Revenge of the Lemmings - Level selection and ordering for v5

[Proxima]

Here's a first draft for what the first 20 levels of Picnic might look like. This is very rough, and I welcome all feedback for changes to the selection and ordering. Notes on my reasons for selecting each level, and any changes I've made:

1-1 9 ways to live: We agreed this was perfect as a first level.
1-2 Roadblock: From v2. Originally the blocker tutorial, repurposed as a 10-of-each.
1-3 It's a long, long way to fall: From v2.
1-4 Rise through the ranks: From v2, where it is the climber tutorial. Repeat of "A step too far" from Clammings (which I think is okay because I suggested a maximum of 5 levels from each of Mazu, Clam and I.S. could stay, and that was more because I wanted to keep those levels available for filling gaps like this, not because I want to keep the best five of each).
1-5 Lemmings on the Run: From Ben Bryant's pack, skillset changed to 10 of each. I shrunk the level to 160 pixels tall, which has meant that if the player lets the lemmings walk straight forward, they land on the rock instead of splatting; I think this is okay for such an early level.
1-6 Seeing red: From mobius's Outtakes collection.
1-7 The Small Jail: From v4. Should we cut out one group of lemmings?
1-8 Dig for Victory!: From v2, originally the digger tutorial. Placing it here makes it the trap introduction level (there is one in 1-5 but it's out of the way), and also means the first 10 levels include each tileset once.
1-9 Gotta Save 'em All!: From v2 and another Clam level. See above regarding tilesets.
1-10 Over or Under: From v4. Save requirement reduced to 15/20 (from 20/20) to make it more suitable for early placement; we could add a talisman for saving 20.
1-11 Through Fire and Flames: From v4. See above discussion for moving this later than its previous placement at 1-2.
1-12 In the cavern...: From v4.
1-13 Magnetic Area: From v4. Mobius didn't like this one much but I think it's an interesting way to get used to the mesh terrain and dealing with traps at RR 99.
1-14 Neighbors: From v4.
1-15 Somewhere Under the Rainbow: From v2. Easy repeat of Changing of the Guards. Since I haven't included Lemmington Spa (see below for why), I thought this could be a good replacement, as it has a similar "float down and build up" theme.
1-16 Nothing Gold Can Stay: From v4.
1-17 Let's Play Lemmings!: From v4.
1-18 The Fearsome Foursome: From v4.
1-19 Lem Dunk: From v4. Increased RR and lowered save requirement, since we can't use (NeoLemmix) RR below 50.
1-20 Minesweeper Lemmings: From v4.

The levels in v4's first 20 that are not included are:

Snowy Caves: Long and has more hazards, so it could come later in the rank.
Pipe Dream: Not sure about including this, but if we drop "Gotta Save 'em All!" this could replace it so we still have a bubble level in the first 10.
Lemmington Spa: Especially since we can only include five weirdybeardy levels, I favour keeping the original version of this rather than the 10-of-each version.
Surrealism: 10-of-each version is trivial. WillLem suggested making it 2-of-each, which is possible, but then it would come later.
Hedonist: Not sure about this one, still might include it.
Biosphere: Builder-heavy. Could still include it in the last 10.
Patience, Young Grasshopper: I need to solve the harder version before making a decision, and the 10-of-each version is not easy and would come later.
Himalayan Lemmings: Large and not very interesting.
Crystal Caves: I'm considering using the original (harder) version instead, in which case it would come later.

[WillLem]

@Proxima The 1-20 draft is looking good so far. I have only these comments to add:

1-7 The Small Jail: From v4. Should we cut out one group of lemmings?

I would say don't cut a group of lemmings. The level's symmetry is part of its aesthetic and appeal.

1-19 Lem Dunk: From v4. Increased RR and lowered save requirement, since we can't use (NeoLemmix) RR below 50.

We can use RR <50 for the NeoLemmix version, no need to change it. IMO, the RetroLemmini version can be different in this regard.

Pipe Dream: Not sure about including this, but if we drop "Gotta Save 'em All!" this could replace it so we still have a bubble level in the first 10.

Of the two, Pipe Dream is easily the better level, but "Gotta Save 'em All!" has a better title. Feels like it (the title) should be used somewhere.

[mobius]

While I agree it's nice to have a selection of various styles all around, I would caution against making this a major concern. I did for a while and I think the pack overall suffered because I kept this in mind. There's simply way more quality levels of certain styles (marble and pillar for example) than others and trying to shoehorn in levels of other types may have hurt the overall quality.

I'd agree Pipe Dream is a better level than the "gotta save em all". This is a good level for very early on and very a pack that's intended to be *very* beginner friendly, which I'm not sure is the best fit for this pack? But if so, then it fits.
I can give more feedback later when I have time.

Oh BTW; did you guys already figure out which levels are going into which pack; is it based on age?

[Proxima]

While I agree it's nice to have a selection of various styles all around, I would caution against making this a major concern. I did for a while and I think the pack overall suffered because I kept this in mind.

Don't worry, it's only something I thought of doing for the first 10 levels, and after that I won't think much about style balance (e.g. in the draft ordering, Levels 16, 17 and 19 are all Pillar). It might be something I consider as a deciding factor if I'm torn between two levels that could go either way, but that's all.

I'd agree Pipe Dream is a better level than the "gotta save em all". This is a good level for very early on and very a pack that's intended to be *very* beginner friendly, which I'm not sure is the best fit for this pack? But if so, then it fits.

It's meant to start easy and build up difficulty gradually. Yes, I'll probably put Pipe Dream back in in the next draft.

Oh BTW; did you guys already figure out which levels are going into which pack; is it based on age?

No, that was just an idea Will had, but I think it's a non-starter; I have enough on my plate without having to sleuth out level release dates, and it's a really arbitrary way to split the pack anyway. Instead, I think that in terms of difficulty, if the levels we are using were rated from 1 to 10, pack 1 would include levels from 1 to 8, pack 2 would be 3 to 10. So there's a lot of overlap, but all the easiest levels should go in pack 1 and all the hardest ones in pack 2. When it comes to sorting out the middle ranks, I'll just go by feeling, although there will be some rules, such as: repeat pairs should stay in the same pack; levels with similar solutions should be split up.