Author Topic: Lemmings 2 glitches  (Read 12925 times)

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Offline Clam

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Lemmings 2 glitches
« on: September 26, 2009, 11:59:35 pm »
Similar to the Glitches in Lemmings topic, this thread is for unexpected behaviour in Lemmings 2: The Tribes, on DOS, Amiga and other platforms.


To start with, here are a couple from the DOS version that were mentioned in the other thread:

  • Graphical bug where part of the closed trapdoor image appears over the open trapdoor. The cause is unknown and this has not been successfully reproduced yet, however screenshots are available here.
  • Invisible wall created when a blocker is counting down to exploding. Story and screenshots here.


Another glitch I have noticed is that when you use a diver on an upwards slope, it gets stuck in the terrain. If you make it dive again as soon as it gets up, it moves even further into the terrain. One could argue that this is the only worthwhile use for a diver ;P

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2009, 07:07:14 pm »
On the graphical glitch, your reproduction didn't work because it wasn't noticed right away.  Which means the game was running a while before I noticed it and paused to take the snapshot.

Offline Simon

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2009, 02:28:16 am »
The following happens at least under the DOS version. However, it's not as spectacular as the other stuff in this thread here.

The screen does not scroll all the way to the bottom. The bottom pixel row will never scroll into view. The pixels are still there and you can walk on them or remove them. You can test this by digging down in Classic 1. This is likely caused by an unexpected height of the OSD panel, which is 41 pixels high.

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Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2009, 10:30:08 am »
Another wonderfully accidental discovery! :D

Check out these pics featuring one of the (supposedly) more useless skills in the game - the hopper.

If you tell a lemming to hop at the exact moment it turns around at a wall, it gets stuck in the wall and "climbs" up one pixel at a time (first pic). You can assign it pretty much any type of skill while it does this, unlike regular climbers or "glitch-climbing" lemmings. And it gets weirder - if the hopper encounters an obstacle on the way up, it starts hopping into the wall (second pic).


By the way, here's more on the diver glitch. It turns out that the wall doesn't have to slope at all for the diver to go in and get stuck. In addition, the lemming falls down into the ground slightly each time it dives, so with a lot of patience (and divers) you can get the lemming to fall through the floor.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2009, 09:40:43 pm »
What level is that?  Is it the practice level or something?

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2009, 10:02:38 pm »
No, I think it's a proper level.

By the way, are the classic lemmings skill glitches been carried forward?
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Offline GuyPerfect

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2009, 11:16:02 pm »
It's the Egyptian practice level.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2009, 11:59:33 pm »
By the way, are the classic lemmings skill glitches been carried forward?

Good question.  It can be a bit of pain to check though since Classic Tribe isn't available in Practice.

However, it's already known that at least some stuff work differently in Lemmings 2.  For example, if you make a digger dig on steel, he will actually try to dig down once (removing no terrain in the process) and then he'll stop, whereas in Lemmings 1 you won't even be able to make the skill assignment if the lemming is on steel (except in rare cases involving specific glitches).

Another thing to keep in mind is that at least on the DOS and Amiga versions, unlike Lemmings 1, you don't have the "select walker only", nor the "highlight and track a particular lemming" ability that you found in ports of Lemmings 2 like SNES.  So for example, I still haven't even been able to achieve the setup where you have a lemming start digging on steel while within a blocker field, because the game keeps prioritizing the skill assigment to the non-walker.

Finally, some Lemmings-2 specific behaviors occur even in Classic Tribe.  For example, in Lemmings 2, a walker that's stuck or near-stuck will automatically start crawling upwards.

I would guess that a few glitches will probably carry over while others won't.  It'll take a little time to find out which ones.  Once the Lemmings 2 editor is available, it would be a lot easier to test out these sorts of things. :thumbsup:

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2009, 12:02:58 am »
Actually, if memory serves, I think I can already safely say that the various steel destruction glitches that don't involve blocker fields, those likely won't work in Lemmings 2, or at least won't work the same way.  I seem to remember testing that out recently and find that when a lemming stands really close to steel (but isn't actually standing right on it) and starts digging, he will dig down one time (and will indeed remove one row of terrain pixels, including excluding those within the steel tile--or did I remember that part correctly?), but then he'll detect the steel and stop.  So you could say it kinda works, but definitely not like in Lemmings 1 where the lemming would've kept on digging.

Offline LemSteven

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2009, 04:52:25 am »
As far as I know, steel is completely indestructable in Lemmings 2.  None of the steel bashing/digging glitches work; a miner will take the a swipe at it but won't remove any steel; and bombers and the like will blast away only the non-steel terrain objects.

I do know, however, that it is possible to have a basher go through the top pixel of steel and keep bashing, only he won't actually remove the steel portion.  This is actually quite useful in "Round the Blox", as it allows your final basher to reach the exit even if you started him a tad too low.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2009, 10:13:04 am »
There was something else I observed while playing around in the Egyptian practice level. When I nuked the lemmings (remember that explosions fling lemmings around in this game), I saw some lemmings fly upwards through a solid block of terrain without breaking it. I might see if I can make it happen again and grab a pic...

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2009, 11:45:41 am »
Okay, I tried out a few more Lemmings 1 glitches just now on Lemmings 2, here are the results.  I also discovered a few interesting differences between Lemmings 1 and Lemmings 2.  Some behavior you can actually observe in Cheapo, which isn't entirely surprising since I think Lemmings 2 was Peter Spada's favorite game in the series.

First, let me repeat the list of glitches:

  • Giant Leap - Jumper lemming climbs up through a wall after the gap it was about to jump into is closed up by a builder
  • Blocker pushing lemmings through a wall
  • Nuke glitch - When you nuke the level the game calculates your percentage based on the number of lemmings that have entered the level, rather than the total number in the level
  • Miner falling through terrain while leaving it intact
  • Climbing up when stuck inside terrain
  • Miner crossing 1-pixel gaps
  • Climber comes away from the wall slightly when it hits a ceiling and falls
  • Blockers make steel areas destructible
  • Climbers transition to walkers for one frame when the terrain they are climbing on is removed - you can then make them build in mid-air
  • Right one-way walls cannot be mined
  • Various steel-destruction glitches where the terrain that the lemming tries to destroy is not part of the steel area. EXAMPLE: Top 7 rows of a steel area can be bashed through - this includes the top of the level and in fact cannot be prevented by better placement in this case :XD:

And here are the results:

  • Giant Leap - no longer applicable, because it looks like jumpers no longer exist in Lemmings 2--the lemming takes a single frame to go up a traversable step no matter the step height.  On a related note, the max traversable step height is 4 pixels in Lemmings 2, not 6 (ie. a 5-pixel step is enough to cause a walker to turn around, compare with 7 in Lemmings 1).

