Author Topic: What skills can't you live without?  (Read 61818 times)

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Offline namida

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2009, 08:48:03 am »
Tricky  20 is a complex one.... with a rather nice result.

In the Single Skill Per Lemming topic, cc's solution didn't use climbers nor floaters.  Those two are off the list.
No bombers is obvious, you can use the standard solution and build over the blocker instead of bombing him.
No blockers, you can dig and build to turn your climber around. (Dealing with the left side on this should be fairly obvious)
No builders is... well, pretty much the standard solution.
No bashers, mine the first obstacle, and after turning around past the one way wall, climb back up, dig on the edge, and mine.
The standard solution  does not use miners or diggers.

So,

Tricky 20: None.



Also, about ditching the basher on Tricky 16 - I think I know what you're thinking of, and trust me, I've done that idea to death. It doesn't seem to be possible.

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2009, 08:51:40 am »
Tricky 19
If I'm not mistake, 1 climber, 1 builder, 1 basher, 1 miner, 1 digger. I suspect it's possible without any floaters, but I'll wait for someone else to confirm this.

Tricky 19: 1 climber, 1 builder, 1 digger (sorry!) Obviously it can't be done with these skills alone, but these are the only skills common to all the solutions.

Offline namida

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2009, 08:53:07 am »
Tricky 21
You can solve it with bashers and builders, or miners and builders. To hold back the crowd, you can use either diggers, miners or blockers. So the only thing essential is the builders. The fewest I can do is 3.

Tricky 21: 3 Builders

Tricky 22
It can be solved  bombers-only. It can also be solved builders-only.

Tricky 22: None

Tricky 23
As far as I'm aware, there's no solution that doesn't use all three destruction skills, the builder, and one climber...  >_>
(By the way, I just noticed that this and Tricky 19 have the same skill set!)
EDIT: Or maybe not. It can be done without the miner.  Thanks Proxima.

Tricky 23: 1 Climber, 1 Builder, 1 Basher, 1 Digger

Tricky 24
As far as I can tell, at least one blocker is needed for crowd control. You also need two builders to reach the exit.

Tricky 24: 1 Blocker, 2 Builders

Tricky 25
There's a no-floater solution out there.  When you get to the far right column, you have a choice of either bashing or mining through it. All solutions use at least two builders, however. So...

Tricky 25: 2 Builders

Tricky 26
If I remember correctly, there's an over-the-top solution which shouldn't need bashers (you'd only need to create holes in the bridge maybe, and a miner or digger can do that). You can do it without builders by bashing right next to the post, then making the next lemming mine then immediately bash when he's just about to turn around.

Tricky 26: None

Tricky 27
I'll let someone else get this one.

Tricky 28
It can be done with only builders, so all other skills are non-essential. It seems the minimum amount of builders you can do it with is 2, so...

Tricky 28: 2 Builders

Tricky 29
It can be beaten with only bashers. It can also be beaten without bashers. Replay attached. Therefore,

Tricky 29: None

Tricky 30
You can do it with blockers,  builders and miners. (Block off the crowd, mine and build across the two lower sections)
You can do it with climbers and miners. (This one is pretty obvious)
The only common skill between these two solutions is miners. Attached is a replay that doesn't use miners.

Tricky 30: None
« Last Edit: May 14, 2020, 05:32:34 pm by Minim »

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2009, 09:06:18 am »
Tricky 23
As far as I'm aware, there's no solution that doesn't use all three destruction skills, the builder, and one climber...  >_>
(By the way, I just noticed that this and Tricky 19 have the same skill set!)

Tricky 23: 1 Climber, 1 Builder, 1 Basher, 1 Miner, 1 Digger

No, the miner is not necessary.

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2009, 09:11:48 am »
Tricky 26
If I remember correctly, there's an over-the-top solution which shouldn't need bashers (you'd only need to create holes in the bridge maybe, and a miner or digger can do that). You can do it without builders by bashing right next to the post, then making the next lemming mine then immediately bash when he's just about to turn around.

