[NeoLemmix] Snack Pack

[SQron188]

Hello, you!

I don't like to come to a party empty-handed, so here's one I prepared earlier!



Snack Pack




(a sample level)


* * *
This pack is mostly inspired by Oh-No! More Lemmings, with my history with it going back quite a few years now. There was scarcely anything close to a tool like NeoLemmix or a way to share my creations like this forum, available to me at that time. A few months ago (at the time of writing) I started watching some of Flopsy's Let's Plays and heard him mention NeoLemmix and the Lemmings Forums.
You can imagine i felt like a kid in a candy store when I came across those!
- - -

The pack consists of 20 levels in a single rank, without any particular order. Each of the levels enforces a time limit.
Players are expected to possess knowledge of the official games (Lemmings, ONML, Tribes, etc.) but experience with custom packs available on this site is suggested as well. Perceived difficulty usually depends on personal experience of the player. Fare well, and save all those Lemmings!

- - -
The pack is compatible with NeoLemmix Player V10.13.

The .NXP file is attached below.

Complementary soundtracks are attached below, separately (they need to be put in the "Music" folder - it should be created if it doesn't exist yet in the NeoLemmix main directory).
* * *

*****
Special thanks go to:
+ DMA for the original game
+ EricLang & ccexplore for Lemmix
+ namida & Nepster for NeoLemmix
+ Flopsy's works for introducing me to the topic and inspiration
+ Alex A. Denisov for Graphics32
+ Eric turner for ZLibEx
+ Un4seen Development for Bass.dll
+ Volker Oth and Mindless for sharing the source code and information
+ IchoTolot, Nessy, Proxima, SimonN, Nepster, the rest of the Lemmings forums Community and everyone else who helped me with this effort!
*****


NeoLemmix Player (V10.13 required)

Pack itself (.NXP)

Complementary music

The custom soundtracks are:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Level 7: Lemmings 2: The Tribes (SEGA) - Shadow Tribe
Level 16: Lemmings 2: The Tribes (SEGA) - Egyptian Tribe
Level 20: Anarchy - In The Kitchen (Amiga Demo) ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edA-BVDrprI )

+++
Flopsy's Let's Play of this level pack (spoilers!)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh8Coh55aAs&list=PLXsuXbpwwJzHt_RomM12nV9jw4GIo6bGZ

IchoTolot's playthrough of the pack (spoilers!):

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5bJ9fL8-cs&list=PLKR1N9oJTTlIjaFTbxB8RS1-lqRYphbTd

Kaywhyn's playthrough of the pack (spoilers!):

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIA_ZUvCDLE&list=PLbp2m4KlFpJtdxK8DMDMFBOutoTP5pWhj

[Flopsy]

Awesome, I've just had my first crack at this.

1 hour in recording time and I've reached Level 12 and can't solve it so I've given up for now.

I'll get my first video up by tomorrow night and post the link in here

My initial thoughts are there are some very well designed and inspirational levels in the levels I've played! I especially enjoyed the Shadow tileset level!

[SQron188]

Thanks for responding so quickly and in fact playing this pack of mine - a newcomer - straight away! I really appreciate this!

Level 12 is rather unforgiving, so don't worry. You are always welcome to ask for help with a level.

I can't wait for your video(s)!

Funny should you mention that since the pack's levels themselves were inspired by Lemmings, ONML and other people's works.
And the Shadow level was an absolute joy to create, I'm happy you like it, too!

[Nepster]

A lot of very nice levels, though the difficulty order is not perfect yet Replays are attached.

