NotaLems Level pack

[Nota_Steve]

I also finished the Tough rank. As kaywhyn said, a few tough nuts in there for sure. I'm going to give you my feedback on certain levels (trying to be quite generalized, spoiler-free) then I'll compare notes!

Level 1 - Already a step up in difficulty and a sign of things to come for this rank. Resource management is the hardest thing here, with the limited skill set.
Level 4 - As previously mentioned, this one is a real tough nut! Probably ended up being in the top 5 hardest levels of the rank for me (#5 I'd say!). It's a repeat that's a lot more challenging than its first incarnation - the difficulty comes from needing to save both sides with again, a pretty limited skill set.
Level 9 - Requires precise placement but it will be a familiar puzzle to any experienced Lemmings player!
Level 10 - Slightly harder than 4 imo, mainly due to the extremely tight time limit where quite a lot has to be done to create a safe path for the crowd. The number of builders is its saving grace, but I needed every one of them!
Level 12 - Another repeat that's much harder than its first incarnation and actually does utilize the mechanic I expected the first one to - in this case, compression! Would be tricky for a beginner I think!
Level 13 - I really like the look of this level! Tropical Hot Dog Nights to quote Captain Beefheart ;-)
Level 19 - Made hard by the 99 RR, as so many levels are. Definitely needed more thinking time than the previous few levels.
Level 21 - Quite a difficult level/talisman, but your options are severely limited, which makes it easier in a way I suppose.
Level 22 - Looks simple... and is! I clocked the solution almost immediately; the hard thing was the execution and completing within the time limit. 4 minutes sounds like a lot, but there's much ground to cover and a fair bit to do.
Level 23 - Seemed uncharacteristically easy for its position in the rank, but I don't mind a breather!
Level 24 - Another problem of resource management. Tricky, but not so bad.
Level 25 - The most difficult thing here was the containment of the crowd at the start but I may well have over-complicated my solution in this instance.
Level 28 - The hardest level of the pack to this point imo. Extreme resource management and timing challenges. Longest solve time so far, eclipsing 4 and 10.
Level 29 - I can tell you, there's no backrouting this level, at least as far as I can see; I tried for a while to do the coward's solution, building over the left fire pit to the exit, lowering the terrain first, but you've clearly thought of that. In the end, I knuckled down to taking the long route! Maybe not quite as difficult as 28, but it's up there.
Level 30 - Wow, you weren't kidding about this being a hard level! The only level in the pack that took me a couple of hours to complete, I don't mind telling you! It's how a pack finale should be though: save the toughest for last! Really clever how you've incorporated four earlier levels into one, re-contextualizing them, by also adding the contained neutrals in each. For the longest time, I just kept ending up a skill short (usually a builder!) but somehow eventually managed to finish with a builder to spare and 2 lemmings more than the requirement saved!

Overall, I thoroughly enjoyed this pack I would probably place its overall difficulty at Easy-Medium, though there are certainly a few levels in the last rank that would fall into the 'Hard' category. You also save the hardest three levels for the end of the rank in my book, so I think you've gauged the difficulty curve well. There are maybe a few things that could be improved in the Easy rank especially, but I would say it's a worthy pack! Probably a bit tough for beginners in its final rank, if that is the intention, but you could say the same thing about Icho's NeoLemmix Introduction Pack.

Replays attached, including talisman solutions.

I am really humbled that you chose to play through my level pack, thank you so much, and thank you so much for your feedback, your critique (all of which is fair) and your compliments have really given me an incite into not only how I can make this level pack better, but how I can improve on my ideas for the second pack I am currently working on.

I have watched your replays and again, much as the same with a couple of my friends and kaywhyn, I would like to address a couple of the levels in the next coming days and release a smaller little pack with just the reworked levels on. I would like to know how difficult it is to achieve the intended solution (or one of the few in many levels cases).

Also, thank you for being very welcoming to me and even taking the time to offer as much as you have to me, it really means a lot.

Very well played!

[IchoTolot]

Seems like I have to give this pack a try soon. 

I'll be away the next two weekends, but in the meantime it looks like some patching will be done and then I can see if I find some backroutes the others have missed. 