Tricky 26: None

A faster solution without bashers:
Quote
Make a pass-through blocker, build one bridge-length before the pillar, mine when you reach it, make the miner build on the other side if necessary. Once all lemmings are facing right, there will still be lemmings falling from the trapdoor; make one dig then build to release the blocker.

And another neat solution without builders:
Quote
Make a pass-through blocker, bash the pillar, release the blocker as before except (obviously) you bash rather than build to stop the digger.

Offline Clam

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2009, 09:14:45 am »
Also, about ditching the basher on Tricky 16 - I think I know what you're thinking of, and trust me, I've done that idea to death. It doesn't seem to be possible.

I did it ;)

The replay is attached to my post on the previous page where I brought this up (edited in after you quoted it)
EDIT: wait, you didn't quote it at all. The replay is here.

Offline Clam

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2009, 09:16:39 am »
Wow, this has exploded all of a sudden... I'll try to keep up. :XD:


Tricky 19: 1 climber, 1 builder, 1 basher. Obviously it can't be done with these skills alone, but these are the only skills common to all the solutions.

It's quite easy to do without the basher. As for the miner and digger, I'm not sure. I'll have another look.
EDIT: OK, I found a no miner solution. That's a new one on me :)

Offline namida

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2009, 09:25:21 am »
Crap, you beat me to it. >_>

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2009, 09:26:06 am »
Oh  ;P I put it that way round first (including the digger but not the basher) then confused myself and thought "That can't be right!" and changed it.

The solution without the miner is the way I first solved the level -- same for Tricky 23. I guess if you happen to discover the reverse-miner trick to begin with it's harder to make yourself think about alternatives :P

Offline Clam

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2009, 09:35:58 am »
Oh... so you haven't found a no-digger solution. Ok then.

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2009, 09:41:29 am »
I've been trying Fun 23, though without the Tame 20 glitch. (I know what it is, just not how to pull it off.) Anyway, it can be done with just one builder, or with just one basher.

Offline Clam

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2009, 09:50:06 am »
Tricky 24
As far as I can tell, at least one blocker is needed for crowd control. You also need two builders to reach the exit.

Tricky 24: 1 Blocker, 2 Builders

I'm fairly sure you can eliminate the blocker here. What you have to do is dig down next to two builder's bridges, one on each side (including the bridge to the exit). You can get 3 pixels of height from the builder and 4 from the digger, which is just enough to make the lemmings turn back. And here's the clever bit - when each digger has dug down exactly 4 pixels, make it mine and then use the miner trick with a bomber. And there you have it - a no-blockers holding pen. 8-) The only question is whether you can do this without losing too many lemmings - to find out I'll have to try it for real.  :sick:

EDIT: This turned out to be easier than expected - just tell the digger to mine right when it's about to explode :P

Replay attached.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2020, 05:39:39 pm by Minim »

Offline Clam

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2009, 09:59:31 am »
Tricky 28
It can be done with only builders, so all other skills are non-essential. It seems the minimum amount of builders you can do it with is 2, so...

Tricky 28: 2 Builders

Possible with 1 builder (start under the platform and block it while it builds) due to the misplaced steel area - you can just bomb this away. Even if this was steeled, you could steel-glitch it out anyway. :D

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2009, 10:13:39 am »
Crazy 1: 1 blocker
Crazy 2: 1 climber, 3 builders, 1 digger
Crazy 3: 2 bombers
Crazy 4: 6 builders
Crazy 5: 7 builders
Crazy 6: 1 climber, 2 diggers, 5 builders
Crazy 7: 1 climber, 1 floater, 3 builders, 1 basher
Crazy 11: 1 builder :P

Offline Proxima

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Re: What skills can't you live without?
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2009, 10:19:00 am »
EDIT: Tricky 27: 2 builders. All other skills can be avoided.