    Of course, you don't really need this glitch anymore in Lemmings 2 anyway, since stuck walkers automatically crawl up.
     
  • Blocker pushing lemmings through a wall - I haven't gotten this to work so far, and I'm fairly sure it doesn't work based on what I'm seeing.  Will test more thoroughly once editor is available.

    I also noticed two more differences with blockers: 1) With 2 blockers as close as possible, walker lemmings trapped in between do not turn left and right, but stay in the same facing direction, just like in Cheapo.  2) When you explode a blocker, the blocker no longer blocks during "oh-no-ing", just like in Cheapo.
     
  • Nuke glitch - no longer applicable since game no longer deals with percentages.
     
  • Miner falling through terrain while leaving it intact - this one is interesting.  The miner glitch, in terms of the positioning of the miner, still works in Lemmings 2!  However, the slight difference in walker mechanics means that when you apply it specifically for the "fall thru terrain" move using a blocker, the lemming will actually be able to walk up onto the terrain rather than falling down from it.  You could indeed make the lemming fall through if you make him explode rather than blocker, but of course that's less useful since he won't survive for long.  But at least that trick still works when you don't have blockers.
     
  • Climbing up when stuck inside terrain - not yet tested, but probably no longer applicable because lemmings automatically crawl up when stuck inside terrain, whether or not they are climbers.  I don't think you can assign skills to these "crawlers" though, so it's still nice to check whether this climber glitch still works or not. Okay, I've just tested this and it doesn't work.  The climber does not crawl up like a walker would.  He would do the same climb-fall-climb-fall routine that a stuck climber would in Lemmings 1, only in Lemmings 2, the climber never moves up as a result, instead staying at the same altitude he started from.
     
  • Miner crossing 1-pixel gaps - not yet tested.  1-pixel gaps may be hard to come by in Lemmings 2 anyway, now that terrain has to be aligned to tile boundaries rather than on arbitrary pixels.  Creating the setup to test this will probably require doing something annoying like stacking builders.
     
  • Climber comes away from the wall slightly when it hits a ceiling and falls - yep, it still works!
     
  • Blockers make steel areas destructible - no longer works.  I tested this with a setup where a walker will explode standing at the same location where a blocker is standing, on top of steel.  No steel is destroyed.
     
  • Climbers transition to walkers for one frame when the terrain they are climbing on is removed - you can then make them build in mid-air - no longer works.  Looks like climbers transition to faller when that happens (but still facing the same direction he was when climbing).
     
  • Right one-way walls cannot be mined - not applicable since there are no one-way-walls in Lemmings 2.
     
  • Various steel-destruction glitches where the terrain that the lemming tries to destroy is not part of the steel area - I haven't tested all the possibilities, but from what I've seen so far, I believe it no longer works.  In Lemmings 2 it looks like they actually check every tile for steel before removing terrain pixels from it, unlike Lemmings 1 where it is all based on only the 1 pixel the lemming is standing on.  Just like in Cheapo.
     

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2009, 09:50:17 pm »
There's a lose only one lemming solution for one of the Classic Levels (whichever one loses four lemmings most of the time) that uses the push lemmings into the wall with a blocker trick.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2009, 10:05:14 pm »
There's a lose only one lemming solution for one of the Classic Levels (whichever one loses four lemmings most of the time) that uses the push lemmings into the wall with a blocker trick.

You're thinking of Classic 7 ("So close but so far away"), and if I remember correctly, it doesn't really cause the lemmings to be pushed into the wall.  Instead it just gets the lemmings stuck between the blocker's right hand and the wall, which triggers the "crawl up when you're stuck" behavior.  If I remember correctly, this means for example, you can't put the blocker too close to the wall, otherwise the walkers actually turn around at the wall instead.  Try it out yourself and see.

Anyway, this one (particularly the push through thin wall part) is much easier to test with a custom level, so I'm probably gonna wait until the editor's available to do further testing on it.  Similarly with the direct-drop move, which you can try testing on in Classic 6, but would be much easier when you can position the exit directly above the entrance.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2009, 10:08:43 pm »
  • Miner crossing 1-pixel gaps - not yet tested.  1-pixel gaps may be hard to come by in Lemmings 2 anyway, now that terrain has to be aligned to tile boundaries rather than on arbitrary pixels.  Creating the setup to test this will probably require doing something annoying like stacking builders.
     

I just noticed that scoopers can come out quite a way (maybe 4 pixels) from a wall after they finish digging through it. So I guess there's a good chance it will work with miners too (to a lesser extent of course).

Offline LemSteven

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2009, 12:26:49 am »
I've run into a rather annoying glitch a few times that's worth mentioning:

Sometimes when a lemming uses a cannon, the cannon goes off before the lemming gets all the way inside, and he gets stuck in there until another lemming comes and uses the cannon.  Then both lemmings are launched together.

I find the glitch to be extremely annoying because you can end up with two lemmings stuck together when you think there's only one.  Or worse yet, if the last lemming to use the cannon gets stuck, you can be left with no way to save him.

The glitch has a tendency to happen if the game is paused after a lemming lights the fuse, but before he climbs in the cannon.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2009, 09:29:49 pm »
You can save a lemming that falls from a great height by catching it in an explosion. It looks like the fall distance "resets" when a lemming gets knocked away. But there's a twist - you can still save the lemming after it has started the splat animation. The attached pics show:
1) A splatting lemming, with a bomber about to go off next to it.
2) The same lemmings after being flung away by the explosion. (The lemming climbing onto the catapult gets knocked away too.)

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2009, 09:42:57 pm »
Intriguing.  So it sounds like there's a very good chance that direct-drop-to-exit would work in Lemmings 2.  As soon as I have the time I'll need to fire up the existing custom-level tools for L2 to test that out.

