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Messages - WillLem

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2656
Closed / Re: [SUG][PLAYER] Ability to turn skill shadows on and off
« on: May 12, 2020, 01:18:21 PM »
I feel this deserves a separate post: the discussion has brought about what I feel is the best solution to everyone's wishes and concerns, which is this:

Rather than providing the option to permanently disable Skill Shadows, make the F3 menu options thus:

Permanently enabled: Skill Shadows will always function as they do currently, i.e by hovering the cursor over the lemming.
Hotkey-only*: Skill Shadows will only function when hovering the cursor over the lemming and pressing a Hotkey (similar to the Splat Ruler) - if it could also be made so that the Hotkey must be user-assigned, then the player would be less likely to forget about it.

So - to make it clear - there would be no way to turn Skill Shadows OFF, and the Hotkey would function as a hold-to-assign rather than a toggle that can be accidentally pressed.

This would mean that players cannot disable them altogether and then forget about them, and would mean that anyone who'd prefer them to be assignable via Hotkey-only would likely create a Hotkey for them that they'll remember, and then use them whenever they need to.

2657
Closed / Re: [SUG][PLAYER] Ability to turn skill shadows on and off
« on: May 12, 2020, 12:27:56 PM »
How many of the cases of precision you speak of were ones that skill shadows can directly help with, though?

My point was more that Skill Shadows being able to help with precision isn't a reason to have precision in a level (i.e. whether or not they can directly help with said precision), just like CPM being able to help with hidden objects isn't a reason to have hidden objects in a level.

Also, since CPM is optional (in the sense that you can turn it on and off when needed), so should Skill Shadows be. EDIT: I'd also compare Skill Shadows to the Splat Ruler: both tend to be most useful whilst the game is paused, so accessing them via a Hotkey seems the best way to implement them.

with skill shadows, a few frames of framestepping while hovering over the lemming will find the correct placement pretty quickly
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Level designers should be encouraged to use the skill shadows, too, because the reason they help line up precise assignments can also help identify spots where a precise assignment can cause a different result than the one the designer intended.
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They can also help line up certain types of interactions when the game mechanics themselves demand some degree of precision to make a certain trick work at all.

I agree that Skill Shadows are useful, and time-saving, especially when combined with Framestepping. I also agree that Skill Shadows are remarkably helpful when it comes to finding and preventing backroutes. I also agree that there's no better way to precisely judge an intended trick.

However, I still think the player should have some degree of control over when they're visible, ideally via a Hotkey so they're always accessible in-game.

As I mentioned, if someone turns off the skill shadows early on, by the time they need them, they may forget the option is there, particularly if it's buried away in the hotkeys menu.

I'd have to agree that it would be unfortunate for a player to disable Skill Shadows initially (perhaps because they find them off-putting), and then forget they are still there as an option.

However, if a player is bothered enough by them to turn them off, they likely won't forget about them. They're a very unique, noticeable and gameplay-affecting part of the NeoLemmix platform; I think a more likely scenario would be that a player would turn them off initially, then once they feel more comfortable that they are able to control their experience, they'd probably turn them back on to see what it's like to play with them enabled, then make the choice to either keep them on or switch them off. By this point, they're very unlikely to forget that they exist as an option.

That said, after discussion/consideration I now believe that making Skill Shadows either permanently enabled (default) or hold-to-assign via a Hotkey (like the Splat Ruler) would likely be the best solution to all scenarios, rather than offering the option to turn them off altogether.

2658
Backroute fix for level 11 Citizen Lemming - thanks to kaywhyn for spotting this one!

The original replay still works, so the intended solution is the same.

2659
I finished the pack. For the most part, these levels weren't too bad, even if they were all somewhat on the easy side.

Glad to know! My intention was for this pack to never be more than about medium difficulty.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Thanks for the comments and the replays, and for taking the time to play through the pack. It's certainly not one of my best remix packs, but it did help me to learn a lot about level creation. I'm glad you enjoyed it, anyway. 8-)

2660
Also, could it be possible to open levels via drag & drop into the Editor?

2661
Closed / Re: [SUG][PLAYER] Ability to turn skill shadows on and off
« on: May 12, 2020, 03:35:22 AM »
When they weren't a feature at all, you really needed to make sure that skill assignments weren't overly precise. Now that they are present, levels can get away with these precise assignments without it being an issue

In a recent discussion about hidden objects, I made the argument that Clear Physics Mode means that hidden stuff is no longer an issue: whilst this may be true, the community still (mostly) considers hidden objects to be a bad design choice; not only does CPM make hidden stuff irrelevant, but having to use it on every level to check for hidden objects isn't something any player wants to do. I've now discontinued the practice of hiding stuff, having been convinced by these discussions that hiding objects is a bad design choice because of CPM, not in spite of it.

The point being that just because a player assist tool makes something easier or less of a problem doesn't mean that levels should contain those elements. Whether Skill Shadows become optional or not, it's still considered bad level design to make overly precise levels - I've been criticised for this a number of times.

So, in the same way that you wouldn't play with Clear Physics Mode permanently enabled just in case you happen upon a level with a hidden exit, Skill Shadows shouldn't be kept permanently enabled just in case you happen upon a level requiring precise skill application.

Skill Shadows are an assistive feature, and for that reason alone ought to be optional.

2662
Forum Games / Re: Ask a question, get a serious answer. (Mk 2)
« on: May 12, 2020, 03:25:58 AM »
Pepsi is better on its own, Coke is better as a mixer.

