Author Topic: Lemmix Level Reviews  (Read 45181 times)

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Offline Clam

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Lemmix Level Reviews
« on: May 25, 2009, 03:02:33 AM »
EDIT: This thread has been changed to open review. The level review game thread can be found here. I'll leave the rules in this post for reference.

Yes, your levels are subject to criticism  ;). This was just starting to gain momentum on the old forum, so we can't just stop it now!


RULES for review game format:

1. You may only review ONE level at a time. Levels are to be reviewed in sequence from the chosen levelpack.
2. The same pack cannot be done more than once.
3. You cannot review one of your own levels.
4. You cannot do two or more levelpacks by the same author in a row.
5. The same person cannot review two levels in a row - that includes across packs!.

The review format is as follows:

Levelpack name - Level # - TITLE
PICTURE - these are available from the Lemmings File Archive
Lemmings
Lemmings Required (% required)
Release rate
Time
Skills
Good - Glowing praise for the level goes in this section.
Bad - Enter your damning criticisms here :P



Continuing from the old thread, the next level is:
elfpak01 level 3 - Gyps Isles

I did the last review, so it's time for someone else to step up to the plate. Let's Go!

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2009, 06:32:56 PM »
The Critics Say:
Gyps Isles, level 3 in the pack, is not good at all...

Lemmings:  50
Save 100% (50)
RR:  99
Time:  3 Minutes
Skills:  2 climbers, 1 floater, 2 blockers, 2 bombers, five builders, six bashers
Good:  The level is aesthetically pleasing
Bad:  Some areas need grass, and what's the point of blockers and bombers in a 100% level?  Blockers, in the locations that they look like they could be used, are not possible to free, and of course you can't use a freaking bomber in a 100% level!
Also, the only solution I can think of that might possibly not use the blocker, requires you to have 50 floaters, which you do not, and many more builders to save thousands of lemmings from drowning.  Gosh, I hate it when developers trick you into thinking it's okay to lose a couple lemms.

P.S. I think the rules should allow across packs, and a new rule should be added:  multiple people can review the same level,  to get a perspective of the views of several critics.

P.P.S.  Didn't notice this until I posted, but there's a gap between the edge of the level and the water.  That's a problem.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2009, 03:26:47 AM »
I'd rather have just one review per level, otherwise it could take forever to get through a pack. You can comment on other people's reviews if you like - in fact I'll do so right now :)

Blockers placed on this level CAN be freed if you know how. The gap next to the water happens because the next water object was placed off the left side of the screen - any objects placed off the left or the top will disappear when you load up the level. (It might also cause a crash in DOS - I'm not sure).

I agree that this level needs more grass to make it look good.

Offline Luis

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2009, 06:38:26 PM »
This is cool. I wanna see some more reviews.
Mr. Lemmings PSP user.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2009, 10:35:29 PM »
Just get on with the reviews.

I guess it's already slow enough!!!

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2009, 05:41:08 AM »
Someone else do the next one - I don't want to end up doing all the "miniature" series. I'd like to see another take on these :)

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2009, 05:05:41 AM »
True, no one else does them.  My suggestion is to allow anyone to do any level, provided they didn't make it.

If you don't mind, I will review miniature III, since we don't want this to die.

Offline -H0ru5-

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2009, 05:31:41 PM »
Unfortunately, I can't help writing critiques for obvious reasons  :D

But before you dig deeper into my levelpack (or to speed up events - question of point of view) you might check this attachment which contains reedited levels including:

Miniature part I-II-III
Gyps Isles
House Of The Lost Staircase
The Specialists

and review these instead the old ones.

I don't want to publish it on camanis, because "Fortress 13" is hopeless and removed until I rebuild it - instead there is a teaser from my incoming new pack called "Morning Coffee". Enjoy  ;)

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2009, 11:32:46 PM »
Miniature part three wasn't bad the way it was.

NOTE:  THE ONLY DIFFERENCE I CAN FIND IS IN GYPS ISLES, BUT STILL HAVE SAME PROBLEMS.

However, it now looks like it may be possible, unlike in the original pack.
Miniature Part III (to keep this from dying)


Lemmings:  20
To Save:  19 (95%)
Skills:  1 of each

Good:   Creative solution, well hidden.
Bad:  Aesthetically, the level needs updates, though they may be better in the elfpak01revisited.dat.
Also, the timing is a bit annoying with the blocker in the solution I found.  Sometimes you will get too
many lemmings walking past that blocker (very annoying).

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2009, 01:32:55 AM »
I've played through the revised version now (see the levelpack topic for comments on solutions. And your email for replays ;)). On with the reviews!

I guess the next level is...

Miniature (part II)

[The levelpack database seems to have disappeared, so I can't get a pic right now (and yet the other pics are still here. ???) Look at the above one and imagine the trapdoor being further to the left]
EDIT The levelpack database is back, but the pic there is wrong since the updated pack wasn't uploaded there.

Lemmings: 20
Save: 16 (80%)
Rate: 70
Time: 3 minutes
Skills: 1 of each

Good: A couple of neat tricks that lead to the basic solution - and another neat trick that allows for an 85% solution.
Bad: Same aesthetic issues as mentioned before. Particularly noticeable in this case is the exit covering some of the terrain. Maybe I'm nitpicking a bit much here...

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2009, 03:28:24 AM »
It works fine for me.  Or are you just talking about the level pack stuff?  I'll look into this...

It works fine...

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2009, 04:01:55 AM »
It might have been down temporarily when I posted the review. I wasn't the only one to notice a problem with that site. In any case, the picture is wrong now since the level was updated, and H0ru5 uploaded the new version here as an attachment rather than the levelpack site.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2009, 04:18:30 AM »
That's true.  I'm just not sure we should continue this pack, since some of the levels, namely the Miniature thread, have effectively killed this topic off.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2009, 04:35:28 AM »
We've done all the miniatures now. Let's go onto the next level - Greek Fire. This one wasn't changed in the update.

What we really need to prevent this thread from dying is another willing reviewer or two. If there really isn't that much interest in custom levels, then there really isn't much point in continuing to build them - or making a new fan game, for that matter. :(

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2009, 04:47:36 AM »
Can someone give me a little help with figuring out how to figure out these solutions?  Because I can't!  :P.

We can make this go farther by allowing multiple reviews in a row by the same person, and maybe they could review their own levels as long as the review is honest.

Though I'm not sure that the second new rule idea would be very good at all...

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2009, 10:10:33 AM »
The lack of activity in this thread concerns me. If we're going to make a fan game, this side of the community needs to be strong. It's all very well to build a bunch of new levels, but without feedback on our designs, we're going to miss opportunities to improve on our designs and make these levels the best they can be. I suggest the following:

- If we are going to continue doing full reviews, we should do so only for levels that we will include, or consider inclusion of, in the new fan game.

