Should NeoLemmix's hi-res mode have independent tiles for official styles?

Yes, create new ones entirely from scratch
3 (30%)
Yes, double the size of the low-res ones so that they appear identical to their low-res counterparts (as opposed to upscaled, as they are currently)
1 (10%)
Yes, use the WinLemm ones (Fire exit would be corrected in this instance)
1 (10%)
Yes, but none of the above (please state new suggestion in comments if you choose this option)
2 (20%)
I don't mind either way
0 (0%)
No, let NL continue to upscale the low-res ones (status quo)
3 (30%)

Total Members Voted: 8

Author Topic: [NeoLemmix][DISC] Iindependent tiles in hi-res mode for official styles  (Read 12030 times)

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Offline Simon

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pixels which appear empty but are actually solid. Does this not constitute misleading visuals?

Solid/air is a question about the lo-res physics pixels, which are composed of 2x2 hi-res pixels in the image. If, e.g., 3 out of the 4 hi-res pixels are colorful, we can argue that players interpret these 2x2 hi-res pixels as a solid lo-res pixel.

Proxima wants to make nice gentle slopes with hi-res pixels that produce near-full 2x2 terrain pixels or near-empty 2x2 air blocks.

Still, the devil will be in the details how we put these 2x2 blocks next to each other.

## #. .. ..
## ## #. ..

In this example, one argument is that the left 2x2 block produces a solid pixel, the second 2x2 block produces another solid pixel, and the third 2x2 block is air.

But the second argument is, due to lack of clear visual grid during play, the player can see this landscape as:

# ## .. .. .
# ## ## .. .

This you can interpret as a step of 0.5 lo-res pixels, which is not possible in NL physics.

I don't know how problematic this is. Such kind of gentle slope appears necessary to draw perfectly rounded pillars, but I'm
wary of the ultimate 2x1 abuse. (click to show/hide)

-- Simon
« Last Edit: January 21, 2022, 07:40:31 PM by Simon »

Offline Will

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One way around this would be to resize every piece by x2 so that, even in hi-res, the tiles appear exactly as they would in low-res.

There is also no reason to take the time to do this instead of just using upscaling.nxmi to set the upscaler mode to "zoom"

Unfortunately, I couldn't get this to work. I have attached an upscaling.nxmi file with the upscaling set to ZOOM, and I tried placing this into several styles folders to no avail. It's very possible that I'm not doing something correctly, but I have followed the instructions as closely as possible.

Meanwhile, I have prepared a full set of PNGs which are essentially the default tiles doubled in size using Nearest Neighbour, so that they appear exactly the same in both high-res and low-res. If nothing else, these will be useful as templates for anyone who wishes to provide their own high-res modifications of these styles. At the very least, those who want the high-res lem sprites but want to keep the low-res tiles can do so using these.

To install, simply drag and drop the contents of the zip to your NL styles folder and choose "replace". NOTE: Using these styles in your copy of NeoLemmix will override the upscaling in high-res - you can revert to default behaviour by removing the "-hr" suffixed folders if you wish.

NOTE 2: These copies of the styles contain modded trap animations
- some of them are improvements of the existing default animations, others remove the secondary animation altogether. If this is not something that you want, then I don't recommend using these copies of the styles at all. DO NOT use only the "-hr" suffixed folders, as this will mess up some of your trap animations.

Offline Will

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Re: [NeoLemmix][DISC] Iindependent tiles in hi-res mode for official styles
« Reply #62 on: February 26, 2022, 04:49:56 PM »
I'm currently creating hybrid versions of the orig styles which use pieces from both Amiga/DOS and WinLemm, and in some cases even merge details from the WinLemm pieces into the Amiga pieces to create a more detailed, hi-res graphic which retains the generally more soft, pixellated look of Amiga.

The results so far are quite pleasing, and this has been a lot quicker to do than you might think. Resizing the pieces took a few minutes thanks to FastStone PNG editor, and now it's a case of choosing which pieces look best in which styles, and merging them in some cases, to create the hybrid style.

So far I've finished dirt and pillar. For reference, here's how Just Dig looked with WinLemm graphics:

And here it is with the "AmWin" hybrid graphics:

Only Floaters with WinLemm graphics:

And with "AmWin" hybrid graphics:

I'll be finishing these hybrid styles off anyway, so when I've finished I'll upload them as NeoLemmix-usable PNGs so people can try out the styles in NL hi-res mode.

Offline Will

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Re: [NeoLemmix][DISC] Iindependent tiles in hi-res mode for official styles
« Reply #63 on: February 27, 2022, 08:25:26 AM »
Marble is done; this one was the easiest because the WinLemm version mostly looks great anyway, all I did was swap in the Amiga graphic for the pink "stuff" (the splodgy clumps of plasticine-looking stuff at the base of the level), and even that I'm not 100% sure is necessary. Let me know which you prefer:

Konbanwa Lemming-san with WinLemm graphics:

Konbanwa Lemming-san with "AmWin" hybrid graphics (only the pink stuff replaced):

Fire, on the other hand, was a fair bit more work to get right. I've replaced most of the terrain pieces with Amiga ones, and the steel pieces are the two blended together. I liked the more solid look of the WinLemm ones, but prefer the softer shading of the Amiga ones. Blending them achieves the best of both worlds. Here's Triple Trouble with WinLemm graphics:

Triple Trouble with AmWin hybrid graphics:

And, to show the lettering, here's Running Jump with WinLemm graphics:

And with AmWin hybrid graphics. The lettering used is WinLemm but with the shading dimmed slightly, to make it less "glossy plastic" looking. This way, it looks more like the Amiga lettering but with some of the extra shading and depth of the WinLemm version:

Finally, Crystal is actually already a hybrid style even in WinLemm! Crystal is the only style to use original terrain, but with redesigned hi-res objects. All I did here was give the entrance hatch and exit a bit more detail, since I think that whoever did the WinLemm styles missed a trick in not doing so. Here's POOR WEE CREATURES, with new entrance hatch and exit detail (the blur in the centre of the graphic is where the centre of the level has been trimmed out, in order to get both objects in the same image):

I'm currently using these hybrid styles in my copy of SuperLemmini, but I'm happy to make NeoLemmix versions of them as well if people like them.

EDIT: I'll probably use some pieces from NeoLemmix's upscaler as well, since I particularly like how the large crystal pieces appear: