Hello all!
A collaboration between my older brother (tan x dx) and I. This one is based off of an old isometric platformer called LodeRunner 2.
Just like in that game, you must collect all the gold to open the exit!
Make sure you have the latest version of the LemRunner styles!
Link to the level pack:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/zxmpy93kdwjp121/LemRunner.zip?dl=1
Link to the solutions:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/wgza0ntpwzodb82/LemRunnerSolutionsV5-2.zip?dl=1
There are 55 levels in total, split between 5 worlds. Both the levels and the worlds increase in difficulty; if you get stuck on one level, try starting a different world!
You'll need to download the corresponding style packs in order to play this. You can get the styles here:
https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=5535.0
Here are some screenshots:
Jungle:
(https://imgur.com/J88rdV7.png)
Gear:
(https://imgur.com/ybjHqsU.png)
Mona:
(https://imgur.com/aTBAsyc.png)
Wacky:
(https://imgur.com/x58veck.png)
Industry:
(https://imgur.com/4dhjWmi.png)
Let us know what you think! :thumbsup:
Hello dexter!
I've played first 2 ranks of the packs and attached my replays :D
I didn't know that you guys made renaissance tileset which is my favorite. I made one of my level for current level design contest with it.
And these new tileset also looks very nice :thumbsup: combined with well fitting music.
I'm personally not a huge fan of button levels but here the advantages definitely outweigh the disadvantages.
Jungle World
Welcome to Jungle World - Nice level to start a rank! Not too hard but not that simple. I love this kind of levels ; gives minimum skillset but the solution is not obvious. very well done :thumbsup:
Encore - Another nice level. It was fairly obvious what should I do, but I still enjoyed it very much.
Ziggurat - likely to be a backroute, since I have a platformer left.
What goes up - somewhat easier than previous levels.
The two towers - I didn't use a glider, but I think my solution is mostly intended ; placing blockers at the trigger area of locked exits, jumper+stoner and then cloning constructive skills etc.
Excavation - This one is my favorite level of the rank. And I think this is probably the hardest eve of the Jungle rank. I must say, placing a blocker at the end of the force field is very clever :thumbsup: Took me a while to notice that.
Shibboleth - I have some leftover skills, but I think I got the main trick. The timings of the bombers were quite precise but other than that I love this level a lot too.
Waste not want not - Probably the easiest level of the rank, especially because more than enough builders are given.
Entrapment - I suspect my solution is a backroute. I have many leftover skills, and I think this level supposed to be more difficult than this.
Lemdiana Jones - My solution is very hackish and have some leftover skills. And I even didn't collect one of the pick-up. But I can't see any other ways to cross the water and pick up the swimmer skill. ;P
Gear World
Welcome to Gear World - fairly easy level since the save requirement is very generous
Trial by fire - I love this level a lot and gave me some ideas for my own level! :thumbsup: Especially sacrificing fallers to flip the splitter part is genius :thumbsup: I have many skills leftover though.
Lefty loosey righty flighty - likely to be a backroute. I only used 8 skills out of 14.
Measure once, build twice - This also seems to be a backroute. I didn't collect a stacker pick-up and didn't use a floater.
Switching gears - much easier than the previous levels. I just only release them with bashers and the level was quite self-solving. maybe backroute?
Like clockwork - Really really really nice level :thumbsup: definitely my favorite levels of this batch. I hardly see any levels that make good use of splitters so far, but this requires players to take advantage of splitter in very creative way!
Authorised Lemmings Only! - I have some leftover skills on this one.
Smoke stacks - was a quick solve still the level is very nice.
Just another cog in the machine - Not sure on this one. I have some stackers left. I'm not a big fan of massing many stackers to cross the gap.
Two by four - probably a backroute. I only used 1 basher out of 4.
Hello dexter!
I've played first 2 ranks of the packs and attached my replays :D
I didn't know that you guys made renaissance tileset which is my favorite. I made one of my level for current level design contest with it.
And these new tileset also looks very nice :thumbsup: combined with well fitting music.
I'm personally not a huge fan of button levels but here the advantages definitely outweigh the disadvantages.
Hi, thanks so much for your responses!
My brother and I have had a look through your replays, and we must say we are impressed by your puzzle solving abilities! :thumbsup:
We really appreciate you guys playing this and finding backroutes, as this allows us to make our levels much stronger. We're looking forward to seeing your solutions for the remaining worlds, so we can update those too.
We're already planning updates to fix all the backroutes, and we will release an updated version of the pack after we've recieved more replays of the remaining worlds.
Jungle World Spoilers:
Welcome to jungle world - Thanks! The "Welcome to..." levels are both a reference to the original game, and a way of introducing the gold sprites and terrain; they aren't intended to be overly challenging. (The smiley faces are a reference too!)
Encore -You got the correct solution, however I recently realised that this level does actually have a backroute. Let's just say that I need to give the zombie a floater...
Ziggurat - You did find a backroute here; will have to rework this one!
What goes up - This one was made somewhat late into development, so I didn't really have time to check for backroutes! You did manage to backroute this one, luckily there's an easy fix.
The two towers - The intended solution is pretty much the same here; the glider is technically superfluous and was only added to be more forgiving with distances.
Excavation - Thanks so much for your kind words! I'm really proud of this one, and I took extra special care to make sure it was backroute-proof. It seems that my work paid off!
Shibboleth - the intended solution is slightly different than your solution, but the spirit of the level remains intact, so I don't consider this a backroute.
Waste not want not - WOW! You really destroyed this level; tan says he knows a rework to make this level way more challenging.
Entrapment - You definitely backrouted this one. Luckily, it has a very easy fix. I suspect you'll be stumped by the intended solution; it's very tricky.
Lemdiana Jones - well done; this level will require some terrain modification!
Trial by fire - the leftover skills are intentional; this level is supposed to be somewhat easy and forgiving since it's very early on in the world.
Lefty loosey righty flighty - your solution is the intended one; again, the leftover skills are there to be more lenient with the timing puzzle. (Originally, Gear world came before jungle world, so a lot of the earlier solutions are designed to be very forgiving. I decided to swap the places of jungle/gear world because I felt that the early jungle levels are both easier and more welcoming than the early gear levels).
Measure once, build twice - yep, this is a backroute! This one will probably require a slight rework.
Switching gears - good catch! I'll have to remove that metal!
Like clockwork - thanks again! This is another of my personal favourites ;)
Authorised lemmings only - you kinda backrouted this level, I think; will have to discuss with tan what he thinks.
Smoke stacks - Nice work on this one! I thought I ironed out all the backroutes, but you proved me wrong!
Just another cog in the machine - You backrouted this one too; the intended solution is very esoteric and bizarre, will need a rework to prevent the stacker staircase! :thumbsup:
Two by four - you definitely backrouted this one! Will need to take a look at this one more in-depth, since the intended solution is verrrrry nasty! :evil:
Mona World : was difficult than previous two ranks overall.
Welcome to Mona World - attached 2 different solutions. Both use every skill. First one uses shimmier merely to gain additional height and second one uses shimmier to actually shimmy along the ceiling. I suspect second one is what you intended..?
Catch my drift - I saved all and have 4 skills leftover but even then I love the level and the solution very much. :thumbsup: It was satisfying to watch 4 gliders gliding down and collecting every gold midair.
Sync or swim - Another nice level! Getting the talisman was quite tricky.
Draft dodgers - I have some constructive skills leftover. But I think I got the main trick. I would say containing the gliders above the updraft and under the builder bridge is very clever.
Tightrope Citadel - This one was a quick solve. I have a blocker left so I might have backrouted this level.
Ad astra per aspera - I guess I also backrouted this one.? espicially I only used half of the platformers.
Hallowed ground - I enjoyed this level very much. :thumbsup: Distracting zombies while collecting golds was very fun to play!
A caelo usque ad centrum - Hehe. Another backroute here ;P I have a lot of leftover skills.
Any way the wind blows - Easiest level of the rank for me. I think there's something unintended part in my solution.
Ascending and descending - This is my favorite level of the rank.:thumbsup: Also I think this is the hardest level so far especially if you try to get the talisman even though I have two stackers to spare. Really cool and epic level to finish the rank.
Wacky World : Warning! backroute-fest incoming .... :evil:
Welcome to Wacky World - Wow this level is deceivingly tough despite its simple layout and limited skillset. very nice puzzle but a little bit difficult for the first level. I love it!
Full circle - This level was also difficult considering that the level has only one lemming. I think my solution is mostly intended but the only suspicious part is where I use a platformer to turn the lemming around at the anti-splat pad area.
Non sequitur - Easiest level of the pack so far. I literally one shot this level.
Mr Magoo - I got no-jumper solution :evil:
Pole to pole - It was quite clear that I should make some jumping spots with stackers. Getting the talisman was tricky though.
Loony bin - Probably a backrute. I think my solution is too hackish+leftover skills.
The Gibbering Cliffs - I can see how intended solution looks like. (bombing one platform, digging another platform inside the splat pad area and guiding the crowd to anti splat pad area or something like that.) But instead, I took the detour :evil:
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manner - Seems to be another backroute. leftover skills.
When Life Gives You Lemmings - I have a lot of leftover skills on this one, especially I didn't use any shimmier.
Know when to hold'em - I got 2stoners/2blockers solution. ;) I love this level a lot! The level gives infinite skills yet the level is not easy at all! I was surprised to see how is this even possible! Really well done!
I most likely to play final rank tonight(it's about 4:30pm here) or tomorrow.
Mona World Spoilers:
Welcome to Mona World - You're not gonna believe this, but actually both of your solutions are backroutes! (The intended solution is to make the last 3 lemmings build 3 times at the beginning, and use the shimmier to collect the odd gold piece, so you are actually closer to the intended solution with your first replay). That being said, the "Welcome to..." levels are supposed to be easy introductions, and you used all skills in both solutions, so I don't really feel the need to change anything here.
Catch my Drift - This replay is very impressive! The intended solution is to use blockers to rebound the gliders (you are essentially "catching" them, hence the name "Catch my drift"). Your solution is much more elaborate than I intended, and you managed to save every lemming, so I might add your solution as a talisman, rather than fixing the backroute. :thumbsup:
Sync or Swim - This is a major backroute. I'll have to rework this level (hint: the updraft column is supposed to be integral to the solution).
Draft Dodgers - While this is technically a backroute, you still kept the spirit of the level (hiding the gliders underneath the zombie), so I don't think I'll change anything here; it is supposed to be an early (and therefore relatively easy) level, afterall.
Tightrope Citadel - This is a backroute; I'll have to confer with tan on how this level will have to be reworked.
Ad astra per aspera - Again, major backroute. Your solution to this one is really creative, though!
Hallowed ground - Thank you! This level is pretty freeform, it's supposed to be a difficult release challenge, I'm very impressed you managed to save so many lemmings!
A caelo usque ad centrum - Definitely a backroute; again, I'll have to confer with tan.
Any way the wind blows - Damn! I was sure I removed all backroutes for this level during playtesting; it's supposed to be a very misleading level; I'll have to add some sneakily-placed mines or fire pits...
Ascending and descending - Your solution to this level is actually kinda backroute-y. It's supposed to be way, way harder. Luckily, it seems like a relatively easy fix.
Wacky World Spoilers:
Welcome to Wacky World - You hit the nail on the head with your solution (This is the hardest welcome level; I originally planned for wacky world to come after industry world, but then we went and made a bunch of tricky industry levels, and also decided that the dark, grungy feel of industry was more fitting as a final challenge world).
