Lemmings Forums

NeoLemmix => NeoLemmix Levels => In Development => Topic started by: Gronkling on April 06, 2016, 02:00:53 pm

Title: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on April 06, 2016, 02:00:53 pm
I've started work on my level set properly this time, so here's a proper thread for it.

~Lemmings Evolution~ (Completed: 100%)

Overview
This will be a pack for neolemmix, mostly using only classic lemmings features (though occasional levels will make use of slight new stuff). It heavily uses my own graphic sets. New music too (that I didn't make). This will most likely be a hard pack, as in it wont have any 20-of everything sort of levels and stuff like that. The levels in this pack are small/compact too, there is a limit of 2 screen widths.

Ranks
Each rank will have 20 levels. The names are based on evolution as I wanted them to be something other than 'progressively more horrible adjectives' because hard levels are FUN! (Yes it's completely inaccurate to real evolution but it's close enough) Placement of levels are just being decided as I go along.

Amoeba - Easier puzzles and tutorials for more well known advanced tricks.
Fish
Amphibian
Reptile
Rodent

Preview Images


Current title screen (click to show/hide)

Release
This might be finished in late 2016 AT SOME POINT
If you would like to be a beta-tester to have sneak peeks and help me find horrendous backroutes so I don't release embarrassing levels, just send me a message (though don't if you want it to be a surprise when it's released e.g. let's players)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development}
Post by: Gronkling on July 04, 2016, 08:17:09 pm
Hi, I've created 50 / 100 levels for this pack now (though there a few I will probably replace), so I will now release a DEMO! This contains a level from each rank, making 5 levels total. All these levels are made in V1.43 but will most likely work in experimental releases too. There isn't any of the custom content such as music and font that'll be in the final release, just levels and tileset. Please send replays/backroutes :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: namida on July 05, 2016, 01:42:07 am
Quote
but will most likely work in experimental releases too

If you're using custom styles, they won't work in any of the experimental versions that have "ExNf" (Experimental - New Formats) in their version number since there's no new-format version of the styles. It will be playable on the experimental versions that predate the new formats (these just have "Exp" in their version numbers), though there's no guarantee it'll be solvable unless you've tested it yourself.
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Flopsy on July 05, 2016, 10:50:04 am
As expected, only got the first 2 levels done. They are all very well made though.

I had the feeling I had the right idea on Level 5 but couldn't quite pull it together *sigh*

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 23, 2017, 12:40:55 am
The lemmings spirit has returned to me! :8:()[:.o0(:lemming:)

I've created a few more levels for this pack in the past week, in the time I've been away I changed my mind on a few things. I won't only using my tilesets anymore but also other ones too (because I got bored using the same 5 sets all the time). Also one or two levels use new skills. I'm still limiting myself to a maximum size of two screen widths.
Also I'm going to allow a few beta-testers, so if you would like to have sneak peeks and help me find horrendous backroutes so I don't release embarrassing levels, just send me a message (though don't if you want it to be a surprise when it's released e.g. let's players)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 23, 2017, 05:15:26 am
The lemmings spirit has returned to me! :8:()[:.o0(:lemming:)

I've created a few more levels for this pack in the past week, in the time I've been away I changed my mind on a few things. I won't only using my tilesets anymore but also other ones too (because I got bored using the same 5 sets all the time). Also one or two levels use new skills. I'm still limiting myself to a maximum size of two screen widths.
Also I'm going to allow a few beta-testers, so if you would like to have sneak peeks and help me find horrendous backroutes so I don't release embarrassing levels, just send me a message (though don't if you want it to be a surprise when it's released e.g. let's players)
Ah good that means the minimal tileset will also be seeing release sometime
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 23, 2017, 09:22:35 am
the minimal tileset will be a gift/prize to people who either test at least 10 levels or finish all the levels when it's released :evil::evil::evil::devil: (i changed my mind on this idea to :P)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 23, 2017, 04:22:21 pm
the minimal tileset will be a gift/prize to people who either test at least 10 levels or finish all the levels when it's released :evil::evil::evil::devil:
You can't keep em locked forever though, I at suggest setting a deadline for the challenge
But If I can test if not beat 10 levels at least, then I accept
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 23, 2017, 04:29:21 pm
im not going to release it publicly EVER it is an exclusive unlimited prize! if you get it i ask you not to upload it to other people ^_^ you can use it in your own levels though. there's no deadline (unless you ask me 498534 years in the future then maybe itd be hard)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 23, 2017, 07:11:32 pm
im not going to release it publicly EVER it is an exclusive unlimited prize! if you get it i ask you not to upload it to other people ^_^ you can use it in your own levels though. there's no deadline (unless you ask me 498534 years in the future then maybe itd be hard)
If I come off as rude, I apologise
Kill me for asking but, (also sorry to do this) What if  IchoTolot posts all the solutions on his channel? what then?
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 23, 2017, 07:54:05 pm
8-)--- :XD:-->
*shrugs* i dunno I guess you'd still get it if you sent all the solutions but that would ruin the fun wouldn't it, and it would be very boring to create 100 replays based on videos just to get a tileset. This prize isn't particularly serious. :P
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 23, 2017, 08:23:00 pm
I'll put this a calmly as I can (unless you would want me to Rant, You should see me rant on discord, don't worry I have a special room for it ;))
Anyway, locking a tileset behind a kind of "paywall" is never a good thing.
Especially if someone doesn't have the time to solve puzzles of your level or can't because they feel stumpted and they can't do anything about it.
Now if it were temporary paywall, I would cut it some slack, I know you mean well as a prize but I heard how tough your puzzles are, and experienced them first hand I don't think putting behind a paywall that could be the hardest level pack which could rival "Nepsterlems"
Some people (Myself included) are dying to edit with your minimal tileset, and IMO All Tilesets that are remotely finished should be released to public after sometime has passed.
Plus, I don't want to do something as shady as bother someone else to give it to me but never share it anywhere else after that.
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: IchoTolot on January 23, 2017, 08:26:00 pm
I think the exclusive price tileset is a poor motivation idea to begin with to be honest. :8():

It's more a motivation to "ruin the fun" as you said if you really want to get yourself the tileset.

