Experimental Releases for Physics Bugs

[Nepster]

Edit by namida: Check the latest posts in this topic for the most up-to-date experimentals. These are released by me rather than Nepster so I haven't edited them into his original post here.

DOWNLOAD THE MOST RECENT VERSION Exp V1.44-D HERE:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/29zxv1iis02n358/NeoLemmix_Exp%201.44-D.exe?dl=1

Here is an experimental release fixing some of the physics bugs. This version is even less official than namida's experimental releases and it might very well be that some bugs get removed in a totally different fashion in the official release. You can get the experimental version here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pkee100jdjlmlcc/NeoLemmix_Nepster_Experimental.exe?dl=0

The following glitches were fixed:

• Cloning platformer leaves gap: The latest brick is now cloned as well.
• Less strict terrain checks for platformers at left edge: Same terrain checks now everywhere.
• Builder-Walker-combo to ghost through 1-pixel walls: If builders now find solid terrain at the pixel they want to go to, they directly turn around and not only after moving into this position. At sufficiently high walls an equivalent check was already in the original code, so nothing should have changed there.
• Building horizontally through walls: Automatically fixed by the earlier turning position.
• Miner falls through 1-pixel high OWW-ground: Lem turns around if after mining, he cannot move down due to steel or wrong OWW. He will not stop if there is normal terrain (e.g. by placing bricks).
• Updrafts don't effect OhNoers: They do now.
• How bashers turn at steel: The behavior is still the same as for the experimental release attached to the posts in the basher topic.
• Triggered traps are only checked during some frames: Now they are checked on all frames (as long as the lemming is no blocker)
• Assigning miners on OWW: The OWW-check for assigning miners was moved from somewhere in front of the lemming to directly below the lemming, just where the steel check is already.
• Skill-count for cloned lemmings: Now only the original lemming is remembered to have used a skill. Warning: I was not able to really check whether the behavior is now correct!
• Swimmer bugs: Here lots of terrain checks were moved one pixel. Probably the biggest change occurs when a swimmer moves upwards in water: He will usually be one pixel below the position in V1.43. In a few other cases, the lemming position will (at least for a few frames) differ by one pixel when compared to V1.43.
• Platformer moves into isolated pixels: This was already discussed with namida on IRC yesterday, so I just went ahead and let the platformer stall a bit. If you don't like this change, it can easily be reverted to the original behavior.
• Non-deleted blocker fields: When a lemming gets killed by a trap (or is teleported away), the blocker field is deleted now.

I tested this version using 455 replays of NepsterLems and various LP level packs. Result:

• 367 replays succeeded.
• 85 replays failed due to builder bug fix
• 2 replays failed due to assignment of miners on OWW
• 1 replay failed due to copied brick of cloned platformer

Because of the high number of the failures due to the builder bug fix, I made a second experimental version with all fixes, except for the two builder bugs.

[IchoTolot]

Results:

Reunion: 28 Failed   15 Undetermined   107 Passed -----  43 broken  ( nearly 1/3 )
Pimo:      21 Failed   12 Undetermined   112 Passed -----  33 broken  ( a bit more than 1/4 )

I did not go through my single levels, but I expect quite a few broken replays there, too.

So in total I would say ~ 100 broken replays overall for me.

As things like the miner/cloner behavior that glitches through terrain were not yet included, prob a few more will come to this.
If there is room for backwards-friendly improvement it would be in fixing that builder behavior.

Also what about the deadly left/right sides, or the possibility of assiging miners on wrong facing OWW's rather than treat it as steel?  Nobody posts in the dedicated discussions anymore and I would like to know what the final result is, so I/We can prepare.

[namida]

Chances are that (pending feedback, and my own actual testing of them) I will use these fixes as much as possible. It'd be a shame to waste the effort that went into making them, after all. That being said, it's never a good idea to rely on the fiddlier details of an experimental release, even if it was one that came from me.

There's no final decision in regards to those things yet. If you feel it's important to prepare your levels now, I would say the best option would be to make them independant of the outcome on those. Be aware that the next update will end up being a pretty major one due to the large amount of physics changes / fixes, so it's to be expected that not all content will be upgraded to it right away. Due to that, and the removal of gimmicks etc, V1.43n-F will remain easily available, so there won't be so much pressure to upgrade as quickly as possible.