Detailed comments (click to show/hide)

1) The level looks like one lemmings should exit on the right, but that's not enforced.
2) Easiest level and the least interesting one.
3) Looks very nice and the first half of the level is interesting. However the long bridge at the end could be shortened a little bit...
4) Amazing wood design. The basher-staircase at the end is already done to death in existing levels, so I would have preferred the level without it.
5) Interesting design with these upside-down icicles. But again I am not a fan of the long bridge at the end.
6) Nice idea, but slightly on the builder-heavy side again.
7) Amazing level! At first I thought this level would be completely impossible. One of the harder levels of the pack.
8) Nice terrain layout, but again on the builder-heavy side.
9) Very good level!
10) One of the easiest levels of the pack. A good level to start the pack, in my opinion.
11) Very interesting terrain layout, though I would have wished for a slightly more complex solution. But maybe I just backrouted the level...
12) By far the hardest level in the pack! Ensuring that the basher continues requires both very precise placements of the builder on the right and the starting position of the basher. Perhaps consider adding another builder?
13) Amazing design and excellent solution!
14) I am not a fan of this level, because it is very precise on the maximal fall height for the lemmings.
15) Nice solution, but I wonder about the traps on the left: They are close to the path of the lemmings, but never get triggered. Is this intended?
16) I might have backrouted that level, because it seemed relatively easy and I didn't really use the stair to the top.
17) A weird level. Not really hard and an unusual terrain layout.
18) Interesting idea.
19) Very nice level. But I really wonder whether so many lemmings together with the harsh time limit is necessary?
20) First of all: The traps at the beginning don't do anything, which I expect to be a mistake. Furthermore I am not a fan of the part directly after the big steel pillar: Building a stair to catch the other lemmings reaches only barely high enough. This makes the level far more precise than necessary for no gain at all (that I can see). Otherwise a nice, beautiful level, but perhaps not as hard as one would expect a final level to be.

One more general comment: All your levels have time limits. Currently the culture here favors giving infinite time for all levels where staying within the time limit isn't the main point of the level and the time limit isn't needed to enforce a specific solution.

PS: Very nice sandwich title picture.

[Strato Incendus]

Could solve all the levels except for three of the 99 release rate ones. Seems I lack some commonly used strategies to control crowds which are so tightly packed together...

Any general tricks one can do to hold back 99ers, without spoiling any particular level? Some tricks you just have to know, after all, like the "cunning plan" (builder wall) or the double miner-cancel trick.

[Flopsy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh8Coh55aAs

For those who haven't watched my first video of this pack yet.

[IchoTolot]

Attached are my replays to all levels.   Nice first pack.   The overall solving time was roughly 1hour for me if you want to measure the difficulty.

Feedback:

General: Nearly all timelimits are unnessesary. Timers are used to enforce certain solutions and prevent backroutes or enforce a certain degree of multitasking. Here they are mostly there to fail an attempt because the crowd came a few seconds too late. I would remove all of them.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Level 1: Nice and easy start, but again the timer is not needed.
Level 2: Bomb your way through.    Could use a bit more decorations + remove the timer
Level 3: This level looks gorgeous! Just the timer is unnessesary.
Level 4: This could be a backroute   Again timer   (Yes I will point it out every time!)
Level 5: The trap is a bit too hidden for my liking, otherwise it looks very nice      Timer
Level 6: If this is intended you got yourself a nice, tricky solution there      Also the timer can go as the bottom way should be blocked through the limited builders anyway 
Level 7: I would shorten the building height. The idea could be done with less bombing I think. Otherwise it looks amazing     Also the timer you know
Level 8: Here the clock is your only enemy and well isn't really needed too     Also this looks a bit bare.
Level 9: I smell a backroute    Also here the timer is just annoying as you need to RR 99 it really early to avoid running out of time
Level 10: Well that was easy    And why we need the 4min timer I don't really know hehe
Level 11: The hardest level for me which took 8mins. Looks nice and was tricky but the timer could go
Level 12: My old Lemmini sense was tingling, that's why after 2mins it was solved Just remove the timer and you got a nice level
Level 13: I smell a backroute
Level 14: A bit too heavy on the building side and 3:30 timer isn't nessesary
Level 15: Another nice level --- again timer, you know the drill
Level 16: Nice and easy   Apart from the timer
Level 17: This could be a bit more compact in the space department I think and without a timer. Otherwise good level.
Level 18: This felt like a backroute I think
Level 19: To be honest I hate these levels     I raged to GigaLem when he had 13 sections! I raged at Nepster when he had 20! I raged also at Flopsy! And you won't be spared!    Concentrating on all seperate sections is just plain annoying and they could all be in their own level for themselves!
Level 20: Nice looking and very easy   The traps at the start aren't working, don't know if that's intended

