Author Topic: Mobius' Lix Levels  (Read 1557 times)

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Offline mobius

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Mobius' Lix Levels
« on: November 23, 2017, 08:20:02 pm »
some new levels (and some old ones)
I miss the days when people made small 10 level packs and shared them quickly back and forth. So I decided to start doing something similar again.

"leftovers" are some levels that I made for the community pack which didn't make it in or may not make it in for various reasons.

"non-tutorials" are 7 brand new levels loosely based off of the L1 tutorial levels.

They probably need a lot of work. The new ones are easy to moderate difficulty.
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

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Offline Forestidia86

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2017, 11:53:35 pm »
Solved all of your new "non-tutorials" and attached replays.
They were quite interesting and I generally liked them but they felt sometimes quite finicky. (Maybe I was backrouting I don't know). Thanks for making these.
It's only a personal thing but for me it's helpful if it's stated that all levels are solvable or similiar. It's generally clear that the levels are tested before published but having the definite information helps me in solving levels.

Some remarks (click to show/hide)

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2017, 12:45:56 am »
thank you!

yes the leftovers; some are present in my version of the community pack but I don't know if I have the current one or if they will remain there. Some are not present. These are all old ideas anyway.

Non-Tutorials:
I forgot to mention these levels are intended to have multiple solutions. Your solution to Task for Batters was very close to mine.  Some interesting solutions there!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline Forestidia86

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2017, 06:35:27 am »
Solved your "leftovers" as well. These seemed rather hard levels to the most part but were interesting as well.

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« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 06:42:42 am by Forestidia86 »

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2017, 08:08:18 pm »
thanks again! most of them were intended :thumbsup:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline geoo

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2017, 02:15:34 pm »
I solved the non-toturials (quite hard and sometimes rather finicky), and the two leftover levels that I haven't seen variations of before.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2017, 01:35:55 am »
thanks for playing!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Other than that the solutions were acceptable and interesting.
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline Nessy

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2017, 01:41:22 am »
Solved all the "leftovers" levels.

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Offline Forestidia86

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2018, 11:56:32 pm »
mobius, did you ever publish "Oblique Strategy" elsewhere?

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2018, 01:08:20 am »
mobius, did you ever publish "Oblique Strategy" elsewhere?

It was in Mobilems II, titled Obstacle One. I also have a chips challenge 1 & 2 levels titled Oblique Strategy.
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline Simon

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2019, 01:32:36 pm »
I'd like to include these levels in the Lix main download. mobius:

Okay? Are you okay to have these levels in the Lix main download?

Duplicates: Some of these levels are in lemforum/, the flagship pack. I'd keep those in lemforum/ and exclude the duplicates from your small pack here, then. If you'd like, we can go over the list and decide for each level.

Folder: Three possibilities come to mind:
  • levels/single/mobius/{leftovers, nontutorials}
    But then your 16 levels would sit alongside other large packs with over 100 levels. I'd prefer something else instead:
  • levels/single/misc/mobius/{leftovers, nontutorials}
    That seems more fitting for a small pack. xmas2018 is also a small pack, it has 24 levels, and it sits in misc/. You'll have two subfolders in your pack then. Or:
  • levels/single/misc/mobius/
    No subfolders. Your 16 levels would sit in mobius/ directly. This feels best to me, especially if we already exclude some levels from leftovers. But it's your call.
No matter how we decide, we can move the levels again if you make more levels.

Replays: I'll need a solution replay for every level. Forestidia and geoo have posted solutions that you commented. I can take all their solutions that you judged close enough to the intended solution. I'll let you know if I need more replays.

CC0: All levels in Lix have been released as CC0 so far. CC0 gives up copyright, it's essentially public domain, with a very permissible fallback license for jurisdictions lacking public domain. This means that random people from the internet could sell Lix without giving us credit. Are you okay with releasing these levels under CC0? I'll be happy to discuss here or in IRC.

-- Simon
« Last Edit: January 21, 2019, 11:54:06 pm by Simon »

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2019, 02:48:20 am »
Sure! Whatever seems best to you is fine. Remove the duplicates.

Replays: Sorry but I'm on an older computer right now that doesn't have any of these files. I really don't have the time to look into it.