Full circle - I'm debating whether or not to fix this one; your solution is a very creative backroute, but you still kept the intended solution. (The main gimmick is: you have to use the anti-splat pad a bunch of times, and the only way to do that is to bash through the lime slope, which you did during the replay).
Non sequitur - This level is intended to be very easy, but you still somehow managed to backroute it! I doubt tan will mind though, because your solution is really creative and seems slightly more difficult to pull off than the intended solution.
Mr Magoo - Another impressive backroute! I'm again debating on whether or not to fix your backroute or add it as a talisman.
Pole to pole - You got the correct solution for this one!
Loony Bin - Another really creative backroute! This shouldn't be too hard to fix.
The Gibbering Cliffs - Looks like we'll need to place a bunch of metal everywhere here!
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Another backroute, but this one seems easily fixed.
When Life Gives you Lemmings - Pretty major backroutes in play here; may have to restructure the entire level. I'll see what tan thinks.
Know when to hold 'em - This is another personal favourite of mine; for a while, I've been wanting to make an uber-hard level in which you have infinite of all provided skills. That being said, your solution is absolutely inspired! Using the stoner to turn around the neutral while in mid-air is absolutely genius and is a good idea for a level on its own!
These are some pretty incredible solutions, backroutes not withstanding!
We look forward to seeing your industry replays.
The jungle/gear levels have mostly been fixed and we are planning on releasing a version 2.0 for the entire pack in a few days. I think I may also release the intended solutions pack along with it.
Here're my solutions for final rank levels ;)
Welcome to Industry World - Solving the level was quite easy but getting the talisman was very tough!
Bait and switchboard - attached 2 solutions. They are basically similar and the only different part is position of the builder. Second solution seems intended to me.
Revenge of the dead - Excellent level here. :thumbsup: It took me quite a while to find out that I had to time the bomber so the zombie floaters clump together so one jumper is enough to bypass all 4 zombies. Before I realized that, I continuously tried to collecte the bottom golds before releasing the zombies and I was always one skill short as a result. Again, very impressive level. I really love it. And the animated water of this style is also very cool.
Livewire Lemmings - attached 2 different solutions. They have a fencer and a platformer leftover respectively.
Lemming on high - I have two leftover skills on this one. I have a feeling that cancelling basher to make a hole in stackers is not intended. :P
Storage facility 22-A - Based on your previous response to my replays, I can see that using the stoner to turn around another lemming while in mid-air is not the intended.(I used this trick to collect bottom left gold.) Still I used every skill so let's see what you think about this solution. ;)
Retrograde - attached 2 different solutions. First one.... is obviously a backroute. I bypassed all three traps so I didn't even have to release the zombies. Seems easy to fix though. Second one on the other hand seems much more promising than the first one. I released the zombies and guided them to single-use traps to make a safe path for the crowd. Unfortunately, the second solution have a lot of leftover skills.
The night shift - I just went with the flow and I ended up solving this level with tons of leftover builders. There's must be something unintended in my solution.
The specialist - I saved all and have some leftover skills. The level was quite tricky nonetheless. There are many places that are deadly for a climber neutral and avoiding them was the main difficulty of this level.
Dead weight - This final levels looks intimidating and was very hard as I expected. The most difficult part was to getting a walker pick-up before the neutral collects all the gold. The level itself doesn't have a time limit but it was very urgent and nice time crunch! I think there're some unintended part in my solutions though.
Overall, I have to say I've been very much enjoying this pack.:thumbsup: Considering that there are so much nice and difficult levels, I'm definitely looking forward to your backroute fixes so the levels I backrouted finally show their true colors to me.
Bait and switchboard - This is a major oversight on my part! Easily fixed, thankfully.
Revenge of the dead - Thanks a lot! You can thank tan for giving me the idea to make the industry world have oil instead of water.
Livewire lemmings - These are both sort of backroutey, but then again I never intended for this level to have a specific solution (the main gimmick is that the central teleporter must be entered in from two different directions, which you accomplished on both). I did not realise you could block the lemmings in using only two builders, however, so I will fix that!
Lemming on high - Placing the blocker in front of the exit was a backroute I should have caught during playtesting! :forehead: (this exact premise was used in jungle world; I should have noticed this here!). I have an easy fix for this, but I worry it will make the solution too obvious...
Storage facility 22a - You are correct in thinking this is a backroute, and another impressive one at that! Fortunately, this seems easily remedied.
Retrograde - Damn! I was certain I made those mines completely backroute-proof! It seems I once again underestimated the tenacity of the lemmings forums! :thumbsup:
The night shift - You are correct in thinking this is a backroute. Mind you, the night shift is an absolute monster of a level and I half expected there to be a backroute in there somewhere.
The specialist - Another tricky level that you backrouted; again, this level is quite complex, so I wouldn't be surprised if it has multiple backroutes.
Dead Weight - A very impressive solution! Me and tan were both certain that beating the neutral to the gold was impossible; this level will definitely require a rework!
We're working on fixing all of our levels, and we should have a version 2 ready in a few days.
...you still haven't solved every level, however...
Dig a little deeper... ;)
Just posting to let both Dexter and tan x dx know that I've started playing through the pack a few days ago, as well as how I have an LP available. However, I'm currently held up by Jungle World 10. I believe Armani said that he was able to solve it, but I'll go ahead and ask anyway: Do I have your guys' assurance that Jungle World 10 is possible with the given skillset? I haven't read any spoilers, as I prefer not to read them until I have solved the level myself. In this particular case,
I always keep being a digger short. I need all 4 diggers to get through the very thick wall so that I'm able to get the swimmer pickup but then it doesn't matter what skills I have left, as the swimmer is stuck in the water without the climber pickup. I can't get it without a digger, but again the problem is I need all diggers for the lone lemming to be able to get to the right side of the level.
Other than this, I don't know any other way to get around the level. I'm not asking for a hint for the level, just want to get solvability confirmed by the pack authors. In other words, you guys have a working replay that solves the level. Like I said, I'm not asking for a hint, nor am I asking for the replay from you both. I'm going to keep trying on this level after I get confirmation of the level being possible with the skillset given. I would had skipped this level already just so I don't hold up the LP if I can't get it solved, but honestly I personally prefer not to skip ahead and instead I prefer to solve every level in order. That's just me, though :P
Hi Armani
I'm glad to see you've found the secret bonus levels! I can confirm there are only two of them. We considered cutting these levels from the pack for different reasons, but we ultimately decided to include them as a nice easter egg which would be revealed upon a user submitting fifty valid replays. :)
Nicely done! :D
Regarding solutions:
Riddle of the Ancients - I made this level without actually realising we already had ten levels for the jungle rank. :forehead: Dexter also pointed out that the intended solution (backroutes notwithstanding) was too difficult for a jungle rank level.
Speaking of backroutes, you've once again outplayed me :XD: I have a fix for this, though, and we should be uploading it in a few days along with updates to the other levels.
Guardian Angels - Dexter cut this level because he felt the solution was too unfocused and had too many potential backroutes. But interestingly enough, your solution is actually very close to what Dexter originally intended. We may add a time limit, however... :evil:
We plan to properly add these levels to the level lists in the next update, so that everybody can enjoy them without having to dig into nxmi files.
Just letting you all know that version 2.0 has been released!
(The original link to the level pack has been modified to contain the new, updated levels.)
Special thanks to Armani for finding backroutes.
Changelog:
Jungle World:
Encore - Zombie now is a floater
Ziggurat - Widened the leftmost chasm and added metal to prevent various backroutes
What Goes Up - Added metal to the centre of the level in order to make the force fields integral to the solution. Also removed the plants from the middle to preemptively remove any backroute attempts.
Waste not, Want not - Removed a single piece of gold. Hopefully this will encourage people to not be so wasteful...
Entrapment - Added two new pieces of gold; this should force the intended solution.
Lemdiana Jones - Modified terrain slightly, and added an extra jumper to compensate.
Riddle of the Ancients - Replaced the glider with a floater. Minor terrain changes to prevent further backroutes. Added to the main level list.
Gear World:
Switching Gears - Removed some metal which allowed for a backroute; replaced with gear traps. Also added a metal floor to prevent digging and bashing.
Authorised Lemmings Only! - Reworked level to a moderate extent.
Measure Once, Build Twice - Shifted crates and platforms by a few pixels.
Smoke Stacks - Filled in some holes at the bottom of the level to prevent digging down to delay the lemmings.
Just another cog in the machine - Changed some shallow platforms to steeper ones.
Two by Four - Repositioned the leftmost splitter and its platform which was causing issues.
Mona World:
Catch My Drift - Reworked the central lemmings chamber; now they cannot be freed with platformers.
Sync or Swim - Added a gold above the chasm to force the use of a jumper.
Tightrope Citadel - Tweaked positions of gold coins very slightly.
Ad Astra Per Aspera - Destroyed the temple a little more.
A Caelo Usque Ad Centrum - Added debris to prevent backroutes.
Any Way the Wind Blows - Added two mines to prevent a backroute.
Ascending and Descending - Increased save requirement to 80/80, added an extra skill and gold coin at the bottom of the level. Also started some fires...
Guardian Angels - Added a time limit, and added to the main level list.
Wacky World:
Non Sequitur - Changed the terrain at the left side of the level.
Mr Magoo - Added a talisman to complete the level without using walkers.
Loony Bin - Slight terrain repositioning to prevent a backroute.
The Gibbering Cliffs - Embedded more random bits of metal into the cliffs.
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Tweaked positions of gold and exits slightly.
When life gives you lemmings - The Golden Goose has laid another egg...
Industry World:
Bait and Switchboard - Terrain modification and added a trap to prevent various backroutes.
Livewire Lemmings - Filled in two pixels to force the use of an extra builder.
Lemming on High - Slight terrain repositioning to remove a backroute involving platformers.
Storage Facility 22-A - Swapped the basher for a bomber.
Retrograde - Added more metal and repositioned the terrain slightly to force the intended solution.
The Night Shift - Moderate rework: Neutral lemmings are now separated from the controllable lemmings, removed all jumpers, added more useless empty boxes.
The Specialist - Removed a gold ingot, tweaked the skill set slightly. Committed many more OSHA violations.
Dead Weight - Removed a platform. Added two extra platformers to compensate.
Tan and I have decided to wait another few days before releasing the solution pack, to give you all a chance to see the revamped levels.
Hello tan x/Dexter,
I've finally managed to solve Jungle World 10, as well as Jungle World 11, and hence solved the entire first rank. Here are my replays for Jungle World. Also as promised, here is the link to my LP of your guys' level pack ;) https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbp2m4KlFpJuTl9UeUQB13QQBlZHAcKTn (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbp2m4KlFpJuTl9UeUQB13QQBlZHAcKTn) Enjoy! :P
General Remarks on the Pack So Far
Wow, these levels are quite tough, but I'm enjoying what I've seen a lot so far. I kind of expected that, especially since I've seen both the Chalkboard demo and Renaissance Lemmings. My favorite levels in the Jungle World rank were Jungle World 3 - Ziggurat and Jungle World 6 - Excavation :thumbsup: The latter in particular is difficult, but it has such a great solution :) The former isn't as difficult, but I really love how the solution comes together and what needs to be done in order to keep the crowd and pre-placed neutral safe.