[Nepster]

Here is a new experimental release, which includes some changes mentioned in topics that have not yet reached a final decision. In addition to the changes made for the first experimental version, the following changes were added:

• Deadly sides of levels: The left and right edge of the level are now void and behave like the bottom. Please try the experimental release and post your feedback in the deadly sides topic so that we may reach a decision soon.
• Stackers turn too soon: The turn-around rule was changed to: One frame after placing a brick, that does not add any terrain pixels, the stacker turns around.
• Climber may bomb deeper holes: A special rule was added: If a climber reaches a 7-pixel wall, then the hoister starts at ground level, not one pixel below.
• Intermediate checks for trigger areas: Intermediate checks were added so that the glitches described by möbius, ccexplore and others should not be possible any more. However to avoid adding new glitches (seperation of builder from crowd), checks for blocker fields are made only at the final lemming position (same as in the current NeoLemmix version). Whether (or rather which) new glitches appeared by adding intermediate checks has to be seen. This needs a lot more testing than what little I just did. 

Moreover the floater, glider and stacker sprites were subtly changed to remove exceptions in the code. It is a known graphical glitch, that neither stacker bricks nor parachutes get recolored. Please ignore this for now.

Download the experimental release here:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/00wa2i8sfr5qspf/NeoLemmix_Nepster_Experimental_2016-04-02.exe?dl=1

[IchoTolot]

Test Results:

Reunion: Same as before.

PimoLems: +1 undetermined. Hurricane 12 "Rod Island" Reason: A basher stops now instead of continuing. --- start a pixel lower and it's fixed, so no break here

If the miner/cloner thing is fixed + a decision in the miner/wrong OWW has been made, I might go through my single stuff where I also use all the new skills.

[Nepster]

Oops, the cloner-miner-bug is already fixed in the new experimental version. I just forgot to mention this.

[namida]

Danger 19 from LPI's intended solution replay raises a possible issue (level and replay attached). Not entirely sure what the ideal result of this situation is.

Note that by slightly changing the timer of the blocker assignment, you can avoid the "stuck in one position, facing same direction" matter. However, an extra digger is still needed compared to previously in order to free the blocker (note that this digger can merely substitute for the miner, rather than being in addition to it). Alternatively, by waiting longer to assign the blocker, one can mine at such a time where the miner will no longer be affected by the blocker. Also note that this is probably not the only way to solve this level, so it isn't even close to level-breaking as far as this level is concerned; just breaks replays and increases the execution difficulty of one possible approach.

[Nepster]

The previous experimental version turned out to be pretty buggy (but what do you expect with an experimental release ): One builder check was missing (which should have been kept from V1.43) and the intermediate trigger area checks introduced quite a few bugs/gltiches (as predicted by Simon).
So here is the next try:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/umwt758tnqczefj/NeoLemmix_Nepster_Experimental_2016-04-03.exe?dl=1

[IchoTolot]

Ok, here are my results:

Reunion:     
Failed: 18 (-10)  Undertermined: 10 (-5) Passed: 122 (+15)    --->  28 replays broken   ~ 1/5

PimoLems:
Failed: 14 (-7)    Undetermined: 10 (-2)  Passed: 121 (+9)      --->  24 replays broken   ~ 1/6

A big improvement in terms of backwards-compability here

Take your time with the final version! Rather fix and check the exp. version a few weeks more, than have a bugged official release which would lead to multiple hotfixes that also break newly fixed replays again along the way.

[IchoTolot]

Ok tested my single levels with the newest exp version.

Results:

Total levels: 35    Passed: 26   Failed: 9     (~ 1/4 failure rate)

The failes were all just broken replays, because of following reasons:

Builder fix: 4 (Among it "T=0K")

Stacker change: 2

Assignment is off due to cloner platformer/builder fix: 1

Basher against steel: 1 ("Lemmings in Unison")

Walker assignment off. 1 ("Spider Dance")

[Nepster]

Here a new experimental release: Lots of small bugs were fixed, like lemmings stopping when meeting (on intermediate checks) some trigger areas of an already triggered traps, and many more...
There are three big changes:
1) Trigger area checks after stepping out of receiver: If there is no trigger area, there should be no difference at all to V1.43. It just does some more checks now. I haven't discovered any irregular behavior, but please check again, especially given namida's worries that this introduces bugs.
2) Disarmers and harmless one-kill traps: Disarmers should no longer disarm harmless traps.
3) Blocker areas overlapping other trigger areas are again working properly. This was a bug introduced in the previous experimental release.

I haven't yet fixed the bug "Walkers allow to pass OW-Fields in wrong direction", because there is no preference yet visible how it should be fixed and I am waiting for more input.