[Guigui]

I'd also like to play the pack. But will there be some updates ? I'd rather play after updates since everyone already played before...

[Nota_Steve]

I'd also like to play the pack. But will there be some updates ? I'd rather play after updates since everyone already played before...

Hi Guigui,

Yes, I'm currently working on a few reworks on some of the levels, I should be done within the next few days.

[JawaJuice]

I am really humbled that you chose to play through my level pack, thank you so much, and thank you so much for your feedback, your critique (all of which is fair) and your compliments have really given me an incite into not only how I can make this level pack better, but how I can improve on my ideas for the second pack I am currently working on.

My pleasure I'm always so grateful for new level packs to play and for all the creators who make them to entertain the community! I'll certainly be up for playing your second level pack when it's done.

I have watched your replays and again, much as the same with a couple of my friends and kaywhyn, I would like to address a couple of the levels in the next coming days and release a smaller little pack with just the reworked levels on. I would like to know how difficult it is to achieve the intended solution (or one of the few in many levels cases).

From what I've seen, it seems to be standard practice to make successive versions of the same pack - i.e. v2, v3 etc. - with a few levels updated and the rest unchanged. The problem with extracting certain levels to make another smaller pack is that if those also get backrouted, are you going to keep making smaller and smaller packs with updated levels? I would've thought it would be easier if you just released a NotaLems v2. Up to you though; your updates will be played either way, I'm sure!

Also, thank you for being very welcoming to me and even taking the time to offer as much as you have to me, it really means a lot.

Very well played!

Cheers! I was made to feel welcome by forum members when I joined not so long ago after being a lurker for many years, so glad you feel the same way!

[Nota_Steve]

Hi Everyone.

Please find attached to the original post my Reworked level pack "NotaLems V2".

Patch Notes

After much fair and constructive criticism I have reworked the structure and design of many levels of the easy rank, in order to achieve it's goal of teaching new players the game and it's skills. I have also taken the time to cut down on unnecessary height in most levels.
Easy Rank
Easy 1 - Moved Digger tutorial first, Improved Pre-text
Easy 2 - Added Pre-text
Easy 3 - Moved Builder tutorial, Improved Pre-text
Easy 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 - Improved Pre-text and changed background on "Egyptian Excavation"
Easy 9 - New level "Tightrope Artists", Improved Pre-text
Easy 10 - Now Neutral Lemming tutorial with improved pre-text, shortened Lemming count and edited level solution
Easy 11 - Now Release rate tutorial
Easy 12 - Removed "Dog wants a drink. Now sacrifice tutorial, Much shortened Lemming count, reworked level design.
Easy 13 - Now "Noughts and Crosses", added Pre-text
Easy 14 - New level "Highland Hijinks"
Easy 15, 16, 17, 18, 22, 23 - Rearranged order of levels.
Easy 19 - Now Lemming turning tutorial.
Easy 20 - Now "Not quite so Menacing"
Easy 21 - Now Builder tutorial number 2
Easy 25 - Removed Lock on release rate, increased release rate slightly.

The Medium rank appears to have done it's job pretty well as I hoped it would serve as a real tester for newer players and a slight difficulty increase to a more experienced player. Many of the levels did contain backroutes so most have now been patched out. I hope that players continue to try and backroute as much as possible so as I can learn better how to avoid them. The criticism of spamming 1 skill in certain levels I think is fair and I have re-worked or removed several levels in this rank that do that, not all though...

Medium Rank
Medium 6 - Removed terrain to prevent backroute
Medium 8 - Lowered Lemming count to 10, Renamed, new solution
Medium 9 - Added steel to prevent backroute
Medium 15 - Removed "Hazardous Work Environment", now "Million Dollar Lemming"
Medium 16-29 - Slightly rearranged due to level removal
Medium 21 - Difficulty of level increased.
Medium 26 - Backroute fix (not a massive change)
Medium 27 - Now "Sandcastle Competition",  Level remains unchanged however a new Silver Talisman added
Medium 28 - New level "Pole Dance" added, Silver Talisman added
Medium 29 - Added terrain to help identify intended solution.
Medium 30 - Reworked level, new solution.

