Author Topic: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge  (Read 40746 times)

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Offline ccexplore

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #45 on: May 14, 2011, 02:57:47 PM »
The table has 9 skills for Fun 20 100%, but after looking at the level I'm rather skeptical.  The non-100% min-skill solution is 8 skills via the ceiling route, with 7 skills already spent at creating the path.  I'm hard pressed to see how to control 100% of the crowd with that method using only 2 skills.  (And the normal route of course needs 9 just to create the path, and you aren't even fast enough to build over the first gap!)  Even 10 for Fun-20 100% I'm unsure (but will keep thinking and see if there's a way), so far I can only confirm 11-skills (doesn't even use the ceiling route btw, but does use a glitch).  I also see no mention of anyone actually reporting on Fun 20 in any posts on this thread.

Or did I overlook something really simple?

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #46 on: May 15, 2011, 12:27:10 AM »
Looks to me like you need 11 skills for 100%. Maybe we ought to adopt a policy of "replay or it didn't happen" :P

Another level I'm not sure about is Crazy 1. Someone posted a result of 5 skills (without a replay :-\), but the poster might not have been aware that 100% is possible on that level. There are a few old replays floating around for 100% on Crazy 1, but each uses 8 or more skills.

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #47 on: November 08, 2011, 07:42:02 AM »
While we're doing max % challenges, we should continue this one too. For starters, there's the 'max % = required %' levels I listed here, some of which aren't in the results. Specifically:
Crazy 10: 10 skills
Wicked 16: 3
Blitz 16: 4
Frost 6: 6

A couple more things we need to sort out:
- The 'disputed' results mentioned in two posts immediately above this one
- Update Wicked 9 to 100% (it wasn't attempted yet anyway, but the max % list in the OP should be updated before anyone tries for the wrong %)
(edit) - Taxing 1 with 9 skills (3rd post above this one)

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #48 on: November 09, 2011, 08:06:37 PM »
Hah, no wonder this challenge was abandoned - the next level is a real stinker :evil:

Here's Taxing 4 100% with 14 skills. 15 is easily done by holding everyone in a digger pit at the right and using an builder to release them at the end, but with much jiggery-pokery (which would take an entire text file to explain :P) you can achieve just enough compression to avoid using this extra builder, and dodge the wall traps with the crowd walking back and forth.

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #49 on: November 13, 2011, 01:26:37 AM »
The next two are easy, both can be taken from regular solution to 100% without any extra skills, or even any more effort.

Taxing 5: 12
Taxing 12: 10

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #50 on: November 13, 2011, 11:16:30 PM »
('before' refers to the original least-skills challenge)

More Taxing:

13: 10, two extra skills are needed to free the blocker, and no-blocker approaches aren't efficient enough.
14: 22, as before (thanks to LemSteven for this one)
15: 11, same as before. I don't know if I ever posted a replay for this one, so here it is. Release rate jiggery-pokery has never been so boring! :P
20: 9, two more than before. You need one extra skill (climber) to avoid losing a lemming at the start, and another one towards the end so no lemmings turn back (previously you could get through two walls with a single well-placed basher).

Offline ccexplore

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #51 on: November 22, 2011, 03:50:48 AM »
Fun 29 100% at 13 skills, and Mayhem 9 (the repeat) 100% at 14 skills.  They are basically the same solution, just that for Mayhem 9, the lack of miners necessitates an extra builder (more precisely, just a single build brick) to allow the blocker be freed using a basher instead.

Found a better method so that Mayhem 9 100% also achievable with 13 skills.  See the "6 builder" solution attached at this post.

The earlier Fun 29 100% also improved to 12 skills via miners.

Offline Proxima

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #52 on: June 19, 2012, 06:20:20 PM »
Some levels have very limited choice in methods for saving the maximum possible, so the results can be read off the now-complete "skills you need for maximum %" challenge. I think the following fall into this category, but one of the experts should look over my list before I add them:

Taxing 18 -- 12 ("skills you need" says 10 builders, but min-skills also uses the floater and basher)
Taxing 28 -- 16 (1 climber, 1 floater, 1 bomber, 1 blocker, 8 builders, 3 bashers, 1 miner)
Mayhem 10 -- 31 (1 climber, 3 floaters, 1 blocker, 20 builders, 4 bashers, 2 diggers)
Wild 5 -- 9 (2 bombers, 3 blockers, 4 builders)
Wild 13 -- 9 (2 climbers, 2 bombers, 2 builders, 2 bashers, 1 miner)
Wild 18 -- 12 (2 bombers, 10 builders)
Wicked 1 -- 4 (1 bomber, 1 basher, 1 miner, 1 digger)
Wicked 4 -- 24 (4 climbers, 1 bomber, 18 builders, 1 basher)
Wicked 7 -- 6 (4 bombers, 2 blockers)
Wicked 9 -- 21 (1 floater, 20 builders)
Wicked 10 -- 13 (1 floater, 1 blocker, 10 builders, 1 digger)
Wicked 12 -- 11 (1 bomber, 2 blockers, 7 builders, 1 miner)
Wicked 17 -- 6 (6 builders)
Wicked 19 -- 8 (6 builders, 2 bashers)
Wicked 20 -- 8 (1 blocker, 6 builders, 1 digger)
Havoc 2 -- 15 (1 climber, 1 floater, 11 builders, 2 diggers)
Havoc 7 -- 26 (10 climbers, 10 builders, 2 bashers, 2 miners, 2 diggers)
Havoc 10 -- 11 (2 climbers, 2 floaters, 2 bombers, 1 builder, 2 miners, 2 diggers)
Havoc 13 -- 11 (9 builders, 1 basher, 1 miner)
Havoc 15 -- 19 (17 builders, 1 basher, 1 digger)
Havoc 16 -- 11 (1 climber, 8 builders, 2 miners)
Havoc 17 -- 11 (1 blocker, 7 builders, 1 basher, 1 miner, 1 digger)