Download link:
   https://www.dropbox.com/s/zd1xyxr3qnfplwo/NeoLemmix_Nepster_Experimental_2016-04-10.exe?dl=1

[IchoTolot]

Nothing new has broken, everything is as before for me.

Tested: Reunion + PimoLems + Every single level from me that uses teleporters

[Nepster]

Time for a new experimental release: Apart from a few bug fixes, lots of behind-the-scenes stuff regarding objects was done. This means on the one hand side, that object rendering is now much faster and even lemming rendering should be improved now. On the other hand, chances are that a few new bugs got introduced by this. So please test it and notify us if you see any graphical (or other) bugs.
The main bug-fixes concern:
1) Walkers passing through One-way-fields: The current fix is kind of a hack-job. Even after dealing with the normal set-up, I needed three more tries before it too worked as expected, if the terrain below the lemming in the one-way-field got removed. In particular this means, that it is kind of doubtful, that I caught all exceptional cases. So please stress-test this bug-fix.
2) Exploder time of 9 seconds: I changed the exploder time to full 9 seconds = 153 frames. Please check, whether you like the current behavior better than the old one. It is a matter of 5 seconds to change the exploder count-down again.

Download link:
   https://www.dropbox.com/s/1qnvrx8zyk6h157/NeoLemmix_2016-04-20.exe?dl=1

[Nepster]

Time for a new experimental release:
1) No leading zeros and black-out instead of white-out in skill counter: Thanks to a change made by namida, leading zeros are now always disabled and instead of whiting out, the option is now to black out the skill count once it reaches zero. These changes were made to give you the possiblity to test them in actual game-play (compared to just arguing theoretically about this). So please give us feedback, whether you like the new way better than the old one, or not.
Important: Old settings for using "White-out" seem to be ignored and so "Black-Out" will be disabled if you download the experimental player. So be sure to check the options menu!
2) New priority algorithm for skill assignments: Due to yesterday's discussion on IRC and some ugly looking parts in the corresponding code, I decided to replace the prioritizing algorithm with a new overly complicated very sophisticated one, which should be much more flexible as well (e.g. easily permits full priority invert is this is desired). In most cases, you will probably not feel any difference, but hopefully the changes remove a tiny bit of frustration once in a while .
So please give it a try and tell us, whenever NeoLemmix assigns a skill to the wrong lemming. The new algorithm can certainly be improved in many ways!

Download link:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1ykzxx9n491mnu/NeoLemmix_Exp%201.44-A.exe?dl=1

[Wafflem]

I get an Access Violation error when I assign a bomber to a lemming that is not falling. The lemming still explodes after clicking "OK", so the error is just an annoyance but still very important to fix.

Also, the green/blue color inversion when assigning a lemming a permanent skill is a very awesome touch!

[Nepster]

The bug is, that NeoLemmix still wanted to display the "type" (e.g. walker, shrugger, athlete, ...) of the lemming, even though he wasn't available any longer.
This should be fixed in version Exp 1.44-B, downloadable here:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/ut1lnjhfa4saqe5/NeoLemmix_Exp%201.44-B.exe?dl=1

[Nepster]

Here a new experimental release:
1) Fixed bug "glider fall through thin floors": There are now stricter terrain checks in place.
2) Foreshadowing of builders, platformers and stackers: Whenever a builder-type skill is selected and the cursor hovers over a lemming who can receive this skill, a dark gray shadow will appear where the terrain will be added.
Warning: The game does not (yet) take sourrounding terrain in account! So even if a builder will hit his head after placing four bricks, the shadow will still display the full 12 bricks.

Download link for Exp V1.44-C:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/ws399r13rsw7mux/NeoLemmix_Exp%201.44-C.exe?dl=1

Edit: This experimental version just crashed for some reason. I removed the download until this is fixed.
Edit 2: Next try...
Edit 3: WARNING: The crashing bug is still there. Please redownload version Exp V1.44-C2.

[Nepster]

I fixed a bit and I haven't seen anything wrong while using the experimental version for the last hour. I am still not sure, what caused the crash or that my changes really fixed the bug, so please let me know if you see something amiss.