CC0: Yes I don't need or want any credit for my work. I'm new wave and I don't believe in ownership or possession :P
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline Simon

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2019, 03:23:18 am »
Thanks for the reply! :lix-grin:

I'm busy for the next days with other things, too. But once I get around to your levels, if I need help, I'll let you know.

-- Simon
« Last Edit: January 22, 2019, 03:35:13 am by Simon »

Offline Simon

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2019, 05:35:50 am »
mobius: Please send me the intended solution to Pinnacle of Defeat. (I could cover Pinnacle of Defeat with any of the backroutes that were posted here, but it's better style to cover with the intended solution.)

That's it, everything else is covered. :lix-grin:



I've removed the following 3 levels because they're already in lemforum:

Take a Giant Nose Dive (= As Good as Dead)
Get Behind Me, Satan (= Conundrum)
Five Easy Steps (= Theresa Falls up the Stairs)

The Whispering Wind, apparently, is not Five for Fighting, but it looks like it. I feel that different levels should look different. Would you be up for redecoration of The Whispering Wind?

Your Eye of the Needle looks different than lemforum's Eye of the Needle. The main trick is identical (?), the supplement ideas are different. If the supplement is interesting by itself, let's definitely keep your version, but let's rename the level then. What would you suggest? Eye of the Short Needle? :lix-blush:

That leaves 11-13 levels and I'll put them all in a single directory levels/single/misc/mobius/. No subfolders. The leftovers will be sorted first, ordered like you had ordered them, followed by the nontutorials, ordered like you had ordered them. I've renamed the files according to the level titles without spaces.

I've covered all levels with Forestidia's replays. You judged those good except for the backroute of Pinnacle of Defeat, but Pinnacle of Defeat had only backroutes posted.

-- Simon
« Last Edit: January 25, 2019, 08:45:39 am by Simon »

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2019, 05:39:05 pm »
I'm sorry but I cannot work on this at all right now--way too much going on.

On Pinnacle of Defeat;
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

edit:
Quote
I've removed the following 3 levels because they're already in lemforum:

Take a Giant Nose Dive (= As Good as Dead)
Get Behind Me, Satan (= Conundrum)
Five Easy Steps (= Theresa Falls up the Stairs)

The Whispering Wind, apparently, is not Five for Fighting, but it looks like it. I feel that different levels should look different. Would you be up for redecoration of The Whispering Wind?

Your Eye of the Needle looks different than lemforum's Eye of the Needle. The main trick is identical (?), the supplement ideas are different. If the supplement is interesting by itself, let's definitely keep your version, but let's rename the level then. What would you suggest? Eye of the Short Needle? :lix-blush:

That leaves 11-13 levels and I'll put them all in a single directory levels/single/misc/mobius/. No subfolders. The leftovers will be sorted first, ordered like you had ordered them, followed by the nontutorials, ordered like you had ordered them. I've renamed the files according to the level titles without spaces.

I've covered all levels with Forestidia's replays. You judged those good except for the backroute of Pinnacle of Defeat, but Pinnacle of Defeat had only backroutes posted.

The Whispering Wind; I feel differently; :P It's designed to be a repeat level, why must repeats be *exactly* the same?
To this and the rest of these levels: The reason I made these levels/this pack is because when working on the forum pack way back; I disagreed with the others on some matters of my own levels then decided to let everyone else do whatever they wanted to them and I stopped working on them. Later I remade many of these levels my way in Lemmini (and subsequently in NeoLemmix) and copied some of these to this small pack. So this was basically a feeble attempt to do them the quote unquote 'right way'.
Since I really don't feel like working with Lix much anymore (apart from multiplayer) it's up to you. Just don't ask me for help because my 'vision' (to sound grandiose) is quite different in some respect and I'm stubborn and don't like to compromise :P I force myself to let others decide and make decisions but I'll always have that voice in my head saying "grrrrrrrr... this is not how it's supposed to be! this is wrong!"
It's a gift/curse :-\
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 01:09:17 am by mobius »
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline Forestidia86

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2019, 06:20:26 pm »
I have a rough adaptation to Pinnacle of Defeat. It should cull some backroutes but still can have some.
The "intended" solution in this version is in the spirit of mobius' idea but very finnicky to perform.

