Quote from: Proxima on March 30, 2026, 05:26:24 PMtaking over the RotL project and moving it back to RL
...
The only way that I can see this working is if those who are interested ... work together to agree on the level selection (and then ordering, backroute fixes etc), with the aim of producing final RL and NL versions with the same levels

Agreed, absolutely. Both versions should be as identical as possible. We all need to co-ordinate.

If it helps, I'm actually not too fussed about level selection/ordering, or backroute fixing. I'm happy for others to take that on.

The thing I feel strongest about is the amount of levels, the pack titles, the music (there's currently way too much), and the overall presentation.

Here's what I'd suggest:

Revenge of the Lemmings (120 levels)
Picnic / Hootenanny / Carnage / Armageddon

Return of the Lemmings (120 levels)
Kind / Cunning / Devious / Menacing

Lemmings Assemble (120 levels)
Breezy / Clever / Perplexing / Ridiculous

Just to quickly add; in case I didn't mention this before; every time I produced an update; my biggest concern was taking in everyone's feedback. "a level=incompatible with NL (or visa versa) wasn't the only reason levels got removed or altered. Obviously every single piece of feedback isn't available in the threads, but some of it should be. At one point Akseli and Pieuw made entire google docs with feedback on every single level. And there's opinions by those who LP'd the games like kaywhyn. Again, its not my call anymore, but imho these opinions should be taken into account. Atm, i don't know where to find those docs, I'll try looking if anyone wants.
I bring this up because the Lemmini version is older and therefore contains levels removed from later versions, like 'Oh no, not again', for example because only 1 person I remember liked it; everyone else that voiced an opinion pretty much hated that level.

Another important thing is backroute fixes and polishes and that sort of thing. I haven't looked at these recent updates of the Lemmini version (and frankly don't intend to) but I wonder if older problems and mistakes in those were brought back here.

Anyways; no intents to be a downer or anything; I fully support whatever you guys do with this. If we start a new pack (sequel or whatever) I'd recommend making a new topic for that, inviting people to post levels and go through a playtesting period, like we did with the lix community set. That was tons of fun honestly, I hope we can do that again, even if my involvement is minimal.

I think it's really great that we're starting to move on this -- a final revamp of RotL is something that has needed to happen for a long time, and hopefully we can agree on enough to work together. That said, right now I am concerned about this project getting off on the wrong foot.

Quote from: WillLem on March 28, 2026, 12:41:48 AMMainly because RetroLemmini is an experience closer to playing the original game than any of the other engines, and it seems like a more appropriate platform for OG-style levels. But also, because it would simply be good to have more custom content for RetroLemmini. I've worked hard on updating the engine, making it more user-friendly, and adapting the NL Editor for use with it, so a collab pack with community involvement would be the icing on the cake at this point.

This is my biggest concern. Don't get me wrong, I agree with all the points you just made, but none of those are a sufficient reason for taking over the RotL project and moving it back to RL. We already have the problem of too many versions floating around, and I'm worried that this will now get even worse.

The only way that I can see this working is if those who are interested (you, me, kaywhyn, anyone else who wants to join us) work together to agree on the level selection (and then ordering, backroute fixes etc), with the aim of producing final RL and NL versions with the same levels (maybe with the odd replacement if some levels really don't work in one engine or the other, but let's hope that doesn't happen).

Environment:
Windows 10, Turkish locale (tr-TR)
Affects both SLXEditor 3.0.2 and NLEditor 1.42

Description:
On a system with Turkish locale, the editor corrupts .nxlv files in two ways when saving:

Skill name corruption: Skill keywords such as SWIMMER are saved as SWİMMER (with a dotted capital İ). This is caused by String.ToUpper() following Turkish locale rules, where i uppercases to İ instead of I. The NeoLemmix Player does not recognize SWİMMER as a valid keyword, so the skill is ignored entirely.
Skillset data loss: The entire $SKILLSET block is saved empty. Opening an existing level with skills defined (e.g. SWIMMER 4, DISARMER 2) and doing Save As produces a file with a blank $SKILLSET block, stripping all skill assignments. This appears to be a consequence of the same issue — the editor fails to match or write skill names when the locale-aware string comparison/conversion produces unexpected characters.

