My experience with NeoLemmix so far

[607]

Hi, it's me again!

The past hour I've been busy setting up NeoLemmix. And I can say, I quite like it so far.
I've been using neolemmix.com, and I can say the site is set up quite nicely, I got the tutorial pack to work without too much trouble.

Some new things added seem a bit cheaty to me, though. Especially the minus. Going frames backwards? Wouldn't that be cheaty? I mean, making a mistake is never a problem anymore... as if you will ever make a mistake, with the one frame at a time method. So, yeah, I'm wondering what your thoughts on abilities like those are.

[Nepster]

The general opinion here seems to be, that the main difficulty in a lemmings level should come from finding a working solution, not from its execution. So

I mean, making a mistake is never a problem anymore... as if you will ever make a mistake, with the one frame at a time method.

is precisely the point why this feature was added.
As for the second half of the quoted sentence: I wish it were so . If you work with a few lemmings simultanously on different parts of a level, it is still quite easy to miss giving one of the lemmings a certain skill at a certain time. Apart from that I usually run NeoLemmix at normal speed and use the "one frame advance"-method only in special cases. Then naturally mistakes happen and going backwards in time comes in handy.

Ultimately this is a case of personal preferences though. If you think this is cheating, then just don't use this feature - noone forces you to do so.

[namida]

The way I see it, it's no "cheatier" than replays - it's just a quicker method of acheiving the same thing. Replays are supported even in some official games (WinLemm, Lemmings 3D, etc), after all.

[607]

Okay, thank you for sharing your opinions!
I understand. It feels a bit odd, but that's probably just because it's new. I will continue playing the original games anyway, and this might come in handy when playing custom levels.
I've got the editor to work, and I'll say this: I forgot to eat, that's how much I was enjoying myself.
For some reason the play-test function doesn't work, but I can just open the CustLemmixNeo.exe (or whatever it's called) and select the level manually, if I want to test it.
I certainly like working with it more than LemEdit, and the new functions (I love the pickup-skill thing) are great, too.

[namida]

When you run NeoCustLemmix, do you get a warning popping up saying "This file was downloaded from the internet, are you sure you want to run it?"

Apparently if you uncheck the "always show this message for this program" checkbox and run it, it should work for playtest mode after that. I can't say for sure since I've never had this problem myself, but other users have reported that this works.

[607]

I accidentally deleted my entire NeoLemmix folder (luckily the rest of my games are still intact)
I reinstalled it, but now I lost the first levels I ever made, which is a shame.
I'd like to ask if there is a place I can get some more tilesets. I see there are quite a few included with NeoLemmix already, but I was wondering if there are any more that are free for anyone to use.

[namida]

A lot of Cheapo style sets exist, and these can be converted to NeoLemmix quite easily. Some are already available in converted form. (Just for reference, the "Cheapo Styles" selection in the editor's style list, are still NeoLemmix styles; they're just converted from Cheapo.) There's a few custom ones for Lemmini out there too, and these similarly can be converted.

However, in terms of specifically-designed-for-NeoLemmix ones, it's pretty much just the included ones (which come from Lemmings Plus II (Tree to Desert), Lemmings Plus III (Sky to Lab) and Doomsday Lemmings (Horror)). As far as I know of, I'm the only person who's been making NeoLemmix tilesets; all the ones I've made are included with NeoLemmix, except the LPIV ones (which haven't been released yet).

Just for reference, all the included ones are absolutely free for anyone to use.

[607]

Okay, I'm really ticked off right now, but it's not by any means your fault. I deleted my entire folder, again. And I lost a couple of fully working levels I created. I really don't know how this happened, there's something odd going on here, I think, because I can't imagine accidentally deleting something twice. I'll look more into this, and probably store my NeoLemmix stuff in a different place if I'm going to restart once again. This really saddens me though, I put quite some time into those levels, and they were good...

[namida]

Can't you get them back from the recycle bin?

[607]

Nope, I have my files on a cloudy thing. I'm not sure how it works (my dad was the only one who did, really...) but I can access my files on any pc or laptop in our house. It's some kind of network thingy, I really don't know. Normally it's quite handy, but there are two major cons to it:
firstly, there's no recycle bin. If you delete something, it's gone for good. That's what happened here.
Secondly, it'll always give a warning when you execute a file from the internet. No uncheck possible. That's what happened a few posts earlier, and it's what made me not be able to test levels.