[Nepster]

Ok, the previous bug-fix did not solve the game-crashing issue. Please redownload version Exp 1.44-C2, where in theory the bug can no longer occur:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/nh2l49s6gkr8ajj/NeoLemmix_Exp%201.44-C2.exe?dl=1

[Nepster]

Given the lively discussions during the last few days, here an experimental version to test some of the suggestions:
1) Bug-fix for miner-blocker interaction glitch: I implemented proposal 3) for now, until it turns out that this introuces further problems.
2) Lots of minor changes in lemming selection and prioritization, as discussed here and here: The most important change is, that selected lemmings now have a red body and are drawn on top of all the other lemmings. Moreover, as discussed, detailed informations are now given always for the lemming that would receive the skill.
3) Shadows for bashers, miners and diggers: Similar to the ones for builders, platformers and stackers introduced in the previous experimental release.
4) Music and talismans should now work properly again.
5) Loading the preview screen is faster now. Not all of this is due to real behind-the-scenes improvements though, because I tuned up the fading speed, too.

Download the new experimental version here:
  https://www.dropbox.com/s/29zxv1iis02n358/NeoLemmix_Exp%201.44-D.exe?dl=1

Note that this experimental version does not yet support namida's new file formats, different background colors, ...

[Wafflem]

Two things to point out:
1. When a lemming floats/glides down, they disappear until they touch the ground again. I think this glitch has occurred before in some of namida's NepsterLems videos.
2. Santa Lemmings don't change color when they are under the cursor, because they are already dressed in red. They should turn maybe blue or green when under the cursor.

[namida]

I'm questioning whether or not to keep Santa lemmings in future, now that we have a lot of features based on recoloring the lemming (it's easy enough to make a one-off special handling for Santa Lemmings, but if we're going to allow one different set of sprites, it makes no sense not to allow custom ones). If such a feature is kept, it's going to be nessecary to either duplicate animations or have a file that defines how to recolor a set of sprites.

In regards to the disappearing lemmings, it's probably just a missing or incorrect sprite for those. Nepster modified these sprites a while back; and we've often messed up with actually including the modified sprites in compiled copies; if a version is compiled with the old sprites but the new code (or vice versa), weird stuff happens. I won't go into the technical details here, but I had thought the required compiled data file was being synced along with the rest of the code now, though... I'll double check this when I get a chance.

[Nepster]

Regarding recoloring of custom sprites: It is not impossible to get this working. Currently the colors to change are hardcoded (mainly because I forgot about the santa sprites), but one could get them alternatively by looking at certain pixels in the first walker sprite: The pixel 5 pixels above the foot position should usually have the body color and the one 9 pixels above has a high chance to be a hair pixel (the actual values are guesswork for the moment!). Then one could use this information to determine the replacement color and apply it.
This would however assume two properties of lemming sprites:
a) Body and hair have a uniform color instead of using many different shades. At least in theory, different shades could be dealt with as well, but that would make stuff much more complicated.
b) The body and hair color aren't used elsewhere in lemming sprites. If they would for example be used in the builder backpack, then the builder backpack would change color too, which will very likely look ugly. This might be a much bigger problem regarding the santa sprites, which I don't really know how to solve.


There are two more little bugs I noticed. I describe them here just to make sure, I don't forget about them:
- Trap sprites that are killing a lemming with a permanent skill are not yet recolored.
- If a level does not give you any skill, the game crashes when hovering the cursor over a lemming (likely due to creating garbled input for the GetPriorityLem method). This only happens if the skillbar is completely empty, i.e. if not even one skill is depicted. Even having one skill with zero uses is enough for NeoLemmix to work fine.

[namida]

If such a feature is kept, it's going to be nessecary to either duplicate animations or have a file that defines how to recolor a set of sprites.

Of course, the latter is preferable, which is why I've now added support for this (since I'm currently working on moving lemming rendering from TLemmingGame to TRenderer anyway, it was a good time to make this change).

b) The body and hair color aren't used elsewhere in lemming sprites. If they would for example be used in the builder backpack, then the builder backpack would change color too, which will very likely look ugly. This might be a much bigger problem regarding the santa sprites, which I don't really know how to solve.

Easy - modify the sprites so the shade of whatever you don't want to have change is ever so slightly different.

[namida]

I've put together this experimental release, which uses new formats to some extent (uses new graphic set format exclusively, uses external sprite files, works with both old and new level files). It has some new features beyond the last Physics Bug fixes, such as indicators on trapdoors and teleporters.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/exhwhwdbzr94s29/NeoLemmix_VExNf145n_Experimental.zip?dl=0

Please note:
- It will probably run slightly slow. Performance issues are known, but are low-priority until it's closer to time for a stable release.
- Only levels using the Orig, OhNo, Xmas, LPII or LPIII graphic sets will be playable in this. The Sega, Horror, LPIV and all custom-made graphic sets are not.
- VGASPEC levels are not playable.
- There's probably a fairly large amount of graphical glitches, especially with lemming sprites.
- Circuit levels might use the Santa lemmings. I changed it to do so while testing and not sure if I changed back before uploading.