For Jungle World 10, sorry to say it, but the fact that things kept failing by a pixel or I kept being a skill short made me not like the level as much as I should had. It normally takes a lot before I rage at a Lemmings level, and this happens to be one of the few that did manage to get me to rage. It's a really nice challenging level and all, but all the precision that's needed made me think otherwise. I ended up solving the original version before I solved the update version you see in the LP, as I wanted to figure out the first version as well since I couldn't solve it for a while. I saw that an extra jumper was given, as well as some kinks in the wall on the right, and I thought even with an extra jumper it's still not that easy for me. However, the solution involves something that I might had already been aware of, I just never fully realized it.
Stackers actually place the stack a pixel lower once a digger is digging nothing away. Thus, I had rejected going underneath the wall way too early and instead kept trying to get to the other side up higher, which of course resulted in me wishing I had one more digger. Not sure why it took me so long to realize this and to finally solve it, but I finally managed to do it :)
Some level feedback:
Jungle World 1 - Welcome to Jungle World Nice, somewhat challenging level to start off the pack
Jungle World 2 - Encore This one was a bit difficult, but it's really just the timing that's hard. The solution is simpler than it appears.
Jungle World 3 - I actually learned something new here, and that is I didn't know that neutrals can interact with buttons. Now that I think about it, I guess it makes sense, since they can interact with traps/exits, so therefore they aren't excluded from buttons. I really like the puzzle of figuring out how to get the neutral out from being stuck in an endless loop between the wall/one-way force field, as well as getting the button to the left of where the neutral starts. Figuring out the bottom level is tricky, but quite a nice one.
Jungle World 5 - The two towers Looks quite intimidating with the extremely wide gap, but it's actually not that hard. Cloners FTW :laugh: Though, I didn't like how in the end I kept failing by a pixel. I also have a glider leftover.
Jungle World 7 - Shibboleth This one was also difficult, but it's a really nice level. The bombers to free the neutrals are a bit precise, but I like how you need to release them so that they all walk to the center except for one which will go to push the buttons.
Jungle World 9 - Entrapment This one was also difficult for me. I'm sure this is a backroute, though. Certainly the hardest part seems to be to make sure no one bunches up due to the one-way force fields.
Jungle World 11 - Riddle of the Ancients I understand that this wasn't originally part of the initial pack release, as this was a secret level. Now it's the final level of the rank. Didn't take me as long as I thought it would. I don't think this is intended, though?
I will continue through the rest of the pack later on! :) Overall, great job so far and I'm enjoying the pack a lot. Very challenging levels that are satisfying to figure out and solve. I'm also aware that some levels have changed in the meantime, but luckily I was only on the Jungle World rank by the time the second version of the pack was released. For this, I might just simply tack on the resolved solutions of the Jungle World levels that changed at the very end of my LP. Meaning, the levels you see in the LP are from the 1st version. Generally, I don't go back and resolve updated levels if an update happens while my LP is in progress. Again, as I said before luckily the only levels I need to resolve are the Jungle World ones, as I was stuck horribly on Jungle World 10 by the time the second version of the pack dropped.
I've resolved updated levels of first three ranks.
I have a feeling that I've found quite a lot of intended solutions this time :D
I will probably look into remaining two ranks someday in this week.
Attached zip file also contains replays which are accepted last time.
You only need to check the following levels :
Jungle 3,4,8,9,10,11
Gear 4,5,7,8,9,10
Mona 2,3,5,6,8,9,10,11
Jungle3 Ziggurat - This feels intended now.:D I used every skill.
Jungle4 What goes up - Not sure on this level. Digger canceling to make a 6 pixels step seems a little bit hackish. Also my solution relys on tight timing.
Jungle8 Waste not, want not - This also feels good. I used all skills and the solution just looks nice.
Jungle9 Entrapment - Slight variation of my previous backroute. I can see what intended solution looks like... from the added golds, but I think the level need another fix for now.
Jungle10 Lemdiana Jones - Same here. I just tweak my previous backroute a little bit. I still have some leftover skills and didn't collect glider pick-up.
Jungle11 Riddle of the Ancients - Same here. almost same solution as before.
Gear4 Measure once, build twice - This must be intended. Very nice level :thumbsup:
Gear5 Switching gears - I think my solution is mostly intended. I freed both zombies and used them to flip the splitters. The only suspicious part is where I used a basher to hit the steel and turn around.
Gear7 Authorised Lemmings Only! - Okay. I love this level very much now. :thumbsup: Everything fall in to place perfectly!
Gear8 Smoke stacks - I have a spare jumper this time :devil: I suspect the position of the first digger is not exactly intended.
Gear9 Just another cog in the machine - Still chaotic a little bit but seems better than before.
Gear10 Two by four - I used every skill this time. Hope this is closer to intended ;)
Mona2 Catch my drift - I deliberately tried to solved this level without using blockers to bounce off the glider.(Sorry, but I love to backroute the levels. :evil:) And here's the result.
Mona3 Sync or swim - I bet this is intended now. Very clever usage of updraft :thumbsup:
Mona5 Tightrope Citadel - I used all the given skills. This seems intended now.
Mona6 Ad astra per aspera - It seems much better now but not perfect probably. I used last cloner merely to meet the save requirement.
Mona8 A caelo usque ad centrum - This also feels intended now.
Mona9 Any way the wind blows - I used first stoner right after the first lemming spawned. Then all the following lemmings spawn in opposite directions as a result. I'm not sure if this is intended as I've never seen this trick in custom levels other than one of mine. If this is not intended, you can easily block this backroute by moving hatch to the right slightly.
Mona10 Ascending and descending - This level is much more difficult than before as you said. I had to pre-plan the position of the stackers very carefully.
Mona11 Guardian Angels - I tried completely different approach this time and got a solution which spares a basher. :P
Attached zip file is full set of my replays for LemRunner V2.0
You only need to check the following levels :
Wacky 3,6,7,8,9
Industry 2,4,5,6,7,8,9,10
Wacky3 Non sequitur - I still think this is the easiest level of the rank. It's very clear where I should use each skill. But it’s still not that easy because I had to time the stacker so the pioneer lemming has enough time to platform over the gap.
Wacky6 Loony bin - Certainly less hackish than before. I reckon this could be intended. Pretty neat level! :D
Wacky7 The Gibbering Cliffs - I think I got the main trick of the level : bombing one of the platform, digging another platform inside the splat pad area and let the crowd fall to anti splat pad area. I have a stoner and many cloners to spare though. I have no idea where all these cloners are needed.
Wacky8 Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Attached several solutions. I suspect none of them are intended.
Wacky9 When Life Gives You Lemmings - I still have some leftover skills on this level.
Industry2 Bait and switchboard - Almost same solution here. The only difference is that I used a blocker this time to prevent the crowd going to fire trap.
Industry4 Livewire Lemmings - I know this solution is acceptable. Last update broke my replay so I just slightly adjust the position of some skills.
Industry5 Lemming on high - Yes, I can roughly see what intended solution looks like now but I would rather backroute the level than solve it in intended way. :evil:
Industry6 Storage facility 22-A - I used mid-air stoner trick again! And It seems that sometimes a bomber is more powerful than a basher, so I spare a stoner this time. Let's see if this is acceptable or not..
Industry7 Retrograde - Attached several different solutions. Each solution contains the crowd at different locations. The first solution looks most promising imo.
Industry8 The night shift - This also feels good. But I think this level is too easy for its position.(if my solution is intended of course)
Industry9 The specialist - I used all the given skill this time. Hopefully this is closer to intended.
Industry10 Dead weight - I think I got the main theme of the level : You can't beat the neutral to the gold + you must collect walker pick-up before collecting the final gold. The only possibility in this case is that I should free the zombie and drop him exactly to the neutral to zombify him so he can't collect the final gold. But the problem is that the execution is way too precise. Even after I realize that I should drop the zombie to the neutral, I failed many times by few frames. Finally I got a solution that successfully drop zombie to the neutral but there're some hackish, heavily timing-based things. I think I could've spare some skills(e.g a stacker and a jumper at the top platform) if I timed it better but I’m too lazy to actually do so... The main idea is actually fantastic and creative but I think the execution is way too precise.(I’m sorry if dropping the zombie to the neutral is not what you intended or there is an easier way to do so...)
I've resolved updated levels for remaining 2 ranks.
Attached zip file is full set of my replays for LemRunner V2.0
You only need to check the following levels :
Wacky 3,6,7,8,9
Industry 2,4,5,6,7,8,9,10
Wacky3 Non sequitur - I still think this is the easiest level of the rank. It's very clear where I should use each skill. But it’s still not that easy because I had to time the stacker so the pioneer lemming has enough time to platform over the gap.
Wacky6 Loony bin - Certainly less hackish than before. I reckon this could be intended. Pretty neat level! :D
Wacky7 The Gibbering Cliffs - I think I got the main trick of the level : bombing one of the platform, digging another platform inside the splat pad area and let the crowd fall to anti splat pad area. I have a stoner and many cloners to spare though. I have no idea where all these cloners are needed.
Wacky8 Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Attached several solutions. I suspect none of them are intended.
Wacky9 When Life Gives You Lemmings - I still have some leftover skills on this level.
Industry2 Bait and switchboard - Almost same solution here. The only difference is that I used a blocker this time to prevent the crowd going to fire trap.
Industry4 Livewire Lemmings - I know this solution is acceptable. Last update broke my replay so I just slightly adjust the position of some skills.
Industry5 Lemming on high - Yes, I can roughly see what intended solution looks like now but I would rather backroute the level than solve it in intended way. :evil:
Industry6 Storage facility 22-A - I used mid-air stoner trick again! And It seems that sometimes a bomber is more powerful than a basher, so I spare a stoner this time. Let's see if this is acceptable or not..
Industry7 Retrograde - Attached several different solutions. Each solution contains the crowd at different locations. The first solution looks most promising imo.
Industry8 The night shift - This also feels good. But I think this level is too easy for its position.(if my solution is intended of course)
Industry9 The specialist - I used all the given skill this time. Hopefully this is closer to intended.
Industry10 Dead weight - I think I got the main theme of the level : You can't beat the neutral to the gold + you must collect walker pick-up before collecting the final gold. The only possibility in this case is that I should free the zombie and drop him exactly to the neutral to zombify him so he can't collect the final gold. But the problem is that the execution is way too precise. Even after I realize that I should drop the zombie to the neutral, I failed many times by few frames. Finally I got a solution that successfully drop zombie to the neutral but there're some hackish, heavily timing-based things. I think I could've spare some skills(e.g a stacker and a jumper at the top platform) if I timed it better but I’m too lazy to actually do so... The main idea is actually fantastic and creative but I think the execution is way too precise.(I’m sorry if dropping the zombie to the neutral is not what you intended or there is an easier way to do so...)
Hi Armani!
You've done another great job with these replays. Most of your solutions seem to be what's intended, but there are few backroutes here and there:
My levels and commentary:
Ziggurat - Yep! This solution only differs slightly from the intended solution, but you've pretty much got it
What Goes Up - The solution is closer now, but still a backroute. Locking the spawn rate oughta fix it, as that would force the player to use one extra builder
Entrapment - Hmmm... another backroute. This one will require more work, it seems.
Switching gears - Your replay is 90% similar to the intended solution; you are correct in saying that bashing the metal is unintended. There is a much more glaring backroute that I also recently became aware of; the entire bottom platform needs reinforcing.
Smoke stacks - This level is intended to be somewhat freeform; I don't consider your solution to be a backroute, since it seems much more elaborate than the intended solution
Two by Four - You are correct in that this solution is much closer to what I had intended! However, it still sort-of defeats the challenge of the level. I'll try again to remove more backroutes, but I fear it may not be possible. At any rate, I feel this level is challenging enough even if I am unable to fix it entirely.