Offline Pooty

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2009, 10:48:13 pm »
I know direct drop works on the SNES version of Lemmings 2 because that was how I solved Sports 8 with 9 skills (although your accuracy needed to be precise to the very pixel). It could work here, too.
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Fun 03 [3], 06 [2], 18 [5]   
Taxing 19 [5], 27 [1], 28 [3]
Tricky 15 [5], 17 [2]
Mayhem 19 [7], 26 [10]

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #19 on: October 31, 2009, 02:30:24 am »
Technically not a glitch, but...

I just noticed that the title to Egypt level 2 is not "Glued to the Goal!" but "G1ued to the Goal!"

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #20 on: October 31, 2009, 02:37:18 am »
I just noticed that the title to Egypt level 2 is not "Glued to the Goal!" but "G1ued to the Goal!"

Huh.  Given that the letter L and the number 1 are nowhere near each other on the keyboard, I have to wonder if they actually did it on purpose.  I mean, I can see the "5 miles" on the L1 Genesis port coming from a Japanese misreading, but clearly that wouldn't be the case for L2 DOS.

That, or maybe it's one of those dylexia-like disorders on the part of whoever designed the level, causing him to never realize the typo, and it's too subtle I guess for other people to have noticed.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #21 on: October 31, 2009, 05:59:47 pm »
How did no one notice that?

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2009, 11:24:21 pm »
1 and l look pretty much identical in the L2 font (the "1" is just a slightly bigger "l"). I found this while looking through the levels in GP's editor, which uses a different font.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2009, 02:16:03 am »
I still find that funny.

G1ued to the Goal?  Are they serious?

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2009, 06:49:22 am »
They are. They are so serious that all the L2 walkthroughs need to be updated because of the change. I can't do that. :XD:

Er... Are there any glitches involving the ballooner? I don't have the editor but I was thinking this: If a lemming gets stuck in a small wall and is given a ballooner skill, what would happen next?
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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #25 on: November 02, 2009, 01:54:31 am »
Lame drawing, I know (I suck at MS Paint).  It's supposed to be the balloon popping.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #26 on: November 02, 2009, 02:29:33 am »
Er... Are there any glitches involving the ballooner? I don't have the editor but I was thinking this: If a lemming gets stuck in a small wall and is given a ballooner skill, what would happen next?

<trying very hard to stiffle uncontrollable laughter at Dullstar's artwork...... ;P>

ah-hem...'cuse me.  Right, ballooner.

I haven't tried it but logic would dictate that the balloon would burst immediately.  The other (less) likely possibility is that the balloon somehow doesn't burst (maybe because it only bursts if the lemming has actually moved up), but the lemming doesn't go anywhere either.

One thing I can confirm is that, courtesy of GuyPerfect's custom Beach level, you can get a ballooner lemming "snagged" on some terrain so that he can't move up, but the balloon itself is not touching anything so it doesn't burst.  I don't see any part of that as glitchy though.

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2009, 07:33:27 am »
I half understand what you're saying...

I'll tell you what, I'll give you a simple lemmings level as an example to show you what I mean. I am now permitted to get the L2 editor now as I sent GP a message, so no complaints anymore.

I was guessing 3 possible outcomes when a lemming gets stuck inside an 8 pixel high wall:

1: The balloon would stay there and not move the lemming upwards.
2: The balloon would fly to the ceiling.
3: It would burst during the blow up.
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Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #28 on: November 02, 2009, 09:36:05 pm »
I can draw better than that, but on quick diagrams, etc., I just make something that gets the point across, no matter how ugly it is.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #29 on: November 02, 2009, 09:48:58 pm »
I half understand what you're saying...

<snip>I was guessing 3 possible outcomes when a lemming gets stuck inside an 8 pixel high wall:

1: The balloon would stay there and not move the lemming upwards.
2: The balloon would fly to the ceiling.
3: It would burst during the blow up.

I was suggesting #3 as most likely, follow by #1.  I've never seen the balloon separating from the lemming so I would be extremely surprised if #2 happens.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #30 on: November 04, 2009, 12:59:22 pm »
Run into this in a recent custom level.  The broken bridge you see in the screenshot was never actually broken.  It just started looking like that when I scrolled that part of the level off the screen and then scroll it back in.

Offline GuyPerfect

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2009, 12:15:54 am »
That's most likely due to being right in front of the spinner graphics for the chain swing. I've noticed the game has a few oddities when scrolling animated elements ONTO the screen.

Offline Pooty

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2009, 01:51:49 am »
Seems right, as it covers the space of one tile. It's a good thing that it's only a graphical glitch.
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Fun 03 [3], 06 [2], 18 [5]   
Taxing 19 [5], 27 [1], 28 [3]
Tricky 15 [5], 17 [2]
Mayhem 19 [7], 26 [10]

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #33 on: November 18, 2009, 05:23:11 am »
I just realised you can edit the save file to play with more than 60 lemmings. Unfortunately, the game freezes when it drops the 101st lemming from the entrance, so 100 is the limit. The number 100 displays in-game as ":0", and if you save them all it says "You saved 00 lemmings" :D

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #34 on: November 18, 2009, 05:26:54 am »
Awesome!  100 lemmings...  wish we could get that for DOS Lemmings 1, as the percentages at that level are awfully easy to calculate!

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #35 on: November 18, 2009, 05:37:03 am »
Awesome!  100 lemmings...  wish we could get that for DOS Lemmings 1, as the percentages at that level are awfully easy to calculate!

Yeah, unfortunately it's very unlikely to happen.  The game sets aside exactly enough memory for 80 lemmings, and there are other stuff in memory immediately following it.  So supporting 100 lemmings would require massive hacking to relocate all the other data structures following it to make room for 20 more lemmings, and then change all memory address references throughout the entire game to adjust for said massive relocation.  Oh, did I mention that the full disasembly of the game runs at about 18000 lines of code?

Your best bet instead is to use Lemmix.

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #36 on: November 18, 2009, 05:49:17 am »
Wow, that is...  extreme.  Lemmix is windows only though.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #37 on: November 18, 2009, 09:26:57 am »
Found another glitch (wow, I'm on fire today). You may or may not be aware that runners don't stand still like other lemmings when executing the Thrower and Spearer skills; instead they take a short run-up before throwing. When a running Spearer runs into a wall during this run-up, it pulls out of the throw and turns back. But if a running Thrower hits a wall during the run-up, it gets stuck in the wall and crawls up.

