Also remember that having skills leftover is not necessarily a bad thing in a pack like Sublems. Sometimes, the author intends the levels as anyway you want ones, i.e, find any solution that works, especially in the very early ranks. They're much rarer in later ranks, where leftover skills generally means it's a backroute, but not always. The any way you want levels in later ranks still show up on occasion. There were plenty of them in L1 in all the ranks.

Keep it up Shmolem! You'll have this pack beat in no time. :)

Offline Shmolem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2020, 12:24:16 am »
There we go, you were right about people having hard time judging difficulty of levels because I just got through Chaotic 11 and then level 12 hits me and I have no clue where to even start with solving it.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline kaywhyn

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2020, 03:42:26 am »
As this example pack shows, the difficulty of individual levels tends to be wobbly and jump all over the place, even within the ranks. In general, levels in the later ranks tend to be harder than the ones in the earlier ranks, but that doesn't mean all levels in the later ranks are hard ones. There can still be easy levels in a late rank and then all of a sudden you get hit with a level with a huge spike in difficulty, and similarly a rank can begin with several hard ones and then all of a sudden the next one is much easier. While early ranks tend to have easy levels, there can still be at least one hard level. Another common thing you will usually see is that levels at the beginning of the next rank tend to be easier than the levels at the end of the previous rank. Not always, but it's pretty common to see this.

Yes, I absolutely agree with you that Chaotic 12 is indeed a hard level. As a matter of fact, I don't think this level was originally part of the pack when I played it in Superlemmini, and so I'm seeing this level for the very first time. However, it is possible, although it took me almost a good 35-40 minutes before I solved it. In some of my early attempts, it was a, "I would had had it if I had just 1 more builder!" It is, indeed, possible with just the 8 builders provided.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2020, 04:33:07 am »
Believe it or not, I never actually tried building up with the eight builders because I knew it wouldn’t be that simple. I tried having three climbers go up, build over the exit and use the three diggers to make a wider space and then bash to the other side and try building up but that wouldn’t work because the climbers would go up the snow pillar and die from falling too far and I don’t think I had enough builders to get up from there anyway.

Offline kaywhyn

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #13 on: June 18, 2020, 06:34:34 am »
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline Shmolem

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Re: [NeoLemmix] SubLems
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2020, 07:57:43 pm »
I’m still stumped to be honest. I tried making the left side wider with the diggers but that didn’t work I still don’t have enough height to get all the way up.