Catch my Drift - I kind of got the feeling that you like backrouting levels! ;) I don't feel the need to modify this level further, since I want it to be somewhat lenient (it is the second level of the pack, after all).
Sync or swim - Very close to the intended solution, well done!
Any way the wind blows - This is completely unintended; you've once again blown me away with your amazing problem solving skills.
Loony Bin - This is a backroute; the terrain to the right of spawn is intended to be a complete misdirect. It seems I will have to do some repositioning!
Bait and switchboard - Another backroute; luckily this one seems easy to fix. I'll modify it once more, then leave it be, since it isn't intended to be overly challenging.
Lemming on high - This one was tricky to fix; looks like it's back to the drawing board!
Retrograde - I was worried this level had a lot of backroutes... I'll fix the more obvious ones, but making it completely backroute-proof may not be possible. I might have to bump this one up the level order towards the easier levels.
Tan's levels and commentary:
Waste not, want not - A very clever solution but still a backroute, unfortunately. I think those upper pillars need to be lowered... :devil:
Lemdiana Jones - Hmm... Looks like further tweaking is required here...
Riddle of the Ancients - Same again. You're very good at this! :XD:
Measure once, build twice - You are correct that this is the intended solution. :thumbsup: However, Kaywhyn has found another backroute that was very similar to your original solution! More tweaking is needed...
Authorised Lemmings Only! - A perfect solution! Brilliantly done! :thumbsup:
Just another cog in the machine - This solution is more or less intended. Good job on saving over the requirement! I may consider adding a talisman for saving more than 50/60. :thumbsup:
Tightrope Citadel - Another perfect solution! :thumbsup:
Ad astra per aspera - A good solution, but I still consider it a backroute. I think the leftmost coins need to be raised higher.
A caelo usque ad centrum - Similarly for this solution. Your solution is very close, but I think the level needs another tweak.
Ascending and descending - Yet another perfect solution! Awesome! :thumbsup:
Non Sequitur - Another backroute! Climbing over that last plant pot was a nice touch. :P I think I can easily fix, though.
The Gibbering Cliffs - This solution is the intended one, except it's actually a lot more efficient than mine! :forehead: This level may see a tweak in the future...
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - All solutions are unintended, unfortunately. But that's my fault, not yours. :P
When Life Gives You Lemmings - Again, another backroute. Your solution is pretty close to what was intended, though.
Storage facility 22-A - The mid air stoner trick is actually intended for this level! (We were very impressed by your usage in the wacky level Know when to hold them. It wasn't intended there, but well done anyway!) The use of the bomber here is a backroute, but this one is easily fixed with a bit of metal.
The night shift - Another very direct solution to the problem. I'll need to tweak the level to make it as difficult as intended. :devil:
The Specialist - Another very clever solution, but still not what I was thinking of. Back to the drawing board for me...
Dead weight - Aha! Excellent solution for this one! Turning the neutral lemming into a zombie was indeed the correct trick for this level. The difficulty mainly lies in synchronising the zombie with the neutral lemming. In the official solution, the zombie is dropped to the left of the electric gizmo, but your solution is still perfectly valid. Nicely done! :thumbsup:
Also included is the intended solutions for all the levels.
Changelog
What Goes Up - Repositioned terrain slightly, and locked spawn rate
Waste not, want not - Lowered some columns to prevent a backroute. Hopefully this will teach people not to be so wasteful...
Entrapment - Added another gold, and tweaked the skillset slightly
Lemdiana Jones - More tweaks to terrain.
Riddle of the Ancients - Took a chisel and carved out a big hole. Also a few tweaks to aesthetics.
Trial By Fire - Restricted the skillset to prevent a backroute
Switching Gears - Reinforced the lower platform to completely prevent turning lemmings around
Like Clockwork - Added a metal block to prevent the zombie from being freed
Authorised Lemmings Only! - Removed a misplaced terrain piece. No change to solution, and existing replay files should still work.
Two By Four - Reworked the skillset. That oughta throw a wrench into some gears... ;)
Ad astra per aspera - Moved the leftmost two coins upwards, ruined the pillars, and removed the updraft to the right. Save requirement reduced by 1.
A caelo usque ad centrum - Slight terrain modification. A crack has appeared...
Any Way The Wind Blows - Added some hanging terrain pieces to thwart a backroute
Non Sequitur - Added a curious new friend! :cute:
Loony Bin - Small terrain repositioning
The Gibbering Cliffs - Changes to terrain to prevent a potential backroute.
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Added egg. Added metal. Added some lovely numbers.
When life gives you lemmings - Rearranged both eggs and citrus. Should be healthier now.
Bait And Switchboard - Reduced the size of some terrain to prevent a backroute
Retrograde - Added reinforcements beneath the zombie container; changed its position in the level rank to be an easier level.
Lemming On High - Minor rework to the level; the exit is now one platform over, and there's an extra gold in its place. Skills have been changed too.
Storage Facility 22-A - Added metal to the exit platform.
The Night Shift - Heaped some more empty boxes on to a load bearing platform.
The Specialist - Added more hazards and metal.
I realized that a lemming has to climb out the left side via jumping, as there's just not enough time to finish the level otherwise. Also, at least 1 lemming keeps slipping by before the staircase to the wall is done, and hence the best I keep on doing is a lose 1 solution.
Honestly, I'm just at a loss as to what else I haven't yet tried, but I will keep trying. Guess I just need to take a break from the level/pack. I could just watch the replay or ask tan x for a hint, but that's just not me when it comes to level solving in Lemmings, as I like to figure out levels for myself. At least not before I have solved the level myself. I only watch after just to compare.
Here's hoping I can get myself unstuck sooner rather than later
resolved all the updated levels
Attached zip file is full set of my replays for LemRunner V3.0
You only need to check the following levels :
Jungle 4 8 9 10 11
Gear 5 10
Mona 6 8 9
Wacky 3,6,7,8,9
Industry 2,5,7,8,9
Jungle4 What goes up - Seems good but I have a digger left.
Jungle8 Waste not, want not - I still spare some builders.
Jungle9 Entrapment - Attached two different solutions. I feel like second one is intended.
Jungle10 Lemdiana Jones - No glider solution again :evil:
Jungle11 Riddle of the Ancients - I didn't use the shimmer. I expect I was able to save the shimmier since I timed the final builder nicely.
Gear5 Switching gears - I tweak my previous solution a little bit. This feels intended now :thumbsup:
Gear10 Two by four - Seems intended. I save much more than required though, that's the only suspicious thing.
Mona6 Ad astra per aspera - I still have a lot of leftover skills.
Mona8 A caelo usque ad centrum - This feels intended too.
Mona9 Any way the wind blows - And this is my new favourite level of the rank :thumbsup: The stoner trick is extremely hard to see. Very hard and very clever level.
Wacky3 Non sequitur - This level was not a easy level at all! looks simple but it's actually a deceivingly hard level!
Wacky6 Loony bin - Another backroute ;P I spared a bomber.
Wacky7 The Gibbering Cliffs - Last update broke my replay so I adjust the position of some skills.
Wacky8 Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - this feels intended :thumbsup:
Wacky9 When Life Gives You Lemmings - I have some leftover skills on this one.
Industry2 Bait and switchboard - This also feels intended.
Industry5 Lemming on high - Almost same backroute ;P
Industry7 Storage Facility 22-A - I got no-bomber solution :evil:
Industry8 The night shift - I bet this is intended. very nice level again
Industry9 The specialist - Slight variation to my previous backroute.
resolved all the updated levels
Attached zip file is full set of my replays for LemRunner V3.0
Hi Armani!
Once again, another very fine set of solutions! Many of these seem to be very close to what we intended! :thumbsup:
We simply have to applaud you for your incredible problem solving skills; you're really keeping us on our toes here! :thumbsup:
What Goes Up - Very close to the intended solution; I feel no need to modify this any further, seeing as how your solution uses the forcefields, which is what I intended.
Waste not, want not - We may have to remove the hanging pillars; having a lemming turn around there seems to throw off the intended solution.
Entrapment - You are correct in that the second solution is what is intended! The first solution seems somewhat harder to pull off, plus I don't really know how to fix this backroute without changing the main conceit of the level, so it appears you have bested me! Very well done! :thumbsup:
Lemdiana Jones - Hmmm... Once again, great solution! This level will need more work.
Riddle of the Ancients - This replay is very close to the intended solution! My bro says he accepts it. Great work!
Switching gears - This is what is intended; great work!
Two by four - This is indeed the intended solution; you saved a bit more than necessary because you were more efficient with your timings; very well done!
Ad astra per aspera - A major backroute. Fortunately, I think there's a simple fix... Hopefully! ;)
A caelo usque ad centrum - My bro tells me this solution is acceptable. Great work! :thumbsup:
Any way the wind blows - Thank you! I'm very proud of the misdirect on this level; your solution is completely correct!
Non sequitur - Yeah, you got it! ;)
Loony bin - Yet another backroute; I feel that the intended solution is a bit more straightforward, however, so I'm not sure whether the level needs updating... I'll take another look.
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Great work, this is more or less intended.
When Life Gives You Lemmings - This is one cheeky backroute! Well done once again! ;P
Bait and switchboard - Solution is intended - well done!
Lemming on high - You're very good at backrouting this level! Fortunately, I feel as though this might be easily fixed with a well-placed block of metal.
Storage Facility 22-A - Nicely done, but still technically a backroute. My bro says he knows how to fix this one.
The night shift - Well done! The builder-cage trick is intended.
The specialist - Once again, you're great at getting the neutral lemming into places where he shouldn't be! :evil: This level is really difficult to balance due to its complexity!
Good news. After being stupidly stumped for almost 2 months, I finally solved Gear World 7. Turns out I had the solution almost all correct this entire time, but there was one very small but crucial thing that I didn't see for a very long time :forehead:
The key here was RR manipulation several times at the beginning so that enough lemmings at a time can get by each individual stack, and this turned out to be the missing piece, as before the climber would always slip by the builder before he could seal off the gap. Here, the builder was too slow by 1-2 builder bricks, and the most important thing was making sure not to keep the RR maxed out the entire time.
It's interesting, really, because while I was having my lunch break earlier today this Eureka moment all of a sudden came to me and I kept praying in my mind that it would work as I was going to try after I finish my lunch. Lo and behold, it does! :)
Anyway, I just wanted to give you two an update and that I will resume my LP of LemRunner next week now that I finally managed to get myself unstuck :thumbsup: I'm still currently on my hiatus from Lemmings, but rest assured that the series will resume where I left off now that I have had success in getting unstuck.
I will post my replays/feedback once I finish up Gear World.
All rightie, I have finally made my glorious return to LPing the pack after almost two months of not seriously playing Lemmings, and just like that I killed off the remaining 4 levels of the Gear World rank in my first LP video in several weeks. So, the Gear World rank has finally fallen, and so I'm back with replays and feedback. I'm aware that some levels have changed from V2 to V3 and hence my replay collection has some broken replays. In particular, it appears that Gear World 2, 5 and 6 need to be resolved. If I do resolve the changed levels later, I'll likely just tack those replays on at the very end of the LP.
Gear World 1 - Welcome to Gear World Hehe, this level is very similar to Jungle World 1 in terms of the layout and solution, and the concept needed to solve it.
Gear World 2 - Trial By Fire This one was an unusually difficult one for me. In particular, figuring out how to get the two buttons on either side at the bottom was quite difficult to figure out, especially when combined with the splitters.