It is compatible with LVL files and NXPs, as long as they only use the above graphic sets.

Also, try out the attached level in the stable version, then in this version.

[IchoTolot]

The test level totally confuses me.
It seems to auto complete/delete exits, but in the new version the exits arent working anymore   This seems like a bug.

Hotkey to toggle the display of hatches etc is still missing, but it seems that this is on the to-do list still.

And the glider animation seems to be glitchy as well (as mentioned )

General things:

- The slight yellow background of the pillar tileset is too yellow for my taste + maybe even the fire one. For tilesets where it isn't 100% nessesary I would be a bit more conservative with the bg color. But a little bit of bg color would still be good to highlight the playing area. The marble one seems to be alright.

- The rock tileset seems to be missing, I'll get an error trying to load a rock level. (Lemdiana  Jones attached as a test)
  EDIT: All OhNo tilesets seem to be missing!

- Escape from Lemlab (marble with teleporters) causes an Access Violation when "entering" the level. Level attached.

[Wafflem]

The same issue with the Oh No styles also happens to the LPII styles.

The background colors...hmm, I have mixed feelings about those. They suit the Marble, Crystal and Sky styles fairly well, but they can be distracting sometimes (e.g. Icho's comment about the yellow/red in the Pillar/Fire tilesets).

[namida]

The non-working exit is because I forgot to adjust the trigger area downwards to account for the larger size. >_> You can fix it by modifying "exit.nxob" (in the "styles/dirt" folder) with a text editor and increasing the trigger area's Y position by 8 pixels.

As for the non-working Ohno / LPII styles, try deleting their "translation.nxmi" files (note: the Orig-Dirt style also has such a file, do not delete this one, there's nothing wrong with it).

Assuming that it's not another translation.nxmi issue (which it shouldn't be), I'll look into the issue with Escape from Lemlab. I haven't noticed issues with teleporters, but I've only tried the ones in the Circuit, Martian and Psychedelic sets.

I'll look into these issues in more depth at some point soon and, if the solutions are anything more complex than what's listed above, I'll release an updated experimental version.


In regards to the glitchy animations, this is known and it's something I'm working on at the moment. In particular, many arise because due to the animations being difficult to resize under the old code, some kludges had to be used to position some of them correctly; with resizing them now much easier, I can make proper fixes to the graphics themself; and doing so is currently WIP. The glider is more likely that it's using the old graphic though, rather than Nepster's improved one, which should be as simple to fix as replacing a few files...

[namida]

Here's one that should hopefully work better:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/e1j3of0o8yuz5kc/NeoLemmix_VExNf1.45n-B_Experimental.zip?dl=0

Lemming animations should be fixed now for standard lemmings, so let me know if you see any that are problematic. The Santa lemmings have not been fixed yet, so there will probably be issues with them.

The non-working minimap is a known issue.
There's another vaguely known issue that affects for example IchoTolot's "Escape from LemLab". Suspected (but not confirmed) cause is teleporters that don't have a proper corresponding receiver.

Note that only the Orig, OhNo and Xmas sets, as well as two of the LPIII sets (Circuit and Martian) and the Epic set, will work with this release. NXPs will, as long as they don't use any graphic sets other than those ones. So, try packs such as the official games (aside from Extra since it uses Genesis styles; also be aware that VGASPEC levels won't work), Lemmings Plus I, GeoffLems, NepsterLems or the various Lemmix conversions to test this out; most (but not all) levels of GigaLems and Lemmings Reunion should be fine too. (Do be aware that most of these have not specifically been tested against this version, so some levels may not be possible.)

As you might notice if you examine the files, the Xmas set doesn't actually have duplicates of all the pieces it shares with the Snow set now. Rather, it'll make use of the new version's ability to mix sets, and just use those pieces from the Snow set. The trap is a special case, due to the need to display Santa lemmings as part of its animation. Similarly, some recurring objects (for example, preplaced lemmings, or the flags) have been put in a "default" set, and when loading levels that use them, it'll redirect to the "default" set for them. Exits and their tops have been merged for all sets except Circuit, where they've been kept seperately so that the top can animate constantly while the body unlocks (it has however been reconfigured to always just use the lockable version - if a level has no buttons, it simply acts like a normal exit).