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #38 on: November 18, 2009, 09:54:08 pm »
And another one. Wow, this game is buggy :D

I was testing out my new level, and my Runner/Swimmer glitched through a wall when it fell in the water. I've uploaded a video so you can see for yourself. If you don't make it a Swimmer, it just drowns as you would expect.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #39 on: November 19, 2009, 12:20:35 am »
Wow, I thought it was just another wall-crawling thing, definitely didn't expect it to literally go through the wall. :o :thumbsup:

I guess with 51 different types of skills instead of 8, there's a vast increase in potential interactions between skills and skill transitions, so it comes at no surprise that there are much more opportunities for glitches.

One that I remember off top of my head, not very spectacular though, is that while the roper waits for the rope shooting to finish (whether or not the rope breaks), it won't fall even if you remove the ground it's standing on.  It does fall of course once it finishes waiting.  I haven't tried yet whether you can assign skills in the transition.  There are likely other skills with similar behavior, though I haven't checked anything else yet (eg. archers?  laser blasters? etc)

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #40 on: November 19, 2009, 03:42:50 am »
I've investigated the wall-swimming glitch further. Here's what I found:

  • The glitch appears to only work to the left. I haven't yet been able to reproduce the mirror-image.
  • Whether or not the lemming glitches through the wall depends on its position when it lands in the water (i.e. how close it is to the wall), not the other permanent skills assigned. It just so happened that my runner fell in the right place earlier because of the auto-jump.
  • The lemming can glitch through any amount of terrain!
  • The lemming appears to spin around as it travels through the wall. It seems to cycle through the animations for swimming in each direction and turning around (as though it hit a wall and couldn't climb out).
  • If the lemming climbs out in mid-air, there's one frame of walking in which you can assign a skill before it falls.

Offline LemSteven

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #41 on: November 19, 2009, 07:36:06 pm »
I recall another glitch that has caused me trouble on occasion.  As an example, I will use my solution for Outdoor 4:

My solution to that level is to send a Canoer across the water while the rest of the crowd is held back with an Attractor.  Once the Canoer is across the water, I want to make him an Archer so that he can shoot an arrow to the other side.  Then someone from the crowd can pour glue on that arrow and make a bridge over the water.

Toward the end the animation in which the leader transitions from a Canoer to a Walker, there is a point in which you can give him the Archer skill, but his feet aren't yet planted on the ground.  So as he is preparing his bow, he falls and transitions back to a Walker, essentially wasting the skill.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #42 on: December 05, 2009, 04:09:55 am »
While fooling around in practice mode, I discover that if you drown a SuperLem, 99% of the time it will prevent you from assigning anyone else a SuperLem again (until you restart the level of course).  While I haven't tested many other methods of killing SuperLems, I did test that merely making the SuperLem disappear off the level boundaries will not cause the same effect.  I also haven't tested yet what happens if some other kind of transition besides drowning occurs (eg. what if the lemming has Swimmer ability? hmm, something to test next...)[edit: tested swimmer, same thing happens--can't assign SuperLem to anyone anymore]

[edit2: Further testing suggests a circumstance where the SuperLem will drown w/o preventing further SuperLem assignment, but it's even weirder.  Basically make the SuperLem with swimmer ability nosedive fast into the water at a near-vertical angle.  Even though if the SuperLem had swimmer ability, it will nevertheless drown!  And yet, somehow with this kind of drowning which looks exactly the same, you can continue to assign SuperLem afterwards.  Strange.  Doing this with non-swimmer SuperLem doesn't work.   Wait, it does.]

[edit3: I have a vague guess as to what might be going on with edit2.  I'm testing this specifically in the Polar practice level with the relatively shallow pool of water at the top of the screen right over the first hill.  I think if you dive the SuperLem into the water fast enough, if it's fast enough it will actually go straight from air to hitting the bottom of the shallow pool in a single frame.  This is equivalent to crashing your SuperLem which will end the SuperLem ability, and only then does the game check for water and drown the lemming.  So you bypass the glitch about not being able to assign another SuperLem, because the lemming actually drowned right after losing SuperLem as opposed to during.  It's still a glitch thoiugh that this kind of dive would drown even a swimmer.]

Offline LemSteven

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #43 on: December 05, 2009, 06:26:49 am »
Okay, here's a weird one I discovered with the Stacker:

Like the Builder, the Stacker has a ceiling detection algorithm so that if he hits his head on something, he will stop building his stack and walk off.  But unlike a Builder, the Stacker does not appear to check and see if the stack hits an object.

This means that you can build a stack going right through a ceiling that is thinner than the height of a lemming.  A good level to try this out on is Medieval 1.  There is a small overhang about 2/3 of the way through the level that looks like this:

                ______________________
               |_____________
                           /
_________________________/


If you assign a stacker at the far right under the overhang, he will build right through and end up on top, and you'll get something that looks like this:

                           |
                           |
                ___________|__________
               |___________|_
                           /
_________________________/

Offline GigaLem

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #44 on: December 06, 2009, 01:27:09 am »
Theres this trick i saw on youtube
If you get something like this
 _____
|        |
|        |
|        |
|        |
|       /_
|        |
 _____
The lemming will wall crawl

Offline Dullstar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2009, 04:49:45 pm »
Yep, I've seen that one too.  I never could actually pull it off though.  It's the trick used in Classic 7 for 100%.

Offline Simon

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #46 on: March 10, 2010, 12:00:35 pm »
1. Play Lemmings 2 in Dosbox.
2. Assign Attractor.
3. Party!

-- Simon

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #47 on: March 10, 2010, 09:38:33 pm »
^
|
|

weird, how long do you have to wait before it glitches like that?  Or was it just a matter of how long the game has been running?

===========

More a visual quirk than a glitch IMO, but the dragon trap in Medieval IX sure is quirky.  Simon noted for example that runners can get past the dragon unharmed, although that at least looks perfectly natural (the dragon reacts slower than the runner can run past where the fire strikes).