- When you play a new level, or set of levels, try to give feedback on it straight away. Use the levelpack topic, PM, email, whatever - but preferably the levelpack topic unless an important part of the  feedback would involve revealing the solution to the level. If the levels have simple solutions (like Dullstar's levels, as well as my new pack), then revealing solutions isn't really a problem.

- Don't rely on the review thread to provide feedback for your levels. If you want people to comment on your levels, then give some comments yourself (but please don't demand reviews from others). Give and get, people :). The more feedback we can give each other, the better. And don't be afraid to nitpick on minor details - obviously our levels are never going to be perfect, but we should look for any opportunities to improve them. If you edit a level based on feedback from someone else (or any reason for that matter), please tell us.

- I'd prefer that this thread was still used for full reviews, but considering the above, there may not be a use for it any more - especially if we are going to make changes to our levels. This could come back later on, however, as the project nears completion. If we do continue to do full reviews, or come back to them later, then we need more participation, and probably to revise some of the rules as well.


What do you all think of this? These are just my suggestions, feel free to disagree.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2009, 08:21:39 PM »
I know!  Full pack reviews could work, because the rules practically choke this thread.
If you don't mind, Clam Spammer, I can make your older packs usable in the fangame by changing the skill amounts.  Your call.

Anyways, I shall review Clamspam05 now.

Level 1 - A step too far?
Good:  Simple solution.  I could see it stumping total n00bs, but that's about all.
Bad:  What bad?

Level 2 - MORE WEE CREATURES!
Good:  Solution easy to execute but still hidden somewhat well.
Bad:  Needs more decorative terrain around the sides, I think.  The vertical ice pillars could be put to great use in smoothing out the edge of the decorative terrain, too, which is currently a little bit rough.

Level 3 - Works on so many levels...
Good:  Looks good.
Bad:  It has been proven that graphics do not make the game.  This level is a bit too hard. to figure out.  However, if you PM me a replay, I might reconsider this opinion.  The name could use revision, too.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #17 on: June 14, 2009, 12:38:38 AM »
Thanks for the feedback :)


If you don't mind, Clam Spammer, I can make your older packs usable in the fangame by changing the skill amounts.  Your call.

I plan to rebuild some of my older levels to get rid of the dumb backroutes. As I've said before, though, some aren't really suited to a fangame, IMHO, especially the ones that use glitches.


Quote
Level 2 ... Needs more decorative terrain around the sides, I think.  The vertical ice pillars could be put to great use in smoothing out the edge of the decorative terrain, too, which is currently a little bit rough.

Rough terrain isn't bad in itself. I agree though that the edge of the terrain is a bit messy, especially on the right. I should probably sprinkle some large crystals in among the decoration too, to add some variety.


Quote
Level 3 ... It has been proven that graphics do not make the game.  This level is a bit too hard. to figure out.  However, if you PM me a replay, I might reconsider this opinion.  The name could use revision, too.

I can understand this from someone who still struggles with the original levels, but I can't honestly see how this is difficult. I could give a couple more builders, though. The main reason I gave the bare minimum of 10 builders to start with was because of a potential backroute where you could go outside the level area and build up to the top. I decided quite late in the design process to add the steel, and that seems to solve the problem (and if we make steel fully indestructible, then that will completely solve it).

And what's wrong with the name? It works on so many levels :P

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #18 on: June 14, 2009, 06:06:53 AM »
Maybe I'll see if I actually figure out the solution.  Temporarily, I will add more builders to the mix.

After I get somewhere with it, I'll tell you if I figured out the name or not.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #19 on: July 02, 2009, 12:35:33 AM »
Restarting this thread with some reviews from Yawg01...


1. Bubble Bath
Good: Skill and time restrictions mean some thinking is required to find a solution.
Bad: The partially hidden exit doesn't look great and probably isn't necessary. Maybe that's just a personal preference.

2. To Each His Own
Good: Interesting concept, and some tough decisions to make.
Bad: Needs more decoration, and not centred on the map.

3. Number Eight
Good: Solution is well hidden. (In other words: I have no idea how you're actually supposed to do it).
Bad: Huge backroute with direct drop. Again, everything is off to the left side, and would look better in the middle.


If anyone else wants to help with these reviews, it would be much appreciated ;)

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2009, 09:30:38 AM »
Thanks for the great feedback! I'll definitely take all of it into consideration when I redo my original packs...ill probably start on that after I finish Yawg04  8)
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #21 on: July 02, 2009, 07:58:12 PM »
Bad: Needs more decoration, and not centred on the map.
<snip>
Again, everything is off to the left side, and would look better in the middle.

It's worth mentioning that Lemmix is of no help in this regard.  Unlike LemEdit, when you create a new level in Lemmix, it puts you on the left end of the level area, rather than the center as LemEdit does (if I recall correctly).  Moreover, (if I recall correctly) neither Lemmix nor LemEdit has a feature to re-position everything in the level to center the level after you're finished creating the level.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #22 on: July 02, 2009, 09:58:19 PM »
It's actually quite easy to do this in Lemmix. Press "a" to select everything, and then use the arrow keys to move it. And to help with centering, you can turn on the screenstart viewer and set the screenstart to 640.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #23 on: July 02, 2009, 11:54:26 PM »
LemEdit does start you in the center, I remember that.

By the way, I don't remember exactly what pack this was from, but once I played a level with several fake exits and hidden traps to kill your lemmings on the way to the exit.  It was not fun at all.  Don't make levels like this.

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2009, 02:02:56 AM »
It's actually quite easy to do this in Lemmix. Press "a" to select everything, and then use the arrow keys to move it.

Wow, you learn something new every day...you just saved me a LOT of work  :thumbsup:
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #25 on: July 04, 2009, 05:26:28 AM »
I could use that for my Ice Palace and Icy World levels.  If you haven't seen them, here are the screenshots on the Lemmings Archive.

The Ice Palace


An Icy World, when I look at the screenshot, I remember that it had some awesome backroutes which would break if the level's alignment were to be changed.  Honestly, the backroute I know of in this level is kind of hard to pull off due to timing, so it may actually be great for challenges!  It's in the netting.  Sometime I'm going to improve the decorative terrain, too.

Random pointless note about this level:
Most if not all of the level was created running Lemmix on Ubuntu using WINE.  This is the only level I remember doing that with.