The tough rank was my way of having a bit of fun, I hoped to make many of the levels as difficult as possible and is aimed at giving the more experienced Lemmings players a challenge. I will openly admit that some of the designs were uninspired and somewhat lazy on my end, with some levels that have proven easy to backroute, skill spamming, tedious or a little bit too easy for the rank. These oversights have been addressed and I hope now the Tough rank proves to live up to it's name! While some of the levels are a bit Builder heavy (Tough 13 for example) I do have a bit of a soft spot for them.
I am certain that there will be some backroutes I have missed, so I hope that they can be identified, Tough 20 proves to be a hard one to create.

Tough 3 - Removed terrain to help identify intended solution
Tough 6 - Reworked to suit intended solution (The solutions I have seen used are very skillful)
Tough 7 - Reworked to suit intended solution
Tough 8 - Added OWD and made changes to suit intended solution
Tough 10 - Made steel more apparent, reworked slightly to avoid unintended route
Tough 11 - New Level "Calacatta Monument"
Tough 15 - Reworked Level entirely (Builder and bombing proves very unpopular, and I agree, this redesigned puzzle should be a worthy challenge)
Tough 17 - Reworked Level (Far too easy to backroute, made changes to suit towards intended solution)
Tough 18 - Removed "Cave Explorer", Now slightly reworked "Spectacular". (Cave Explorer was a lack luster attempt at a level, I feel the new OWD in "Spectacular will offer a reasonable challenge)
Tough 19 - Slight rework to suit the intended solution.
Tough 20 - Reworked level, different skills
Tough 24 - Reduced Lemming count, Added Steel to prevent slight backroute (while I was happy with the solutions I've seen, it was a slight backroute)
Tough 25 - Added Steel to increase difficulty
Tough 26 - Added OWD to aid intended solution.
Tough 27 - Slightly reworked to suit intended solution.
Tough 28 - Level remains unchanged, however a gold talisman has been added (This level has proven popular, I think it's appropriate to give an extra challenge)
Tough 29 - Slight rework to increase difficulty


As always, I would appreciate any feedback as it will help me with the second pack I am currently working on, all criticism is fair in my eyes .

I'd like to express my gratitude to everyone who has played NotaLems thus far, and a huge thank you to Kaywhyn, Proxima and JawaJuice for their feedback and help.

I hope that you give my reworked pack a go and more importantly, I hope you enjoy it!

Steve x

[JawaJuice]

Congrats on the v2 release, Steve!

I'll give you a bit of feedback on the blurbs at the start of the Easy rank levels; I just noticed a few typos and such - feel free to ignore if I'm being too pedantic

Level 1: "The first few levels will teach you skill starting with Diggers."

I think you mean 'skills' rather than 'skill' here.

Level 6: "Blockers will block the Lemmings from a path you may not which them to take."

'wish' rather than 'which'.

Level 8: "You may have noticed on the level page and small circle with a question mark."

'a small circle' rather than 'and small circle'.

Level 9: Only one 's' in 'occasionally'

Level 12: "Sadly you won't be able to rescue all the lemmings all the time... This level will teach you that."

Except it won't, because it is possible to save all the lemmings with this reworked level (see attached).

I'll include my replays for the new Easy rank levels where my old replays no longer worked (about a half a dozen of them). I dig the new one, Highland Hijinks

[Nota_Steve]

Congrats on the v2 release, Steve!

I'll give you a bit of feedback on the blurbs at the start of the Easy rank levels; I just noticed a few typos and such - feel free to ignore if I'm being too pedantic

Level 1: "The first few levels will teach you skill starting with Diggers."

I think you mean 'skills' rather than 'skill' here.

Level 6: "Blockers will block the Lemmings from a path you may not which them to take."

'wish' rather than 'which'.

Level 8: "You may have noticed on the level page and small circle with a question mark."

'a small circle' rather than 'and small circle'.

Level 9: Only one 's' in 'occasionally'

Level 12: "Sadly you won't be able to rescue all the lemmings all the time... This level will teach you that."

Except it won't, because it is possible to save all the lemmings with this reworked level (see attached).

