First half of Genocide done, plus a level. Only 3 new replays this time, plus Genocide 18 and 19 resolved.

Regarding resolved levels:


Now the new ones.


With this, I don't think there's anymore backroutes in the first half of Genocide, but let's see what you say. If the first half took this long, I can't imagine the second half being any better for me. I know there's still some really difficult ones ahead in the remainder of the Genocide rank. 19 main levels left and then the Bonus rank. Getting really close to the end now!

I can definitely tell that you get a kick out of seeing my solution replays. Another thing they do is they show you other ways of solving the same level. Having multiple solutions is not necessarily a bad thing, but rather they can potentially show you what can be done on a level. It's important to keep an open mind. After all, the more ways you know to do the same thing, the better. I see this in my students all the time. I show multiple methods of solving the same math problem, and then the students can simply take their pick on what they think is easiest for them to do the problem. It's the same thing with solving levels in lemmings. Unless one intended solution has been specifically enforced, it's very unlikely people will solve the same level in the exact same way.

yes i see that. at least that's 2 lined up builders so miner can miner through middle pole. that part reminds me of the 2nd to last level of neolemmix's franlems sadistic level 9 (Queztalings) that i did from dodochacalo. that one I think is the hardest one in the pack to line up the builders steps so miner can mine through 2 stairs going through middle pole. and that is for neolemmix too. It took me 3 days to get the solution to work exactly

I have definitely forgotten about this level. It's been a really long time since I've played Franlems. Now that I have taken a look at the level again, yes it's one of those that's very difficult to set up correctly. It's not a hard level, because the solution is easy. It's the execution of the solution that's very difficult. Thus, this is a really good example of a level where finding the solution is easy, but the execution is very hard. I likened this to computer problems. Often times, it's much easier to identify the problem, but finding a fix/solution is much harder.

if you google it, you can get it. just enter lemmings anthology in search bar. it will say it's by "The Company" you can download it there. it's cool. it plays all the amiga ones. orig, ohno, xmas 91,92 holiday93,94, demo version, it even plays new years lemmings (5 levels), lemmings tribes. and lemmings 3.

Got it. Thanks!

anyways just finished level 24 so far so good. but level 23 Is horrid. shouldn't even be a level. it's not even a puzzle. it's just trying to get the diggers placed extremely in exact positions on poles otherwise level fails. it took many tries to get that first part right, then rest of level is easy.

the level is Sternenhimmel(what a german title being that bad). anyways Sternenhimmel means in english sky of stars. Sterne means stars.
Zimtsterne(cinnimon stars) are german christmas cookies. I bought some on amazon.com. don't really care for them though.

anyways that level I think is ridiculous, not even a puzzle. Shouldnt even be in Superlemmini or even Lemmini. To Me that level just for that first part should be in last rank since it's extremely difficult just to get started.

Oh gosh! When I saw the title of the level, I was like I definitely will comment, because eric's going to love my story here. When I first played that level on Lemmini, I would learn that I ended up considerably overcomplicating the solution years later. So rather than bash to free the blockers, my setup is extremely difficult to pull off in that I had the digger pits and builders all set up so that I could use one miner to free all of them. The problem of course is that since there are several poles you would have to do it all correctly, because one too high or too low and the miner won't get through all of it. Now that I have seen the solution, much easier to just bash all the blockers free. Given how my solution is very difficult to do, I'm not even sure if I want to do it ever again, but if I ever do play it again and I get it working, I'll definitely send you my replay. Too bad I never saved it, though. Perhaps if it's still possible, I'll just do it on NL since it's much easier due to skill shadows. Amazing how that's the first solution I even came up with for the level.

edit: the heck? Challenge accepted! See replay. This is for Lemmini.

so in Superlemmin, Tsyu needs to fix this too as this solution doesn't work in Superlemmini

Ah yes. In the process of reporting the climber goes through one pixel ceiling bug, I totally forgot about reporting the builder wall to Tsyu as well. I'll do that in a bit. Again, I will credit you for discovering this.

edit: done!

