Author Topic: Hello  (Read 7545 times)

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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Hello
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2009, 09:43:40 PM »
I have no idea.

Offline namida

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Re: Hello
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2009, 11:01:52 AM »
They're all level packs for Cheapo.

You can find all my old packs here:
http://lemcrazy370.tripod.com/stuff/level.htm

The only exception is Lemmings Plus 3, which can be found here:
http://207.58.177.175/~geoo89/lemmings/lp3full.zip

You *should* be able to use the older style files with LP3 even though it contains new ones. The only difference is the music.

Also note that a file "generic.sty" is missing. Although you'll get the wrong music, you'll be able to play the levels by renaming (or rather, copying, to avoid the original file being missing) the Orig-Columns.sty to generic.sty.

Rather than just being hard the whole way through, it works like the original games, having several difficulty rankings, each one harder than the last. While in LP1, this is quite erratic and there are many harder levels on lower difficulties, LP2 and LP3 are more standardized. That's not to say LP1 doesn't have it's good levels at all.

Some of the best levels IMO:

Lemmings Plus 1:
Return of the T (I consider this the ultimate level of LP1)
Don't Shoot My Lemming

Lemmings Plus 2 (note: a lot of the Lemmings Plus 2 levels are just taken from the Ultimate Challenge packs):
Oblivion (and to a lesser extent, the Oblivion clones, which basically use the same trick but add in other elements)
Death In All Directions
Lemmerixo (I consider this the ultimate level of LP2)

Lemmings Plus 3:
The Final Countdown
The Last Laugh
Lemmings From Beyond The Unknown
Warped Out
To The End! (I consider this the ultimate level of LP3 and possibly the most challenging level I've ever made that isn't in any way "unfair")


For those who've never played Oblivion or an Oblivion-based level, I strongly urge you to give it a go. The trick used to beat it (which is actually a genuine trick, and not some kind of obscure glitch) is a genius one that, at the time, even some of the most experienced players didn't think of trying. I don't think anyone actually ever managed to solve it until I hinted at what the trick was.
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)

Online Proxima

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Re: Hello
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2009, 06:25:56 PM »
Lemmerixo (I consider this the ultimate level of LP2)

Awesome level, but perhaps not quite "ultimate". For that, try saving 100%. You'll find it's quite a nice challenge with an interesting solution, worthy of being a separate level in itself.

Offline namida

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Re: Hello
« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2009, 02:45:42 AM »
LP2 in general is not very hard.
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)

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Re: Hello
« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2009, 12:32:29 PM »
Maybe so, but I'd hoped to provoke more of a reaction from you than that :P

Offline namida

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Re: Hello
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2009, 03:46:15 PM »
LP1 & 2 are very old now. I don't even remember most of the levels from them, I'd probably get quite stuck if I went through again and played them all. The only hard levels I can still solve are Return of the T, Oblivion and Death in all Directions, probably because they're among my favourite creations (Oblivion for the reasons mentioned before, Return of the T because it was the first hard level I ever made, and Death in all Directions simply because it's fun). (Yep, I can't even remember how to solve Lemmerixo anymore.)

LP3, on the other hand, is still new enough for me to remember how it's done.

I really need to find my backup disc that has the completed parts of LP4 on it. Some of the levels were pure genius. The released demo contains one of the best, as well as the easier version of another (if I can remember how the hard version worked), but that still means a LOT of lost levels, considering I had completed 61 levels (43 of which were unique).
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Hello
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2009, 06:45:30 PM »
We need screenshots of those levels...  then I'd make Lemmings Plus DOS!
What?  Cheapo isn't WINE compatible.  :(

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Re: Hello
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2009, 10:00:24 PM »
That would be cool. The only snag is that the screenshots really would have to be taken by the original creator, since in Cheapo once levels are compiled into a set I don't think there's any way to access them in the editor. You could take screenshots in-game but it would take a long time as you'd have to do it one screenful at a time.

Offline namida

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Re: Hello
« Reply #23 on: August 03, 2009, 06:25:46 AM »
The levels are only compiled into one file, not encrypted in any way. I'm very sure they can be extracted.

However, some of the Lemmings Plus levels rely on mechanics exclusive to Cheapo. Out of the levels mentioned before, I can say for sure that at the very least Oblivion and To The End don't work in DOS (although Oblivion could probably be modified to work in DOS while retaining the same trick). Another one of the better (albeit not that hard) ones from Lemmings Plus 3, "The Way Across", also does not work in DOS. Then of course, there's ones that require vertical scrolling, or the ones that use custom graphic sets with object types that don't exist in DOS. And the upside down ones (not that Lemmings Plus made much use of this, the only levels I can think of off the top of my head in the entire LP series that did this are "We All Fall Up" and "We All Fall Up XP")

A DOS version of the Lemmings Plus series, while certianly possible, would require at least some of the levels to be modified or replaced with new ones. If the Custom Lemmix is ever released, I'll definately look at rebuilding the Lemmings Plus series on it. A possible alternative is using the source code to recompile a Lemmings Plus version of it.

EDIT: Indeed, I have managed with little difficulty to extract a level from a compiled set. I'll look into writing an app to automatically decompile a set.
EDIT: To test this in practice, I extracted "To The End!" from Lemmings Plus 3, which is a level I no longer have the source file of. It worked.

But anyway, there's no reason not to do a remake. So, I'm currently setting up a virtual machine running Windows 95, simply because DosBox Lemmix is still too glitchy for my liking and Lemmix editor is weird.
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)

Offline namida

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Re: Hello
« Reply #24 on: August 03, 2009, 12:37:19 PM »
Upon further investigation, it seems that To The End would require only very slight, if any, modifications to work in DOS. It's just much harder to execute the solution.
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Hello
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2009, 01:18:36 AM »
Hmm...  I could maybe set up a virtual machine...  I don't feel like it though.
With the custom sets, we may be able to cover those (VGASPECx.DAT)

Offline namida

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Re: Hello
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2009, 01:30:55 AM »
Hm. In the case of Oblivion, it is indeed that the required graphics are not available in DOS's set, so a VGASPEC will solve it.
However, in the case of "The Way Across", for example, it's a mechanics difference.
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)