[SQron188]

Could solve all the levels except for three of the 99 release rate ones. Seems I lack some commonly used strategies to control crowds which are so tightly packed together...

Any general tricks one can do to hold back 99ers, without spoiling any particular level? Some tricks you just have to know, after all, like the "cunning plan" (builder wall) or the double miner-cancel trick.

Nothing in particular comes to my mind...
I'd say: finding a way of keeping the crowd away from the work being done? timing? some of level titles giving vague hints?
I'm not sure if I can say much more than that.

[Flopsy]

I've now finished the pack, Level 12 was the only major brick wall but there were some very inspirational and very well designed levels in this pack.

I've got 2 more videos to come on this pack on my channel bringing the total to four.

Great pack overall and very high quality for a first attempt at a level pack, I look forward to seeing more from you SQron188

[SQron188]

Thank you for your kind words and your work again! Indeed, I'm excited at the idea of working in this area some more!

[SQron188]

A lot of very nice levels, though the difficulty order is not perfect yet Replays are attached.

Detailed comments (click to show/hide)

1) The level looks like one lemmings should exit on the right, but that's not enforced.
2) Easiest level and the least interesting one.
3) Looks very nice and the first half of the level is interesting. However the long bridge at the end could be shortened a little bit...
4) Amazing wood design. The basher-staircase at the end is already done to death in existing levels, so I would have preferred the level without it.
5) Interesting design with these upside-down icicles. But again I am not a fan of the long bridge at the end.
6) Nice idea, but slightly on the builder-heavy side again.
7) Amazing level! At first I thought this level would be completely impossible. One of the harder levels of the pack.
8) Nice terrain layout, but again on the builder-heavy side.
9) Very good level!
10) One of the easiest levels of the pack. A good level to start the pack, in my opinion.
11) Very interesting terrain layout, though I would have wished for a slightly more complex solution. But maybe I just backrouted the level...
12) By far the hardest level in the pack! Ensuring that the basher continues requires both very precise placements of the builder on the right and the starting position of the basher. Perhaps consider adding another builder?
13) Amazing design and excellent solution!
14) I am not a fan of this level, because it is very precise on the maximal fall height for the lemmings.
15) Nice solution, but I wonder about the traps on the left: They are close to the path of the lemmings, but never get triggered. Is this intended?
16) I might have backrouted that level, because it seemed relatively easy and I didn't really use the stair to the top.
17) A weird level. Not really hard and an unusual terrain layout.
18) Interesting idea.
19) Very nice level. But I really wonder whether so many lemmings together with the harsh time limit is necessary?
20) First of all: The traps at the beginning don't do anything, which I expect to be a mistake. Furthermore I am not a fan of the part directly after the big steel pillar: Building a stair to catch the other lemmings reaches only barely high enough. This makes the level far more precise than necessary for no gain at all (that I can see). Otherwise a nice, beautiful level, but perhaps not as hard as one would expect a final level to be.

One more general comment: All your levels have time limits. Currently the culture here favors giving infinite time for all levels where staying within the time limit isn't the main point of the level and the time limit isn't needed to enforce a specific solution.

PS: Very nice sandwich title picture.

Thanks for your effort again. I am really excited about this whole level-sharing experience!

