Lemmings' Ark....

[tseug]

I found another backroute in Lemmings' Ark. I am still at a loss as to what was intended, could please someone tell me?

Some screenshots:










EDIT: I'm a lemming now!! [smiley=laugh.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif]

[Deathman48]

Where exactly did you use your basher?

I THINK the intended solution requires you to make a Lemming a climber, dig down the left edge of the OWW, bash right when you can. Let the Lemming drop and climb up the far wall, when he turns around up there, build left to the one way wall, mine down. Mine down again, have a Lemming build in the middle of the OWW (where you have) and build over to the exit. That essentially completes the route though you need to use the climbers at certain points to get them where you need them to be, but I THINK that is more or less what was intended. That's an impressive backroute though, I had mega trouble just doing it any way I could. Hell, that looks simpler than the intended solution, which is what I'd be listing in my Walkthrough for this difficulty.

[ccexplore]

GameFAQs for SNES Lemmings have a solution for this level which sounds like an intended solution

[tseug]

Thanks. Those solutions are the same and seem intended. I used the basher at the far right of the upper tunnel. If you look closely you can see that two pixels were removed, preventing climbers from going up. This was easier than the other backroute and the intended solution, so feel free to use it in your walkthrough.

btw, how did other people do Sunsoft 21? I just gave it my first real try and I've already found two different ways.

I finished doing a complete runthrough of all the Genesis levels. I went a little overboard on Sunsoft 29 and 30. ;D ;D ;D I also totally backrouted Final Impediment. They really should have tested the level more, 10 extra builders is

[Lomay]

thanks for showing this to us, because I try'd to finish that levels, but It was really hard! >_<

[Proxima]

btw, how did other people do Sunsoft 21? I just gave it my first real try and I've already found two different ways.

Hmm, it's a while since I looked at that level. Something like: bash through the structure at the bottom and build over the bash tunnel. Build up to the base of the pillar on the right side, build to the stairs, build to the broken stairs from the right, build to the pillar from the bottom of the stairs, build up the gap in the stairs, mine and bash under the metal, bash to release the crowd.

[tseug]

Ah... that turns out to be one of my solutions.

[Proxima]

What's the other?

[tseug]

Well, I guess it wasn't exactly the same, but same idea. (screenshot)

Here's the other one. (screenshot)

[Proxima]

Very nice!

[tseug]

  Which one seems more backroutish?

[Proxima]

It seems pretty clear that the first is more likely to be intended (done my way it requires all the builders, IIRC) -- but then the second is hardly a backroute, as it also uses all the skills (except the ones you can't use in any case) and is not easier to find or execute than the main route.

[geoo]

Tseug, your solution for Lemmings' Ark is fairly interesting. It seems that the basher mask is different to the Dos version's one. I only knew about the other, pixel precise miner backroute.

For Sunsoft21, I have another solution: screenshot
It seems even more like a backroute IMO.

And congratulations for finding the glitch with the lemming sliding straight up through the terrain...it was also logical to me when I had found it.

And it seems that you have got 100% on Tricky22. If not, I can confirm that it is possible though.

[tseug]

@Ahribar: I could have saved two builders by using a blocker to hold back the crowd. Doing that leaves lots of stuff left over, so it would probably qualify as a backroute.

@geoo89: That definitely is a backroute. If you want to find out exactly how the basher mask looks stick a climber inside a wall and bash.

[Lomay]

for the SNES verison (sunsoft 5) is really hard. >__<

[Deathman48]

Tseug, your solution for Lemmings' Ark is fairly interesting. It seems that the basher mask is different to the Dos version's one. I only knew about the other, pixel precise miner backroute.

For Sunsoft21, I have another solution: screenshot
It seems even more like a backroute IMO.

I still can't see how he's used the basher in the one way wall, I can't see how that works when the arrows are pointing the other way thus preventing you from bashing.

And your screenshot is how I beat Sunsoft21 and it's the one I list in my Walkthrough (final one of those is up btw, link in sig) because it was the only one I could ever get to work consistently. =/

Well, I guess it wasn't exactly the same, but same idea. (screenshot)

When I tried that the spike trap actually activated.

[ccexplore]

Tseug, your solution for Lemmings' Ark is fairly interesting. It seems that the basher mask is different to the Dos version's one.

Rather than the basher mask being different, I think what you are seeing is that the one-way wall's trigger area is differrent from the DOS version. &#A0;Or perhaps more precisely, the DOS version is different from everyone else. &#A0;I mentioned somewhere in the challenge thread how in the DOS version, the one-way wall is 4 pixels higher than where you expect it to be. &#A0;Now remember the Mayhem 12 trick, how you can bash away the top few rows of steel. &#A0;That would in principle work just the same for one-way walls also, but in the DOS version, because the one-way wall's trigger area is 4 pixels higher, it doesn't work unless you start bashing higher.

[tseug]

The basher mask is different, the back end is sort of lumpy.

[ccexplore]

Yeah, I finally noticed that in the process of trying (unsuccessfully, as you might've read by now) to do Tricky 23.

The Amiga version also happens to have the same sort of mask for the basher incidentally.

Although, I observe something even stranger, possibly related to the lumpiness of the back end: &#A0;try doing a sort of "backstroke" against the wall and see what gets removed. &#A0;(It might sound crazy, but it actually looks to me like you need to assign the basher a split second before the lemming actually turned around against the wall......) &#A0;I don't think I've seen that at all in Amiga version, despite the lumpy back end being in that version also.

[DarkSonic]

That backroute of Final Impediment I found out too =P
But I'm wondering how you made a steep slope like that, and how you managed to get 100 percent there. Could someone explain that? The highest I got for I am A.T. was 82 percent.

[Proxima]

One digger can release another when he digs one pixel next to him. Lemmings can walk up a step less than six pixels high. You should be able to see how it goes from that.

[tseug]

Actually a digger can release another up to two pixels away. (you can see that some of the steps are different sizes in the screenshot)

[DarkSonic]

I already found that out. But it's very hard to execute. What release date is recommended to do it?

[tseug]

I assume you mean "release rate"

I used something like 78. It doesn't really matter much though if you do it how I did it (Make one step 7 pixels high then occasionally crank up the RR so the lemmings all get out). It's easier to execute with savestates (in gens press F5 to save, F6 and F7 to cange the slot, and F8 to load).

[DarkSonic]

Oh yes, I meant 'release rate' fun typo XD
Anyway, thanks for that. I'll try it(won't be easy to execute)