A backup should be made every week, but nobody knows how to access that backup. Besides, I think it is made on Sunday, and I did most of my work on Monday and Tuesday.

[mobius]

I suggest buying flash drives. You can get small ones for cheap prices [I'm totally guessing cause I can't remember; around 10-20$ for 5-10 GB]
I have many of these and its very simple to back up your stuff with them. When using them however, you should get many and store different things across them in case something has a virus. You don't want to spread it to all of them.
I was able to identify where a virus was I had like this.

and there good for things like Lemmings cause most of these files are very small for today's standards.

It sounds like this may not be applicable but there are programs like Un-eraser that can restore files that have been deleted in the traditional method

[607]

So, that problem I had kind of set me back: but worry not, I won't give up so easily!
I have remade the simpler level already, and made one new one. I can say some of the Lemmings Plus tilesets will definitely be used!
Something I noticed:
I have a level featuring one cloner. There's one Lemming, and you need to save two. In the editor, it says the requirement is thus 200%. However, in the game, it says 100%. It still works the same, because 1 out of 1 will give 50% if you haven't used the cloner. But it's still a bit inconsistent.

[namida]

This is because (by default settings) in-game, cloner-adjusted percentages are used. The editor has never been changed to match this, though you're right that it probably should be.

Just for reference, you can actually change how the game displays percentages in the Options menu (press F3 on the title screen). There's three options for it - "ADJ" (Adjusted) is the default one. Otherwise, there's "OFF" which turns percentages off altogether and just displays number of lemmings instead, or "ON" which doesn't take into account cloners (ie: it would display 200% required on that level).

[607]

How does one create a level with custom graphics, not consisting of a tileset? I believe it's called VGASPEC, but I'm not too sure on how it works. I'm definitely trying to include one of such levels in each rank, though.
Sorry for my ignorance and newbie-ishness.

[namida]

You need to create a corresponding VGASPEC file (the name comes from the filenames of the respective files in the DOS version; the name has little actual relevance to how they're now implemented). As you probably know there's some already included with NeoLemmix Editor - those from DOS, Genesis, etc.

To create your own, just create a graphic set (using the Graphic Set Tool) that has a single terrain piece and no objects. The filename for it should start with "x_" and (as with most files) have a ".dat" extension. For example, "x_awesome.dat" is the one for "What An AWESOME Level". The name part (not the whole filename, but just the custom name part in the middle) shouldn't be more than 16 characters long, and can't start or end with a space (but it can have a space in the middle).

[607]

Okay, I've seen enough .xm's, .mod's and .it's for today

[607]

You need to create a corresponding VGASPEC file (the name comes from the filenames of the respective files in the DOS version; the name has little actual relevance to how they're now implemented). As you probably know there's some already included with NeoLemmix Editor - those from DOS, Genesis, etc.

To create your own, just create a graphic set (using the Graphic Set Tool) that has a single terrain piece and no objects. The filename for it should start with "x_" and (as with most files) have a ".dat" extension. For example, "x_awesome.dat" is the one for "What An AWESOME Level". The name part (not the whole filename, but just the custom name part in the middle) shouldn't be more than 16 characters long, and can't start or end with a space (but it can have a space in the middle).

Now how do I create a level with that VGASPEC?

[namida]

In the editor's folder, there should be a folder called "styles", and inside this, one called "NeoLemmix". Copy it into that folder.

It's then selectable from the "Special graph" selection menu in the editor (click the "..." next to it under the level properties).

[607]

Oh wow, I was really confused for a while
Turns out I created a level with a Lemmix tileset instead of NeoLemmix, stupid me...
I got it there, now. But nothing shows if I import it, only black. I made a .png file with transparent background, and no black in it. It's 1169 x 200 pixels. I did file -> new, then Add, then Import, and chose the .png file. I said Use Alpha Channel, and Zoom Small Images was checked. I then did file -> save as and gave it the right filename. If I add it in the Editor, I only see black.

[namida]

Just to make sure - you added it as a terrain piece, not an object, right?

"Use Alpha Channel" is correct if you have actual transparent background (in a PNG or GIF file). The "Zoom Small Images" is only relevant for display inside the graphic set editor - it has no bearing on the output.

