Author Topic: Which levels can be beaten without assigning skills to more than one lemming?  (Read 32313 times)

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Offline Proxima

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Yes, it's the flip side to namida's challenge. This time you may only give skills to one lemming.

(No nuke glitches were abused, spindled or mutilated in the creation of these results.)

Fun: All except 3, 4, 6, 13, 18. -- Non-100%: 2.
Tricky: All except 2, 10, 15-18, 22, 24, 25. -- Non-100%: 8, 12, 13, 23.
Taxing: All except 2, 7, 9, 16, 19, 23, 24, 27, 30. -- Non-100%: 5, 6, 28.
Mayhem: All except 5, 9, 11, 15, 19, 20, 21, 26, 29. -- Non-100%: 1, 2, 7, 10, 18, 25, 30.

Original Lemmings: 25 + 21 + 21 + 21 = 88/120

Tame: All possible with 100%
Crazy: All except 1, 3, 10, 14, 17. -- Non-100%: 11, 15, 18, 19.
Wild: All except 5, 7, 8, 13, 15, 18, 20.  -- Non-100%: 3, 10, 12, 19.
Wicked: 2, 4, 6, 11, 13, 15, 18, 19. -- 100%: 2, 18.
Havoc: 1, 3, 4, 6, 8, 10, 11, 15, 18, 19. -- Non-100%: 10, 18.

ONML: 20 + 15 + 13 + 8 + 10 = 63/100

Xmas 1991: All possible with 100%
Xmas 1992: 1-3.
Flurry: All except 8, 12, 16. -- 100%: all.
Blizzard: 1-7, 9, 12, 14. -- Non-100%: 12.
Frost: All except 6, 10, 13, 15, 16. -- Non-100%: 7, 14.
Hail: 1, 3, 4, 6, 8, 9, 11, 13. -- Non-100%: 6.

Holiday Lemmings: 2 + 3 + 13 + 10 + 11 + 8 = 47/70

Total: 88 + 63 + 47 = 198/290

Lemmings 2

Beach: All possible!
Cavelems: 1-3, 8.
Classic: 1-6, 10.
Space: All except 6.

Lemmings Revolution

Column 1: 1, 2.
Column 2: 2, 3, 4. -- 100%: all.
Column 3: 1, 4. -- 100%: both.
Column 4: 1, 3, 4, 5. -- 100%: 4, 5.
Column 5: 3, 4, 5, 7. -- 100%: 4.
Column 6: 1, 2. -- 100%: 1.
Column 7: 1, 7, 8, 9. -- 100%: all.
Column 8: 3, 5, 8. -- 100%: 3.
Column 9: 4, 5, 6, 7, 10, 11. -- 100%: all.
Column 10: 2, 7, 9, 10, 11. -- 100%: all.
Column 11: 2, 11. -- 100%: 11.
Column 12: 1, 3, 5, 6. -- 100%: 1, 3, 6.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2020, 02:47:50 am by Proxima »

Offline namida

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I was considering this myself, and is indeed how I found the solution to Fun 26.

Also, Fun 2 is definitely not impossible at all. However, 100% is impossible.

Also: I don't think it needs to be said that all of Tame is possible.

Fun 9 is possible with 100%. It's not the exact same lemming, but the right one is always possible to select at the time and is just lost in the crowd.

Offline Proxima

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Also, Fun 2 is definitely not impossible at all. However, 100% is impossible.

Oh yes, I forgot you only need to save one lemming :D

Offline ccexplore

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Fun 9 is possible with 100%. It's not the exact same lemming, but the right one is always possible to select at the time and is just lost in the crowd.

Actually, the game mechanics favor more recently entered lemmings if all lemmings under the cursor are walkers, so in general, if the worker lemming became lost in the crowd, it is not trivial to pick him out again, and in some case may truly be impossible.

Nevertheless, I was able to make your solution actually work with the same lemming, as you can verify with the text version of the attached replay.  The only dicey part was between assigning him the miner and then the digger after his initial 3-step building, which as you know is the first place you screwed up in your solution.  (The miner has to revert to walker first before you can assign him digger, because it's on that frame of reversion that the miner actually moved horizontally, allowing your digging to be positioned correctly.)