I'll include my replays for the new Easy rank levels where my old replays no longer worked (about a half a dozen of them). I dig the new one, Highland Hijinks

Not at all pedantic, these are oversights I'm very well known for, I type too fast for my own good haha, thanks for pointing them out. Fingers before brain unfortunately...

[JawaJuice]

V2 Medium replays attached. You'll have to let me know if I've still backrouted any of these. 'The Pillars of Positivity and Negativity' still feels like it might be, mainly because I have a ton of unused diggers - I'm not really sure what your intention is with this level tbh, I just solve it in the way that seems most logical to me! That's always the case though really. I rarely set out to backroute a level (unless I spot a really obvious one and want to highlight it) but I do sometimes struggle to see what an author is intending. And wow, you've made 'Potholing' really hard now - way longer solve time than any other level in Medium. It actually took me longer than almost all of the Tough rank levels, although admittedly I haven't played your updates yet; could well be that some of those seemed easier than they were due to backrouting them previously. We shall see!

[Nota_Steve]

V2 Medium replays attached. You'll have to let me know if I've still backrouted any of these. 'The Pillars of Positivity and Negativity' still feels like it might be, mainly because I have a ton of unused diggers - I'm not really sure what your intention is with this level tbh, I just solve it in the way that seems most logical to me! That's always the case though really. I rarely set out to backroute a level (unless I spot a really obvious one and want to highlight it) but I do sometimes struggle to see what an author is intending. And wow, you've made 'Potholing' really hard now - way longer solve time than any other level in Medium. It actually took me longer than almost all of the Tough rank levels, although admittedly I haven't played your updates yet; could well be that some of those seemed easier than were due to backrouting them previously. We shall see!

All are intended, except for Pole Dance, however, Pole Dance (much like Calacatta Monument) is actually from the Second pack I'm making with a different skill set, and I know that it's very simple, I was going to make a new level but time hasn't been on my side, nor is it in the coming weeks. I will replace it somewhat soon, however for now it fills the void haha.

Well done on Potholing.

[Nota_Steve]

Hi everyone, sorry. I know that I just released V2, however I noticed a glaring issue within the level pack. I've now re-uploaded it on the original post on this thread, please download and enjoy!
Sorry for any confusion!

Steve x

[JawaJuice]

Hey Steve! I assume you were talking about the new level 'Calacatta Monument' when you mentioned a glaring issue; I got the latest version V2 Tough rank cleared. I would say you've succeeded in making the rank live up to its name! That said, I still found 'Potholing' from Medium harder than pretty much any of these. It could just be a me thing - not seeing the solution for ages - but I'd consider swapping out an early Tough level for it maybe.

Of your updated levels, these were the hardest for me: Level 3 (Catacombs), Level 10 (Pair of Aces), Level 15 (Crosses and Noughts), Level 18 (Spectacular), Level 20 (The Arches) and Level 27 (Clam Dune). I really needed to totally re-work my previous solution for these, so guessing I must've backrouted them pretty badly before (assuming I still haven't!). The gold talisman on 28 wasn't too bad, primarily because I found I could just tweak my previous solution very slightly.

V2 replays attached. Great job again with this pack - a ton of fun! 

[Nota_Steve]

Hey Steve! I assume you were talking about the new level 'Calacatta Monument' when you mentioned a glaring issue; I got the latest version V2 Tough rank cleared. I would say you've succeeded in making the rank live up to its name! That said, I still found 'Potholing' from Medium harder than pretty much any of these. It could just be a me thing - not seeing the solution for ages - but I'd consider swapping out an early Tough level for it maybe.

Of your updated levels, these were the hardest for me: Level 3 (Catacombs), Level 10 (Pair of Aces), Level 15 (Crosses and Noughts), Level 18 (Spectacular), Level 20 (The Arches) and Level 27 (Clam Dune). I really needed to totally re-work my previous solution for these, so guessing I must've backrouted them pretty badly before (assuming I still haven't!). The gold talisman on 28 wasn't too bad, primarily because I found I could just tweak my previous solution very slightly.

V2 replays attached. Great job again with this pack - a ton of fun! 

You're a beast of a player, again, thank you for taking time to help me inprove level making, it's really kind of you to offer as much as you have.

I think the NotaLems projects has run it's course and I'm gonna focus on the second level pack with the info I've been given.