If you want to try messing around, you can modify the "translation.nxmi" files in each graphic set's folder.

Do note - levels using the Epic set might look a bit weird, as the actual Epic set contains the Lemmini graphics (which NeoLemmix then downscales); whereas this version actually uses the respective pieces from the standard sets, thus using the native NL pieces.

If you downloaded this before I added Epic tileset support, just download the attached file, and place it in a subfolder of the styles folder called "epic".

[namida]

Here's a new one.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7v75rirno6wsnpe/NeoLemmix_VExNf1.45n-C_Experimental.zip?dl=0

Most of the improvements from before are behind-the-scenes stuff. There's a few minor fixes (eg. the glider in 1px wide updraft bug is fixed, scrolling is no longer glitchy when done by clicking the minimap; savestate frame is no longer visible for a split second when backwards framestepping). Try playing the included NXLV file if you dare.

Also, for those interested in the behind the scenes stuff, take a look at the one-way arrows' data files in any sets that use the standard ones (ie: any L1 set except Fire / Crystal or any OhNo set). If you're lost, check the translation table files for a hint. Pickup skills might be interesting too.

For the record, this copy includes translation tables (and the required pieces themself) for:
- All Orig sets
- All OhNo sets
- All LPII sets
- All LPIII sets
- The Xmas set
- The Sega set
- The Horror set
- All Orig VGASPECs
- The Covox / Prima VGASPECs
- The "Epic" set

LPIV sets or any that are only auto-downloadable (not fully included) are *not* supported by this copy, nor are any of the unofficial / non-DOS-version VGASPECs.

[namida]

Another new one. This one introduces the new replay format (which has been quick-tested but not thoroughly tested yet). Old format replays are still supported for loading, but it only saves new-format ones. It also includes all of Nepster's recent changes.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5x5cd99pxgm54q8/NeoLemmix_Experimental_VExNf1.46n.zip?dl=0

As far as I know, no packs have been tested against the very latest physics fixes, but NepsterLems and Deceit's Lemmings have been tested against physics very close to the current ones so should still be solvable, if you're looking for a pack to properly play on this. As far as I'm aware, neither of these packs use styles outside of the ones supported in this version.

Supported graphic sets are same as above, plus the LPIV sets (or in other words - all graphic sets that ship by default with the stable version). The background in Dirt levels is not intended to be permanent, but it's more to show off this feature; if you don't like it, delete the "dirt_bg.png" file in styles/themes. The VGASPECs that weren't already supported before, still aren't (or in other words - it's still only the Orig, Prima and Covox ones that work). I don't want to release the tools needed to convert custom graphic sets at this stage as it's likely the format is going to change more, but I'll look into converting some of the auto-downloadable ones with the next update.

Known significant issues:
- Traps / teleporters with custom sound effects (eg. the teleporter in LPIV_Space, the landmine in LPIV_Wasteland) are silent
- The mass replay checker is broken
- Using a destructive skill very close to the edge of the level may cause the game to crash

If you'd like to see constructs in action, you can see an example in styles/pieces/marble/terrain/escher.nxcs (it's a slightly modified, for testing purposes, version of the block in the middle of Fun 11 / Taxing 18). You can refer to it in a new-format level file (to obtain such a file, just do a mass level dump from any NXP that only uses the supported graphic sets) the same way as you'd refer to any other terrain piece; just change the "SET" and "PIECE" lines to "marble" and "escher" respectively. Both escher.nxcs itself and any new-format level file are plain text files, so you can modify them with any text editor.

Also, there's currently no support for UI actions in replays. If the discussion topic leans towards having support, I'll add it in to the new replay system.


Please let me know if you get any access violations when performing backwards frameskips. I noticed this issue in some past ExNf versions, but haven't seen it happen in quite a while now, so it's possible Nepster fixed it, or that one of us unknowingly fixed it as a side effect of another change (since the actual cause was never determined). Even better if you can work out how to consistently reproduce these, but simply alerting me to that it's still happening is still very useful.

[namida]

Here's a minor update to the above one.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/6godvlwls89df3p/NeoLemmix_Experimental_VExNf1.46n-B.zip?dl=0

The mass replay checker is now working again, and (at least as far as I can tell) destructive skills near the edges of levels no longer cause crashes. Also, the previously-unnoticed issue of preplaced lemmings not showing up in mass dumped images / on the preview screen is fixed too.

The issue with custom sound effects has not yet been fixed.