Some miscellaneous comments about your comments:

(Solutions and spoilers abound!) (click to show/hide)

Oh boy, I think half of the replays are backroutes!
You’ve been very resourceful and I haven’t backroute-proofed the levels enough.
I’m not mad about it, of course.
These are my first steps in the level-making territory, after all.
As mentioned in the original post, the levels don't follow any particular order, even though I had a thought of arranging them in order of difficulty, but then came to the conclusion that I suck at that.

2) Was initially planned as part of some form introductory levels and then as a breather level, but both ideas got scrapped.
3) Long build near the end is just one of the possible solutions. The intentional one was to go the upper route.
4) Funny should you mention that, since it kind of started off the other way round – as a way of incorporating the basher staircase into my levels. I knew (from watched LPs, for example) that the trick is widely known if not old, but it’s part of what I had wanted to accomplish since my first encounters with the game. Ah, good memories...
5) ) Long build near the end – that may be my age and ONML influence showing. I took time limits for granted, like this: Lemmings = time limits, taking it for granted.
6) Another very old idea of mine.
11) No, it wasn’t meant to be too complicated, apart from the bit in the beginning.
12) I'll think about the skillset. I tried making it so that you can start building from the very edge of each platform (with all of the builders going to the left) and adding a couple more bridges above those to stall rushing Lems as well as make sure the basher continues. The basher should simply start as low as possible.
15) Intentional, hence the level title.
16) Nah, you’re not supposed to climb to the top of the staircase.
17) I was trying to balance the grey and the red colour in the layout for added aesthetic value.
19) I was trying to make it very harrowing.
20) Traps at the beginning not functioning – intentional, it’s just (intimidating) decoration, just like in level 15.
And sorry, again it’s just my “old” side, with the time limits.
I’ll perhaps try to fix some of the backroutes (due to my incompetence) in an update, so I guess I shouldn’t say what you’re supposed to do there yet.

...

I’m so happy about each positive bit of feedback on this!

[Flopsy]

Forgot to post my replay files for my LP playing this pack, you would probably find this useful for your backroute fixing.

[SQron188]

Forgot to post my replay files for my LP playing this pack, you would probably find this useful for your backroute fixing.

Thanks for the replays, although I think they're the same ones as your Let's Play solutions.
I've been very  keen while watching the LP and I remember them all!
They still might come in handy for pixel-measuring or such shenanigans. And for archive purposes, surely.

[joshescue18]

I have finished this pack.

[kaywhyn]

Hello SQRon188,

I played and solved all of the pack sometime quite a while back, from way back in April 2020. I'm just attaching my replays for completeness and for historical reasons, as because this pack is currently only for Old Formats NL, they might not be of interest to anyone, but they're there just in case. In addition, here's my video playlist of solutions: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbp2m4KlFpJtdxK8DMDMFBOutoTP5pWhj

General Feedback

Snack Pack is a level pack by SQRon188 and his first one. It is currently only for Old Formats NL, i.e, v10.13.18. It consists of 1 rank of 20 levels, very similar to Lemmings Halloween 2017 by Raymanni, but that one is for New Formats NL. For a first level pack by SQRon188, this is pretty decent and I quite enjoyed it very much. Although the general consensus of the NL community is to avoid time limits unless absolutely necessary to block backroutes, I myself personally don't mind them, especially as I'm a huge math and numbers person. I got to say that while I was recording my solutions to the pack earlier today, it was a blast in the past just seeing them again after so long. I definitely remember some of the levels being decent challenges. It's also been great getting to know SQRon188 on Discord, YT, and the Forums, as well as one Jackbox session.

As already noted by SQRon188 in the OP, most of the levels use ONML tilesets. I think there's only two exceptions, where they both use a L2 tileset. I also remember ONML being quite challenging for me back when I was a kid, but I eventually completed all of it in my early years of middle school after much struggling.

