Author Topic: Packs I have, need replays for both Old and New formats.  (Read 1758 times)

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Online kaywhyn

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #15 on: September 06, 2020, 09:17:07 am »
You can add one to the "don't have list", and that is MegSegaBytes (last page of NL levels board). So far, it appears that no one has completed it ever since it was released. I have plans to play it sometime, but of course I have other packs that I'm prioritizing ATM. Also, I was wondering if you were going to explain the situation to namida, as it appears he misunderstood what you meant by "turning replays for Alpha Plus green." Of course, I know what you really meant by that.

Offline ericderkovits

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2020, 09:20:06 am »
yes I know he misunderstood, as soon as I saw his post, I think he thought I beat it but that is not what I meant. What I meant is I'm turning green the replays that I collect from neolemmix's level board.

Online kaywhyn

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2020, 09:24:39 am »
Yea, the reality is that you ran a mass replay check or simply viewed other people's replays to verify nothing was broken and hence "turn the replays green." Also, you know yourself very well when it comes to level solving and can conclude that Alpha Plus is probably one of the very last packs you would play or completely avoid, given that it's very hard. Truth be told, I'm only on the second level of the pack. That's how hard it is :crylaugh:

Offline ericderkovits

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #18 on: September 06, 2020, 11:19:05 am »
Thanks for telling me about MegaSegaBytes, by Flopsy and Wafflem. I downloaded the pack, all the levels have special styles so it asks you to download them. anyways your right nobody has completed it. Joshcue18 had the 1st rank but some of his replays are broken. Maybe I should post this in a new post to see if Icho is willing to attempt it. He is an awesome puzzle solver, and he solves almost any pack that is uploaded.

Also I missed Classical Lemmings. This one only the 1st 2 ranks had replays, which according to Mass replay check are all good. Nice Classical music in that one. Also I tried downloading Renaissance Lemmings, but this pack is broken, due to the pickup skills are special-styled ones, and for some reason even when touching them they don't get picked-up, so I'll pass on this pack.

Finally Halloween 2017 by Ryemanni can't be downloaded anymore since his dropbox says there's an error. So I'll forget this pack too.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2020, 05:27:39 pm by ericderkovits »

Offline ericderkovits

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I don't have replays on Flopsy's and Wafflem's MegaSegaBytes Pack. (UPDATE)
« Reply #19 on: September 06, 2020, 11:33:16 am »
Thanks to Kaywhyn for mentioning this pack that I somehow missed. This pack is listed on the last page in the Neolemmix levels board for anybody who wants to download it.
I did, and I think it seems to be a real graphical nice pack.

This pack was made by Flopsy/Wafflem so it's an awesome pack, a sequel to MegaSebBytes.

also classical lemmings I somehow missed so I downloaded that one too, but only the 1st 2 ranks have replays.



UPDATE: Thanks to Icho, I do now have replays for Flopsy's/Wafflems's MegaSEGABytes
UPDATE: Thanks to Tanx dx for updating his All Hallows Eve and Renaissance Lemmings styles so they now both work. All thanks to Icho for his replays of All Hallows Eve and the posted ones by Tanx dx for the Renaissance Lemmings
             
« Last Edit: September 20, 2020, 07:10:58 pm by ericderkovits »

Offline ericderkovits

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2020, 05:17:05 pm »
And of course for Namida's packs the replays should be good since the ones I downloaded were his. Today I  will turn green his Omega 1 pack. Will do 1 pack of his per day until I get all his
turned green. (already did Mass Replay Checks on them and they're all good for all his packs).

Offline WillLem

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #21 on: September 06, 2020, 09:41:24 pm »
There's no obligation to share replays at all.

I remember Icho saying I should have provided replays for Oh No! More Reverse Lemmings because there was indeed an impossible level in there (this was due to the conversion from SuperLemmini format to NeoLemmix - the level has now been fixed, of course), so I've always provided a full set with every pack since then. I sometimes use replays just to help get me started if I'm struggling to see any sort of solution for a more challenging level, although I'll delay this as much as possible.

Nothing wrong with being someone who makes easier levels. The forums certainly could have more easy level packs available.

how I wish there was more of me :D im out of easier content to play lol

Watch this space! Lemminas II is in progress (slowly but surely... looking at a Christmas release, methinks). :lemcat:

Yea, unfortunately I think a lot of the easier content will come just from the new members. The long time members will likely keep making difficult content.

Not necessarily. I actually think it's a lot harder to make a good (i.e. non-trivial) easy level than it is to make a difficult level. It's virtually impossible to guess how another player will approach a level you've designed (hence why even the most experienced designers still experience backroutes), which also means that it's very possible to accidentally make a very challenging level that you might think is easy by your own standards.