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #26 on: July 06, 2009, 08:12:08 PM »
In the interest of facilitating discussion and development in this thread, I'd be happy to trade reviews with people. Anyone up for some constructive criticism? Personally, I'm happy to get any feedback I can, so the least I can do is offer some in return  :)
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2009, 12:23:36 AM »
I'm always up for some criticism ;)

Here's some more from Yawg01:

Not The Bars Again!
Good: Quick and fun level, nice decorative touches
Bad: 10 minutes for such a small level? I'm guessing this was intended to take a while to solve, and the quick way is a backroute.

The Brick
Good: Looks straightforward, but isn't due to lack of builders. Great concept.
Bad: Assigning that many floaters is painful. And besides that, they're not really needed to complete the level.

Two Sisters
Good: No obvious solution, and there are a few different ways to go about solving it.
Bad: Could use some decoration. The level looks like it was quickly thrown together.

Up On the Cross
Good: Simple design, nice short level
Bad: Useless spare skills (climber and bomber). Needs decoration.

By the way, release rate 0 doesn't work in replays - when you pause and turn the rate down to zero, then replay the level, it doesn't change the rate back to zero when it should. Try to avoid using this (set it to 1 instead).


Random pointless note about this level:
Most if not all of the level was created running Lemmix on Ubuntu using WINE.  This is the only level I remember doing that with.
That reminds me: I have some random pointless trivia about my levels too. Maybe we could start a random trivia thread and share our fun level designing stories :)

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #28 on: July 08, 2009, 01:53:45 AM »
Nobody review mine until I get my next pack done!

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2009, 07:28:22 PM »
I just completely overhauled and re-uploaded Yawg01, and your feedback was invaluable in the undertaking, Clam Spammer. Muchas Gracias  :). If you have the time check it out, I think you'll find some of the levels aren't as easy as they used to be... :evil:
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #30 on: July 09, 2009, 04:29:21 AM »
I just completely overhauled and re-uploaded Yawg01, and your feedback was invaluable in the undertaking, Clam Spammer.

Wait, you didn't let me finish :XD:

Level 10 has a huge backroute. I see you've tried to fix it, but... well, it's still there.  ;) Admittedly, it's much harder to do, but still not too difficult.

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #31 on: July 09, 2009, 05:20:20 AM »
yeesh, thats what I get for quick-fixing old levels...could I get a replay?  ;P
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #32 on: July 09, 2009, 05:43:25 AM »
I just found an even easier way... PM sent.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #33 on: July 10, 2009, 07:45:50 AM »
Have you ever been able to get the replays to work?  They displayed the problems with Lemmings in the Plumbing (original version) so I don't know if the problems have been fixed or not.  If you haven't gotten them to work yet, I'll describe problems by PM. (uploading my Lemmix folder somewhere would be a last resort).

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #34 on: July 13, 2009, 07:59:23 PM »
Have you ever been able to get the replays to work?  They displayed the problems with Lemmings in the Plumbing (original version) so I don't know if the problems have been fixed or not.  If you haven't gotten them to work yet, I'll describe problems by PM. (uploading my Lemmix folder somewhere would be a last resort).

Yeah, I got them working finally. However, I decided the intended solution for the level in question wasn't worth the effort it would take to save it, so I modified the skills to implement one of the sneakier back routes as a solution.

And now for some reviews  8)

I thought I'd start by finishing the review of ClamSpam05;

4. Lem Squared
Pros: Solution is clever, and makes use of several interesting strategies. A very good puzzle.
Cons: Visually it's pretty boring. I realize this was deliberate, what with the name, but perhaps you could have strayed from the theme on the outskirts of the puzzle, just to add some flavor.

5. Play Bridge
Pros: Nice symmetrical design. Spare, but not too much so.
Cons: This level seems to throw the difficulty curve of the pack off a bit. After the last two puzzles, it was a bit of a let down challenge-wise.

6. The Endless Steps
Pros: Love the design. Some very creative use of graphics here, and it really makes the level.
Cons: I'm not a huge fan of bomber puzzles (mostly because I suck at the timing  :XD:), so I'm a bit biased against this one, but this really fell into the category of levels where I can easily see the solution but can't muster the patience to actually implement it. A few more blockers would have been nice  :D

7. Altitude Training
Pros: Solid design, visually pleasing, and a relatively exclusive solution. The lack of bashers made this one a lot less straight forward.
Cons: I really don't have any valid complaints about this level. Its just plain good.

8. Web 3.0
Pros: The whole "3" theme really works well, and forces the player to come up with a creative solution (especially the 3 builders). Plus the stacked webs just look cool.
Cons: While I like the webs, I find the overall design somewhat bland. Like Lem Squared, I think this level could use some sprucing up, even if its outside the work area.

9. Circus Lemmings in Training
Pros: Nice theme, clever use of graphics. The solution is far from obvious, and requires a decent amount of refinement to get it working. Solid puzzle.
Cons: Bit Spare, could use some more eye candy, if only because the work area is so linear.

10. Guns Blazing
Pros: Good composition, visually pleasing, and a challenging and engaging solution. Overall this is a great level.
Cons: Steel is a bit overused. I see little danger of back routes with the only digging tools being bashers and a few bombers. Also, this level was almost challenging enough to merit (in my opinion) going all the way and eliminating the excess skills.
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #35 on: July 14, 2009, 07:58:39 AM »
Yawg, could you redo the review of ClamSpam05's level three?  I couldn't figure it out...

Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #36 on: July 14, 2009, 07:19:54 PM »
Yawg, could you redo the review of ClamSpam05's level three?  I couldn't figure it out...

I had skipped over that one...thanks for giving me a reason to go back and figure it out  :)

3. Works on So Many Levels...
Pros: Simple design and structure that nevertheless does a good job concealing the solutions. It's one of those puzzles that looks simple at first, and then stumps you for awhile.
Cons: I don't think I've ever had to use the strategy I did to solve this one, so I'm not sure whether it actually "works on so many levels" or not...While it was an interesting way to overcome the obstacles, I found the method I used (which I'm assuming was the intended one) to be pretty messy. This really comes down to my personal preference for more precise solutions though.
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?info&pack=174

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #37 on: July 16, 2009, 09:46:28 AM »
I don't think I've ever had to use the strategy I did to solve this one, so I'm not sure whether it actually "works on so many levels" or not...

Ohh... I see what you mean. No, I don't suppose that sort of solution is going to work on many different levels. I was referring more to the shape of terrain, which is arranged into distinct "levels". (And I might also be referring to a certain level designer who does a fair bit of work on Lemmings levels ;))

In response to your other reviews:

4 and 8 - I probably did overdo the graphics here. I'm a fan of experimental designs though (eg. "Training Zone Alpha" from my 4th pack).
5 - The lack of difficulty isn't really worthy of criticism in itself. You have to have some easy levels in a puzzle game, after all. In hindsight, it's probably misplaced in terms of ascending difficulty order.
6 - Yes, it's bomber timing. Learn to live with it. It's not like a simgle mis-timed bomber is going to force a replay anyway - there's plenty more bombers to cover your mistakes.
9 - The central area could use a bit of decoration, I agree.
10 - I could use the smaller steel pieces to reduce the apparent amount while maintaining its functionality. For the most part, though, it needs to be there in some form.