Well played mate.

[Guigui]

Im currently playing the Tough rank of this pack (I started by hardest rank as per my stupid habit, I like to end with soothing levels )

I can confirm that Tough 4 No Justice is hard and requires a lot of precision. One will definitely struggle to save those left-side Lemmings if not pixel-precise.
I do have a solution that saves 47/46 :

Spoiler

One extra Lem saved, certainly by sparing a bridge over what's intended to stop the miner before it falls to the bottom.
To achieve this you have to place the bomber, miner, and 2 builders in pixel-perfect places. See solution if interested.

[kaywhyn]

Hello @Nota_Steve,

I have resolved all of V2 of NotaLems. My entire replay collection, but you only need to check Easy 9, Easy 10, Easy 12, Easy 14, Easy 25, Medium 6, Medium 8, Medium 21, Medium 26, Medium 27, Medium 28, Medium 29, Medium 30, Tough 3, Tough 6, Tough 7, Tough 8, Tough 10, Tough 11, Tough 15, Tough 17, Tough 18, Tough 19, Tough 20, Tough 24, Tough 25, Tough 26, Tough 27, Tough 28, and Tough 29.

Before I comment on some of these new solutions, one thing I need to point out, and that is the repeat levels have the same ID as the originals. As a result, this confuses the mass replay check and hence it uses the replay of the original to run against the repeat level instead of the replay with the matching rank and level number. I know you mentioned that you're not going to be fixing up this pack anymore despite any backroutes that may appear with V2 (and there's a few that I still managed to cheese ), but for future reference, the fix for this is to make sure every level, including repeats, have a different ID. To do this, simply hit the random ID button in the editor to give the repeat level a different ID from the original. The levels that don't have repeats are fine, it's only the ones that are repeated that are problematic when they have the same ID as the original.

Also, the levels file in the base of the pack has the wrong .txt extension again when you're defining the order of the ranks

Resolved Easy Rank V2 Feedback

JawaJuice has pretty much already pointed out the problems with some of the pre-texts here, though a few I will add on my suggestions:

Easy 1 - Probably something like "teach you what the skills do" would be better.

Easy 2 - Looks good! Though maybe lowercase bashers, but then again it is the name of a Lemming skill. Meh, doesn't really matter here

Easy 3 - Insert "build" between "will" and "a," and lowercase pixels but other than that, great!

Easy 4 - At least I would lowercase miners, but again it being the name of a Lemming skill, I think it's simply preference. "Diagonal" and "Fashion" should both be lowercase

Easy 5 - For floaters, insert "to" between "Lemming" and "land." Lowercase "Float" in the final sentence. Also maybe "change the Lemming's hair color from green to blue for easier identification" is a better way to put it. Actually, there's a bit more to this, and that is their outfit changes from blue to green as well. In other words, the colors for the outfit and hair swap for those assigned these skills!

Easy 6 - An alternative to the suggested "wish" would probably be "want." I think either one could work here. For the third sentence, perhaps a good way to put it would be "A Lemming that walks into a blocker will turn in the other direction." For the fourth sentence, insert "away" after them.

Easy 7 - Insert comma after "spot"

Easy 8 - Should be "required." For the fourth sentence, perhaps a better way to put it would be "Highlight over the circle and click it to see the requirements for the level's talisman."

Easy 9- Insert "can" between "you" and "go." For steel, the description is a bit inaccurate, as it's more that steel cannot be destroyed but will turn any bashers and miners around that hit it. Insert "to" between "try" and "solve."

Regarding the level itself, it doesn't teach players that steel will turn Lemmings around if they bash or mine into it. However, I like how you put the up and down arrows so that it seems like you're introducing them before Medium 9, which is the next time one sees them. As such, maybe it's a good idea to expand on what one can do with them, such as with down OWAs you can only dig, mine, and bomb. In contrast, when it comes to the classic 8 skills, only bombers can destroy up OWAs.