That's why I prioritized the intro pack since last year and tried to make it as good as possible... Also, with my next pack I will try to fill the void of easy/medium difficulty levels as well.

Looking forward to these! How is the Intro pack coming along?

I also tried to make Lemmings Plus VI a bit easier than my other recent packs for much the same reason

The Sane rank was certainly very enjoyable to play through. Definitely planning to have a go at Rank 2 as well when I start playing Lemmings again, I'm taking a bit of a break from it at the mo.

Online kaywhyn

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #22 on: September 06, 2020, 09:52:59 pm »
Hey WillLem, welcome back. I'm guessing a break from the forums was very much needed or that you just had a lot to do the last several days/weeks.


Not necessarily. I actually think it's a lot harder to make a good (i.e. non-trivial) easy level than it is to make a difficult level. It's virtually impossible to guess how another player will approach a level you've designed (hence why even the most experienced designers still experience backroutes), which also means that it's very possible to accidentally make a very challenging level that you might think is easy by your own standards.

That's exactly why it's nearly impossible to account for every possible backroute. Sure, some are much easier than others to catch and patch up early on, but as you said, due to how everyone approaches solving levels in different ways, one or a few are bound to be kept in even after release because some of those couldn't had been accounted for due to, say, a new version of NL or some physics updates or possibly even an oversight on the creator's part because he/she missed a really obvious one. 

Offline WillLem

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #23 on: September 06, 2020, 10:53:14 pm »
Hey WillLem, welcome back. I'm guessing a break from the forums was very much needed or that you just had a lot to do the last several days/weeks.

Thanks! I've just been a bit busy and getting into some of my other hobbies (mainly music) and other general life stuff. It's good to be back.

That's exactly why it's nearly impossible to account for every possible backroute... due to how everyone approaches solving levels in different ways, one or a few are bound to be kept in even after release because some of those couldn't had been accounted for

I think that unintentionally difficult levels and backroutes are both parts of the same phenomenon, caused by what I'm going to call "Designer's Dilemma." It's the point at which a designer considers a level to be mostly finished and can't see anything obvious wrong with it, and the next stage of its development can only happen once someone else has played the level. It's essentially completely out of the designer's hands at that point, and requires a second pair of eyes, and more importantly - a second solving brain!

Online kaywhyn

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #24 on: September 06, 2020, 11:13:23 pm »
I think that unintentionally difficult levels and backroutes are both parts of the same phenomenon, caused by what I'm going to call "Designer's Dilemma." It's the point at which a designer considers a level to be mostly finished and can't see anything obvious wrong with it, and the next stage of its development can only happen once someone else has played the level. It's essentially completely out of the designer's hands at that point, and requires a second pair of eyes, and more importantly - a second solving brain!

Nicely said, especially with you terming it "Designer's Dilemma"! :thumbsup: Then we're in agreement that backroutes are always inevitable. The best way to reduce many of them is with experience and to have not just a second person but rather as many testers as possible, preferably those who are able to solve levels, but even then those who can't are still valuable, as then the feedback given to the creator from those people is that the level is likely working as intended and appears to be a difficult level for the most part.

Offline namida

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #25 on: September 06, 2020, 11:27:07 pm »
Quote
The best way to reduce many of them is with experience and to have not just a second person but rather as many testers as possible

Having too many can get a bit tricky to keep on top of, not to mention it means less people who get their initial impression from the released version of your pack!

My advice is to aim for 2 to 4 testers, and importantly, have a variety of skill levels among your testers - you don't want just experts testing it, as they're used to advanced tricks and might overlook simpler backroutes that the less-experienced players find. On the flipside, though, the less skilled players might not be able to solve some of the harder levels, so that's why it's important to have experts too. (There can be special cases here. For example, I only asked the expert players to test Lemmings Plus Alpha because it was intended to be an extremely hard pack.)

If you've done multiple packs, you'll also start to get a feel for who's going to test more or less of the pack, and what kind of feedback they'll give. This is important to consider too. There's one person who's tested a few of my packs, who was excellent at finding backroutes / solving levels, but never gave any feedback whatsoever, even if prompted. This is perfectly fine when it's one tester, but I wouldn't want the entire team to be like that, as feedback is important for level order, possibly for getting rid of really bad levels, etc, too.

Offline ericderkovits

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #26 on: September 07, 2020, 06:38:16 pm »
OK, now I added Godlems to my collection as Icho solved the pack.

Online kaywhyn

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #27 on: September 08, 2020, 12:26:31 am »
Hey eric, I PMed you my replays for United. The only ones missing are Genocide 21, 28, 37, and 40, as I still need to resolve them. I will send those later once I'm successful. Also check the 2nd message I sent you.

Online kaywhyn

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Re: my list of new format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #28 on: September 08, 2020, 03:38:22 am »
Having too many can get a bit tricky to keep on top of, not to mention it means less people who get their initial impression from the released version of your pack!