and for rank 1 level 30 I just added an extra builder to original level and deleted my altered one. by adding the extra builder the climber won't climb past a 4 builder one.(i think this solution is more intended for the builder wall). and if by adding an extra builder creates a backroute I'm not worried about it since it's only rank 1 and usually Icho gives more freedom in the 1st rank levels anyways)

Good call! The turning around upon hitting steel is really inconsistent anyway. In Lemmini, the lemming doesn't turn around when mining/bashing into steel, but he does in Superlemmini and NL. Also, with the extra builder, one could simply build with the climber to turn him around rather than add a 4th layer to the builder wall, ie, let the climber build just before reaching the builder wall so that he hits his head and turns around. Nevertheless, this should be ok since it's close enough to the solution of adding a 4th layer to the builder wall anyway.

yes i think I have made the decision for Drunk Lemmings on the way home. I will put original one back and accept yours as the solution. but I forgot to add the OWW to it which I will do. why not. Superlemmini has the climber issue and basher issue in Field trip on sloped terrain anyways, so that is altered. so I might as well use your solution. also I think I like that solution too better. I think fewer people know about the 3 builder thing anyways and it is only in the beginning of hey not too rough (rank 2)

Edit: I now have the OWW's in it. this will still fix a different backroute. just not yours.
Edit2: I have officially put level back and put your replay in my replays folder for HeyNotTooRough as the solution and deleted the 3 builder one.
so when this pack gets uploaded for others. people will have to use your solution. it's better this way anyways since 3 builder one wont work.

Sounds good! Truth be told, it never occurred to me to even use the builder wall when I first solved the level on Lemmini years ago, and the miner/bomber was the very first solution I found. However, there is also an inconsistency here, and that is my Superlemmini solution appears to not work in Lemmini. It appears that the bomber hole in a miner tunnel is just like NL's in that lemmings will still walk out to the left. So, this would mean that Superlemmini's physics is very inconsistent compared to the other two engines. Therefore, the only way the solution will work in Lemmini is by mining to the left and then bombing, but when the OWW is added then my solution won't work. Also, in Lemmini's case, my solution is much harder to pull off due to timing the bomber at the right time and the positioning of the miner. At the same time, IIRC Superlemmini physics is based off of Amiga's, and I'm not sure if these inconsistencies also show up in Amiga. However, it's important to note that it's based off of Amiga, which doesn't mean that it's supposed to emulate Amiga in every single aspect and so it's ok for it to be slightly different.

also I really appreciate your help in the solving of levels as I want this Superlemmini pack to be a joy for everyone, especially when they can choose to play it with untimed bombers and music from neolemmix's version(superlemmini allows more options.). It's just too bad Superlemmini still has these issues with the  climber and the basher not bashing on mildly sloped terrain. hopefully the next release  by Tsyu will be better in this regard.


also I've changed level 21 hurtmeplenty (field trip) to extend vertical terrain so 2nd climber will turn around. I think this one is the best choice. so I removed 1 miner now to match level as it originally was.

My pleasure. I enjoy Superlemmini just as much as you do, and it's still my preferred engine of choice out of the others, so I really appreciate all the packs you have converted to Superlemmini. Granted, I haven't played through any of the converted packs yet, but I certainly will once I'm done with some NL packs. Really, the solutions I sent you were merely meant to demonstrate that it won't be necessary to make other adjustments and thus saving you some unnecessary work, as well as provide you with a different solution to the level that I myself found. That's why it's so much fun to compare solutions with others imo. In any case, I'm glad that they have been helpful in helping you make informed decisions on some of the levels. Ultimately, it's your call at the end of the day as to what you do with the levels, since it is, after all, your project, and I have to respect your decisions. In a way, you can say I'm like a "pre-tester."

I certainly didn't mean to drag out the conversation like this and slow your progress, so forgive me there. I just occasionally see comments on some of the levels you're working on and then I think, hey, I think eric would be interested in seeing an alternative solution that I found when I played the pack on Lemmini back sometime ago. Hopefully, there won't be any further levels that will differ significantly from Icho's intended NL solution. Not to mention a lot of my solutions wouldn't work anyway with the updated pack in NL.

