Can't run Custlemm in Dosbox

[finlay]

I've attached a screenshot of the problem. VGALEMMI.EXE, ie normal DOS lemmings, runs fine. What am I missing?

cheers. Good to know this place is still alive, incidentally.

[ccexplore]

The original version of CustLemm was derived from some version of Lemmings that has its music in a CD, which is essentially what that error message is complaining about.

We have hacked it a while ago so that it no longer needs the CD for music.  You can get this version here:

http://www6.camanis.net.ipv4.sixxs.org/lemmings/files/clones/customized_lemmings_nocdlem.zip

The hacked EXE is called "nocdlem" instead of "custlemm".  You really only need the EXE from the zip file since you already have all the other files.

[finlay]

Awesome, thanks. On another note, do you know how to get the sound to work in Lemmings 2 (also on dosbox)?

[ccexplore]

Two possibilities:

1) Run "install.exe" in your L2 directory.  This will run a short program where you can set various game options one by one, including what the game should use for sound.  I usually pick Sound Blaster, but I think all/most the options given will work with DOSBox--you can try them out all and see which sounds you prefer.  After picking an option and press ENTER, you can just press ENTER for the rest of the options to go with the defaults.  Soon the program will exit and you can run the game again and see if you get sound now.

2) If that still doesn't work, or if "install.exe" is missing for some reason, you may need to download/run a version of Lemmings 2 that is compatible with DOSBox.  I got my copy from abandonia.com.  In addition to install.exe, it also has an "L2-fix.com" launcher for the game, which does some extra magic to make sure that the game will work properly in DOSBox.  If you don't run the game through the launcher (ie. by entering "L2-fix" instead of just "L2" at the DOSBox command prompt), you may experience problems like inability to get past the first levels of each tribe, and possibly other problems including sound.

[finlay]

I see. I picked up on using the L2-fix somewhere else on this board and I've worked my way through four or five of the tribes already, so I know that the program works at least (although it's crashed twice, possibly just after using it for ages, so I'm having to remember to save regularly, which is annoying...). I'll try the install option.

edit: tried but there seems to be no music anyway and the sounds are a bit old and awful (is this just because it's the DOS version?). Never mind... I think I'll keep them off...

edit2: unless that's just something to do with the first option "pc internal speaker".

edit3: ok, got it working with the 'sound blaster' option but it's asked me for some other options and I'm wondering if it affects anything if I change them. I've just done the default for all of them. It's just that the music's jumping slightly and I'm wondering if it's anything to do with that.... Meh, it's getting too late now though!

[ccexplore]

You can try increasing the emulation speed to see if it helps with the skipping.  Press Ctrl+F12 to increase and Ctrl+F11 to decrease.   In DOSBox windowed mode, the emulation speed is indicated on the window title bar as the number next to "Cpu Cycles:", with 3000 being the default.  Note that the default configuration has Ctrl+F11 half the emulation speed while Ctrl+F12 adds some constant number (500) to current speed.

Also, what kind of computer are we talking about?  While Lemmings 2 is by no means a demanding game, together with the demands of emulation, it is possible that on an ancient machine it may not be able to fully keep up, resulting in things like sound skipping.

And yeah, we're talking about DOS, so even the "sound blaster" option will probably sound a little primitive compared with what you hear on the Mac for example.  I mean, you know what Lemmings 1 sound like in DOSBox, so you know pretty much what to expect.

Hope this helps.

[ccexplore]

Also, what version of DOSBox are you using?  Maybe upgrading your version of DOSBox might help.

Don't know too much about crashing, I don't think I've ever actually have the Lemmings 2 game itself crashed on me, although it does have glitches from time to time.  If it crashes DOSBox itself, then the fault really lies with DOSBox and maybe an updated version would help.

[finlay]

It's not an ancient machine per se, although it is a PowerPC mac. Big white imac G5. And dosbox 0.63. I haven't updated it recently. I'm not too worried about it crashing really (it might even be that I didn't give it long enough to move on, although several minutes of a black screen is a bit much), it's just that the first time it happened I lost about five levels' progress, which was just annoying. So now I'm remembering to save every two or three.

Anyway, I'll try that later. The sound on the sound blaster option is the only one with 'familiar' Lemmings sounds, like "Let's go" and "Yippee" when they enter and leave the level, so I'm going to stick with that one. One of the other options has music that doesn't skip but doesn't have these sounds, for instance. Possibly because it doesn't have them.

The mac version of Lemmings is so old now (16 years) that even that doesn't have much less primitive sounds than this (the music was in midi format and very similar to the amiga music which one can find on youtube), although I was a bit shocked when I heard the sounds on Lemmings 1 for DOS the first time, which was recently. It's really the graphics that got a big update for the mac.

[ccexplore]

Ah, forgot that you are using a Mac.  I don't know what the most up-to-date version of DOSBox is for the Mac, but for the PC the latest versions are like 0.74 or so, so unless they stopped maintaining the Mac version, you may be overdue for an upgrade of DOSBox.  Not that it's a guarantee to solve the problem; I'm hardly an expert with DOSBox performance tuning even for the PC version, let alone the Mac.

Also, I'm surprised there is no Mac version of Lemmings 2 available for download somewhere out there?  Or does that work even less well than PC Lemmings2 in DOSBox?

[finlay]

It was never released for Mac, actually. Even then, my own computer can't run Mac Lemmings, and I have to use the older one... this is something to do with the classic mode on the Mac...

I could come up with 100 possible reasons why it might not have been released. I guess it's partly because it wasn't successful enough and partly because Lemmings 1 needed a big graphical upgrade for even the macs of the day, and they probably didn't want to bother... I was always annoyed that it wasn't, though, because I think they were planning to release it.

(hmm, how did you forget? You mentioned the mac version of lemmings 1 right there! also the screenshot shows the version number and the fact that I'm running OSX )

[ccexplore]

(hmm, how did you forget? You mentioned the mac version of lemmings 1 right there! also the screenshot shows the version number and the fact that I'm running OSX )

  Wow, you're right, somehow I totally did not notice that it's a Mac windows title bar!

I knew you played Lemmings on the Mac back when you were active on the forums.  I think the DOS-like look of DOSBox in the screenshot somehow tricked my mind into thinking that you are running it on the PC.   I can be stupid like that sometimes.

[finlay]

In case you're wondering, I finished Lemmings 2. It's, uh, interesting. A few really good levels but a lot of rubbish. And too many goddamn skills! Kept me playing though, so can't complain.

[ccexplore]

Yeah, I do think the good levels in Lemmings 2 are all in the Classic Tribe.

Part of it I think is they purposely made the game easier as a whole.  I think you can like squeak by with like 1 or 2 lemmings or something (or lose plenty at any rate) to pass a level, as long as you have enough to solve the next level.  You can get a little more challenge if you try to get gold on all level (usually means save all of them, or lose just a few for some levels).

Lemmings 2 definitely follows the philosophy of quantity over quality in general.  As you said, there are plenty of new skills (43 to be exact), but quite a few are pretty silly and useless (divers anyone?--ignoring the glitch...)

I guess they thought having this new take on Lemmings can help attract new fans to the series?  And hey, as you said, it did keep you playing, so they must've done something right. When Psygnosis/DMA was running the Lemmings franchise (ie. the 1st 3 or so games), they are definitely not afraid to make big changes to the game from one to the next.  Lemmings 2 is different from Lemmings/ONML as Lemmings 3 is to 2 and 1.