Here's another example (see screenshot).  Lemmings landing a little to the left of where the dragon's fire strikes can apparently still trigger the dragon to fire, with no one killed in the process--including a lemming that's practically right at the dragon's mouth.  ;)  Basically it looks like the trap has a larger "activation region", with a smaller "kill zone" inside, and there's of course the small delay between activating the dragon and the deadly fire striking the kill zone.

Offline -H0ru5-

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #48 on: March 10, 2010, 11:33:55 pm »
More a visual quirk than a glitch IMO, but the dragon trap in Medieval IX sure is quirky.  Simon noted for example that runners can get past the dragon unharmed, although that at least looks perfectly natural (the dragon reacts slower than the runner can run past where the fire strikes).

As far as I remember, runners could avoid the Walker too, and jumping also saved the lemming despite the trap became triggered. There's no L2 in nearby to check myself, however.

Offline Simon

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #49 on: March 11, 2010, 12:03:04 am »
Attractor glitch: I had the game running for over 4 hours at that time and was restarting a lot. It hung right after the attractor assignment. It might be a Dosbox glitch, but it looks like it's an L2 memory leak. I could still move the mouse while the opened cursor didn't close, and nothing else but the mouse moved.

ccexplore's screenshot is another good proof of how the dragon-type traps work in detail. The behavior is logical and not a bug at all, yep. It's just rather different from both a nonconstantly animated and a constantly animated trap in L1.

I did a quick runner test against the robot in the space practice level. A single lemming can't do it, as the trap kills on the 1st or 2nd frame. I made 20 runners and clustered them in the pit in front of the trap with glue pourers. After freeing them, none got past. But there might still be a different way to time them. The trap has a some harmless frames at the end of the cycle. It's kill area is rather large, though.

Another screenshot is attached - the rope sticks to the corner of the water tile, as if some part of terrain was there. I think this is unique to this particular position, I haven't got it to work in different water basins yet.

-- Simon

Offline ccexplore

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NEWFLASH: direct drop FAILS on DOS Lemmings 2
« Reply #50 on: March 13, 2010, 11:56:37 am »
I know direct drop works on the SNES version of Lemmings 2 because that was how I solved Sports 8 with 9 skills (although your accuracy needed to be precise to the very pixel). It could work here, too.

I haven't tested that level, but at least on a different level (Space 4), it looks like direct drop doesn't work in DOS Lemmings 2. :( The Space exit is 32 pixels wide, and I believe the trigger area is the 2 pixels at the bottom center (x=15 and x=16, taking x=0 to be leftmost column of pixels of the exit object).  Setting up the fall accordingly to happen at the desired x locations, the lemming immediately exits upon landing with a low fall, but splats and dies upon landing with a high fall.

I suppose to be absolutely thorough I should test out a few other x's for falling, just in case I'm wrong about the exit trigger area's location (though that level isn't exactly ideal for that).  But until someone manages to come up with a different finding for DOS Lemmings 2, I don't think direct drop works in that version.

Offline Simon

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #51 on: March 13, 2010, 06:56:54 pm »
DOS version again: When you start a level, if you press ESC to restart even before the tribe's music has begun to play, the music will never play during any retry. This bug makes sense, because subsequent retries never pause nor restart the music that should be playing all along.

If you visit the results screen, the music will play normally again when playing the same or a different level.

-- Simon

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #52 on: March 26, 2010, 06:59:20 am »
  • Miner crossing 1-pixel gaps - not yet tested.  1-pixel gaps may be hard to come by in Lemmings 2 anyway, now that terrain has to be aligned to tile boundaries rather than on arbitrary pixels.  Creating the setup to test this will probably require doing something annoying like stacking builders.
     

I just noticed that scoopers can come out quite a way (maybe 4 pixels) from a wall after they finish digging through it. So I guess there's a good chance it will work with miners too (to a lesser extent of course).

Still haven't tested with miners (although when it comes to Lemmings 2 graphics, 1-pixel gaps are kinda hard to come by in the first place).  But I just ran into an example of the "gap skipping" behavior with the scooper on Cavelem 4.  See attached screenshots.

Arguably one can say it's a quirk rather than a glitch, because when you look at the scooper's animation, it clearly looks like he hops down from one step to the next rather than walking down it, so it's not unreasonable that it only falls based on the exact pixel it hops to rather than all the in-between ones.  One can make a similar argument for miner, although I think in that case while it does a little hop down the first step, the movement onto the second step does look more like walking.

Offline geoo

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #53 on: March 26, 2010, 07:54:55 am »
Ah, I had actually wondered whether that'd be possible in Cavelem 4, but I didn't find the correct starting point.

I don't know why I didn't post them before, but I got screenshots of some miner tests (you don't need to stack builders to create such a setup as you can use...well...stackers :P). Passing 1-pixel gaps seems to work consistently (i.e. not just for the first stroke) if the position relative to the gap modulo 2 fits.
Also another miner glitch carries over from L1, though not as consistently, as the vertical distance from the starting of the miner to the gap has to be an odd number of pixels, see screenshot below.

I also encountered (in Medieval practice), but couldn't reproduce, a very weird glitch, where the game got paused, yet I could select between the normal cursor and the wind wheel, and could even charge the latter. However it was not possible to unpause, and neither was scrolling.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #54 on: April 05, 2010, 12:23:29 pm »
Discovered this glitch while, of all things, trying to get a particular screenshot for geoo's "diver test" level:

One nice thing about DOS Lemmings 2 is a rudimentary ability to frame-step.  This is basically done by pressing Spacebar and followed quickly by P.  The Spacebar turns on fan mode (and more importantly, unpause), while P of course pauses.  If the two keys are pressed quickly enough (like if you roll your fingers across those 2 keys), you can advance the game by exactly one frame.  Sometimes you might get 2 frames if you're not quite quick enough, but that's still not bad.  [I used this ability extensively for my min-skill Highland 4 solution btw.]

I just discovered that if you advance by one frame this way, it seems to prevent the explosion countdown from happening for that frame.  So doing this enough times you can delay, for seemingly as long as you can manage it, a lemming assigned exploder from exploding.  It's possible that the mere act of pausing or unpausing also causes this, but in any event, the effect is most dramatically seen when you do this frame-step move repeatedly.