Gear World 3 - Lefty loosey righty flighty Another difficult one. Nice level with two separate group of specialists, swimmers and gliders, as the title somewhat suggests. I do have two bashers leftover, yet going to V3 didn't show this level as breaking, so it appears that my replay from a few months ago still works. Indeed, I just checked it still passes. Acceptable solution? Mine came really close to not working anyway. Had I done the bashing timing differently, I think the gliders would had taken the swimmer route and similarly the swimmers take the glider route.
Gear World 4 - Measure once, build twice Somewhat easy. Nice idea of using stackers to release the crowd, and the final one with a climber since he can get out himself after the stack is complete.
Gear World 5 - Switching Gears This one was an unusually difficult one even with just two skill types. In particular, the hardest part was making sure no one walks out to the left at the bottom since everyone needs to be saved, including the neutral. See my LP of the pack, as my replay no longer works for V3.
Gear World 6 - Like Clockwork Another very hard one. I likely used an extremely fiddly and very messy way to solve it in my LP. See that, since my replay doesn't work in V3 either. That was a very nice concept of constantly keeping the zombie trapped behind the splitter as the neutrals kept flipping it off. Earlier attempts that failed had me going, I wish they had made the entrance spawn more neutrals to keep the zombie at bay :laugh: There definitely must had been a very good reason for keeping the neutral count as it is, as it might had made the level way too easy otherwise.
Gear World 7 - Authorised Lemmings Only! As mentioned before, I was stuck on this level for almost 2 months before I finally had a brilliant idea that came to me during my lunch break last week. I honestly have no idea why it took me so long to see that the RR needs to be manipulated several times in this level. Very nice level! :thumbsup: Often times, you only need to do it once and that's that, but here it requires twinkling a few times. As you have seen in my LP and correctly stated, I nearly had the solution this entire time, was just missing the RR manipulation :forehead: Well, glad that I finally figured it out on my own ;)
Gear World 8 - Smoke Stacks Thought I was going to be stuck here for a while. This one wasn't as bad as I thought. Still a challenging one. I have a jumper and a basher leftover, so backroute maybe?
Gear World 9 - Just another cog in the machine That's a nice level concept of using stackers next to one another to bridge a gap, but honestly I'm not a huge fan of that. Way too much precise timing needed to pull it off. Another one that I figured out somewhat quickly. Fencing the trapped lemmings out to either side was quite interesting.
Gear World 10 - Two by four Difficult but nice level to close off the rank. Nice idea of bashing a stack in progress to make it stepable from the left but still saving the neutrals from splatting! :thumbsup: Also nice idea of building over a button and then bashing with the final preassigned glider to collect it before you lose too many.
Part 10 of my LP is currently being uploaded, so be on the lookout for that when it becomes available soon! ;)
I will continue with the Mona rank soon! For now, very satisfied to have finally solved the first two ranks completely :)
Hi Dexter/tan x,
Mona World rank finished, so I'm back with replays and feedback!
Mona World Rank Feedback
Overall, the rank felt much easier than either of the first two ranks. I feel Jungle World and Gear World are both harder than Mona World. The Mona World rank was still no pushover, but the levels in this rank didn't take me anywhere near as long as most levels in either the Jungle World or the Gear World rank.
Mona World 1 - Welcome to Mona World! Different level from either of the first levels of the previous two ranks, but also very easy compared to them :P
Mona World 2 - Catch my drift This was a really interesting puzzle of using the preplaced gliders to collect the gold, as well as figuring out how to do so with the skillset. There was only one gold button that I collected with a floater, and there's one that appears that it can be collected with a floater but cannot, and so has to be collected by a glider. It definitely got me wondering how to get those two, particularly since some platformers need to be used to collect the others with gliders. Then I found a way to spare a platformer so that I can collect the two gold buttons that can only be collected with a glider and a floater. A couple of skills leftover, but I'm guessing this is fine?
Mona World 3 - Sync or swim One of my favorites! :thumbsup: This was definitely an easy one to figure out. I was simply a dummy with where I was trying to achieve compression. Took me a while to spot that I'm supposed to do it at the bottom when they all float down :XD: I think this is similar to a previous level earlier in the pack that used a similar concept? It's possible I might be confusing it with another pack, but I'm sure it might be the LemRunner pack.
Mona World 4 - Draft dodgers Difficult one, although knowing myself I likely overcomplicated the solution considerably. It was quite difficult figuring out how to get the gold button on the very far left, as well as how to make sure no one gets lost except for the bomber if it's used. Seems like it's intended to be used to get rid of the zombie. Making sure no one is near the zombie when he falls off the screen was difficult to achieve. Seems like the key was giving a glider to the shimmier and realizing that the two right-most gold buttons can be collected but he needs to be able to just miss the one before them in order to do so. Also I believe one of the gliders almost kept going to the right and would had gotten infected but fortunately he bounced back to the left. It was definitely annoying making sure no one gets trapped underneath the platformer bridge gliding in an infinite loop. I simply was trying to save a builder to turn the lemming that collects the gold at the far left around back to the right.
Mona World 5 - Tightrope Citadel Nice rehash of Tightrope City from the original Lemmings. In my LP, I criticized the extreme pixel precision, but as it turns out I brought it on myself. I checked the intended solution after I solved the level, and yea I got to say your solution is easier than mine :XD: My solution is just very messy and fiddly in order to make sure no one bounced off the left blocker and goes out to the right, and the blockers had to be placed pixel perfect, and possibly the first builder over the left blocker so that he could still be released with a digger. The solution also involved some RR fiddling.
Mona World 6 - Ad astra per aspera I'm almost certain this is a backroute. I don't think it's supposed to be this easy for the second half of the rank :P
Mona World 7 - Hallowed ground Interesting puzzle. It wasn't necessarily a hard level. It was annoying more than anything IMO. In particular, the lemmings getting infected at the stacks took me by surprise. I must say digging and then platforming with the lemming behind him to seal off the gap after maxing the RR is quite clever! :thumbsup:
Mona World 8 - A caelo usque ad centrum Another Latin title, I think? Yet another level that I ended up overcomplicating and hence this was another hard one for me. I checked your intended solution after I solved the level, and I never realized there's a ledge after the floater falls off the left at the top that he can land on :forehead: This definitely explains why I struggled so much with this level :XD: In particular, the part that gave me the most problems was two lemmings being too close to each other so that even when stacking the second one just slips out. I kind of figured that the floater and the climber would be lost no matter what, thus why I have a bomber leftover, as if I use it, then I'll be one short of the requirement.
Mona World 9 - Any way the wind blows This level is too easy for its position this late in the rank. The timing was just right to get the gaps at the bottom sealed up before any of the others arrived.
Mona World 10 - Ascending and descending Somewhat a difficult level, although the hardest part for me was getting the crowds down safely while making sure a worker lemming can climb back up the digger shaft later to collect the gold in the starting area. I got to say using stacks to make splatforms for the crowd and climbing back up the digger shaft were clever! :thumbsup: I didn't use the basher, although I'm guessing it's simply to make it easier to get the climber/glider home?
Mona World 11 - Guardian Angels Wow, this is a really good, hard level that was satisfying to figure out! :thumbsup: Probably the hardest level in the entire rank despite it being a secret, bonus level. I really like this one too. Certainly a lot of things that can catch you off guard here. In particular, getting the neutral lemming up was hard to figure out, especially since he's not a climber like the lemmings from the presassigned hatch. Seems like the only feasible way to get him up is to use the updrafts near the exit. The timing here can be quite tricky and difficult, especially since the builder needs to finish sealing off the gap before the disarmer arrives. Once again, knowing myself I likely overcomplicated the solution here too.
So far, I've only taken a look at the first two levels of Wacky World, and already Wacky World 2 has me stumped despite it just being a 1 lemming level. So, it appears that the difficulty has picked up again with Wacky World after what I thought was an unusually easy third rank of the pack in Mona World. Needless to say, both Jungle World and Gear World felt quite difficult to me, Mona World was easier than either of the first two ranks, and now the difficulty is picking up again with Wacky World.
I definitely seem to have hit my stride now that I'm making very decent and great progress through the pack after my long, extended absence from the game/level pack. It was definitely a very much needed break, because it seemed to have helped a great deal. Time away can really help. As a result, I'm really enjoying this pack! :thumbsup: Looking forward to the rest of the levels if I'm able to get to them. Seems like you both are enjoying my LP videos very much :)
Hello tan x/Dexter,
I have solved all levels of the LemRunner pack. Here is my complete set of LemRunner replays. I have also attached my resolved solutions to some changed Jungle World and Gear World levels for V3. Now some feedback.
Jungle World 3 - Ziggurat It was one of my favorite levels of the Jungle World, and now it's my favorite even more now that the intended solution seems to be enforced. That trick with trapping the neutral between a blocker and wall is very clever! Well done! :thumbsup:
Jungle World 4 - What Goes Up Other than not digging through the starting platform, my solution is more or less the same as last time. Still uses all the skills, and different from the intended solution which I checked after resolving the level.
Jungle World 8 - Waste Not, Want Not Once again, my solution seems to be a slight variant from the intended, at least in the main area before the exit. My solution requires really good timing, especially with collecting the gold button before the trap and finishing the splatform in time before the crowd arrives.
Jungle World 9 - Entrapment My solution should still be acceptable, particularly since the only difference from the intended solution is with how the second shimmier is used, as well as how I released the blocker with a walker instead of with a falling bomber.
Jungle World 10 - Lemdiana Jones Likely a slight backroute, especially since mine can either be a glider leftover or a jumper leftover. This one is with a jumper leftover, so it can definitely be a no glider solution just like Armani's. I have to suspect that mine is the exact same as his. I haven't watched his solution yet.
Jungle World 11 - Riddle of the Ancients Once again, my solution is very different from the intended one. Mine is a bit timing heavy in one place. Since I still end up using all of the skills, I'm guessing this is still acceptable?
Gear World 2 - Trial by fire This seems intended now. Very nice trick of using fallers to activate splitters, despite it being very pixel precise! :thumbsup:
Gear World 5 - Switching gears Not sure why I struggled with this level despite there only being two skill types. It mostly has to do with how I tried avoiding releasing both zombies and I freed only one of them. Still, nice level, and one that will likely not take very long, especially with only 7 skills and a very small level.
Gear World 6 - Like clockwork Another favorite of mine in the rank despite this one taking me a while to resolve. That's really neat with infinitely keeping the zombie trapped on the other side of the splitter as long as you have walkers available! :thumbsup: Not sure why it took me a long time to see that, though. I kept trying to have the lemming over the top go back to the right with walkers to finish off the gaps before the basher releases the neutrals. Turns out they will always slip into the water before the gaps are sealed and hence it's simply going about the level the wrong way.
Now feedback on the Wacky World and Industry World ranks, since I've already given feedback on the first three ranks last time.
Wacky World Feedback
I mentioned that I felt the Mona World rank was slightly easier than either of the Jungle World and Gear World ranks. I felt the first two ranks were harder. With Wacky World, however, this one felt about the same difficulty as the first two ranks or just slightly harder. The hardest levels for me in the rank were Wacky World 2 - Full circle, Wacky World 3 - Non sequitur, Wacky World 5 - Pole to pole, and Wacky World 10 - Know when to hold 'em.
My favorites in the Wacky World rank were Wacky World 2, 3, Wacky World 7 - The Gibbering Cliffs, Wacky World 8 - Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners, and Wacky World 9 - When Life Gives You Lemmings
Wacky World 1 - Welcome to Wacky World Nice, somewhat easy level to start off the rank. I say slightly harder than Mona World 1, but probably just a bit easier than either Jungle World 1 and Gear World 1.