I redownloaded your new attached ones and reloaded original levels but for some reason only the drunk  lemmings on the way home works. you didn't even use the 3 builders. you used a miner and a bomber and basher at beginning.
you had 1 builder left over at end of level

in neolemmix's version icho put right faceing arrows up to 1st building so I wanted to see if your replay still worked using that one in Superlemmini. yes it still works.

the disturbance in the matrix starts off doing a few things but then nukes.

Also I used the original 2 levels since I think by using the altered ones that is why they say level doesn't exist in replay

For the Disturbance in the Matrix, there's nuking because I nuked the level. For some reason, the steel doesn't work on that level, but if you want you could simply use my replay and finish off the level as usual. The purpose of my replay is to show you that there's no need to modify the level even though a climber is able to get through the builder wall, because if you position the builder and the miner correctly, the miner will go through the builder bricks and hit the steel, turning him around. Just make sure to release the blocker with a basher before the climber hits the blocker and turns around again.

For the Drunk Lemmings On Their Way Home, again the purpose of the replay is to show you a different way of solving the level. That's the solution I first used on Lemmini, and interesting that it still works even with the OWW on Superlemmini. Unfortunately, there's not really anything that can be done to block off my solution, and so it'll just have to be accepted as an alternative.

Ultimately, it's your call at the end of the day. Glad to hear that you finally got Field Trip to work.

I can confirm a climber still goes over the builder wall, but an adjustment shouldn't be necessary for the rank 1 finisher. See attached replay. Not sure why the steel isn't working, but if you position the builder and the miner correctly so that the miner goes through the builder bricks, you can get the miner to mine into the steel and turn around, and thus no need for any other adjustments.

edit: Also, the other level you made adjustments on is Drunk Lemmings On Their Way Home. However, no adjustment is needed there either if you use my solution. See attached replay. This is the solution I used in Lemmini. If the climber doesn't climb over the pit I made at the beginning, then I would have two builders leftover, but since he does, that's why I used a spare builder to turn him around and hence I have one builder leftover. 

Ok yea, you're right, I can't get the second climber to turn around either. I also tested this on an ONML level, and indeed same thing happens when there's one pixel of ceiling above. A climber should not be able to climb through it. In this case, yea I think providing an extra miner is the best way to go about it. Alternatively, an extra basher can also do. Or, you can simply keep the Lemmini version and get rid of one floater and all but two of the diggers. Or, you can simply expand the terrain vertically so that when the basher bashes there'll be more ceiling above and then the climber will turn around properly.

Nevertheless, you gave me something to report to Tsyu about. I'll post the replay and ask him if this climber behavior was intended or not. Thanks for catching this. Of course, I'll credit you since you are the one who caught this first.

edit: All rightie, I have reported the behavior to Tsyu. Let's see what he says.

Ok, sounds good

edit with a tip for Hurt Me Plenty 21: Try adjusting the timing of when you assign the floaters. For example, instead of both near when they hit the ground, try when one is almost near the ground while the other one maybe before he falls off the starting platform. Also it might not be necessary, but you can also try adjusting the position of the first basher. That should help turn the second climber around.

edit 2: My bad. I realized that I could simply edit this post, not make a new one. I removed it and copied and pasted what I wrote to here. Weird. Also, I said to adjust when you assign the floaters, not the climbers. If you can't get it to work, perhaps I can take a look and try it myself if you're willing to send me the level file.

edit 3: Confirmed that it's possible for a climber to turn around in a basher tunnel in Superlemmini. I tested this on a Sublems level. Thus, you'll need to play around some more with the floater assignments. Like try assigning at some point while they're falling. All rightie, send it my way. In return, I'll give you a successful replay if I get it to work.

edit 4: Ok, sounds good. I'll be more than happy to help out, although my contributions will mostly be limited to solving the levels. I'll leave the level editing to you since it's your project, but on the level solving end I'll be glad to help out there wherever possible if you're not able to solve it yourself.