One new issue I discovered, is that preplaced lemmings are placed one pixel too high. This is probably an issue with the style conversions, not with the game itself, so I need to look into that more before I apply any fixes.

I also still need to fix the positioning of some of the Santa lemming sprites...

(EDIT: For the record, I mass-tested a large collection of NepsterLems replays that Nepster sent me (though they only cover levels up to the end of the 4th rank, as I requested that he only send them for levels I've beaten myself) and the overwhelming majority of them still work. So, I would be very surprised if NepsterLems isn't solvable even on this newest version, since it's been tested against a version not far behind and the only major physics change lately relates to a skill that isn't used in NepsterLems.)

[namida]

Here's a new experimental version. This is basically (minus some still-to-be-done bugfixes) the upcoming V1.47n update.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/zh5syt1nc4wb0dc/NeoLemmix_Experimental_V1.47n_Exp.exe?dl=1

NXPs compiled for V1.43n-F will give a compatibility warning on this version. Here's an experimental Flexi Toolkit that marks them as V1.47n-compatible. (If you want to mark it as compatible with both, look under the "Advanced Options" button. For marking as V1.43n-F-only, use the stable version.) It doesn't yet support NXRP replay files for the replay manager.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hvj2e7wxw71mcyg/FlexiToolkit.exe?dl=1

[namida]

Updated both the experimental player and experimental Flexi.

Player:
- Fixes a bug with some graphic sets crashing (it's somewhat random what ones will have the issue, and re-saving it from GSTool may fix a broken one (or break a working one); but at any rate, this update fixes the issue altogether)
- Fixes the bug where lemmings aren't drawn on the minimap
- Background colors are supported even for old-format graphic sets (need a not-yet-released experimental of GSTool to do this)

Note that autodownloading of graphic sets doesn't work in this copy. I've fixed this for the next experimental version.

Flexi Toolkit:
- Filename of imported replay files is now used when adding (but not when replacing; it keeps the one of the replay being replaced)
- NXRP replays are supported


EDIT

Another update to Flexi Toolkit:
- You can now download graphic sets from the NeoLemmix Website directly into your project

[namida]

Uploaded another update to the player. Fixes:

- Graphic set auto-downloading now works again
- Fixes the swimmer-climber bug and implements the currently-strongest proposal for relaxed platformer assignment checks (note: the latter is not yet 100% confirmed as a permanent change)
- Fixes the cut off pixel of terrain at the bottom and right of the screen
- Fixes several issues relating to preplaced lemmings, converted-from-Lemmini levels, and those two things combined with each other

EDIT: And another!

- Fixes the issue with non-default Autosteel settings not working
- Implements adjustable volume for sounds and music

[namida]

Uploaded another update which integrates some recent fixes by Nepster (including a fix to that trigger overlap bug), as well as glider shadows.

[Nepster]

Warning: Do not yet rely on the behavior of overlapping trigger areas (which has yet to change), nor on the blocker-force-field interactions (which cannot overlap at the moment, but this may change again in the near future).

[namida]

In general, I would not advise relying on V1.47n behaviours at this stage. For anything you intend to release in the near-future, I would recommend primarily targetting V1.43n-F (and thus, only using behaviours / features / etc that it supports) for now, but you can also test that it works with V1.47n if you like.

If it's a more long-term project (let's say, if you don't intend to release for a couple of months or so), you can probably target V1.47n, in which case, take heed of Nepster's warning.

[Proxima]

Can't we just say don't rely on the behaviour of overlapping trigger areas, ever, as it's bad level design? The player shouldn't be expected to know the inner workings of the game mechanics. Erik Hermansen, the creator of DROD, put it this way in his advice to level architects: Don't expect players to be DROD scientists. I would say this goes for most puzzle games.

[namida]

Can't we just say don't rely on the behaviour of overlapping trigger areas, ever, as it's bad level design? The player shouldn't be expected to know the inner workings of the game mechanics. Erik Hermansen, the creator of DROD, put it this way in his advice to level architects: Don't expect players to be DROD scientists. I would say this goes for most puzzle games.

I would agree for the most part; one exception would be with water overlapping other objects (due to swimmers). Even V1.43n-F handles this correctly.

[namida]

Experimental editor release (at last): https://www.dropbox.com/s/ditkyiemhm93ss7/NeoLemmixEditor.exe?dl=0

I haven't implemented support for graphic set mixing yet. Nor have I removed some no-longer-supported features. So the only real difference is that it has support for locking the release rate.
(EDIT: Newest update has now removed the gimmicks menu, and the "Ghost" option for preplaced lemmings / entrances.)