Easy 10 - Lowercase "Diamond" and "Grey." As for the level, unfortunately the part of the pre-text saying that neutrals are needed for the save requirement isn't true, as you can completely ignore the neutral entrance and still pass the level by saving all the Lemmings from the regular entrance. That's because there's 30 Lemmings/neutrals total and two hatches, which means 15 come out of each entrance. Notice something? That's right, 15 is the save requirement, which matches the total amount of Lemmings that come out of just one hatch. This is an easy fix though, and that is simply make sure the save requirement is greater than 15. Even better, make it a save all level!

Easy 11 Yea, I think this is a much better position for the level now and for an RR introduction!

Easy 12 "Lemmings death" - Lemmings should have an apostrophe. As for the level, yea, I think this is a bit better for demonstrating that traps can only kill one Lemming at a time. The only thing I'm not seeing is how it's possible to save everyone here Unless the level changed since the time JawaJuice resolved it for which it's possible to.

Easy 14 - Decent level, though nothing special either

Easy 25 - It's still possible to do the level pause free I'm not sure if I suggested one, but I think 95 for the RR would be fine here. Thanks for removing the locked RR!

Resolved Medium Rank V2 Feedback

Medium 6 - A fair bit harder now, but still an excellent level. Getting over the gap is definitely the hard part here!

Medium 8 - Much better with the heavily reduced Lemming count and would be a fine level here except as I mentioned Easy 9 doesn't teach the player about steel turning miners around because one can solve the level without that.

Medium 21 - My new solution definitely looks a lot better now!

Medium 26 - Still an easy level with the change, just needed to swap a miner with the digger in my solution.

Medium 27 - Wow, tough talisman, though maybe my solution for it is intended If it is, I don't see an easier to obtain it.

Medium 28 - Ok level. I was able to do better than the talisman requirement.

Medium 29 - Would agree with JawaJuice here as this one being one of the hardest levels of the pack and would probably be better for the Tough rank. In the end, my solution is quite similar to my previous one, just needed to tweak it in one location

Medium 30 - Much better and a far more decent challenge for the rank finisher!

Resolved Tough Rank V2 Feedback

Tough 3 - Hard one, though the solution came to me shortly after I went out for the night and had a struggle with it prior. Nice one!

Tough 6 This looks more or less intended now!

Tough 7 - Still an easy one even with the change, but I can see how this one can be a stumper for less experienced players. Seen this trick plenty of times and I have a level in my upcoming level pack that requires it

Tough 8 - Any better? Still don't use the floater.

Tough 10 - Much harder now but quite a decent challenge! However, my biggest criticism here is the really tight time limit. When I finally did figure out all parts of the level, I had to go back several times and readjust my solution so that it doesn't run out of time. The only thing I can think of is maybe increase/max out the RR much earlier so that it wasn't as much of a problem, but it still seems to be unnecessarily tight regardless. I would definitely ease up the time limit and make it way less tight.

Tough 11 Seems to be a backroute here

Tough 15 Much better level now! Also much harder and is very appropriate for the rank now. This one took me a while to find a solution, so in completely agreement with JawaJuice here with this one being one of the hardest of the pack.

Tough 17 - Still a backroute I'm sure

Tough 18 - Bit harder but still one of my favorites!

Tough 19 - Much harder and I would say one of the hardest of the pack as well. This seems more or less intended, though I used one miner to turn a Lemming around, which I honestly didn't think it was possible to assign where I did, but guess I learned something new here!

Tough 20 - Yup, this seems intended now and is definitely a much better level! Yea, untimed bombers are very powerful

Tough 24 - Tad bit tougher now but still one of the best levels! I really dig the new solution I found

Tough 25 - Much harder now but still an excellent and one of the best levels as well! Figuring out the very limited amount of builders was especially satisfying. Can easily be a roadblock for less experienced players for sure!

Tough 26 - Definitely harder now, especially with figuring out how to keep the others at bay for a while in order to get tasks done before they come. Nice challenge and satisfying level when things finally worked out!

Tough 27 - I use all the skills here, though some parts look a bit unintended to me. Meh, what do I know whether or not my solution is intended

Tough 28 - Like JawaJuice, just needed to tweak my solution just a tiny bit in order to get the talisman.

Tough 29 - Yea, still not a fan of this level. It's one of the worst levels of the pack IMO, but the pack overall is excellent despite this

Nice work and as already mentioned I look forward to more levels/level packs from you!