Wacky World 2 - This one is still quite challenging even though it's a 1 lemming level! Indeed, it managed to stump me. Turns out that I went about the level wrong and had some conceptual errors. It didn't occur to me to platform lower coming from the right on the top than the platformers coming from the left so that he can still drop down to the anti-splat pads around the same height where the exit is located. Also, I did the right side wrong which caused me to be a skill short, and that needs to be done with proper skill sequencing so that the level can be solved.
Just as a side note: When I opened this level in the editor, you have the sketches left in when the level was saved. You might want to consider removing them just in case of "accidentally" opening it in the editor. Here, I simply wanted to check something with mining through on the left side just past the exit. I almost noticed the platformer sketches, but luckily it was a blur and therefore nothing was spoiled. Even then, I still managed to figure out and solve the level on my own :P
Wacky World 3 - As mentioned in the second LP video with this level, I take back my criticism of the unfair, precise timing that I thought the solution uses. The level title is indeed appropriate, as if you take the obvious way, you will not solve the level, no matter how much you adjust the skill assignments of the basher/stacker. Despite this one stumping me for a while, this is one of my favorite levels of the rank! :thumbsup: Bashing and using the raised pixel to platform to the left to the steel block so that the crowd can step out and take a detour to give the basher enough time to get to where he needs to stack is genius. Also, realizing that you need to stack when going to the left, not to the right, or they won't be able to get onto the exit platform later. This would also prevent being able to collect the gold on top of the blocks later.
Wacky World 4 - Mr Magoo I'm pretty sure this is a backroute. Even then, this was an easy level.
Wacky World 5 - This was a hard one for me. Still, nice splat pad puzzle. I must say that's clever with using stackers to jump on to avoid the splat pad trigger areas and playing leap frog :laugh:
Wacky World 6 - Loony bin Somewhat easy. I somehow have a feeling that my solution isn't quite intended. It felt cheesy to me :laugh: In particular, that first digger surviving the fall when it looks like he should splat instead.
Wacky World 7 - This one was somewhat difficult. It definitely did the job of making me wonder how in the world you can get through the gaps when you only have two builders but one won't be enough to get to the exit coming from the left. Once again, I feel my solution isn't quite intended. Here, I simply used the cloners to exceed the save requirement. This is one of my favorite levels design-wise, especially since green is my favorite color :P
Wacky World 8 - Another of my favorite levels in the rank! :thumbsup: Very nice 1-of-everything level. My solution is probably not intended, since I do have some leftover skills. Also, I'm very confused why the lemming exit limit on the upper exit is very high. Perhaps you intended that to be part of the puzzle of figuring out a lemming needs to use it?
Wacky World 9 - Yet another favorite level of mine in the rank! :thumbsup: Somewhat easy. That's clever to use a platformer to catch the digger to collect the gold button in midair.
Wacky World 10 - Difficult level for me to finish off the rank. Mine solution is quite timing heavy, particularly since it involves bombing the blockers at the right time. Pretty interesting level that provides an infinite amount of three skill types, though. I definitely like the intended solution here better than my solution, as it's not as fiddly and messy.
Industry World Feedback
The Industry World was definitely a really difficult rank, so I think it being the final rank is very appropriate. It's definitely harder than any of the previous individual ranks. In contrast to Wacky World, where 3 levels managed to stump me, 4 Industry World levels managed to stump me badly. However, the roadblocks here took me longer than the Wacky World roadblocks. Only Wacky World 3 took me the longest to get unstuck out of the other two roadblocks, but Industry World 3 - Revenge of the dead, Industry World 8 - The night shift, and Industry World 10 - Dead weight took me the longest to solve, since these all required off-camera time to solve after two failed recorded video attempts to get them solved. The three levels mentioned were definitely the hardest for me, although except for Industry World 10, the solutions themselves aren't too difficult to execute. Industry World 7 - Storage facility 22-A was another hard one for me.
My favorite levels in this rank are Industry World 2 - Bait and switchboard, Industry World 3, Industry World 4 - Livewire lemmings, and Industry World 8
Industry World 1 - Welcome to Industry World Nice two skill types level (only bombers and stoners) to start off the rank. Not too difficult, but at the same time not a complete walk in the park.
Industry World 2 - Difficult one for me. Very nice puzzle involving figuring out how to time lemmings to go into the teleporter so that they go out in the correction direction to collect the gold. I kept thinking that a lemming needs to turn around to the left at the top to get the two gold buttons at the top. Turns out this is wrong. Instead, we need to use the fact that the direction lemmings come out of the receiver depend on the direction they entered the teleporter. It also took me a while to see platforming the small gap to the left of the entrance. One of my favorites of the rank! :thumbsup:
Industry World 3 - Once again, there were a lot of conceptual errors I made that prevented from solving the level. A lot of attempts had me one lemming short of the requirement. I kept thinking the climber that uses the teleporter was going to be lost no matter what. I also kept thinking to build and then platform over the zombies to collect the gold, but this requires bombing two of the zombies free and I would lose the climber no matter what. I also kept trying to get the lemmings compressed so that I could block in front of the locked exit while everyone else was trapped on the other side. The moment of feeling proud of using a builder to seal off the basher tunnel at the bottom was definitely short-lived, as that was another conceptual mistake. I don't know why it took me so long to see the solution here. I remember it all of a sudden came to me after eventually staring at the level long enough.
Despite this being one of the levels I stumped me badly, this is another favorite level of mine in the rank! :thumbsup:
Industry World 4 - Much easier than the previous level, although it took me longer than it needed to. Containing the crowd inside the fencer tunnel is very clever! :) Yet another favorite level of mine in the rank! :thumbsup:
Industry World 5 - Lemming on high Difficult one. I say the hardest part was holding back the crowd and also releasing the blocker if used. It's clear that it needs to be on top of a stack so that it can get released later. My solution here definitely feels very hackish. The part where I used a jumper to time the stacking and blocking on top of it seems unintended. It also has to be done at a specific time so that no lemming from either side can get over the stack. I almost thought I had to do a complete restart when releasing the blocker, but I was able to quickly realize that the part of the stack that remained to turn the blocker around could be used to my advantage to solve the level.
Industry World 6 - Retrograde My solution also feels a bit hackish here, especially with getting the spacing between the lemmings right so that no one slips past the teleporter. This one wasn't as bad as I thought, but it's still challenging IMO. I don't know if it's intended for the crowd to use the teleporter. The hardest part here is certainly keeping the worker alive after he releases the zombies and forges a path for them to walk into the mine traps. That's quite clever to use them for that purpose so the others can exit safely! :thumbsup: I'm going to guess my solution isn't 100% intended, especially since I have a jumper left, although it might still be acceptable?
Industry World 7 - As mentioned before, this level was a hard one for me. I thought using fallers from high places to stone to make a bridge to the exit is clever! :thumbsup: My solution definitely is hackish here, especially since I use a stacker to turn a lemming around and I platformed above to get over the stack. I checked the intended solution after I solved the level, and I'm definitely aware of lemmings turning around inside the stoner terrain mechanic. I definitely thought about using it here on this level, but as it turns out I simply was doing so in the wrong place. Because I used the cloners differently, this was what allowed me to spare a platformer for the gap in the middle.
Industry World 8 - Yet another level that managed to stump me for a long time. I think I ended up solving this level just slightly a bit faster than Industry World 3 even though they both took me 1.5-2 days. Once again, conceptual errors on my part that prevented me from solving this level. I tried other ways to solve it, including using a floater to bridge the gap and make a splatform for the neutrals, but I would always be a builder short. I also tried to get the glider to turn around to do the same, but turns out you cannot build into terrain to turn him around for that. My biggest mistake here was thinking a basher is always used to free the neutrals in the area where you need to send a climber up the crates to get the gold buttons. I also tried to bash through the long section and get the gap bridged before the neutrals arrive, but they always come before that can be done, if you don't hold them back. I also ran into problems with using builders to turn the climber around to prevent him from going over the crate on the left. Turns out that I never thought to not assign the floater a climber so that the builders wouldn't be wasted for that. So really, it was due to incorrect builder placements, along with conceptual errors, that prevented me from solving the level.
The key here is realizing how the building needs to be done so that everyone can still go out to the right later on. This I got down somewhat quick, but it took me a long time to see the builder wall is needed to free the neutrals and floater later. I think it was simply due to me thinking that this would just use up too many builders. Of course, I'm well aware of the builder wall trick (I have solved plenty of custom level packs that require it) :P
Shortly after getting the level solved, I realized that the level can be solved with a builder left to spare. That is the replay solution of mine I have attached. Still, amazing that a level with a very minimal skillset but plenty of builders could be a big problem, like it was for me :XD:
Industry World 9 - The specialist Somewhat difficult, although a bit easier than the previous level. I think it's quite easy to tell that the neutral is our allowed casualty, especially since he is a climber and therefore will climb into the fire trap after disarming the trap and collecting the gold. My solution is most definitely not intended, since I do have a couple of skills leftover, and I did check the intended solution after solving, and once again very different from mine :P
Industry World 10 - As seen in the final LP video, mine is very fiddly and quite timing heavy. My solution has several pixel precise skill assignments. All this time, I incorrectly raced a normal lemming to beat the neutral to the walker pickup before the final gold button is collected. Immediately after letting the intended solution play, it was clear that my solution is very different due to the start being completely different. This also told me that there's no racing of a normal lemming to beat the neutral lemming to the bottom. It still took me a while to determine that you used the zombie to infect the neutral so that it's no longer for him to collect the gold and pickups at the bottom. That's really clever! :thumbsup:
Since my solution is just as difficult or slightly harder than the intended, I still think it's too awesome to break, although I will understand if you want to break my solution, which misses the zombie infecting the neutral trick completely anyway.
This thus concludes an excellent pack by the both of you! It was a long and very difficult journey, but I'm so relieved to finally be done with the pack so that I can move on to other level packs I would like to LP. I also managed to solve the entire pack without hints on any of the levels, too! :laugh: In case that hasn't been clear, I'm one of those Lemmings players that prefers the satisfaction of figuring out and solving levels on my own without help/hints. I only watch solutions after I have solved the level for the first time on my own.
I can definitely recommend this pack to others thinking of playing it, although I will also warn that it's a very hard pack and to not expect it to be a quick solve. The only reason it took me 2 months to solve all of the pack is due to taking an extended break from it and the game Lemmings in general. I got to say all that time away really helped me to get my motivation for anything Lemmings-related back. It was definitely worth it.
I will get to the Integral Lemmings and All Hallow's Eve packs sometime! I have plans to LP them eventually, but it's not going to be for a while. As usual, I will link you to the LP once I get to them! ;)
Glad to hear you both have been enjoying my videos of me solving your guys' levels! :)
Hi Kaywhyn!
Congratulations on making it through our entire level pack, we really loved your letsplay!
Below are responses to each of your comments, made by tan x and myself.
We're working on a new version of the level pack, which will be coming soon.
Gear World and Jungle Resolves:
Ziggurat - This is the intended solution, well done!
What goes up - The intended solution criteria is that the rightmost forcefield must be used to turn a lemming around, so that it builds a bridge to catch the other lemmings. Your solution accomplishes this, so I consider this to be a valid solution, great work!
Waste Not, Want Not - Looks like another unintended solution! The main challenge that the level should pose is the exit being unlocked before the first lemming arrives there. Any solution which circumvents this is unfortunately classified as a backroute in my books. I know how to fix this one though.