That part you can pick out the same lemming with a little luck/timing, because any lemmings from the crowd to the left of him may all be on the 3-step bridge, and so if you keep your mouse cursor as low as possible and also leaning left, you can indeed pick up just your worker lemming on your mouse cursor.  Then to avoid this sort of hairy lemming selection, I finish the rest of the solution by keeping the worker lemming working on something, so that he can always be selected out of the crowd.  In particular, I have him build towards the pillar to bash it, rather than have him walk to it to bash.

[edit:  oh I see, Proxima added a stipulation about picking out any lemming from the crowd again.  I think if you're relaxing the criteria that way, maybe you should indicate which levels you've done so far that rely on that rule, so that other people like me can then check which ones are truly possible to assign skills to only one lemming.]

[edit2:  replay removed because it's been superceded by a solution that also works on Tricky 26.]

Offline ccexplore

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Caveat: if you lose your "worker lemming" in a crowd, you're allowed to fasten on one lemming and assume that's the right one -- this allows levels like Fun 12 to be beaten that would otherwise be a real pain even though they are obviously theoretically possible.

Actually, there's no need to invoke your rule on Fun 12.  Just assign climber to your worker lemming first, this will give you a natural way to separate him out no matter what.

I would ask that in the spirit of the main criteria of the challenge (assigning skills to only one lemming), that your additional rule be avoided as much as possible, invoked only when absolutely necessary.  Furthermore, any levels which have only been confirmed using that rule should be called out as such, so that further work can be done to determine whether the rule is truly needed on that level.

Offline Proxima

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To make things simpler, I've just removed that rule. You're right about it not being needed so far -- I would have thought of the climber trick myself if I'd done the levels in a different order, since it's by far the easiest way to approach levels like Fun 16.

If we do find any levels that can be done with that rule but not without it, then I'll maintain a separate list as you suggest.

Offline ccexplore

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Here's Fun 27 100%.  There's a subtle trick at the very beginning which if you don't look carefully, you might miss.  Details below:

Quote from: highlight to read
There's a delay between the builder laying down a build brick and moving on top of it.  If you dig in between those two phases as I did at the very beginning, the digging will leave the rightmost pixel of the brick intact.  That pixel will make the right wall of the digger's pit just high enough to block lemmings that way.

Offline ccexplore

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There's one more thing I need to clarify.  Note that the game mechanics does not prioritize lemmings assigned climber and/or floater over non-climbers/non-floaters, so my remark about assigning a climber does not mean that if you do so, you will be guaranteed to pick him out in a crowd.  All I mean is that since you can assign climbers well in advance of any actual climbing, you can usually rely on the climber separating himself out from the crowd, when you have the crowd contained by high walls.

Offline ccexplore

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Tricky 26 is possible using basically my Fun 9 100% solution.  The only refinement I need to make was to not waste any bashers when making the 3-step bridge at the beginning.  Those bashers (which I inherited from namida's original solution) turn out to be completely unnecessary.

I've attached the Tricky 26 solution here, and removed my earlier Fun 9 solution since it's been superceded by this one.

Offline Proxima

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OK, as there are now quite a few results better than my original lists I've replaced the first post with a list of what has so far been achieved. And added Mayhem 24 because it's obvious.

Offline ccexplore

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Tricky 20 and 27 can be removed from the non-100% list.

Offline Dullstar

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Interesting...  off to ONML!

I'm not done yet, but so far 1-3 are possible...  I'll check all of tame.

Offline Proxima

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I thought those two might turn out to be 100%able... fortunately I was able to work out your solutions just from reading the text files  :thumbsup:

Offline Dullstar

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The entire first half of Tame can be done with 100%.  Actually, there were two levels that I didn't get 100% on, but that was on one because of a mistake (dug down too far so I had to break through the floor with a bomber) and the other was because I didn't feel like waiting for all the lemmings.

Offline ccexplore

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fortunately I was able to work out your solutions just from reading the text files  :thumbsup:

 :D Okay, I'll remember to at least include a screenshot next time.  The Lemmix replay thing was supposed to alleviate me from having to write a detailed explanation, so I'll tend to be a little slow in doing that sort of thing, but I think a quick screenshot can usually capture 80% of how the solution works, and should complement the text files nicely.