Don't forget, I made up "challenges" for these levels too. I listed these in this post, when I uploaded the pack.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #38 on: July 16, 2009, 09:38:44 PM »
Could someone upload a replay of ClamSpam05's level three?

It would be quite helpful.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #39 on: July 16, 2009, 10:15:51 PM »
This is one way of doing it. I'm not keen to try it without using diggers... :XD:

EDIT: as soon as I typed that, I knew I was going to try...so heres the solution sans diggers as well.
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #40 on: July 26, 2009, 12:04:21 PM »
Sorry to interrupt but can anyone review any of MY levels please?  :'( I know I'm not allowed to review any of my own levels. My level packs are located between 3 and 4 and the files are named lm_set01 to lm_set15. I would like to see at least one or two of the levels in my level packs so that I understand what I can do to improve the levels I created last year.
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #41 on: July 27, 2009, 02:21:19 AM »
Id be happy to give you some feedback, especially if you're willing to give me some in return (Yawg01-04). I probably won't have time today, but I might be able to take a look tomorrow  :)
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

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Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #42 on: July 27, 2009, 09:00:51 PM »
I took a look at Im_set01 and here are my thoughts.

Builderless work and More Builderless work are both solid puzzles but the first is the stronger of the two because its layout does a better job disguising the intended solution than the first. More Builderless work didn't take long to figure out at all, though Builderless work made me think a bit, and it was purely a layout issue. They're both solid puzzles.

The last two levels in the pack were pretty badly back routed; the 9th because of a steel glitch and the 10th because of an overabundance of builders. My other complaint about Where do I dig next? was the unnecessary floaters. They may have been required for the intended solution but my back route didn't use them, and it was just a pain to hand em out  :P

Lemtris was probably my favorite puzzle in the pack, partially because I enjoy tetris of course... :D
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

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Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2009, 08:29:41 AM »
Thanks for your thoughts Yawg, but I need to know what you mean by "the steel glitch" because all my levels don't use glitches at all.

Speaking of backroutes, I think the third level of my second set has a bad bad backroute :scared: so I need to change the level quickly!
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #44 on: July 28, 2009, 08:50:21 AM »
I've finally changed the level (Entirely) to make "The Squeeze Machine". Shouldn't be any backroutes here. :P
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Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #45 on: July 28, 2009, 05:47:37 PM »
The steel glitch to which I was referring was the one that allows you to bash through the top 5 or so pixels of steel at the top of the screen. This allowed me to build directly to the exit as opposed to taking the intended long route around in Fired up my lonely friend?.
Remember, whether your levels "use" glitches or not, the glitches are still there. We can blame Psygnosis for that  :P
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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #46 on: July 29, 2009, 09:23:59 AM »
Um...  Psygnosis?  I thought they were the publishers.  DMA Design made the game, didn't they?

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #47 on: July 29, 2009, 08:54:03 PM »
Um...  Psygnosis?  I thought they were the publishers.  DMA Design made the game, didn't they?

You're right, actually. :thumbsup:
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #48 on: July 29, 2009, 08:54:48 PM »
Anyway, I wonder when my second lemmings level pack will be reviewed. I changed one of my levels recently, because the unglitched backroute from my old level was so hard to get rid of, I wanted to replace the level completely. My second level pack file can be downloaded lm_set02.
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #49 on: July 30, 2009, 08:50:16 AM »
Sure, I don't mind doing some more reviews. Here are my thoughts on lm_set02 (the new version), level by level:


1: The traps don't work because they're placed too high. (Don't you test these levels before uploading them?) Other than this it's a good quick level, and the % requirement is set just high enough to make you think a little.

2: Nice idea, but it's fairly easy to just bomb down do the exit at the start.

3: Again, the trap doesn't work. Fix that up and you've got a nice little challenge. This level has a nice simple visual design too.

4: Funny, but there's really not much to this level. With a different skill set you could make a good tricky level out of this.

5: An interesting take on the 1-of-each concept, but the intended solution stands out somewhat.

6: Very simple, standard block-and-release fare. The overlapping rocky pieces look quite messy.

7: Good take on an original level. Why 74 lemmings? (This doesn't really matter, but it's highly unusual.)

8: Deja vu indeed... I was just writing these reviews when you posted this very level in the Challenge thread. Anyway, fun little challenge but annoying to release the crowd with no arrow key select. (Unless you use the release rate to avoid this ;))

9: I like this one. Solution is fairly quick to execute, and the middle chain is a tough obstacle. The repeating brick pattern is a little plain though.

10: Solid multitasking level. Could be made a little more compact to make things quicker.

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #50 on: July 30, 2009, 09:36:50 AM »
Oh dear. I intentionally built them all for Lemmini use. :-[ I tried my best to do it for Custom Lemmings use but I completely failed. :XD:

That's only for the first three levels. Anyway, the point about "Stolen Goods" is that there are a couple of things which are taken away from the level, "Have a Nice Day". The goods include:

Number of lemmings (Stole 6 out of 80)
Climbers (Stole 1 out of 2)
A missing left side platform
Time (Stole 2 minutes was it? I'll have another look)

I'm sure I took away more, but I created Level 7 because the solution was the first time I solved "Lemming Drops".
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Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2009, 09:45:30 AM »
Oh...

Do those traps work where they are in Lemmini? In any case, it's easy enough to fix.


Heh, stolen lemmings. I get it. :D

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #52 on: July 30, 2009, 07:12:08 PM »
OK: Which user is going to check out my 3rd level pack. Sorry, I'm being greedy here :P
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Offline Yawg

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #53 on: July 30, 2009, 10:30:24 PM »
OK: Which user is going to check out my 3rd level pack. Sorry, I'm being greedy here :P

You look at mine, I'll look at yours  8)
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #54 on: July 31, 2009, 07:02:44 AM »
Yawg. All of your levels are really difficult! I couldn't solve any of them at such a high challenge. :( Glitches are the main reason why I don't prefer to play your levels. Sorry I seem to be so negative. :XD:
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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #55 on: July 31, 2009, 06:22:40 PM »
Yawg. All of your levels are really difficult! I couldn't solve any of them at such a high challenge. :( Glitches are the main reason why I don't prefer to play your levels. Sorry I seem to be so negative. :XD:

That's why Clam Spammer's first four packs are really hard!  Those ones use glitches as well!  Although some of his glitch levels I think would be salvageable if the skill sets and lemming requirements would be changed...