You'll need to download the stable version of the editor, then replace the EXE with this one.

Please be aware that playtest mode currently does not work properly with custom graphic sets. This is a known issue.

[namida]

Uploaded an update for both the player and the editor to fix the issue with playtest mode on custom styles.

Please be aware that attempting to use playtest mode with this new editor experimental and an older player version (whether stable or experimental) will not work, and vice versa.

[namida]

Updated the experimental again. Includes Nepster's recent physics fixes, a fix for the issue of new version's settings overriding old version's, a fix for the crash on levels with custom window orders, and custom sound effects now work.

[IchoTolot]

Updated the experimental again. Includes Nepster's recent physics fixes, a fix for the issue of new version's settings overriding old version's, a fix for the crash on levels with custom window orders, and custom sound effects now work.

Which link contains the new version?

Does the first post in this topic got the most recent one? As that version seems outdated to me.

I don't really know which link in which topic (as there is the "upcomming update" topic as well) contains the actual newest version anymore

The first post in each of the 2 topics should contain the newest exp version to player and editor, then it should be clear to everyone (if they do not already, I don't 100%ly know )

[namida]

Here are the latest links:
Player: https://www.dropbox.com/s/zh5syt1nc4wb0dc/NeoLemmix_Experimental_V1.47n_Exp.exe?dl=1
Editor: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ditkyiemhm93ss7/NeoLemmixEditor.exe?dl=1
Flexi: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hvj2e7wxw71mcyg/FlexiToolkit.exe?dl=1
GSTool: https://www.dropbox.com/s/cam8ncyjnoloj30/GSTool.exe?dl=1

Note that the Editor is only the EXE; the rest of the files you can use the copies from the stable version.

Also, there is a known bug with teleporters taking longer than they should to trigger the receiver / release the lemming in this latest experimental version (not present in earlier versions). I've passed details on to Nepster.

[IchoTolot]

Thanks! I will look into the new version over the weekend and see if sth new broke (probably unlikely) and see if older bug stuff works fine now.

[namida]

As mentioned in the previous post - there's a known issue with teleporters, so if the levels that break involve teleporters and the break occurs /after/ a lemming teleports, don't worry about fixing the level / replay to account for it.

[namida]

Just uploaded a new version of GSTool. It supports some settings that don't work in the current version but will in future versions, most notably, a new object type: "Background Image". An object set to this (one per graphic set) will be used as a background image on any level that uses the graphic set in question as its primary graphic set.

Most other newly-supported features are for long-term purposes, not immediate future.

Note that colors work a bit differently with this new version. You no longer set particle colors; instead, you can set the mask color (used eg. for bridge pixels), minimap color, and background color; with the remaining colors being unused (but the first three have planned future use; GSTool, when opening an old DAT graphic set, will automatically set the colors correctly for the new uses, including these future ones. I'm not sure if it sets them correctly when opening an old graphic set from any other format.)

[IchoTolot]

Just uploaded a new version of GSTool. It supports some settings that don't work in the current version but will in future versions, most notably, a new object type: "Background Image". An object set to this (one per graphic set) will be used as a background image on any level that uses the graphic set in question as its primary graphic set.

Most other newly-supported features are for long-term purposes, not immediate future.

Note that colors work a bit differently with this new version. You no longer set particle colors; instead, you can set the mask color (used eg. for bridge pixels), minimap color, and background color; with the remaining colors being unused (but the first three have planned future use; GSTool, when opening an old DAT graphic set, will automatically set the colors correctly for the new uses, including these future ones. I'm not sure if it sets them correctly when opening an old graphic set from any other format.)

So theoretically I could start replacing the huge single colred backgrounds "soon". "Soon" only because I don't want to create ugly errors in existing stuff when I remove them ----> loading a level with them will create an error for a missing piece, but this should be solved as I remember with only giving a notice that a tile is missing and remove it in the level for now rather then giving an error.
EDIT: Also the ordering of the tiles should not have an impact anymore when removing adding stuff.
And of course when the bg image is fully supported I will use them as well instead of the big picture.

[namida]

It will work from the next experimental release.

This version won't have any way to handle missing objects; you'd need to replace them with dummy ones for now (future versions will have a better way to deal with this, once the new formats are in use). All that needs to be done is specifying one object's type as "Background Image", and that object's graphic (first frame, if it has more than one) is used as the graphic set's background image.

[namida]

I'm going to post all future V1.47n candidate updates solely in the V1.47n announcement topic.