My advice is to aim for 2 to 4 testers, and importantly, have a variety of skill levels among your testers - you don't want just experts testing it, as they're used to advanced tricks and might overlook simpler backroutes that the less-experienced players find. On the flipside, though, the less skilled players might not be able to solve some of the harder levels, so that's why it's important to have experts too. (There can be special cases here. For example, I only asked the expert players to test Lemmings Plus Alpha because it was intended to be an extremely hard pack.)

This is all very well said! :) This was pretty much what I was trying to get at, but I did a much poorer job with my explanation. Of course, as I have never done any level making, at least not yet, I definitely don't have as much key insights into it as the others who have extensively done so.

Quote
If you've done multiple packs, you'll also start to get a feel for who's going to test more or less of the pack, and what kind of feedback they'll give. This is important to consider too. There's one person who's tested a few of my packs, who was excellent at finding backroutes / solving levels, but never gave any feedback whatsoever, even if prompted. This is perfectly fine when it's one tester, but I wouldn't want the entire team to be like that, as feedback is important for level order, possibly for getting rid of really bad levels, etc, too.

I have a feeling I know who you're referring to. I generally only see "I've finished the pack" posts from him with only replays and no feedback. From my daily sightings, I know that many people here appreciate feedback, both good and bad, for their own packs. Conversely, I love hearing and seeing feedback from the pack authors themselves regarding my replays. That being said, if you noticed I generally have a difficult time with finding poor things to say about levels, as most of the feedback I've given are "excellent level," "great level," or something along those lines. Needless to say, I'm one of those people where I almost never ever can find bad things to say about the levels, because it really takes a lot in order to get me to really hate a level. If there are levels I didn't like, it's generally only limited to about 1 or a few per rank.

Offline ericderkovits

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Re: my list of old format neolemmix packs i have all the replays for
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2020, 11:08:26 pm »
 

Also I have been collecting some Old format replays for packs that didn't have new format ones.

Packs I have so far from the old formats boards are: (Version 10.13)

1) A Masters Degree in Lemmings (turned them green)
2) An Unnamed Pack by Duuddu (turned them green)
3) lemmingbytes(turned them green)
4) lemmings stampede (turned them green)
5) Paralems (turned them green) note on this pack after downloading it level 29 of Demented (IT'S FEEDING TIME!) the style cattrap was reported missing so I grabbed it from Pitlems and
    Put in into a styles folder for Paralems main folder. It's the only one in there since it was missing.
6)  Raylems (turned them green)
7) A Snack pack by SQron188 (turned them green)
8) Yung's first pack (turned them green)
9) Lemmings Redux (turned them green) Note: the Style dirt_md was reported missing so I had to grap it from Vampprince's and put it into a styles folder for old-formats lemmings Redux.
10) Mobilems 1 (turned them green)
11) Be Smart (turned them green)
12) Old formats intro pack (turned them green)
13) Lemmings squared (turned them green. Note only 32% of the Talisman's were obtained)


packs from v1.43 that I have played with the replays (Note: v1.43 there is no way to turn any green, so just have to watch them to see them work)

1) Lemmicks with Gimmicks
2) Colorful Arty's Reverse Lemmings
3) Gigalem's standard pack


ok now the ones that are in old format that are also in new formats that I downloaded are

1) Sublems (turned them all green)
2) Seblems(I downloaded the old format replays from the board but too many are broken so I don't have any replays. Also most new format replay won't work with the old format ones as they break).
UPDATE:  I now fixed all of Seblems old format replays and turned them all green(and all but 1 talisman I got from the old format ones)
               The one Talisman I couldn't get was Rapture 20, complete in 3min 50sec or less. This is just way too difficult, spent  couple days on minipulating the level to try to get it, but it always
               goes past 3min 50sec. Although I completed the level, just took a bit longer to complete. Even watched the neolemmix one that got the Talisman and repeated it exactly, but for some
               reason the time is different. Perhaps in the old format ones the clock is faster. Also Icho's youtube video one he didn't use the same exact solution so he didn't get the Talisman either.

3) Lemmings World Tour (I have some replays that work with the old formats from the replays that are used with the New formats. Many work, but still many don't)

Packs that I still need replays for

1 Casual lemmings (for old formats I downloaded, but again the replays that were uploaded, most don't work. I think it's because the pack had a new update and the replays were Not updated
to match the new pack, so the replays break._
2) Revenge of the Lemmings 2.0 I need replays since non were posted on the board, but Namida has solutions for this pack on Youtube which I will eventually get solved)


also many of Gigalems special packs the replays don't work either so I just deleted the packs after uploadeding them. But his standard one I got all the replays(which I turned green)




« Last Edit: September 23, 2020, 05:06:31 am by ericderkovits »