For the most part this is more a nuisance than useful, since it throws off the timing you intended for the exploder (and typically if you needed the lemming to explode later, you would've assigned him exploder later).  One rare situation where this might be helpful is if you can't assign the lemming exploder at the intended time because of other lemmings in the same area getting priority for selection, or if you needed to assign some other skill to that lemming at the very same frame you wanted to assign him exploder.  This glitch theoretically allows you to assign exploder to that lemming at a slightly earlier time and still have it explode at the desired position.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #55 on: April 11, 2010, 10:24:45 am »
It appears frame-stepping (or maybe just frequently pausing) can throw off the timing of more than just exploders.  I just discovered a similar effect with the dragon trap in Medieval 9, where if you frame-step you can get a walker to survive going through the dragon!  Basically it looks like when you frame-step, the portion of the dragon's animation of its head rising up, that part ends up going slower than if you let the sequence run unpaused, apparently enough to let the lemming be out of the danger zone by the time the dragon actually fires.  I've attached a DOSBox video showing this.  The frame-stepping does not have to be perfect (ie. it's okay if you step through 2 frames instead of 1 every now and then) for the result.

But it gets weirder, as the video shows.  I'm still unable to figure out the exact conditions triggering it, but it seems with some particular combination of timing for pausing and unpausing while approaching and getting through the dragon zone, you may be able to get the dragon into a totally glitched state. :o The telltale sign of this state is that the dragon's head disappears completely, not even the tiny bit of green you normally see poking out during its hiding state.  The dragon will be completely confused, mostly not popping up at all while multiple lemmings walk straight past, except every now and then, only to fire consistently at wrong moments that causes no one harm.  Again, I have no clue at this point how exactly you can trigger this condition, but I've done it about 4 times now, including 2 times where I'm not even really frame-stepping, just pausing and unpausing maybe 3-4 times with only a single lemming getting through.

Even without the totally glitched state, the frame-stepping trick itself is more than sufficient to get the entire crowd in Medieval 9 to bypass the dragon, providing the lemmings are spaced the same as they come out of the entrance and your fingers don't fall off by then. ;P

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #56 on: April 19, 2010, 01:02:56 am »
Some weird stuff with Superlem and trampolines. I have attached a zip with videos showing the following quirks:


1. If you assign the Superlem skill to a lemming below a trampoline and hold the cursor just below the trampoline, then when the lemming hits the cursor, instead of striking its pose it bounces on the trampoline.

2. If you do the same thing with the cursor a little lower, the lemming starts doing the Superlem pose, but when it reaches the level of the trampoline it suddenly stops and tumbles down.

3. Here it gets really strange. If there is a lemming in mid-jump from the trampoline, doing the above will cause the superlem to teleport to the position of the jumping lemming and tumble down from there.


A couple of other things to note:

- The superlem has to be facing to the left for these glitches to work. If the cursor is directly above the superlem, it faces right (even if it was walking to the left), so it has to actually be flying to the left to trigger the glitch.
- There must be some terrain to the left of the trampoline. I tried mirroring the setup in the videos and didn't observe any glitch behaviour.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #57 on: July 28, 2010, 12:48:36 pm »
I've just found another Lemmings 2 trap that succumbs to the Medieval dragon framestepping effect.  Though in a much more dramatic, shocking fashion......

The trap? :drumroll: The bouncing tennis ball of death in the Sports tribe.

But whereas the Medieval dragon merely slows down by half during framestepping, the effect on the ball is much more stunning--literally:  the ball freezes completely while you are framestepping! :o

This is awesome because if you are observant, you'll find that the ball doesn't actually kill on every frame.  It basically only kills on one or a few frames in its animation cycle, namely at a point where it's going down and at the height where it starts touching the hair of a lemming standing below at ground level.  So you can simply pause the game when the ball is at a nonlethal frame, and then frame-step repeatedly to hold the ball in place while allowing lemmings to walk past the ball harmlessly!

Unfortunately, even the most reliable technique discovered to date for framestepping is still not foolproof.  Because even with DOSBox's keymapper help, the game may still unpause during framestepping once in a blue moon.  This is of course catastrophic for this glitch, since the ball bounces so fast, unless you have lightning reflexes such an accident will probably make the ball kill a lemming.  So until I found a way to do framestepping absolutely flawlessly, I'm finding that I still need to apply some additional techniques (typically minimizing the time lemmings spent in the ball's death zone) in order to feasibly carry out Sports 1 and Sports 5 solutions that take advantage of this glitch.  Some other solutions theoretically possible with the glitch alas still remains very difficult to successfully execute, until I have a method for framestepping that never fails.

Also, even when the framestepping works, I'm finding that when you do this long enough, once every so often the ball will still advance by one frame anyway.  The timing when that happens seems to be pretty random and unpredictable.  In fact, I've found that if you framestep enough times, multiple balls can actually become out-of-sync with each other! :o Which again poses complications in certain levels where you may want to frame-step through multiple balls at the same time, like Sports 1. :XD:

For video demonstrations of this glitch, check out my DOSBox video for new challenge solutions to Sports 1 and Sports 5 (to be uploaded).

Offline Clam

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #58 on: December 08, 2010, 02:12:33 am »
I just took a bite out of the trapdoor in Classic 5 with a miner :o. The side of the trapdoor that gets mined appears to close up slightly as well. It seems to be caused by fast-forwarding while the trapdoor opens. Pic attached.
EDIT: further testing. You can build up to the entrance and do even more damage to it...

Also attached are screenshots of a bug I found ages ago but never took screenshots of (:-[). With multiple knockback explosions (here I used the nuke, but well-timed exploders should work) you can force lemmings up through steel.

Offline Lemmy556

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #59 on: December 08, 2010, 07:41:44 am »
There is also a few glitches on console versions.

SNES:
1. Two rope gliches.

2. Its possible go past little walls by using enough jumpers

3. One of the pits at classic 7 isnĀ“t working(when lemmings gets there it just keeps walking

4. Ballooners gets stucked to walls

Genesis:
1.Skiers were added, but the skill wont work.

2.When you play practise level first time(before playing any tribes), take your skills including attractor.
Take one of the levels and use attractor, if you notice attractor will be the Beach one. Now, end    practising and play classic tribe. After bit of playing go back to practise mode. Pick attractor andother   skills. AS you know, classic lemmings doesnt have attractor animation and see what you got when you use it.

