Yeah, both points hamper the usability. The ways to save a level are very unclear about the file extension and file content that you receive. This is a relict from when L++ could only open its own format. At this time, use Save As, yep.

The buttons that don't allow smaller adjustments than 10 are a case of "program wants to be smarter than the user" again, which is bad. :-D Will fix.

And I want to go through the whole topic sometime again. I know of at least one post by Clam Spammer that I didn't answer properly to...

-- Simon

Hi,

version 2009-11-01 is up:
Download page

Mindless has set up an L++ server. To connect, enter flux.camanis.net in the IP/hostname box and hit "connect to". We should try out this server in our next session. If it works nicely, I will add a button that always connects to there. :-D

Maybe Wednesday, November 4th at 20:00 UTC is an okay time for the next playtest?

(Note that at this time, the server has just the same functionality as a regular hosting L++ player. There is always a single game open to join, and everyone who's connected must hit "ready" to begin. Things like opening separate rooms sound like very nice additions, but require further restructuring of the netcode.)

minimac:
Yeah, I'm not sure which new skill would tackle the current problems best. Stacker, bomber and roper are all highly situational. The best thing might be to implement several and let the level designer choose, I'll see what I have time for.

geoo:
About L2 styles in L++... this might be something for the next semester break if there is good documentation available, heh.

We could try a skype conference during a networking session if everybody has it available. You said you do, I also do; we could ask around who else does. The best part will be hearing other people rant and shout. :-D

Isu:
Thanks for the great review. Especially that you find the editor usable is awesome to hear. Follow the topic and just drop in when we agree upon a date/time for the next netgame. :-)

-- Simon

Yep, I can host at 20:00 UTC today, Sunday, October 25th. My IP address today is (edit: expired), and everyone's invited.

However, I probably won't be up longer than 21:30, as I have university on the morning after. If someone else wishes to host instead, he's welcome. :-) (Host should have an open port 22934 for UDP.)

A problem with the current version is that the L++ host must attain all the games and cannot leave early. I have begun writing a dedicated server today, i.e. a server program that runs separately from L++, and the players will connect to that program. The goal is that this can be run around the clock on a computer that is always connected to the net, unlike mine. I will not have it done until tonight, though, as it requires some restructuring of the game as well.

-- Simon

PS. I will certainly consider altering the L++ physics if you all see fit. Stopping a digger by digging yourself sounds really good, and it even makes sense because you steal the other digger's earth. There are a lot of similar things in this thread that I still want to comment on.

Ah, to clarify the Stallman post: I don't mean GuyPerfect gets profit this way. But a lot of the rest applies. Software should be given away to "your neighbor who needs it", i.e. Dullstar or anyone who is going to design levels in the future. (This wasn't said explicitly in the linked article although I thought it was; it's only in the definition of free software.) It'll also drastically reduce the time to find/fix bugs/usability issues. (This was in there.)

I will continue to read about the development here as I've done all the time. So back to the topic, yup.

-- Simon

How do you make a trapdoor drop lemmings to the left?

Lemmings will walk to the left iff all of these apply:
- The level is played in multiplayer,
- there is no horizontal wraparound and
- the trapdoor's lemming entry point is on the right half of the level.

I haven't made a custom directory selector for the hatches, as I've thought that the current system would work. It's not documented yet, however.

Sometimes it asks me to save the level before exiting, even though I've just saved it. Then when I hit "no" and go back to the menu, the level is blank. I think this happened when I saved it in a lvl file (copied over from Lemmix) instead of a new txt file.

The things are probably still written in the .LVL file, but in L++ format. If you rename the file to .TXT, it will be openend properly again, as the program uses the extension to determine the data format.

I should do something about this, as it is very irritating. Either implement saving LVLs natively, but this will be a problem in case they're played in Lemmix, as I neither read, use nor save steel areas. Or always make sure that trying to overwrite a LVL file always generates a new TXT file. Not relying on the extension is also good, but managing the file folders might become more uncertain for the user who uses Lemmix with the same files.

Sometimes the terrain pieces seem to "group" together - when I click on a particular one, it selects a whole lot of others as well.

If you're not using the frame-dragging button or its hotkey Shift, then it's a bug, although I haven't seen it before.

Selection boxes mess up when I drag over a large area on a level with wrapping. They flip over when you get halfway around the level, and cover the other half instead.

I still wonder what the best method is for determining what way the user wants to select things. Do they also wrap around when they fit on a single screen? In that case, it should always go with the rectangle that doesn't go offscreen.

For consistency with Lemmix, I think it would be better for map sizes and terrain grids to be multiples of 8 (or 16 since everything is doubled here) instead of 10.

Very good thing, I will swap the 5 for the 16. I need the 10 in some cases for my self-drawn objects.

---

Steve:
Thanks, I will add those levels into the next version, so everybody can select them from their folder.

geoo:
Not copying the physics from L1/ONML/... exactly was actually my biggest fear when I thought about presenting my game on these forums in the past. If they're playable and fun, and even feel nice for regulars here - then that's really good. :-)

-- Simon

Four chaotic hours of fun with geoo, Clam Spammer, minimac, Peter and Insane Steve. :-)

Video, first part

Video, second part

-- Simon

Heh, 7 a.m. isn't the best option either. I'll drop you a PM so we can find out a nice time.

-- Simon

Try again looking for me now.

I live in Germany and the university semester has started, so I'd propose something that is in the later evening for me. That should fit for Americans as well. 22:00 UTC maybe, this is 00:00 local time and 23:00 local time after daylight savings are over.

I can host a game then, so there aren't any problems with closed ports. My IP address usually changes once a day. Try to connect with L++ to 79.200.183.66 at exactly 22:00 UTC today, i.e. in under half an hour. :-)

If nobody comes, I will open again at 22:30 and 23:00 UTC. After that I will probably go to bed and we'll try tomorrow.

-- Simon