Could be same with Yawg's glitch levels...  if they use glitches, anyways.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #56 on: July 31, 2009, 06:43:58 PM »
Yawg. All of your levels are really difficult! I couldn't solve any of them at such a high challenge. :( Glitches are the main reason why I don't prefer to play your levels. Sorry I seem to be so negative. :XD:

Actually, only one of the levels I've released so far uses a glitch, and its more of a by-product of the mechanic the solution exploits than anything. I'm glad you think my levels are difficult though, 'cas I intended them to be  8)

Rather than glitches, I prefer to center my puzzles around lesser-known game mechanics and creative combinations thereof.
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Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #57 on: July 31, 2009, 11:19:52 PM »
That's why Clam Spammer's first four packs are really hard!  Those ones use glitches as well!  Although some of his glitch levels I think would be salvageable if the skill sets and lemming requirements would be changed...

It's been a while since I looked at ClamSpammer's levels, but I don't recall that many of them actually uses glitches.  There are many other ways you can create difficulty without using glitches, you know.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #58 on: August 01, 2009, 03:37:39 AM »
That's what Clam Spammer told me about his first four packs, anyways.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #59 on: August 01, 2009, 03:50:59 AM »
Looking back through my extensive catalogue (:P), I can only find two levels that specifically require glitches to be used in order to pass (well, it was supposed to be 3, but one of them turned out not to need it after all :(). A lot of my levels use tricks in the game mechanics that you don't usually see in the original levels, but not "glitches" as such.

I actually thought my levels were more "glitchy" than this :D

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #60 on: August 01, 2009, 09:38:58 PM »
Do you think you might be able to make your early levels easy enough to consider including in the fangame?

It doesn't need to be terribly easy, just easy enough to beat without being an expert.

EDIT:  They could also work in an "Insane" category or something like that.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #61 on: August 02, 2009, 02:28:04 AM »
I'm sure I could make my levels more "fan-gamey". Some of them probably won't make it, or will have to be rebuilt completely, and some need more decoration. It all depends on the individual level.

I've neglected my early levels a bit too much. Maybe this is how I should spend my Lemmings time, rather than taking over all the challenge threads... :P

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #62 on: August 02, 2009, 06:20:08 AM »
Worry first about making the needed tweaks to the levels to make them beatable, then we can decide which ones are worth keeping.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #63 on: August 02, 2009, 07:29:05 AM »
Last I checked, they were all beatable...


Don't worry, I plan to keep most of these levels - or, in some cases, build new ones from the same concept. I'll list the ones that I don't think would suit a general Lemmings audience:

The Square Route of Lemmings - I've already done a remake based on this idea, so this can go
Rounds and Swingabouts - too long and boring, and no real substance to it
Escape from Alcatraz! - too long and boring, and was really only intended to be a nice-looking design anyway
Get Out of the Pool! - glitch (or at the very least, extremely obscure game mechanics)
Brick Replacement Therapy - too bizarre
Stay Out of the Pool!!! - crazy bomber timing, and based on a glitch level
The Other Side - backroute that can't be fixed without changing the terrain (and thus not keeping true to the original design)
Rise Through the Ranks - glitch
The edge of madness / The fringe of insanity - ridiculous timing needed
Santa's Workshop - too obscure

If you think any of these are really fangame material, then please tell me why :)

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #64 on: August 02, 2009, 05:43:03 PM »
That explains why your levels are so hard...  although I did spot an issue with one of your levels...  either that or I'm missing something.

Am I overlooking something, or in
Turning the Screws

do you need a blocker to turn around lemmings at the middle trapdoor?  If so, you can't because of the game physics and the trap.

I really suggest simplifying these just a little.

Also, I think I'm going to restart the level review game...  as a separate topic, though.

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #65 on: August 03, 2009, 04:06:58 AM »
Yes, you've missed something there. I know you can't turn the lemmings around on that platform, and that is intentional. However...

Quote
Lemmings turn around when they fall through a blocker's field.

And like I said, I'll make an individual decision for each level on what I should do with it. For this particular level, I'll probably loosen the percentage requirements, since currently it forces you to save the maximum possible. (As far as I know, at least :P)

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #66 on: August 03, 2009, 06:33:25 PM »
I just uploaded my 5th level pack, Yawg05. If anyone feels up to it, I'd love to get some preliminary feedback  :D

Download:http://camanis.net/lemmings/levelpacks.php?pack=120
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #67 on: August 09, 2009, 02:05:35 AM »
I'll look at yours now. In the meantime, try the preview levels from my Lemmings Plus DOS Remake (one of which is entirely new), I'd like feedback on them even though four of them are pretty old now (although Lemmerixo has an all new solution).

Okay, I played "Vaccum" and "Tribute To Billy Mays", since they're the sort of short fun level I feel like playing at the moment. Vaccum was a bit on the easy side (although a clever trick used to get the last few pixels of height needed!), but Tribute To Billy Mays was a fun level (although kind of evil, for taking advantage of a glitch and pixel precise moves...)
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #68 on: August 09, 2009, 04:22:11 AM »
Thanks for the feedback...mind giving me a replay of how you did Vacuum? Sounds like you found a backroute  :-\
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Offline namida

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #69 on: August 09, 2009, 04:48:44 AM »
No problem.
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #70 on: August 09, 2009, 04:33:11 PM »
No problem.

Ah, I was afraid there might still be an issue there. I'll probably have to widen the gap between the platforms then, because the intended solution is pretty cool...nice trick with the blocker though  :)
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #71 on: August 25, 2009, 08:59:15 PM »
Hooray! I was the first person to try Giga's levels! If only they could do with some changes for use of Customised lemmings, these levels are really good. These levels I wouldn't consider Mayhem although Level 7 was the only one I couldn't do.

Level 1: May have been seriously backrouted (i.e. too easy). I didn't need a climber for this one.
Level 2: Pretty good. A fair bit of precision required here.
Level 3: Has a surprise of a hidden exit. Not bad, although Part 2 is harder. :P
Level 4: Too easy. Up that rate to make it harder.
Level 5: I've done it with 10 builders to spare, so not hard enough for a double entancer.
Level 6: Terrain looks a bit messy but it's a little bit harder.
Level 7: The biggest challenge of this set, will you tell me if this level is possible? A nicer looking level too.
Level 8: Way too easy but I like the lemming train.
Level 9: A good challenge although I only lost one lemming rather than 20.
Level 10: Let me say this to you on this level: Nobody wants a hidden exit on the last level without telling.