3.You can climb out of screen without killing lemmings. This makes Classic 5 and Highland 10 easy to save all.

4.Give stacker skill to lemming. Then give a skiil that says with lemming a rest of level(like rock climber). If lemming was walking to right, this makes it possible to turn around.

5. Attractor glitch, just bash some ground where attractor is playing, attractor will stop, but other lemmings will keep dancing.

Gameboy:

1. Take scooper, scoop a bit and take ballooner: Animation glitch

2. Give floater skills to lemmings. Use bazooka(or any other blowing skills) Floater chances to parachute skill

3.Let one lemming go to cannon. If there is any lemmings near of the cannon when it blows up, cannon will blow all the lemmings near of it too.

4. Sometimes there is problems with exits(showing animation wrong)

Thats enough for now

Offline Lemmy556

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #60 on: January 07, 2011, 04:20:43 pm »
Found new one from Amiga version.

1.Take Skier skill and Medieval practice level
2.Catapult kills skiing Lemmings

Offline geoo

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #61 on: April 18, 2011, 10:12:22 pm »
Don't think this one has been mentioned yet:

When you make a lemming an exploder, and shortly before blowing up give him a archer/roper so he starts aiming, but explodes before shooting the arrow/rope, you won't be able to assign archers/ropers to any other lemming until you restart.

Offline DragonsLover

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #62 on: May 18, 2011, 03:03:11 am »
Here's a nice one from SNES version
I like dragons! They're the center of my life! I'll never forget them...

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #63 on: August 19, 2012, 03:47:20 pm »
Back to DOS Lemmings 2, here's a surprise I found while playing around with the surfer on Highland 6.  Basically if you assign the surfer immediately when the lemming starts to drown, and then immediately try to blow him back against the wall he fell into the water from, you can get him to do this crazy super-leap off the water. :o  Indeed, it almost looks more like the lemming got catapulted or something.

Video attached.  The ZIP file has the AVI movie captured from DOSBox, but I have had trouble playing such clips in Windows 7's Windows Media Player (other media player seems to work fine, and I never had this problem on older versions of Windows either).  So for convenience I have also attached a WMV file that's a low-quality conversion (to make the file size as small as I can), that does work on Windows Media Player.

Offline Simon

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #64 on: August 19, 2012, 04:12:54 pm »
Hmm, the water's side walls are higher than the usual egdes on which water actions usually exit. The surfer shouldn't do anything here. Will test with different edge heights.

-- Simon

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #65 on: August 20, 2012, 02:18:52 pm »
I did some more testing and made a few more movies.  Here are the key points:

  • height of wall doesn't seem to matter.  For example, attached clips are from Medieval 4 where the water level is even with the side wall's height.
  • It is very important to assign the surfer at the exact frame the lemming hits water and starts to drown.  If you're late on that by one or two frames, you'll likely end up with normal behavior instead.
  • I usually pause immediately after assigning the surfer, so I can get the fan going as soon as possible.  Not sure if that's important or not.
  • The position of the cursor (ie. where you place the fan basically) apparently matters.  It appears that the fan is providing a force vector against the lemming, in what looks like the exact direction as going from fan to lemming.  The resulting "crazy jump" behavior appears to be the lemming reacting to this sudden force, and being against the wall/floor the lemming is immediately bounced off and moves in the reflected direction.  So for example, placing the cursor/fan below and to the right of the lemming, at about 45 degrees like I did in my previous post's clips, and lemming flies up and to the right at roughly 45 degrees.  Whereas in one of the clips here ("...-different-angle..."), notice how placing the cursor/fan almost horizontal to the lemming's position, and the lemming flies near-horizontally to the right instead.

Offline Simon

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #66 on: November 11, 2012, 05:23:05 am »
The glitch glider: Assign a hang glider and blow him into a vertical wall. When hitting the terrain, the lemming will resume to be a walker for one frame, facing the wall. You can assign skills to him that do not require ground underneath during performance, e.g. roper or flamethrower. A twister will immediately fall.

If you don't assign anything to him, he will walk into the wall, turn, and be a faller. I don't think there is a walker frame with the lemming facing away from the wall, so builder/platformer can't be assigned usefully.

-- Simon

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #67 on: April 12, 2013, 10:36:49 am »
Having a runner jump with a low ceiling overhead can apparently make its trajectory go crazy. :o At least that's what happened on Space 10.  See attached zipped DOSBox video and see if you can figure out what the heck happened.  Kinda reminds me of the surfer glitch mentioned above, but with an even more mundane setup.

Also, very bumpy terrain can apparently make the magno booter go crazy, eventually even making the lemming stop magno booting on its own.  Polar 8's left-entrance area is perfect to test that.  See attached zipped DOSBox videos.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #68 on: May 11, 2013, 07:18:11 am »
Seems like every time I do a challenge in Lemmings 2 I run into a new glitch, though to be fair this one is pretty mundane in comparison to other ones reported on this thread.

Roller exiting on Beach 9, notice how he started entering the exit way left of where the exit trigger normally is.  The zipped DOSBox video includes a normal walker lemming exiting to clearly show the difference.

Offline Leo

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #69 on: May 17, 2016, 02:37:17 pm »
Walking in the water lemming.
Assign Swimmer skill, then Magno boots and let him enter the water (Medieval practice level is easiest to try this). He will keep 'Magno boots walking' in the water and not drowning. Then make him Twister and knock him down with the fan. Lemming will walking in the bottom of the pool, beneath the water surface.
This glitch doesn't work with SNES version.



This one is not a glitch, but a feature. Normally, Twister leans to the left, but on the Mega Drive/Genesis Twister made from left walking lemming leans to the left and Twister made from the right walking lemming leans to the right. Picture is here (left and right Twisters), but Twisters looks little strange on the still picture



On the SNES can not be two or more Twisters at the same time, only one.

Also, Mega Drive/Genesis sprite for the "tallest" walking lemming has trimmed hair. This is just in the Lemmings 2. Original Lemmings game for the Mega Drive has 'normal' sprite with the hair.

« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 01:05:15 pm by Leo »

Offline grams88

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #70 on: May 17, 2016, 10:57:35 pm »
That is strange the walking in the water glitch. ???