Palatable Rank Feedback

Also as noted in the OP, the levels are in no particular order, although I think for the most part the levels progress in the natural order of easy to hard. None of the levels were particularly challenging, but some still required some thought before I got them solved.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Palatable 1 - Head-Bumping On Ice Nice level to start off the pack. It's not hard, but it's not exactly completely trivial either.

Palatable 2 - Tidying Up Not a very interesting level, but it is a straightforward level of bomb away the trap triggers and the final obstacle before the exit

Palatable 3 - The Port This one is a nice looking level and decent challenge, but it's still not too hard here. Definitely reminds me of plenty of levels from other level packs where the challenge is to get through with as much efficient skill usage as possible to ensure you'll pass.

Palatable 4 - Bramble Bush Bash Can be a bit confusing where the branches will lead to, but fortunately there's only builders and bashers to work with here. The basher staircase at the end is a bit repetitive for my liking, but it's not overly excessive.

Palatable 5 - Icicle Balancing A bit builder heavy, but I honestly don't mind these levels from time to time. At least it's not to the extreme like Hunt the Nessy

Palatable 6 - Collective Hysteria I didn't like how some lemmings went splat while making the long staircase to the exit, but I think it's possible to time the building in such a way so that no one splats. Decent level and puzzle here!

Palatable 7 - Ten-story Stories and Tall Tales The concept is nice here, but this is way too repetitive and excessive on the bombing for my liking. I would have to agree with Icho here that I think this could be done with a not as tall map. Otherwise, this was quite a decent and somewhat challenging level, though it's only with regards to how to place the bombers.

Palatable 8 - Pick a route, any route Nearly straightforward level here. Because of the lenient save requirement, you can easily ignore your losses here. There's also more than enough builders here to prevent them too.

Palatable 9 - Tandem Parachuting Probably the best level of the pack! The time limit is a bit unnecessarily tight here, but without that this is a great level. It's quite fun to beat the crowd to the splat falls and eliminate them before the others arrive. Well done!

Palatable 10 - Permafrost Another great level here. Now that I've rewatched my solution, I did some unnecessary stuff here, as this can easily be done without builders.

Palatable 11 - Gratuitous Death One of the hardest of the pack. I think I remember trying a lot of things that ultimately don't work. I think I remember initially going through the zapper trap but I would ultimately come up short I think.

Palatable 12 - At One Fell Swoop I like the idea here of using builders to extend a basher and also him releasing all the blockers! Difficult one due to the high RR

Palatable 13 - Trips and Tracks Another great level! This was fun to figure out. Can be somewhat challenging but it's not too hard.

Palatable 14 - Got Ninety-Nine ProbLems, But... Not easy but not too hard to figure out. I would have to say getting the lemmings down to the exit was the hardest to figure out. I do like the release of the crowd and also cutting off the path of the long splatform near the bottom to solve the problem of the lemmings getting into danger so they can exit.

Palatable 15 - Don't Be Afraid Decent level that can be challenging, especially with the amount of obstacles to clear and the restricted skillset, with bombers and builders as the only skills to clear them.

Palatable 16 - Diligent Servants Great level and nice music here! This was fun to figure out, even if it's not that hard.

Palatable 17 - Emergency Evacuation Nice level and concept, although nothing special and memorable.

Palatable 18 - Uneven Distribution Nice level and solution.

Palatable 19 - As if four weren't bad enough Another really hard one. I think this was even the hardest level for me of the entire pack. With so much juggling going on, it's not easy to see the best way to distribute the skills to each section. Still quite a decent level here. I'm sure there are easier solutions than the one I found, but here I think the time limit is also a unnecessarily tight.

Palatable 20 - Vox Humana Not the hardest level for the final level of the pack, but it's not an easy one and a bit dragged out. Think the hardest part here was turning around to make the splatform on the other side of the tall steel wall. Builders might seem plentiful, but you can't waste any, as they are all used in the solution. Nice one to finish off the pack.   

Overall again quite a decent first level pack by SQRon188. Thanks again for it, as well as for Assorted Gubbins