Root cause:
This is a well-known .NET pitfall sometimes called the "Turkish I problem". In most languages, i.ToUpper() produces I. However, Turkish (and a small number of other locales including Azerbaijani) have a dotted/dotless I distinction: they have four separate letters — i, İ, ı, I — and their casing rules reflect this. So on any tr-TR or az-AZ system, .NET's locale-aware string methods will silently produce different results than on any other system.
This is not a UTF-8 issue — the files are encoded correctly. It is purely a string operation behavior issue. The same bug would affect any user whose Windows system locale is set to Turkish or Azerbaijani, regardless of their keyboard layout or display language.
All calls to String.ToUpper(), String.ToLower(), and String.Compare() that deal with keywords or identifiers should explicitly pass CultureInfo.InvariantCulture to guarantee consistent behavior across all locales:

csharp
// Problematic:
keyword.ToUpper()
// Fix:
keyword.ToUpper(System.Globalization.CultureInfo.InvariantCulture)

Impact:
Any level saved through the editor loses its entire skillset. The editor is completely unusable for level creation on Turkish systems.
Affected locales are not limited to Turkish. The same dotted/dotless I distinction applies in Azerbaijani (az-AZ) and Crimean Tatar (CRT) and Kazakh (KAZ) as well.

Never got around to replying, oops!

All your replays look good, including Tense 8. Surprising that it was much harder than the repeat! Though considering the repeat had backroutes in testing, perhaps it never got the best evaluation of difficulty. But it could also just be a matter of different people finding different things difficult; we'll see!

Glad you enjoyed the levels!

I've made some progress with this already. We have all the music in .mod format (much smaller file size than .ogg or .mp3), and the levels are all converted to .rlv.

I'm working my way through them quickly just to check for things like screen start positions, empty space, and to make sure the standard solutions work (big thanks to ericderkovits and IchoTolot for posting solutions on YouTube for when I get stuck!)

As for ordering, level selection, backroute fixing and stuff like that, that can happen later. Once I have everything good to go I'll post a suggested "track listing" for the first 2 packs along with the pre-prepared levels and we can go from there.

Sounds great! It'd be interesting to hear what you come up with. All the best with it

Version 2.9.5 hotfix update

User records weren't being stored/displayed correctly - this has now been fixed (amongst other things). To everyone who has been keeping up with the version updates, many thanks for your patience and support.

Here's what's changed:

Player Records

• Bugfix - Completed was being set to "false" incorrectly in 2.9.4, this has now been fixed. If you downloaded 2.9.4 before I had a chance to catch this, and have used it to play levels, see these instructions for quickly restoring your progress.
• Bugfix - Records are once again shown correctly in the Level Select dialog. The refactor which fixes this also fixes a number of other de-sync bugs.
• Player records are now always automatically backed up when opening RL, not just when migrating between formats.

Replay Autosaving

• Replays are now automatically saved into a sub-folder with the same name as the level pack
• Improved default name string - titles are concatenated to allow for single underscores (rather than double) between tags, and timestamp values are separated by "-" rather than "_"

Hold LMB to Assign

• 'Ctrl' instead of 'Alt' is now used for this feature for stability purposes
• So, hold Ctrl and LMB to automatically assign skills to any lemming under the cursor!

Skill Panel

• Holding LMB and dragging the cursor across the panel now switches between buttons

DMA Levels

• Renamed SEGA Lemmings rating to 'SEGA' rather than 'Extra Levels'.

Music

• Updated default .mod tracks.
• Further improvements to missing music handling.

A reminder of what's new as of 2.9.

---

Get the latest version here.

Thank you so much, what a big help. We're playing a very old version on a very very old b/w Macintosh laptop ;-) And we import the midi files into logic to play around there...!

Hi kalo, welcome to the Forums. I'm sure we'll be able to help.

Please find attached the MIDI tracks that are available from the Windows 95 port. I'm not sure if this is what you want. Which version/port of lemmings are you playing?