Entrapment - The intended solution is that a shimmier is supposed to be trapped between the two forcefields on the underside of a platform bridge, however, like you said in your summary video, I don't think this is possible to enforce. Your solution seems a little trickier to pull off, since it requires timing, so I feel no need to modify this level further. Great work!
Lemdiana Jones - Once again, a solution that does not require all skill pickups is classed as a backroute.
Riddle of the Ancients - An acceptable solution! Not exactly what I had in mind but it does use all skills. :)
Welcome to Gear World - Yeah, the similarities to Jungle world aren't lost on me. I made this one to be quite easy, since originally Gear World came before jungle, but both of these intro worlds are designed to be easy.
Trial by fire - You are correct - this is intended! :thumbsup:
Lefty loosey righty flighty - Your solution here is intended; the leftover skills are only there to make the level more lenient, since it's very early on in the pack. :thumbsup:
Measure once, build twice - Hmm... I thought I'd already fixed a very similar backroute to this one. Look's like I'll need to make some more drastic changes! :devil:
Switching gears - Another intended solution, nice one!
Like clockwork - Thank you! I am also quite proud of this level. You figured out the solution - you need to use walkers so that the "clock" keeps "ticking", great work! :thumbsup:
Authorised Lemmings Only! - You got it in the end! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: I love levels that use the Flow Control mechanic of fiddling with the release rate!
Smoke Stacks - This level is far too easy to be at position 8 in the rank; I'll have to move it up in the level order. Your solution isn't intended, but it actually seems to make more sense than the intended one, so well done!
Just another cog in the machine - A nice solution! Good work!
Two by Four - Your solution deviates slightly from the intended solution, but is more or less correct. I may adjust the save requirement to make it slightly more challenging.
Mona World:
Welcome to Mona World - Well done on getting the intended solution on your first try! There are several other solutions to this level, but I don't consider them to be backroutes since this is only an introductory level.
Catch my drift - Great solution! The intended solution is slightly trickier, however, so this level is planned to be updated. Since the intended solution is somewhat counter-intuitive, and this is only the second level of the rank, the updated version will feature pickups in specific locations as a hint.
Sync or swim - Thank you, this level is one of my favourites too. However, your solution is actually a backroute! The updraft to the right of the level is supposed to be integral to the solution, so the updated level will be tweaked slightly.
Draft dodgers - Another unintended solution, however I expect this level probably has quite a few backroutes (it was made very late into development and I didn't have very much time to playtest it). Climbing over the metal on the left hand side is definitely unintended, however, so that will be tweaked.
Tightrope Citadel - A nice solution! Good work! :thumbsup:
Ad astra per aspera - Definitely a backroute. It would seem I'll have to get out the chisel again. Those columns are a little too pristine...
A caelo usque ad centrum - I've made a change to the level that will disrupt your solution. Yours is very close to intended, however.
Hallowed ground - Thanks! I have different criteria for what I consider to be a "backroute" based on each individual level. This level's criteria is "release rate must be altered at least once" and "all skills must be used", which I think is impossible to do otherwise, meaning any solution to this level is valid. Great job!
Any way the wind blows - Great catch! This is definitely a backroute, this level is supposed to be trickier. That being said, I don't know if the intended solution is still somewhat easy, so I may bump its positioning up to be earlier in the rank.
Ascending and descending - An excellent solution! This level came about after I realised that a digger tunnel was nine pixels wide, and stacker blocks were three pixels wide. The puzzle developed after that!
Guardian angels - Thank you! This level was originally not going to be a secret level, however I thought its solution was too vague and ill-defined, so we instead decided it would make a good secret level, rather than deleting it altogether. It has no set solution, since I found it had too many backroutes while playtesting. Still, it's quite a tricky puzzle either way. :thumbsup:
Wacky World:
Welcome to Wacky World - Nice work!
Full circle - This was a great level to watch you solve - I had no idea it would be so challenging, I definitely misjudged how hard this level is. It will probably be moved down in the level order. Thanks for letting me know about the sketches, I was sure I removed them all, but apparently this one slipped under the radar. They will be removed in the next patch.
Non Sequitur - This is one of my favourite levels! I really enjoyed watching you solve it. ;P Excellent work on catching the misdirection! I must say that I grinned devilishly when I heard you say that a stacker wouldn't work at the right side. :devil:
Mr Magoo - A similar solution to this has already been uncovered by Armani, so I made it into a talisman. It's not a huge departure from the intended solution, so I don't consider it to be a backroute.
Pole to pole - Thank you! Another favourite of mine. "Leap frog" was actually this level's name at one point, but I decided that "Pole to pole" fit better and sounded more unique.
Loony bin - This level, (along with Retrograde later on), is a level that I've now come to realise has too many backroutes. Rather than trying to hopelessly patch up every backroute, I think it would probably be easier to just bump it up in the level order, and have it as an open-ended early level.
The Gibbering Cliffs - Oof! This was a nasty backroute. I've taken the liberty of jamming more random bits of metal into the side of the cliff. Hopefully that will block this solution.
Neurosis Is No Excuse For Bad Manners - Still a backroute! I've tweaked the level slightly to stop this from happening.
When Life Gives You Lemmings - Hmm. Looks like a particular piece of citrus fruit is causing yet more issues. I've had problems with that trouble maker before! Fear not, for it shall be removed in the next patch! :P
Know when to hold 'em - This is one of the most evil levels I've ever made. :devil: I'm proud of how nasty this level is, and I loved watching you solve it in your LP, very well done!
Industry World:
Welcome to Industry World - Your solution is quite unique, well done!
Bait and switchboard - Another level which I seriously misjudged the difficulty on, this will definitely be moved up in the level order. Your solution is also a slight backroute, however. Luckily it's a simple fix. :thumbsup:
Revenge of the dead - Thank you, another level that I loved to watch you solve! I was honestly quite surprised that this had no backroutes, since it had quite a lot when I was playtesting it.
Livewire Lemmings - This level is really easy, it definitely needs to be at position #2 in the rank. No idea why I let it be this high.
Lemming on high - Your solution differs slightly from the intended one, but I don't consider it to be a backroute, since your solution fills both my criteria (1: Lemming must block on top of a stacker. 2: A lemming must go via the top of the level.) Since your solution meets both of these criteria, I consider it to be valid, nice one!
Retrograde - Like I mentioned earlier, this one has a ton of alt solutions, so I plan on moving this up in the level order. Any solution here is valid, so long as all three zombies destroy the mines.
StorageFacility 22-A - A good use of skills to solve the level. Nice work! :thumbsup: I've updated the level to enforce the solution I had in mind.
The Night Shift - Excellent work! The "builder cage" was the trick I had in mind for this level. Nice work on saving a builder too! I think I'll leave this level as it is. Solution accepted!
The Specialist - A definite backroute here! I've amended this level to avoid such eventualities.
Dead Weight - Your solution was brilliant, but alas! It was a backroute! I've changed the level subtly to prevent your solution from being valid. Excellent work though! :thumbsup:
Once again, thank you so much for playing through our pack! We really loved watching your series, and your solutions gave both of us valuable insight into improving and balancing our levels.
We'll be updating the level pack soon, with a few fixes and tweaks, as well as a reshuffling for the level order.
Version 4 of lemrunner has been released! The original post has been modified to contain the newest version of Lemrunner.
Special thanks to Kaywhyn and Armani for play-testing our levels; their solutions provided us with valuable insight and plenty of enjoyment. :thumbsup:
Changelog:
Waste not, want not - Removed the upper pillars.
Lemdiana Jones - More changes to terrain to prevent certain jumper positions from being able to reach the pillar.
Measure once, build twice - Added a dip and removed some pipe braces.
Catch my drift - The four blockers now must be acquired as pickups.
Sync or swim - Moved one piece of gold, ruined a balustrade to discourage digging.
Any way the wind blows - Repositioned the terrain to the left of the entrance, closed the gap between the two mines slightly.
Ad astra per aspera - Chiseled more chunks away from the columns.
Draft dodger - Added cracks to a metal block to prevent climbers from going over it.
A caelo usque ad centrum - Raised one gold on top of a pillar. Added a time limit of 4:00 mins.
Full circle - Removed sketches that were mistakenly included in the level editor (level otherwise remains unchanged).
The Gibbering Cliffs - Stuck more random bits of metal into the cliffside.
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Changed a jumper to a shimmier. Rearranged cheese. Added mangos.
When Life Gives You Lemmings - Removed a Very Naughty lemon.
Bait and switchboard - Removed a terrain piece from the left of the map.
Retrograde - Raised the electricity trap slightly.
Storage facility 22-A - Added an extra piece of gold above the exit.
The specialist - Reworked various platforms and hazards.
Dead weight - Removed pipes and a crate at the very top right of the level. Lowered the small platforms above the skill pickups/gold by a few pixels. Lowered the structure at the right by one pixel to make platforming more forgiving. NOTE: Although this shouldn't change the overall solution, it has the potential to break replays.
Additionally, we've re-organised the level order for each world. We did this because we felt that some levels were harder or easier than others, and we wanted the level order to more accurately reflect difficulty.
This may mean that some of your replays for certain levels may correspond to incorrect levels, sorry for this inconvenience!
I think there're only 3 or 4 backroutes remaining :D
These replays are basically same solutions but I had to adjust a little bit since the lastest update broke them :
Gear5, Mona3,6, Wacky8, Industry10
Now these are new replays you might want to check :
Jungle09 Waste not, want not
Jungle10 Lemdiana Jones
Mona02 Catch my drift
Mona07 Ad astra per aspera
Wacky09 When Life Gives You Lemmings
Industry07 Storage facility 22-A
Industry09 The specialist
Jungle09 Waste not, want not : Almost same solution as before which means I still have 2 leftover builders. ;P
Jungle10 Lemdiana Jones : I bet this is intended now. :thumbsup: It use all the given skills and pick-ups.
Mona02 Catch my drift : Now the solution seems somewhat obvious due to position of the blocker pick-ups. It's a very nice level though. ;)
Mona07 Ad astra per aspera : The latest update enforce me save a basher by extending the basher with platformers so I can remove two pillars with one basher. I think I almost got the intended solution but I still have two jumpers left.
Wacky09 When Life Gives You Lemmings : This must be intended. Very nice level! :thumbsup: I quickly found out that I had to extend the basher but how to do that was quite hard to see.
Industry07 Storage facility 22-A : Almost same solution. I still don't use a bomber.
Industry09 The specialist : This is certainly a backroute ;P
Feedback:
The visuals and level are really impressive! :thumbsup:
I especially liked 4,6,11 and 7 (even if 7 has a part I would make clearer: Realising that the force field indeed reaches over the 2 pixel overhang is not totally clear without peeking into true physics. Maybe make the overhang like 3-4 pixels. Let's say that cost me like 30mins ;)
Let's say just 1 level just left a bit of a sour mark due to connected pixel-precise assignments that lead to the otherwise working solution fail because of 1 pixel in different locations.
It's level 10 "Lemdiana Jones":
After a bit of time I saw the needed trick and method, but needed quite a lot of time to get it to work and it always failed because of single pixels!
But let's move to the spoiler tag for a more detailed discussion and how to maybe ease this up a bit:
The starting digger needs to be placed exactly so that after the digger+stacker shinanigangs the platform reaches through the low hanging wall and you are indeeed able to build.
This leads to the platform being too far away from the left wall so that the glider is JUST short.
But you got a stacker for an extension - which then usually leads to you jumping OVER the glider pick-up skill by a single pixel.
That leads up to 3 connected pixel-precise assignments.
So you need to be twaeking every single precise assignment around until it finally works which is really frustraiting when you know it must be the solution.