Could you send me (via PM) the file you made so I can look into this? Just the special graphic file; I don't need the level itself.

[607]

With the new release of the editor, I can make VGASPEC levels!
I also noticed that when using the other skills gimmick, you can choose one skill to use endlessly Kind of interesting!

[namida]

With the new release of the editor, I can make VGASPEC levels!
I also noticed that when using the other skills gimmick, you can choose one skill to use endlessly Kind of interesting!

Indeed! I myself haven't used that gimmick in any levels, but DynaLem's Unused Gimmicks Pack has a level that really shows off that gimmick's potential.

[607]

Okay, two things: the sound still stops working now and then. I thought someone mentioned a key to fix it, but I can't remember if it worked, and I forgot which key it was.
And the other thing: I'm playing Lemmings Plus I now, and to get the custom music, you should just put the .dat file in the same folder as the .exe, right?

[namida]

S toggles sound effects on and off, but that setting is reset when you finish a level. If you're accidentally hitting it, that might be what's causing the issue. Lemmix was known to have sound issues along those lines at one point, although the way sound is handled was rewritten at one point in NeoLemmix (previously it used some kind of built-in Delphi library I think, while it now uses Bass.dll).

And indeed, that's how to use a music pack. The filename should be the same as the EXE, with "_Music" at the end. EG: For LemmingsPlusI.exe, it should be LemmingsPlusI_Music.dat.

[607]

I've finished my first custom graphics level. Not really a VGASPEC, as I also made a custom exit and trap. I won't spoil the theme of the custom graphics levels yet, but I can reveal that I'll try to make those the only levels with custom gimmicks, and have a specific one for each. It was quite challenging to make a level with the "VGASPEC" I had in mind, using an interesting gimmick, yet still fitting into the first rank of the game. I find I often turn out with "tricky" levels while I was planning to make one for the first rating.

[607]

I've been having really much fun with this, in-between learning for tests.
Today I created the most difficult level I've made yet. The problem is of course that I can't actually test the difficulty of it myself, as I already know the solution. I think it could perhaps fit in in at least the third difficulty though, but I'm not too sure.

[607]

I think I finally get the music situation.
I thought you needed to use Amiga music, but I now think it doesn't matter where it's from, as long as it's in the format .it. Is that correct?

[namida]

IT or OGG.

Many formats similar to IT will also work if they're renamed to have an IT extension; MOD and XM are two examples of such.

[Simon]

renamed to have an IT extension; MOD and XM are two examples

Why are you forcing users to give misleading filenames?

-- Simon

[namida]

It's more that the other formats just so happen to work, but aren't explicitly intended to be supported. It's the same with that some other sample-based formats might work if renamed to an OGG extension, as the "load music" function is fairly generic and not format-specific (however, the function that loads info on looping points is very much OGG-specific, so any non-OGG sample-based formats would be stuck as looping the whole file, not able to loop a specific section of it).

So, while they will work, it's also worth noting that if for some reason a format other than OGG or IT doesn't work at some point (at least during V1.xx series, I'll probably improve the situation for V2.00), I'm probably not going to try too hard to fix it.

[607]

Uh, that's interesting.
I didn't even know there was a possibility of looping specific parts of a song.
Now my problem is the opposite of what it was before: at first I was trying to find more music I could use that would fit (and I searched for .mod specifically, as I thought that was what you were supposed to use) and now I have more interesting themes than levels to use them in

I let my younger brother (9) play my hardest level yet earlier today, and he helped me find a backroute, which is nice. After that I forgot the correct solution xD I figured it out again eventually though, and did what I probably should've done earlier: I saved a replay.

[namida]

Yep, I try to always save replays every time I make or change a level. Even more important though, is making sure I have replays for every level before releasing amything. There's been the odd case where people have released impossible levels, possibly due to fixing backroutes then not ensuring the intended solution still works, so this is a good way to avoid that.

[Simon]

other formats [...] aren't explicitly intended to be supported.

I assume this means "supported by the lib". You've given lots of support for it already.

Does the lib outright refuse to load a file with an unwanted ending?

if [...] a format other than OGG or IT doesn't work at some point [...] I'm probably not going to try too hard to fix it.

In that case, the forced rename has put users in the worst of all situations. They won't see at a glance which files have stopped working.

-- Simon