Author Topic: [SuperLemmini] SubLems  (Read 29394 times)

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Offline Colorful Arty

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2016, 01:17:55 PM »
Thanks Nepster! Glad to hear you liked some of those levels! :)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Once again, thanks for all of the feedback! :D Good luck with Chaotic!
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Ben H

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2016, 01:39:42 PM »
Nice to see SuperLemmini getting some love. :thumbsup:

It is my favourite Lemmings engine, but it doesn't seem to get too much love around here.

Offline namida

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2016, 01:45:11 PM »
Nice to see SuperLemmini getting some love. :thumbsup:

It is my favourite Lemmings engine, but it doesn't seem to get too much love around here.

If you look at what the two engines that do see significant use (NeoLemmix and Lix) have that SuperLemmini doesn't, you might see why. ;)
My Lemmings projects
2D Lemmings: NeoLemmix (engine) | Lemmings Plus Series (level packs) | Doomsday Lemmings (level pack)
3D Lemmings: Loap (engine) | L3DEdit (level / graphics editor) | L3DUtils (replay / etc utility) | Lemmings Plus 3D (level pack)

Offline Colorful Arty

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2016, 03:00:43 PM »
While NeoLemmix (and to some Lix) are quite good, there are a few reasons I like SuperLemmini over them.

1. SuperLemmini has better graphics and more fluid animation.

2. SuperLemmini gets rid of glitches, but keeps quirky behavior, while NeoLemmix removes them both.

3. I find most NeoLemmix packs I have seen use entirely custom graphics. While that is cool, I prefer the original and ONML tilesets, as they seem better done and (in my opinion) have much more potential than the new ones. The new ones seem very monochrome. Again, no offense meant toward the new tilesets.

4. I find creating levelpacks is a LOT easier in SuperLemmini. (Mainly because I don't know how to make a NeoLemmix pack.
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline IchoTolot

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2016, 04:49:51 PM »
While NeoLemmix (and to some Lix) are quite good, there are a few reasons I like SuperLemmini over them.

1. SuperLemmini has better graphics and more fluid animation.

2. SuperLemmini gets rid of glitches, but keeps quirky behavior, while NeoLemmix removes them both.

3. I find most NeoLemmix packs I have seen use entirely custom graphics. While that is cool, I prefer the original and ONML tilesets, as they seem better done and (in my opinion) have much more potential than the new ones. The new ones seem very monochrome. Again, no offense meant toward the new tilesets.

4. I find creating levelpacks is a LOT easier in SuperLemmini. (Mainly because I don't know how to make a NeoLemmix pack.

1.) Ok, personally Graphics don't matter to me. If I want graphics I play sth else.

2.) Flamethrower climb, climber miner tunnel, "Retro 20" == Glitch :8():    These are not quirky anymore...they are just unlogical. You can't climb through fire....Lemmings turn in a tunnel....Lemmings cannot walk through walls! These are basic rules which are violated!

3.) The old ones are still there. You just got more to choose from. + Lemmings 2  tilesets look even more awesome than the Lemmings 1 tilesets in my opinion :8():

4.) Lemmini/Superlemmini pack creation is a nightmare compared to NeoLemmix. Writing a huge text file + getting all the folders together is just a hazzle. In NL simply get the FlexiToolkit, give it all your levels+music+png-graphics(optional) and done! You got your pack! + you get a written tutorial on the NL homepage.
If you don't know the other way you can't simply say the old one is better :8():

And now the ONLY argument I would possibly need:  Frameskipping!  This alone accomplishes more than everything combined!

I don't want to waste hours of my life watching replays of what I just did over and over + I love levels with awesome, but often precise tricks. These require precision which SuperLemmini doesn't provide. I also like huge and hard levels which is made worse with replay watching as well.
The level is about the puzzle and not getting the execution right for hours!
I hated this back in my Lemmini days when I knew the solution right at the start but could not quickly execute it and get quickly on to the next level.