Pepsi Max Cherry is the best soft drink of them all! :lemcat:

Who is your favourite Simpsons character and why?

2663
NeoLemmix Main / Re: NXP extractor
« on: May 11, 2020, 07:46:46 PM »
This one extracts to a bunch of DAT files (which then extract to empty folders).

2664
Forum Games / Re: Corrupt-a-Wish
« on: May 11, 2020, 05:07:03 PM »
Congratulations, you are now a skeleton.

I wish I had a DeLorean.

2665
Closed / Re: [SUG][PLAYER] Ability to turn skill shadows on and off
« on: May 11, 2020, 04:47:47 PM »
The player should not have to tweak their options to play certain content, and level designers shouldn't have to account for the player's options when designing the level.

That's why I think it should be a hotkey that's accessible at any time rather than a menu option.

Some players might disable the skill shadows, play some content that doesn't really need them, and then forget about the option's existence by the time they encounter a level that requires it.

Not a problem: if players disable Skill Shadows in the first place, it's because they prefer to play with them off. They are likely to be skilled enough to make it through such a level with or without them.

I agree with Proxima that the difficulty of the game without Skill Shadows is being overstated here. Skills Shadows are meant to be an assistive tool, not a required/mandatory feature: if a pack cannot be played without them, then that's the fault of the pack, not the player or the option.

Also, again - this is why I'm suggesting it be implemented as a hotkey, so it's always accessible in-game, even to players who prefer to have the Skill Shadows switched off.

I think a hotkey to disable skill shadows is a bad idea; my reasoning is basically identical to Icho's:

It's just because new players may hit it unwillingly by accident and then just struggle through the game with no explanation what happened.

I'm now saying this for the third time, and I'm not sure how I can make it any clearer:

"it could be that there is no default Hotkey assigned for Skill Shadows, so players must go into the F3 menu and customise one themselves. This would ensure that players know which key toggles the Skill Shadows on and off, and eliminates the problem of a player accidentally toggling them off when they don't want to (and then not being able to switch them back on)."

If we were to include a menu option, a hotkey like with Clear Physics to temporarily show them would be useful. But, when they are enabled, the hotkey should do nothing, as for players who don't go out of their way to disable skill shadows in the menu, this behavior is never desirable. The opposite, however, is potentially useful and would deserve a default setting (I'm envisioning this as a hotkey to be held down).

Yes, very much agreed! This is a good idea, and would likely keep everyone happy on both sides of the debate. :thumbsup:

Essentially, what I'm suggesting is that Skill Shadows be given the same status/usage as Clear Physics Mode - it's there when you need it, but you can ignore it if you want to. The moment a level requires either of these features in order to be possible, then it's the fault of the design; people have been making that very clear to me since I joined the forums! ;P

2666
In Development / Re: [NeoLemmix] ConkLemms Demo
« on: May 11, 2020, 12:36:20 AM »
Nice! I'll give this pack a playthrough, for sure. Where did you get the Atari music from?

2667
Challenges / Re: [NeoLemmix] Skills you can't live without
« on: May 08, 2020, 05:11:54 AM »
Here's my most notable replays from that session:

Plain 23 Can You Bomb It? - 1 basher
Plain 27 Lemmings On The Spot - 5 builders

2668
Tech & Research / Re: Extracting levels from the Amiga version
« on: May 07, 2020, 08:23:31 PM »
OK, so... here's where I'm up to:

Thanks to namida, I have an extraction tool that can generate LVL copies of the Amiga levels by decompressing emulation savestates - genius! 8-)

Furthermore, thanks to geoo, I have a full set of already-extracted Amiga LVLs, which saves me having to create 120 savestates and extract them all manually.

I did a few manual extractions in order to compare the two by opening the respective LVL files in the NL Editor, to make sure they're the same. Indeed, both the savestate extraction and the LVL from geoo's zip folder looked like this:



As you can see, some of the water graphics are missing. It's good in the sense that, at least I know that the zip folder from geoo contains the exact files I'd obtain by extracting them manually using namida's tool. So, that puts the conversion project a few steps forward. :thumbsup:

I then discovered that opening either LVL file in the 1.43 Editor yields the following:



So - all of the water is there! This indicates that the files themselves do indeed contain the necessary data to generate the objects. However, it also confirms what namida said about new formats disregarding objects that are in a certain "slot", as the LVL file marks these as "fake".

All I have to do is open the files in 1.43, save it as a new LVL file, and then open it in the new Editor - everything is there, intact!



This means that no manual editing is necessary, which is great! However, it would take quite a lot of time to open each file, save it, re-open it, and save it again.

So, thankfully, namida then provided a magic version of NeoLemmix which doesn't disregard "fake" objects. By using NL's F8 "Cleanse levels" feature, I was able to obtain a full pack of completely processed NXLVs with all terrain and objects intact!

So, once again: thank you, namida and geoo! I can now start work on the newly restored conversion of Lemmings.

2669
Tech & Research / Re: Extracting levels from the Amiga version
« on: May 07, 2020, 06:15:35 PM »
I found these sitting on my hard drive. Is this what you're looking for?

Yes! Brilliant, thank you! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

2670
Closed / Re: [SUG][PLAYER] Ability to turn skill shadows on and off
« on: May 07, 2020, 02:16:05 AM »
There is, of course, one other thing to take into account here: Namida is looking at working towards a final version of NeoLemmix.

Surely it would be better for the final version to have this option, particularly if it isn't too difficult to implement and is unlikely to create any actual problems.

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