This could be solved:
Method 1:
- Remove a stacker, Make the left ceiling a little bit higher so that the glider lands on the platformer bridge without the extra stacker.
Method 2:
- Try moving the glider pick-up skill c.a 2 pixels higher so that the jumper almost always gets it.
The general level idea is great, but having multiple pixel-precise assignments directly depending on each other resulting in endless pixel tweaking of the otherwise correct solution is not fun.
Replays attached and I'll see when I have time to go through the next rank. :)
Hi IchoTolot!
Thank you so much for your replays and feedback. We're very sorry for the late response, we've been quite busy lately, so we weren't able to respond to you quickly.
Jungle world responses:
Welcome to Jungle World - Perfect solution!
Encore - Great work!
Ziggurat - Wow! This solution is completely unexpected. I'd hesitate to even call it a backroute because it seems so intriguing, well done!
What goes up - The intended solution.
The two towers - Good solution.
Shibboleth - This solution is very similar to the intended one, the skills are just used in a slightly different order. Great work!
Excavation - Thank you for the feedback for this level. I think it may need tweaking like you said. The level "what goes up" was made to introduce this puzzle, since that level contains a similar puzzle, except more forgiving, but it seems this level's terrain is too ambiguous.
Entrapment - This is a backroute, but as I've already mentioned, the intended solution to this level may be impossible to enforce. Oh well. Well done for solving it, though!
Waste not, want not - This is another backroute! This level seems to be tricky to balance around what I had intended.
Lemdiana Jones - Perfect solution! This level may see some tweaks in the future to reduce annoying pixel precision.
Riddle of the Ancients - A good solution.
Gear world responses:
Welcome to Gear World - Great solution!
Trial by Fire - Exactly as intended, great job!
Lefty loosey righty flighty - This is a backroute; may have to tweak this level.
Smoke stacks - I love seeing solutions to this level, since they're always so varied, well done!
Measure once, build twice - Perfect solution!
Switching Gears - Another perfect solution!
Like Clockwork - Perfect solution. Great job on saving a walker!
Just another cog in the machine - An interesting solution, especially since you walked straight through the grinder trap. Nicely done! :thumbsup:
Authorised Lemmings Only - Perfect solution!
Two By Four - Another perfect solution. Excellent work.
Mona world responses:
Welcome to Mona World - Solution is different from what I intended, but since it's just an intro level, any solution here is valid.
Catch my drift - Another very impressive solution, you somehow managed to save two blockers, which I thought would be impossible, great job!
Sync or Swim - The replay for this level is surprisingly long! I thought for sure you sent a bad replay! It's a correct solution, though! :thumbsup:
Hallowed Ground - This level is impossible to backroute, since all skills are required to complete the level. That being said, your solution is quite original and very impressive. Well done!
Tightrope Citadel - Perfect solution!
Any way the wind blows - Another backroute. I have no idea how to fix this one, unfortunately. Great job on managing to stump me! :thumbsup:
Ad astra per aspera - I would classify this as a backroute, unfortunately. I will have to chisel away at those pillars some more...
Draft Dodgers - I thought for certain that this level would have a ton of backroutes, but apparently not. This is the intended solution, great job!
A caelo usque ad centrum - Perfect solution!
Ascending and descending - Perfect solution!
Guardian angels - Another perfect solution!
Wacky world responses:
Welcome to Wacky World - Perfect solution!
Full Circle - This level differs slightly from intended, but the spirit of the replay is the same (the level's entire gimmick is using the central anti-splat pad multiple times, requirng the player to bash lower than expected). You did this in your solution, so I consider it to be valid. Great work!
Mr Magoo - Great talisman solution!
Loony Bin - This level unfortunately has a ton of backroutes, but you managed to get the solution which I had intended, so great job!
Pole to Pole - The fruits on this level are placed in such a way as to provide a clue to the player (the dead centre of each orange points to where you should build each stacker). You managed to beat this level without using that guideline, it must've taken a while to line everything up, very well done! :thumbsup:
Non sequitur - Perfect solution!
The Gibbering Cliffs - A very nice solution! A little different than what I intended, but still good :)
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Very creative, but I count this as a backroute. Looks like that purple goop will have to become a lot more dangerous... :evil:
When Life Gives You Lemmings - Oh dear! A nasty backroute. These accursed citrus fruits...
Know when to hold em - Very impressive solution, great work!
Industry world responses:
Welcome to Industry World - Great job on getting the talisman here!
Livewire Lemmings - This solution is exactly correct, great work!
Bait and Switchboard - A backroute, which seems tricky to fix. The intended solution is to build just before the slope, to put all the lemmings out of sync with each other, but this seems very hard to enforce. Great work here!
Retrograde - This level has no set solution, so everything here is valid. Great job!
Lemming on High - Technically a backroute, but the timing on this replay is so impressive! Well done.
Revenge of the Dead - This is the intended solution, with one slight exception. You used a builder/jumper at the wrong locations, which my brother once joked was technically a backroute. I thought the timing required to pull it off would be too fiddly, but you've accomplished it here! Great work! :thumbsup:
Storage facility 22-A - Perfect solution!
The night shift - Perfect solution!
The specialist - :lem-mindblown: The climber doesn't even get killed at that patch of electricity?! :forehead:
Dead weight - Perfect solution!
The original post has been updated to include the latest pack.
Note: The LR2 style packs have also been updated. You will need the latest version for this update to work.
Levels Changelog is as follows:
Added 3 new bonus levels (each rank now has 11 levels each)
Added a postview text for the last level of every rank.
Jungle World:
Excavation - The overhang and force-field have been extended slightly to make the solution slightly more obvious. This may break some replays. Also made the jungle way more humid.
Entrapment - Entire level has been completely reworked. Level is now easier to solve, and harder to backroute (hopefully). Also features the new "laserer" skill type.
Waste not, want not - Moved a gold. Removed a builder.
Lemdiana Jones - Tweaked some terrain slightly. Removed a stacker. Overall solution hasn't changed but should be more forgiving.
Gear World:
Lefty Loosey Righty Flighty - Modified leftmost terrain to remove a backroute. Also added a gear to the far right of the level to preemptively remove a backroute, and make the intended solution more obvious.
Added a bonus level, "Depth Charge"!
Mona World:
AnyWay the Wind Blows - Level has been heavily reworked. Features a slightly different skillset, and wider gaps between the lower platforms to enforce the intended solution.
Ad astra per aspera - Chiseled away at those pillars some more...
Wacky World:
Neurosis is no excuse for bad manners - Some colourful lumps have sprouted from that purple goop stuff. It must be spring.
When Life Gives You Lemmings - A lemon has become more angular. It must be spring.
Added a bonus level, "Lem Ninja"!
Industry World:
Bait and Switchboard - the two bashers are now in a pickup, rather than starting the level with them.
The specialist - Moved some patches of electricity to actually pose a threat to a climber. :forehead:
Added a bonus level, "Pixel Imperfect"!
Please note that some levels also have minor graphical reworks, such as different terrain pieces or new fog. These changes are purely cosmetic and shouldn't affect the solution/replays at all.
Special thanks to IchoTolot for his replays and feedback! :thumbsup:
Here are my updated solution including the new bonus levels. :)
Jungle World 10 is way better now, thanks for the update!
I noticed a new theme after backroutes have been patched.
There are quite a few levels now which need active use of the back and fourth splitter to seperate lems from each side. ;)
Also, "AnyWay the Wind Blows" is a lot harder now!
For the new levels:
"Depth Charge": I like the concept and the level, but like 2 pixels less terrain to go through could be beneficial as right now there is next to no leeway for the basher placements as the bombers just barely go through.
"Lem Ninja": One of my favorites of the pack now! :thumbsup: It looks so easy, but actually figuring out the route is really difficult as there are soooo many! May I ask you to submit level+replay for the community pack? ;P
Actually, I might go through the pack once more soon after backroutes have been patch out and may ask this for a few selected ones. The pack could need a few more levels from you two! :)
"Pixel Imperfect": I needed a bit to see whats going on here as you cannot use builders as a splatform, but as the same time cannot put stacker steps there. It is precise, but as you lukily only need to place them correct 2 times it's fine. Nice trick though!
In general, I think there are only a few single backroutes left at most. But that's only estimation. ;P
Hi IchoTolot!
We've released version 5.1 in response to your replays. It's only a minor patch, here's the changelog:
Ziggurat - Filled in a hole to prevent the bomber backroute. Should've released this one sooner, OOPS! :forehead:
Depth Charge - Changed the terrain slightly and replaced a block of metal with a smaller one to allow for more leniencey while bombing.
The Specialist - Added some metal to prevent mining.
The level "Entrapment" has not been modified, despite the backroute. This is because I feel the backroute may be impossible to fix. The intended solution seems easier to pull off, so I don't really mind all that much.
All of your other solutions are intended, great work! :thumbsup:
Additionally, my brother and I have been discussing levels to include with the community pack, and we've compiled a list of levels which we feel stand out above the rest:
Jungle 7 - Excavation
Jungle 10 - Lemdiana Jones
Gear 7 - Like Clockwork
Gear 9 - Authorised Lemmings Only
Mona 6 - Any Way the Wind Blows
Wacky 2 - Full Circle
Wacky 6 - Non Sequitur (Not too sure about this one - it's really misleading and tricky, unless you know the solution, in which case it's very easy)
Wacky 11 - Lem Ninja
Industry 6 - Revenge of the Dead
Industry 7 - Storage Facility 22A
Industry 10 - Dead Weight (Not too sure about this one either - the solution seems way too precise and unforgiving)
Do you agree with our selection? Are there levels you feel are missing from this list? We're also aware that we might have selected too many to be included. Is there a limit for level contributions?
Thanks for the fixes. I attached my resolves. :thumbsup:
I was surprised I found another solution to "Ziggurat" rather quickly as I had a few problems with that level before.
I still think "The Specialist" is a backroute though. :evil:
Regarding the selection, here are the levels which would be on my selection list (you may notice it is a bit similar ;)):
Jungle 7 - Excavation
Jungle 11 - Riddle of the Ancients (It just has that classic feel to it)
Gear 5 - Measure once, build twice (I was really impressed with that one. You might think it's fiddly getting up at first, but it turns out very clean)
Gear 7 - Like Clockwork
Gear 9 - Authorised Lemmings Only
Mona 6 - Any Way the Wind Blows
Mona 9 - A caelo usque ad centrum (I just loved the digger tunnel shinanigans!)
Wacky 2 - Full Circle
Wacky 11 - Lem Ninja
Industry 6 - Revenge of the Dead
Industry 7 - Storage Facility 22A
Industry 11 - Pixel Imperfect (Apart from the 3 precise assignments it's very clean and the trick is hard to spot)
In the end it is your decision what to submit though.
Currently there is no limit to submissions. I will only take action when I see that a rank has like a very heavy amount of entries from one person.
Given that you are two persons and not just one and you only have one submission so far I am willing to accept a bunch. ;)
Version 5.2 has been released!
This is just a minor update, fixing a few issues with the industry world; make sure you also have the correct style version.
The Specialist - Extended the rightmost part of the level, and added a piece of gold.
All levels featuring teleporters have had their teleporter exits moved down by two pixels, to fix a graphical error that tan discovered.
The solutions are completely unchanged, save for Pixel Imperfect, which was broken by the patch.
The intended solution (and replay file) remains unchanged.
The Specialist - Removed some steel and terrain from The Specialist to prevent a backroute.
This level really is becoming an arms race, huh! :laugh: