Author Topic: [SUG] Collectibles  (Read 614 times)

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Online WillLem

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[SUG] Collectibles
« on: February 25, 2024, 04:01:04 AM »
It's an idea that's come up a number of times in a number of different conversations.

Mario has coins and power-ups, Sonic has rings and chaos emeralds, Lara has jade, silver and gold dragon statues (in TRII, that is).

I've always thought that Lemmings is a game for which collectibles would be an ideal match, particularly in levels which offer multiple solutions.

What collectible should Lemmings have? Pickups and buttons have a very specific in-game purpose, and can be made non-optional for the level's solution; ideally, we need something that rewards exploration and provides value whilst remaining fully optional at all times. We want to do something cool if a player gets them all, as well.

Ideas and suggestions very welcome.

Offline Herby

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2024, 06:50:17 AM »
For example: Talisman pieces. Gold, silver, and bronze.

Idea is not bad.

Offline Simon

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2024, 12:33:42 PM »
Clones (clonesgame.com) has golden baubles, which they call qdots. Clones screenshot

The GUI shows the collection in the top left, and it counts for for online highscores. To have a chance at a top spot, you needed all golden baubles. The baubles were more important in highscores than the score (however they computed it) or maximizing the save count.

For the record, I do not want to do anything cool when the player collects them all. <_<

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Online WillLem

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2024, 03:14:46 PM »
Began work on this today.

For now, I'm thinking a blue diamond, but suggestions are welcome if anyone has any better ideas. Talismans could absolutely work as a collectible, but since they're already used for Talismans themselves, it's probably better to go with something else.

Here's the panel icon (the only thing implemented so far):



The idea here is that when there are still collectibles available in the level, the icon will appear in greyscale. Then, once all have been collected, the icon will appear in colour:

--->

This allows for any number of collectibles to be added to a level, with no need to display a number in the panel (we'll still display a number in the preview and postview screens, and possibly on the Window caption).

Thoughts and suggestions very welcome, this idea is very much in its infancy so there's plenty of room for development.



Also see the invincibility mode topic, which could be a possible reward for obtaining all diamonds available in the level (or perhaps we include a special diamond which grants this ability). Please note that this doesn't mean collectibles will definitely be linked to invincibility mode - we could add one, and not add the other, or add both but have them as separate features.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2024, 05:30:36 PM by WillLem »

Online WillLem

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2024, 06:15:18 PM »
Continued with basic implementation today. We have a collectible blue diamond with various animation states, plus the skill panel icon now responds to whether or not they have all been collected (this is also reset correctly if the level is rewound beyond the point of the final diamond being collected). Note that the icon won't appear at all if the level doesn't contain collectibles.

Here's a demonstration gif:



Obviously, the animation needs to be improved - I'll get on that later. Some questions in the meantime:

1) Should the diamond itself be smaller, or is it good that it's the same size as the one in the skill panel?

2) Should the diamond disappear when collected, or is the greyed-out version OK? My thinking here is that players may wish to still be able to see where the collectibles were, in the same way that pickups and buttons remain visible even when no longer active

3) Should something happen when all are collected? I'll likely soon begin work on Invincibility mode, which could work as a possible reward for obtaining all of the blue diamonds (yes, I realise how strong the Sonic influence is here ;P) - do people like this idea, or should Invincibility be a separate feature obtained some other way? Or, should it be up to the level designer?

4) Any other thoughts?

I'm going to rule out keeping count of the collectibles in-game - I don't want to clutter up the skill panel any more, and it's possible to display a total number on the Window caption if necessary. We'll still track the numbers in preview, postview, and the level select menu as per other level records and talismans, etc (I also want to add the talisman icons to the postview screen at some point).



EDIT: We now also have Editor support, with a method for counting the total number of available collectibles and adding this to the level file. This will come in handy later when tracking records, etc.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2024, 10:30:24 PM by WillLem »

Online WillLem

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2024, 05:24:52 PM »
Added level select screen support today!

We now account for collectibles in user records (note that the icon is coloured in blue when the total number of diamonds available in the level has been collected):





Plus, we have a speed button for showing just the collectibles record. If the World Record beats the user's, this is also shown (note that the speed button is currently grey because the user hasn't yet obtained all collectibles):





And finally, the speed button icon changes to blue once all diamonds have been collected during a single successful level completion:

« Last Edit: March 16, 2024, 10:31:35 PM by WillLem »

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2024, 08:34:48 PM »
Added a preview screen button:



« Last Edit: March 20, 2024, 06:21:15 AM by WillLem »

Online WillLem

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2024, 06:20:10 AM »
Added the ability to customise collectibles per-style.

Each style now has an "icons" folder, into which can be placed the "panel_icons", "levelinfo_icons" and "talismans" image. Each of these now includes the new collectible (a blue diamond by default). Here's an example:

-/-/-/-

So, the left image features the default blue diamond, which will appear in the level select screen for any level featuring default lemmings. For lemminas, the diamond has been changed to pink.

Of course, for other styles, this icon can be changed to whatever the designer wants the collectible item to be in their style. Note that the icon will then also need to be changed for the "panel_icons" and "talismans" graphics as well, and placed into a folder called "icons" within the custom style folder.

For now, all styles with custom sprites have had the diamond added to "levelinfo_icons" (this includes Millas, Soniclems, and all Lemminas styles). This is to guarantee continuity when the default is released; it's then up to the style creator if they want to change it to something else from there.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2024, 06:00:47 PM by WillLem »

Online WillLem

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2024, 06:00:37 PM »
Much improved animation for the diamond:



Meanwhile, zombies deactivate collectibles (so, we have a use for that monochrome diamond after all!). This requires collectibles to have an additional graphic for the deactivated state, or at least some sort of animation handling when a collectible has been disabled by a zombie.

All that remains now is to decide what to do when all diamonds have been collected. Possible ideas:

:lemming: Activate invincibility mode for the lem that collects the final diamond
:lemming: Unlock a secret level
:lemming: Reveal an alternative exit (or, maybe the final diamond could become an exit)
:lemming: Set all skills to infinity-of-each (this would differ from the Infinite Skills hotkey in that it wouldn't activate "Infinite Skills mode", so player records would be saved and it would count as having solved the level)
:lemming: Clone all lemmings, or just the lemming that collects the final diamond (just riffing now)

Ideas welcome!

Collectibles will be available as of SLX 2.7 even if we haven't decided on what to do when all are collected. This can be something we decide later, even if the decision is ultimately to do nothing. Currently, we simply record that all diamonds have been collected - this is then shown in the level select, and on the preview screen. That may be sufficient, but it's worth discussing the possibility of an in-game reward whilst the feature is still very much in development.

« Last Edit: March 21, 2024, 12:55:34 AM by WillLem »

Offline mobius

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Re: [SUG] Collectibles
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2024, 01:49:03 AM »
I like the idea (similar to talismans) of having a thing like this as a bonus challenge on a level. Can fit in any kind of level but particularly good for "fun" levels. I'm having trouble coming up with a more complicated use atm.
everything by me: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=5982.msg96035#msg96035

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