I've done it at last! Saving both bombers and a builder, here's the solution:
Quote
Let the first lemming dig (A few lemmings will be lost thanks to the high release rate). When half way down let him mine a bit then build. Use the blinking cursor feature on the right to let someone build left out of the pit. Use it again to mine right when the lemmings climb to the top of the ramp. Build over the created gap. Let someone from the right side of the new pit build a step so that they jump to the next pit. Quickly bash the wall on the right and then let the last lemming build to the exit.
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Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #72 on: August 31, 2009, 06:18:27 AM »
I finally downloaded Yawg05 and had a look through it. For some reason, I find your levels frustrating. It might have something to do with all the hidden traps...

Here are my thoughts as of now:


1: I don't know how namida solved this (I tried to watch the replay but it didn't work - even when I switched to ONML viewer mode), but I found two solutions here - one fairly straightforward, the other a slight backroute using the miner trick.

2: Trigger areas cancel steel - huge backroute.

3: I haven't made a decent attempt at this yet, but the builder count seems to present a challenge. (Hidden traps... ><img src=" title="Angry" class="smiley" />)

4: Hidden trap behind the exit? Now that's harsh.

5: Whatever the solution is, it probably requires some insane precision.

6: Steel glitches make short work of this one.

7: If you know how the arrows react to miners (which I sort of do), then this is a good little puzzle.

8: The "normal" solution comes up one builder short - I suspect this is intentional, but if it is then I have no idea how to solve this. (Except by building out just beyond the steel area and bomb away the edge of the starting platform.)

9: Easy. Ridiculously easy.

10: Good grief... :XD:

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #73 on: August 31, 2009, 04:17:14 PM »
In response to your review:

On the whole, I admit this pack has a fair few too many hidden traps. In general I'm against hiding them for the sake of it; the only reason I hide mine is for aesthetic reasons. They aren't meant to be a nasty surprise, rather, a quick fix for some of the more annoying back routes.

1. This level has been fraught with back routes since the day I finished it and frankly, I'm tired of trying to patch them all up. We'll just say its meant to have multiple solutions  :P

2. I don't see how you were able to exploit this with the skills given.

3. I'm surprised you found this level challenging, as it was the one I most considered removing for being too straightforward. Of course, I know the solution so that might explain that  :D

4. Again, the trap is only to force you to modify your solution. This is one trap I might consider revealing though; it isn't TOO ugly.

5. Indeed it does. You wouldn't believe how many tries it took me to capture a successful replay. Making this level taught me a lot about the builder head-bumping mechanic though.

6. I've only recently become more aware of my steel-placement to avoid back routes, and this is actually one of the first levels I made that I only just now released, after some touch-ups. I'll see if I can go about fixing the steel placement.

7. Why, thank you. I had fun with this one.

8. Not sure what you mean by "normal solution", as this level's intended solution is far from "normal". I can assure you that it doesn't require any glitches though.

9. Could I get a replay  ???

10. I still feel guilty about making this level. It was basically my revenge on the community for all the bomber timing levels made, past and future  :evil:
Finally released my 6th level pack! Ten levels intended to push you quite a bit beyond the expectations of Mayhem/Havoc; check 'em out and let me know what you think!

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Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #74 on: August 31, 2009, 10:53:19 PM »
2. I don't see how you were able to exploit this with the skills given.

It only takes one digger to exploit it. If you could swap this for a miner (or any number of miners, I guess) and position the steel objects better, then this wouldn't work - the question is whether the intended solution can be modified to use miners instead of the digger.
(EDIT) I should clarify: simply swapping the digger for a miner still leaves a backroute with steel-cancelling by the trigger area of the trap. If you shift the steel object so that it actually covers the steel terrain, this won't work.


9. Could I get a replay  ???

You certainly could. :) And if you have a look at my "top 5", you should be able to see why I found this easy.


Check your PM for replays.

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #75 on: September 16, 2009, 07:43:13 PM »
I tried out Giga's levelpacks but now, I took a look at AdamPack1 (made by Adders who I'm guessing it's Adam :P) and played all of his levels (Only four :(). Here they are:

1: Up! : Good starter level, perfect for Fun, especially the 20 of each skill. The one way rock can easily be built over though.

2: Working my way back to you!: Nice idea of bashing to rescue the others, you don't need that many builders though...

3: Get down on it: A classic sheer drop based level, and good effort taking off the bashers to remove a horrendous backroute.

4: Frustration: Even though your description tells us, this is either way too hard or impossible (Mind you, the wall was taken off on the far right hand side, the time limit is too harsh for such a massive level, and an exit top inside a rock ???).

It was clear that he made the levels with Lemmix.
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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #76 on: September 27, 2009, 03:59:05 PM »
Here's some of Joemon's levels reviewed on Joe03, using the Original lemmings graphics:

2: To get through a ceiling: Blowing up a ceiling is quite boring for some people like me, and I didn't have to use THAT many builders. The time is right.
3: Long way to success: Time limit is right again, but the one way block is no use without any ground removing skills such as the basher, and also, this level works without the floater (see Lemmix replay, if you can't load replays follow this address:)

http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=67.0

7: No looking down: Pretty challenging, but I only used 4 builders and 1 floater for that one.
8: Irritable lemming syndrome: My goodness, what a dark and boring level. It's very similar to Tightrope City, my least favourite level in the game. If I had to do a comparison your level is easier than it.
9: Dead in a few seconds: I lost 15 with 9 builders here, whereas the level wants you to lose 20 with 20 builders. Pretty nice scenery with the inclusion of water.

I may do the rest, but I can't be bothered at the moment.
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Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #77 on: October 01, 2009, 12:43:22 PM »
I'm still working on a 4th pack. One level still in progress, while the others are being tested then ideas for the rest of the levels for the pack will be thought out :)

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #78 on: October 04, 2009, 02:10:32 AM »
ISteve10.dat is finished! I'll post it soon (couple hours or so).

I'm quite pleased with how this pack turned out; I think it is by far my best levelpack to this point and relies entirely on clever solution-finding -- no cheap tricks or glitches anywhere in this pack.

Also there's a snow level and a dirt level.  :o
"こんなげーむにまじになっちゃってどうするの"

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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #79 on: October 04, 2009, 03:04:55 AM »
Can we also have someone review Epic03?  btw, it's only six levels.

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #80 on: October 04, 2009, 05:18:22 AM »
Ok, here's the pack. If you find something that screams "backroute lol", tell me  :P

I also have a hints/solution file if you want it, but I'm not going to upload it quite yet.