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #53 on: June 24, 2012, 03:17:21 AM »
Added Clam's Mayhem 26 result from the other topic.

I made a couple of improvements to this solution (saved 2 blockers), reducing it to 17 skills.

Offline LemSteven

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #54 on: June 24, 2012, 06:59:41 AM »
Wicked 4 -- 24 (4 climbers, 1 bomber, 18 builders, 1 basher)

I verified 21 skills while working on Wicked 4 for the other topic.  Note that the final result I posted there is based on two different solutions, which is why the result here is 21 skills instead of 19.

Offline Proxima

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #55 on: June 24, 2012, 12:50:06 PM »
Quote from: Clam Spammer
I made a couple of improvements to this solution (saved 2 blockers), reducing it to 17 skills.

Aha, so that's what ccexplore meant with his cryptic comment on the old forums about "one key place where you can build just once to seal up". Yeah, I never found that, I just took the less efficient but more fun route :P

I've filled in a few more for myself -- Taxing 16, Taxing 27, Mayhem 2 by looking at ccexplore's skill reduction replays to see which used the fewest skills in total, and Taxing 26 since I was able to match Clam's minimum skills for any % result.

Mod Edit: Corrected name of replay referring to Taxing 26.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2020, 04:23:57 PM by Proxima »

Offline Proxima

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #56 on: June 24, 2012, 04:56:03 PM »
A few more easy results:

Wild 10 needs three more skills to make a dig pit and release the crowd; with so few skills available, I see no other option.
Wild 11 needs one more skill. Make the climber float to the exit, and use a lemming from the crowd to do the mining.
Wild 20 needs one more to stop the second lemming falling through the gap.
Wicked 14 needs two more to free the blocker; a 6-skill no blocker solution also exists.
Blizzard 15 needs four more, to make two more lemmings climbers and floaters.
Frost 3 needs one more: dig and build on the left instead of blocking.
Frost 16 needs one more to stop the athlete walking out on the left.
Hail 3 needs two more. Place a blocker at the start of the first basher's tunnel. After bridging between the "X" and "M", have the worker lemming mine to release the blocker and crowd; then when they turn back at the "M", there's enough time for the worker lemming to complete the route before the crowd catch him up again.

With my Hail 5 result from the other topic, that's Hail complete!  :thumbsup:

Offline Proxima

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #57 on: June 25, 2012, 09:17:46 PM »
Blizzard 7 with 7 skills. With sliding unavailable since it leaves one behind, this looks like an unimprovable result.

Also, Flurry 14 with 4, and Clam's Flurry 16 replay improved to leave out the floater, for a total of 7 skills.

To finish off Flurry, 9 seems to need two more skills (dig/build on the left; the Crazy 8 trick doesn't work here), and 10 also needs two more, replacing the blocker with a dig pit and build to release. (Using just a dig/build fails, since you can't delay the crowd long enough to build over both gaps.)

Offline LemSteven

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #58 on: June 26, 2012, 12:23:13 AM »
Tricky 28 is now down to 4 skills.  Just to the right of the entrance there is a spot where a lemming can build such that (1) the bridge combined with the existing twig act as a wall to the left-facing lemmings, and (2) the builder does not turn around.

Offline Clam

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Re: Minimum skills with maximum % Challenge
« Reply #59 on: June 26, 2012, 10:30:06 AM »
On Flurry 9, there's a spot where you can dig far enough to make a wall that turns the lemmings, then turn it into a basher which stops by itself (see the 'basher-planning' bit in this post). This gets you 100% with 4 skills.

Also saved a skill on Flurry 10 (now 10 skills), by bridge-stretching to reach the middle island with two builders, and then using the third (you need 3 to get onto the platform in any case) to isolate another lemming, which then has time to build to the end.

Funny that you should mention the Crazy 8 trick (I presume you mean mining into the terrain hole), and then Tricky 28 - where you can perform this trick thanks to a missing terrain pixel just below the entrance ;). The builder works fine too though, good find :)