I know very few people use this any more, but...

Is there anyone who knows how to compile a level pack that can be recognised as such in SuperLemmini? Putting the folders with the levels in "levels" doesn't seem to be enough.

I've had a look at the existing level folders/config files that other people have created and can't fathom exactly what needs to be typed where.

Any help with this is much appreciated

-WillLem

Hi all,

I invite you to share some of the backroutes or interesting solutions you may have discovered whilst playing any of the Lemmings games.

The challenge here is to solve some of the more difficult levels in an unusual way. this is particularly challenging in the Oh No! levels, which often have only one or two intended solutions.

Here are of a few of mine to start things off. Lemme know what you think!

Lemmings Mayhem 13 - The Great Lemming Caper
Oh No! More Lemmings Havoc 4 - The race against cliches
Oh No! More Lemmings Havoc 15 - Have an ice day

- WillLem

I've updated this topic with a new post, that takes a different approach - whereas the first post is more a list of "here's everything you can do", the second post is a step by step to go from "I've just got some random levels" to "Here's my pack, properly sorted into ranks etc".

https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4335.msg77545#msg77545

Brilliant, this is what I was looking for. I have only just begun creating levels really so it won't be relevant for a while yet, but it's nice to know the info is there.

Cheers,

-WillLem

I've finished all default & custom sprites now, and made a few tweaks to get them just right. Couldn't wait to begin so I've started work on the Xmas Lemmings as well.

Here's the Xmas Blocker (L&R) as a taster for now

-WillLem

Yeah, I do think without the belt would be better for the low-res sprites. (Hypothetically, it would be pretty cool for all sprites to have it once a lemming becomes a disarmer; but I also feel this would become too much effort - especially taking into account that anyone creating custom sprites would then need to follow suit. So I prefer to keep the low-res sprites pretty simple - but the high-res ones, yes, let's keep the cartoony look, it's really neat!)

Interestingly, I had the same thought - maybe Lemmings should keep the yellow hat & hi-vis when they become a disarmer. But then I realised that all sprites would have to be edited to follow suit (no pun intended), so hmmm... maybe not at this stage!

Here's the low-res Disarmer sans belt

I've also done the Stacker; quick question regerding this one, Builder and Platformer - the WinLemm sprites include dark brown 2x8 pixel rectangles to represent the building blocks, but then these are recoloured in the actual game. How does in work in NL, can these blocks be recoloured according to the level type/style? And what is the exact pixel size of a Stacker's building block (in hi-res)?

Finally, I'm sending these over at the moment just so you can see the work that's being done and get some ideas about how you could implement hi-res; I'll probably go over them all again once they're finished just to make a couple of final tweaks before sending over a full pack of the final versions. For a start, I'm thinking each Lemming needs a little cowlick of green hair: the WinLemm sprites don't include this, so I'll want to make sure that's included in the final versions! Let me know if there are any details you'd like to include as well.

All best,

- WillLem

Did you create a low-res version of the disarmer sprite? If so, let's try and get that one in to the upcoming NL12.7 update, or even possibly the upcoming styles update - that's something we can make use of right away. (Obviously, I'd prefer the low res one didn't have these cartoony details - I do like them, but all the other low-res sprites don't have them, so for the sake of consistency I feel they should be a feature only of the high-res ones.)

Done! (see attached) I've de-cartoonified it and also re-coloured it to be consistent with the other original NL sprites. Let me know your thoughts, it'd be great to see this as part of the next update!

On a side note - before you get to these skills, there's a consideration that's come up in discussion for Diggers and Blockers - that we should have sprites that clearly indicate which direction they're facing, unlike the current ones which are basically symmetrical. I mention this because it makes more sense to do that the first time, rather than to have to redo them later for that. (This, in general, would extend to any state, other than animations that the lemming will no longer exist after completing, either because they die or because they exit; but of the existing ones, IIRC only those two, plus Disarmer which needs a new sprite anyway, has this issue. I guess Drowner too, as they can recover if you assign them a Swimmer, but that's such an obscure case that I don't think it needs a special effort for this.)

After some deliberation on this, I finally came up with the idea of the Blocker holding a STOP sign (see attached). I didn't want it to be too different from the original, plus it needs to remain clear that the Blocker affects Lemmings on either side. So, it's basically the same animation but the Lemming is holding a sign in the same hand as the direction they're facing. It's a possible solution anyway, let me know what you think.

As for the Digger, are you thinking having a brand new sprite that faces each way? That could work, although again I'm not sure about straying too far from the original with the classic skills. I'll put this as a last priority if the discussion is still ongoing. Having said that, maybe seeing a sprite in action might swing the decision... I'll see how I get on with the others first.

- WillLem

Nice work! I like the humorous touch.

Thanks NieSch. These were done in the silly spirit of the original game, hope I've managed to do it justice

The lemming sprites look very nice!

The button panels aren't particularly useful though, as they don't fit with how NL works. Take a look in styles/default/panel - notice how we have skill_panels.png that contains a few panel backgrounds (this basically works by using the first one for the first panel, second for the 2nd, etc, if it runs out, it loops back to the first one for the next panel), and then icon graphics such as icon_restart.png that just have the icon graphic with a blank background.

Thanks Namida, means a lot that you like these. I'm enjoying the project so I'll definitely keep going with the others.

As for the buttons... I can't help but think that it would be great to have a nice looking chunky button panel. I like the smooth, "clickable" button look & feel of Lemmini. Would it be a massive pain to implement a different panel style for hi-res mode?

If so, I'm happy to simply do an upscale of the existing panel components and provide sprites/graphics for all buttons including skills. That way, you can keep the coding the way it is whilst retaining a unique look for the skill buttons (rather than them defaulting to the skill sprite - unless this is what you'd prefer, of course).

Again, happy to help with all of this and do whatever's needed to make the finished article look as fantastic as possible. I'm really glad that you're on board for going ahead with it as a mini project, and I agree that it's best not to rush. It's better to take a decent amount of time over it to get it as solid as possible.

Hmm, it's possible I misremembered, but is the skill icon for floater posted by WillLem above the exact same graphic as the one of the frames for WinLemm floater sprite?  I'm not so sure (but don't have WinLemm around to compare)?  Are the sizes (width and height) even similar?

If the icons are basically same size as the sprite then I guess it matters a lot less.

I suppose the fact that past custom content creators never customized the icons differently from the sprites do speak volumes about demand for feature, that is a fair enough point.

I used one frame of the WinLemm floater sprite; re-coloured it, gave it an outline for more definition, added pupils for eyes, and changed the umbrella colour to red and white. I like the idea of having a "Super Sprite" as the button icons, an approach that quite a few versions of Lemmings have taken over the years.

Thanks all for your replies. It's great to feel a part of the community Watch this space for more sprites coming soon!

- WillLem

Quote from: namida on September 25, 2019, 08:57:23 PM

Hm, yeah, there's a bit of a style difference from the WinLemm ones, although I don't see any reason they wouldn't be at least useable.

Well, at least for Xmas Lemmings sprites, I think the Mac ones are your only choice for hi-res, since we know there are no WinLemm version, and the SuperLemmini ones are definitely not Mac and might possibly be created by author of SuperLemmini, and therefore potentially subjected to same licensing issues you alluded to earlier.  The SuperLemmini Xmas ones are also kind of crappy anyway IMO.

OK... I'll do my own using the WinLemm sprites as a guide. Might take a while to get those finished, I'll concentrate on the regular ones for now.

Btw, which level(s) is/are best to see the Disarmer, Fencer and Shimmier skills in action? If I know exactly what they're for it'll be easier to build the sprites.