Offline Simon

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2019, 07:24:35 pm »
Pinnacle of Defeat: Sadly no fix yet. I've tried with Forestidia several iterations of reply #15, and all have backroutes. I conjecture that Pinnacle of Defeat relies heavily on NL/Lemmini physics details.

Quote from: mobius
Since I really don't feel like working with Lix much anymore (apart from multiplayer) it's up to you. Just don't ask me for help because my 'vision' (to sound grandiose) is quite different in some respect and I'm stubborn and don't like to compromise :P

Sorry, I didn't read this edit sooner.

Has the level designer culture put you off? Was I too ignorant myself? Or is Lix too different from the other Lemmings-likes and it's too hard to realize your level ideas in Lix?

It's all fine, and you've done much good already for the culture. The levels wouldn't have been the same without you.

Quote from: mobius
The Whispering Wind; I feel differently; :P It's designed to be a repeat level, why must repeats be *exactly* the same?

I feel that repeats are a problem, they lead to confusion, especially if they look exactly the same.

When I looked through your leftovers, I thought that Whispering Wind is merely an old version of Five for Fighting, and discarded Whispering Wind immediately. Only when I found your explanation from 2017-12 that WW and FfF are different levels, I reconsidered WW for keeping.

To clarify that both levels (WW and FfF) are keepers, different looks would have helped. For now, I'll keep WW as it is, and it's all good.

Happy that you've allowed to include all these levels in Lix!

-- Simon

Offline mobius

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2019, 02:07:24 am »
Yes; Pinnacle of Defeats solution is finicky and as such; sub-par on the enjoyment scale. It's up to you(s) what to do with it; whether to change solution or include/not include at all.

Don't worry; nothing put me off.
Culture in general puts me off. I've always been a contrarian and I have a short attention span. I've just realized better of late that I'm not particularly good at working with others. And I've just lost interest in Lix for now. Maybe I will gain it back one day; but I may never.
But I'm saying 100%: you may do what you feel best with these levels; since I'm not active in it anymore; I shouldn't have much of a say into the matter; those who play/are active should decide.

Quote from: mobius
The Whispering Wind; I feel differently; :P It's designed to be a repeat level, why must repeats be *exactly* the same?

I feel that repeats are a problem, they lead to confusion, especially if they look exactly the same.

When I looked through your leftovers, I thought that Whispering Wind is merely an old version of Five for Fighting, and discarded Whispering Wind immediately. Only when I found your explanation from 2017-12 that WW and FfF are different levels, I reconsidered WW for keeping.

To clarify that both levels (WW and FfF) are keepers, different looks would have helped. For now, I'll keep WW as it is, and it's all good.

Happy that you've allowed to include all these levels in Lix!

-- Simon

Here's where we disagree: I really like repeats. The repeats of the original game never gave me this problem. It's one of the (at least to my knowledge) unique things about L1 that I always liked and stood out to me. You revisit an old level except must do things differently now; so there's some nostalgia but also an added challenge.

Whispering Wind actually enforces my original solution to that level when made way back. Clam actually found the solution to (present day) five for fighting; which I liked so I kept that as it is/was. But still liked my solution (and at the very least RTW also liked it, evident in his video) so I made it into this 'repeat'.

I have weird ideas. The layout for five for fighting came to me in a dream and I feel like it (and maybe all levels) are real in some strange sense, tangible like a place or maybe living entities. I make best work I think when I just create these things as they were observed. Whenever I try to just force myself to 'make a level' out of nothing it always sucks. But I'm not really explaining this very well...

I digress; that is just in reference to the structural outline. If you want to change the decoration that's fine. Like I said; while I'm not active it isn't up to me. I don't believe I ever owned my levels even when they were just ideas before they were put down into the computer anyway.
"Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away."
-Hakwin Rinzai

"Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man"
-the Dude


Offline Simon

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Re: Mobius' Lix Levels
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2019, 07:07:12 am »
All right, cool that there are no hard feelings. Yeah, I acknowledge the like for repeats, and especially in your folder, the levels should keep your style. They're good, and they're well-covered with replays.

Move on to other projects or life, and tackle exciting problems. If you'd ever like to come back, the door will always be open for you. :lix-smile:

-- Simon
« Last Edit: February 01, 2019, 07:45:24 am by Simon »