Use CustLemm mechanics to play these. For example, Level 9 will be impossible for obvious reasons if you don't  ><img src=" title="Angry" class="smiley" />
"こんなげーむにまじになっちゃってどうするの"

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Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #81 on: October 04, 2009, 09:04:10 AM »
Use CustLemm mechanics to play these. For example, Level 9 will be impossible for obvious reasons if you don't  ><img src=" title="Angry" class="smiley" />

It might be Lemmini by the fact that your level 9 is impossible. I've solved it with Lemmix, and this is actually the first level I solved in your pack.  ;P

Your level 10 reminds me of a level that I recently created called Level 101. This one should be as difficult as your levels. I'll put it up in the submissions thread for the epic lemmings fangame.
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Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #82 on: October 04, 2009, 02:21:50 PM »
Nicely made levels so far. Extremely challenging though.

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #83 on: October 04, 2009, 03:39:17 PM »
Don't worry about that. ALL of Insane Steve's levels are difficult.

Anyway, as this is meant to be an open review thread, would anyone review my fourth set? The third was done in the Custom level review game.
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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #84 on: October 04, 2009, 03:41:27 PM »
Hey, I have time.  I'll be HAPPY to review your levels!
Just downloaded the pack, and I'm setting up a custlemm for it.

Offline geoo

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #85 on: October 04, 2009, 04:02:17 PM »
I actually didn't find Insane Steve's new levels outstandingly hard; each one required quite a bit of thought, but none gave me major trouble. Only exception might be level 6 if my second solutions is a backroute and I have to find a different solution (my first one is a very blatant backroute to the right exit, the fall height is too low there).
Overall a very enjoyable pack to play.

My favourite one was level 4, closely followed by level 5, though I'm not quite sure whether my solution to level 5 is the intended one.

I found yet another backroute to level 8, essentially ClamSpammer's first backroute, just using a basher against the steel block right to the holding pit to turn the climber around.
There's also a backroute to the 9th level, as a climber can easily get out of the water, but I think I also found the intended solution.

I'll send my solutions via e-mail.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #86 on: October 04, 2009, 04:03:44 PM »
lm_set04
Level 1 - Creepy Tentacle Monster
@%#! hidden traps!  Also, requires knowledge of keyboard controls.  This level was probably intended for Lemmini.

Level 2 - Upsidedown Islands
I haven't completed this level yet, but here's what the first impressions are:

Good:  Looks nice...  well, most of it.  Time limit forces you not to complete the path with only one lemming, then release the crowd, but instead you have to get close to completing the path and then releasing the crowd.
Bad:  The apparent solution is obvious.  Doesn't require much thinking to find.  Also, the upsidedown figure with the exit on it, which I am assuming is supposed to be the Nessy in the official level, Hunt the Nessy, is rather ugly.  Too much building, which ruins the chance of a really good hero lemming level.

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #87 on: October 04, 2009, 04:17:59 PM »
Have you done Level 1 yet? I've got a harder version if you want it.

Anyway, here are all your levels.

Level 1: Found an easy backroute to your level, which spoils the thing, even though it's Level 1 this is my first replay.
Level 2: This level I don't like. I didn't need the one way at all. My second replay saves 100% in less than 25 builders.
Level 3: Found what I think is another backroute. Here's another replay.
Level 4: I solved 100% and didn't have to use the one-way at all. Here my fourth and final replay.
Level 5: This one is better than the other four. Good job, even though I don't like having to rescue lemmings falling too far, especially with two entrances.
Level 6: This is way too easy for a final level. I only needed two bashers to win.
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Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #88 on: October 04, 2009, 04:30:20 PM »
My Joe03 levelpak didn't have all levels reviewed. Is anyone interested in reviewing any of my packs?

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #89 on: October 04, 2009, 05:04:01 PM »
I believe that touches all of my "Official Backroutes!"  Yeah, the levels had those backroutes on purpose.  They're all supposed to have more than one solution.  Although, yeah, level 1 could use some work...  I'll patch that one up with a few...  upgrades.  I'll remove Level 2, though.  The intended takes a lot of work, but I'm assuming the "backroute" makes it trivial?  If not, I'll leave it in, but... (I'll try the replays later)

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #90 on: October 04, 2009, 08:39:07 PM »
Ok, got your solutions. Of them 4 are what I'd consider "fairly different" backroute, though all but about one or two of them will be fairly trivial to fix.

Your solution to 7 was amazingly clever, btw.
"こんなげーむにまじになっちゃってどうするの"

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #91 on: October 04, 2009, 10:28:09 PM »
I'm still trying to pass the first level in the pack.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #92 on: October 05, 2009, 03:00:07 AM »
I just played through ISteve10. Expect a PM with replays shortly  :)

Level 4 was my favourite too, though I also liked 9 (even though it's a bit long) and 2 (very simple and clever).

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #93 on: October 05, 2009, 05:09:10 AM »
I hate that 5 was so easy to backroute -- the intended solution is quite elegant in my opinion. 6 was expected, though.

I might make a "challenge" pack which highlights geoo's level 7 route and Clam's somewhat roundabout way to pass 9, among a couple other things I noticed.

Thanks to everyone who dled and played the pack -- if you're stuck on some of the levels, I'll release the solution .txt with the de-backrouted version of the pack.
"こんなげーむにまじになっちゃってどうするの"

~"Beat" Takeshi Kitano

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #94 on: October 06, 2009, 10:36:05 PM »
Lm_set04
Level 1 - Creepy Tentacle Monster
UPDATE:  I think I found a way to do it.  I haven't tested it, but I think the best way to go about it would be to use a glitch to push the lemmings into the wall.

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #95 on: October 07, 2009, 04:02:50 AM »
Ok, fixed most of the backroutes (I hope), except probably 6. I think 6 is hopeless but I don't know maybe I can put the intended trick in a level later.

I'll post the revised version very soon, 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9 have been altered to remove various backroutes.
"こんなげーむにまじになっちゃってどうするの"

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #96 on: October 07, 2009, 05:38:10 PM »
Lm_set04
Level 1 - Creepy Tentacle Monster
UPDATE:  I think I found a way to do it.  I haven't tested it, but I think the best way to go about it would be to use a glitch to push the lemmings into the wall.

I didn't use that! ;P Anyway, I have a tougher version of this level if anyone wants it. I'll put it up in the custom challenges thread.
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Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #97 on: October 10, 2009, 05:39:03 AM »
Ok, I revised the pack to remove some backroutes. I hope. At least, re-try 5, 6, and 7 if you didn't find the "real" routes in the past.

Also here's a text file with hints and solutions.
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Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #98 on: October 10, 2009, 06:20:40 AM »
Heh... that reminds me of something, you had a website showing your level pack downloads and also, the hints and solutions to (almost) each one.
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Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #99 on: October 10, 2009, 10:27:35 PM »
Is anyone interested in reviewing levels of any of my paks? Sorry if i'm naggy

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #100 on: October 11, 2009, 12:27:39 AM »
I'll review them.
What I will do for simplicity is back up and replace some packs in a LEMRMAKE directory.  Then run it in DOSbox (seeing as I don't want to reboot my computer to review).