Alright enough SuperLemmini rant for now... will later sent more feedback replays :)

The far biggest criticism I have about the (really good :thumbsup:) pack so far is the engine :P  (Nepster pointed this out about my feedback in IRC as well)
Followed by sometimes the usage of glitches (I will continue to use that term!) + hidden traps (this can easily be fixed)     

Offline Gronkling

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #20 on: May 14, 2016, 04:53:25 PM »
I will wait for a playthrough of this pack on youtube or similar as I don't want to install Java. It looks pretty from what I've seen though :>

Offline Nepster

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #21 on: May 14, 2016, 06:23:44 PM »
And let the Chaos rule... (click to show/hide)

Offline Tsyu

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #22 on: May 14, 2016, 07:09:19 PM »
Quote
There are no empty pixels; it is solid, but lemmings still treat it like empty space. I'll try to fix that as well.
I am not completely familiar with the SuperLemmini code and how it recognizes air vs. solid terrain. If SuperLemmini automatically sets all pixels with the background color to air, then the problem might simply be that some pixels in the blue terrain pieces have precisely that color. So it might be worth a try to change the background color in this level slightly, which (if I remember correctly) can be done in SuperLemmini.
SuperLemmini uses transparency, not color, to determine whether a pixel is solid. And if mask ([stylename]m_*) exists for a terrain piece, then SuperLemmini uses that instead of the graphic (([stylename]_*) to make this decision. (The mask feature exists so that the high-resolution graphics don't drastically change how some levels like Mayhem 26 play.)

What's really going on is that the visual graphic for terrain piece 28 in the Fire set is one pixel thicker than its mask, and Colorful Arty aligned the pieces based on the visual graphic (I blame the people who made Windows Lemmings' high-resolution graphics). I'll have discrepancies like this fixed in SuperLemmini 0.103.

Level 15: After spending 15 mins trying to find any way to solve this, I gladfully thought of that BUG (yes this should be considered as a bug :devil:) behavior where a climber gets stuck in
                a basher/minertunnel....turned RR to 68 and level done.
I don't think I've encountered this before. Could you attach a replay demonstrating this?

11) Not sure, if this is intended, because it abuses SuperLemmini mechanics: One-way-arrows cancel steel :lem-mindblown:.
This behavior will be fixed in SuperLemmini 0.103. (This also means that the nukers in Newbie 10 will no longer leave a gap under the exit.)

Offline IchoTolot

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #23 on: May 14, 2016, 07:13:22 PM »

Level 15: After spending 15 mins trying to find any way to solve this, I gladfully thought of that BUG (yes this should be considered as a bug :devil:) behavior where a climber gets stuck in
                a basher/minertunnel....turned RR to 68 and level done.
I don't think I've encountered this before. Could you attach a replay demonstrating this?

Replay is already attached in the zip file. Level: DON'T TURN AROUND!

Offline IchoTolot

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #24 on: May 14, 2016, 07:54:24 PM »
Alright here is Retro :)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I felt no real difficulty here for most of the levels, but I assume I nearly saw EVERYTHING done with the original L1 levels by now over all the years.  They mostly bring nothing really new to the table anymore. Also it can be that I solved so much until now that all these old little tricks just fall right into my eyes.
+ some of them could differ a bit more from the original.

The DOS music is still awesome though :thumbsup:

Offline grams88

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #25 on: May 14, 2016, 10:40:26 PM »
Hope all is well. :thumbsup:

I quite like the updated version of lemmini which is superlemmini. :thumbsup: It looks like you did a lot of work there Tsyu, :thumbsup: one thing I did notice was that you are able to click on the lemmings to build in about the same place as in the one before it was difficult or sometimes it did not work. Sorry If I never explained that too well. I've not really tried Neolemmix myself yet so it would probably be hard for me to compare.

Oh got to love those walking bombers Ichotolot. :lem-mindblown: Well maybe they can get annoying at times.

I've been trying some of the retro levels as well, that's me onto the 5th level. Kind of reminds me of my small pack where you play some of the original levels and make a different puzzle out of them. :thumbsup:


Here's some more replays for yourself ColorfulArty.

Offline Colorful Arty

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #26 on: May 15, 2016, 12:53:38 AM »
Glad you're enjoying the pack grams! It's always nice to see SuperLemmini get appreciated! :D

Replies to Nepster's Chaotic solutions...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

For IchoTolot

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Nepster

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #27 on: May 15, 2016, 09:18:33 AM »
Regarding Chaotic 10, 17 and 20 (click to show/hide)

Insane (click to show/hide)

Offline Colorful Arty

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #28 on: May 15, 2016, 01:48:05 PM »
Regarding Insane:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
My Youtube channel where I let's play games with family-friendly commentary:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiRPZ5j87ft_clSRLFCESQA

My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/colorfularty

My levelpack: SubLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4942.0
For Old formats NeoLemmix: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2787.0
For SuperLemmini: http://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=2704.0

My levelpack: ArtLems
For New formats NeoLemmix: https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=4583.0

Offline Nepster

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Re: SubLems 1.0 release for SuperLemmini!
« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2016, 02:04:45 PM »
Oops, I forgot to attach the replays :-[. Here are they.

Regarding Insane 1, 7, 9 (click to show/hide)