Maybe the lemming with the trimmed hair has his hair hidden under the hair so to say.

Offline Minim

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #71 on: May 18, 2016, 06:05:07 am »
The triggered area for water is usually about 4 pixels higher than the water itself, as I've found out in the original Lemmings games. So we'd expect lemmings to walk when there's no trigger area directly below them.

It's no surprise that DOS had not bothered to fix the walk on water glitch by extending the area downwards. However, it's unusual that assigning a Twister on water doesn't turn him back to a swimmer, and that Twisters are effectively immune to trigger areas.
The user formerly known as minimac

Offline Leo

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #72 on: May 18, 2016, 12:51:17 pm »
Not just Twister, they can do lots of things under the water. Roller, Archer, Attractor, Flame Thrower, Runner, Skier... etc.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #73 on: May 18, 2016, 11:21:06 pm »
Walking on bottom of water is actually a classic consequence of how Lemmings (including Lemmings 1) handle collision detection in general.  Namely, it is really checking for the lemming standing on top of some trigger area, rather than checking any part of the lemming overlapping with the object.  So for water it usually means the very bottom of it is walkable, unless the game designer made the trigger area extends lower than the visible bottom of the water object.

The hard part of course is getting the lemming to the bottom of water without going through the lethal non-bottom parts.  In Lemmings 1 you can for example try to get stuck at terrain below the water, then use known techniques to move the lemming up until it reaches the water bottom.  Similarly in Lemmings 2 you can potentially try crawling from below.  So the more interesting part to me is that the magno booter is apparently unaffected by water, so the lemming can actually go through the normally lethal parts of water to reach the non-lethal bottom.

Incidentally, the "4 pixel higher" thing Minim pointed out is I think DOS-Lemmings1-specific.  However I believe even on Amiga where the visible bottom of water aligns with the trigger area's bottom, as explained above you'll still get a harmless bottom.  Though I have yet to test that on Amiga yet.

Offline Leo

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #74 on: May 19, 2016, 09:18:26 am »
Magno Booter is unaffected by water only if he is already a Swimmer.

And one more thing not exactly a glitch, but it's interesting. On the practice levels, PC, Mega Drive and SNES, have only 20 use of each chosen skill available, but on the Amiga, Atari ST, Archimedes and FM Towns 99 are available. GB, GG and SMS don't have practice levels.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2016, 09:27:24 am by Leo »

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #75 on: May 19, 2016, 10:30:38 am »
Oh okay, I misread.  You said something about the lemming doesn't get drowned, so I missed the part at the beginning where you said the lemming was assigned swimmer, since I was thinking swimmers can't drown anyway.

So I guess the surprise is that non-swimmer magno booter do apparently drown, but swimmer mango booter doesn't transition to swimming upon reaching water.  So when you said it doesn't work in SNES, does it mean the lemming will transition to swimmer instead?

The limits on L2 practice level skill usage on certain ports are actually worse than described.  On the PC version when selecting skills to try for a practice level, as I recall, skills you've already selected (especially if you select 20 of them each) may prevent you from adding other skills (you get some sort of "not enough memory" error or similar), with no easily discernible pattern as to what exactly trigger such cases.

Offline Leo

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #76 on: May 19, 2016, 02:02:08 pm »
Yes, only SNES version works as it should, Swimmer Mango Booter just start to swim in the water and after he came out of the water is just walker (and Swimmer as it is permanent skill) again.
On the practice skill selection screen you can't select 20 of them. It's only possible to select each skill just once. But when the practice level starts there are 20 (or 99, depending of the version) of each selected skill to use.
There is a problem with selecting skills for practice on the PC (and just on the PC) "Insufficient Memory" message can occur on some skills depending on which skills are already selected. Like, some skills require more memory then others. But, the PC version is the only one where it's not necessary to select all 8 skills for the practice.

Time given for the practice levels is also not the same in all versions.
PC and FM Towns 9:00 (except Egypt 9:01, strange isn't it?)
Amiga, Atari, Archimedes 9:00 (except Egypt 9:01) but timer doesn't counting, so it's actually endless.
SNES 5:00
Mega Drive 3:00

And some more interesting facts:
SNES, Mega Drive, GB, GG and SMS do not have color inversion for the permanent skills.
Atari ST is only version without Intro animation and End animation.
SNES is only version with the background graphics on the levels (except for the Classic tribe) and only one with snowfall on the Polar tribe (simple but nice effect).
FM Towns is only one with a 'real' flame on the Jet Pack skill. Just dots on the other versions or even nothing on SNES, GB, GG and SMS.
I have already mention left and right Twisters on the Mega Drive.
And certainly plenty more details, I don't want to bother everybody with that things any more.

Offline kieranmillar

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #77 on: May 13, 2017, 09:38:35 pm »
Rollers appear to have a massive trigger area for exit objects, only on the bottom row of pixels, but it's really wide. This means that a lot of the time they will display the exit animation in the wrong place, but it does allow you to e.g. just barely build over the exit, assign a lemming that passes over it to be a roller, and he will suddenly exit while a walker keeps walking.

At first I thought it was the entire bottom row of pixels for the exit area, but it appears instead to cover 1 or 2 grid spaces, exactly aligned to the grid. For the medieval tribe, it appears to be 2 grid spaces while it's 1 for most other tribes, I think this might be because the medieval exit trigger is pretty much bang on the border of 2 grid spaces (or may even be 2 pixels wide and is present in both), so it seems that rollers expand the exit trigger area to the width of the grid space(s) that it is on.

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #78 on: May 14, 2017, 04:24:38 am »
Cool find! :thumbsup: I have long noticed the part about exit animation being in the wrong place for rollers, but did not realize there is an actual, exploitable physics glitch behind it that allows the sort of things you described.

Offline DoubleU

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #79 on: November 22, 2017, 08:10:19 pm »
The link for the glitch thread is broken. Where can I find that thread?

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Lemmings 2 glitches
« Reply #80 on: November 22, 2017, 09:53:14 pm »
Probably this one.  Unfortunately links that were made for the old forum (lemmingsforums.com) seem to not have migrated correctly when we moved the forum to lemmingsforums.net (or maybe they were correct at one time but then something later changed on the current forum breaking the links).