Wait, where do I get the VGAspec for pack 3?

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #101 on: October 11, 2009, 02:11:08 AM »
Here's the results so far:

joe01 - Level 1 - A fun start

Number of Lemmings:  50
To save:  25 (50%)
Release Rate:  10
Skills: No climbers or floaters, 20 of everything else.

Good:  Simple level for its place in the pack.  Nice design...
Okay:  ...although a little sloppy.  I hope "A fun start" refers to the difficulty level. :XD:  Plus, the part of the design that's there is decent looking, but for the rest,  :scared: another lack of decorative terrain.  Why is this always lacking in levels, both custom and official?
Bad:  Isn't very fun to play, not please with going back to grab stats.  It appears there's a 100% solution, but if it works, it's hard to pull off due to the water trigger areas.  Could have been avoided rather easily through better placement of terrain.

joe01 - Level 2 - The Crusher

Lemmings:
  50
To save: 
40 (80%)
Release Rate:  20
Skills:  10 builders

Good:  The traps can be seen, so to anyone who has played Lemmings, it should be clear that it isn't just watch the lemmings enter the exit.
Okay:  Again, rather plain-looking.  Decorative terrain is generally a good thing.
Bad:  Gotta love misbehaving trigger areas, you can never tell what the highest altitude they're willing to strike at.  Although, this cannot be solved easily without severely changing the level.  This makes clearing the level, well, a little annoying the first time.  Solution is way too obvious, and the trapdoor sticking in the ceiling is ugly.
Note:  Sometimes a level's solution should be obvious, but this doesn't feel like one of those cases to me.  I can tell it's not backrouted, as well.  Is a backroute even possible with this skill set?

joe01 - Level 3 - An unhealthy option

Lemmings:  40
To save:  25 (62%)
Release Rate:  50
Skills:  20 builders, 10 bashers

Good:  Definately a nice looking level from the veiwpoint the game provides.
Okay:  The building isn't too bad, but it's slow.
Bad:   At first, it looks intimidating, but then you see the skillset.  Woah, that's easy!

joe01 - Level 4 - Another twist of lemming, please

Lemmings:  50
To save:  50 (100%)
Release Rate:  50
Skills:  1 climber, 50 floaters, 4 builders, 1 basher, 1 digger

*white flags level*
VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY BAD:  Requires one to click on fifty lemmings, make a lemming dig really deep, taking at least a minute, and a basher must be told to go the right way in a really small space.  GAAAAAAAAAH!

Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #102 on: October 11, 2009, 10:45:04 AM »
I'll review them.
What I will do for simplicity is back up and replace some packs in a LEMRMAKE directory.  Then run it in DOSbox (seeing as I don't want to reboot my computer to review).

Wait, where do I get the VGAspec for pack 3?

I had it with original Lemmings package. Want me to send to you?

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #103 on: October 11, 2009, 11:22:56 AM »
another lack of decorative terrain.  Why is this always lacking in levels, both custom and official?

Decorative terrain takes time to make you know.  It's a choice of whether you want to spend more time on a level that's basically done, on something that doesn't actually have any impact on the level solution, or instead spending that time on your next level.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #104 on: October 11, 2009, 02:54:15 PM »
Original Lemmings package?  So, are you saying the VGAspec3.dat from the original lemmings game?  If not, send it to me.

Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #105 on: October 11, 2009, 03:53:35 PM »
Original Lemmings package?  So, are you saying the VGAspec3.dat from the original lemmings game?  If not, send it to me.

I found the Lemmings DOS version on the Lemmings file archive. Vgaspec3.dat is in it.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #106 on: October 12, 2009, 12:28:16 AM »
I've gotten levels 1-4 of joe01 reviewed.  Level 4 is a prime example of why level developers need to be more careful.  It's on page 7.

Offline Pooty

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #107 on: October 12, 2009, 09:45:49 AM »
Good:  The traps can be seen, so to anyone who has played Lemmings, it should be clear that it isn't just watch the lemmings enter the exit.

I played the level, and I solved it by doing nothing at all.  ???
SEGA Master System version
100% on 110/120 levels (92%). Other levels [Lemmings lost]:
Fun 03 [3], 06 [2], 18 [5]   
Taxing 19 [5], 27 [1], 28 [3]
Tricky 15 [5], 17 [2]
Mayhem 19 [7], 26 [10]

Offline geoo

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #108 on: October 14, 2009, 01:24:47 AM »
Ok, I revised the pack to remove some backroutes. I hope. At least, re-try 5, 6, and 7 if you didn't find the "real" routes in the past.

Also here's a text file with hints and solutions.
Steel digging is still possible in level 9, allowing you to waste a builder somewhere in the solution.
Pretty certain I found the intended solutions for 5 & 7 now; retrying level 5 I suddenly realized you could easily send an athlete down to the bottom, something I had previously overlooked. With that in mind, I found the solution pretty quickly and didn't look out for more complex routes.
In level 6 for a long time I blatantly overlooked to most efficient way to do the ending part near the left exit (as you'll remember from my previous replay), but now found a solution that looks to me like it might very likely be the intended solution, the only issue is that there's a leftover builder. Using this additional builder, another route is possible which does not use the key element.
I like the idea a lot, especially having 7 floaters which seem like they'd go to the right exit, 7 climber for the left exit and one leftover lemming; the actual solution still making use of these number, however in a different way.
Solutions via e-mail in a few minutes.

Offline Joemon

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #109 on: October 14, 2009, 07:18:32 PM »
I have a 4th levelpak on the Lemmings file archive now :)

enjoy  :thumbsup:

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #110 on: October 29, 2009, 06:13:47 AM »
I randomly downloaded Clam Spammer's 4th and 5th packs.

In pack 4, level 3 is the only level I've successfully done after a few attempts on both.

In pack 5, I passed level 1 with 100% in one try. Then I 1 tried level 2 with no problems.

If pack 5 supposed to be a lot easier than pack 4?
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Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #111 on: October 29, 2009, 06:16:55 AM »
I made these with Dullstar's fangame in mind. So yes, they are supposed to be easier than the levels in my earlier packs.

Offline chaos_defrost

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #112 on: October 29, 2009, 06:22:30 AM »
Ok, just making sure.

One last thing, is 9 supposed to be possible with no climbers and 2 diggers used?
"こんなげーむにまじになっちゃってどうするの"

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Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmix Level Reviews
« Reply #113 on: October 29, 2009, 06:36:51 AM »
If you find a solution in this pack that looks too easy, it's not a backroute, it's an alternate route. Which is kind of a cop out, but hey. :D

Perhaps this level is a little easier than I'd like it to be though, especially considering how tough my original solution was... I'll think about it.