Also I think with the new loose file format it will get hard to keep it hidden anyway ;P
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 23, 2017, 08:28:10 pm
oh fine i just thought it was a fun idea :XD: ill just release it when the pack comes out
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 23, 2017, 08:36:57 pm
oh fine i just thought it was a fun idea :XD: ill just release it when the pack comes out
Fair enough
Like I said, what you could've done what handle it like Lemmings Plus V
Set a Deadline and Talisman to unlock a Tileset
if the Deadline isn't met, Release em anyway
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 24, 2017, 02:38:56 am
Hate to double post but I think an update to the .nxp would be nice since i can't run it on 10.12.XX onwards
And maybe add a few more levels to the demo too
But I solved Hydnellem Packii out of boredum and I can say....Good level but Brutal too
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: nin10doadict on January 24, 2017, 06:12:17 am
The tilesets are very pretty but the levels are ridiculously hard. Got the first two, but those solutions are very precise. Third one seems to have this impassable block (I know it doesn't but it sure looks it), 4th one I don't even, 5th one is much the same. Much like Lemmings Plus IV, I doubt I'd get far in the full game.
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 24, 2017, 07:49:54 pm
I updated the demo to work on new versions (I didn't add any new levels to it though)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: GigaLem on January 28, 2017, 06:42:32 am
Lastly, I'm tested to ask about testing because of the minimalist tileset, I know we'll get it anyway but still
:( Darn it it feels like a tease, I want to make levels with it already darn it, The patience is killing me gyah
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on January 28, 2017, 12:19:26 pm
I give in!!!! :) :o :lem-shocked: :lem-mindblown: 8-)
Now we can talk about something other than this tileset.
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, DEMO Released}
Post by: Gronkling on March 05, 2017, 11:09:20 pm
I'm up to 75 levels! That's three quarters there!! I shall release 2 more images in celebration (though the final product might be a bit different due to testing).

(http://i.imgur.com/JofUEly.png)
Tropical Ruin - Fun with tileset mixing!!

(http://i.imgur.com/RskR2DS.png)
Sport Pod - I make use of the fact there's no minimum screen size any more! This pack emphasises small levels and sometimes they'll get tiny
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, 75% complete!}
Post by: mobius on March 05, 2017, 11:18:56 pm
Tropical Ruin looks hard without even knowing the stats. Sport Pod looks interesting despite being so small and simple.
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, 75% complete!}
Post by: GigaLem on March 06, 2017, 12:36:52 am
Oh wow Tropical ruin looks beautiful
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, 75% complete!}
Post by: nin10doadict on March 06, 2017, 05:44:09 pm
Indeed. Very pretty.
Sport pod isn't just going to hand you a builder and platformer, is it... No, of course not. :evil:
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Development, 75% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on March 07, 2017, 08:20:18 pm
Well none of the levels in this pack will use any new skills so you can count out the platformer :P
No new objects either other than preplaced lemmings sometimes.
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on April 10, 2017, 03:23:42 pm
All levels, music etc is now complete! I could release this pack now if I wanted. First I would like to do around a month of beta testing to remove any glaring backroutes (which I'm sure exist) and difficulty curve mistakes. Please PM me if you would like to be a tester! Your name can go in the credits unless you don't want it

EDIT: I have enough testers now
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Strato Incendus on July 18, 2018, 02:02:19 pm
So, are things moving forward here? The pack has been ready for over a year, but isn't released yet?

Are the levels so difficult that even your testers haven't finished them yet? :evil:

If so, I'm going to have to base my Gronkling level for Lemmings World Tour only on the demos you've uploaded so far...
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on July 18, 2018, 02:04:59 pm
im currently converting them into the new format, the levels still have backroutes in them that need fixing. there are also 3 levels that need replacing right now (1 i forgot the solution for completely and was too backroutable anyway, 1 broke due to a feature that was removed, 1 is just not very good)
i hope i can get it out before the end of august, but no promises as usual
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Strato Incendus on July 18, 2018, 05:22:19 pm
Okay, thanks for the info! I gave your demo a shot in the meantime. I was quite surprised that there was only one level I couldn't solve - I expected to get stumped by literally every single one of them, after what I had read about this pack here so far.

I also believe I may have found yet another backroute, because I managed to save every lemming on the last level.

Perhaps some of the things I write here are redundant, because your testers have probably informed you about them already, but anyway :D :

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Overall, just these couple of levels look very promising already, and they're also exactly the type of smaller, restricted-skillset levels that I tend to enjoy the most (rather than huge X-of-everything levels or levels with annoying terrain shape that are bound to make any execution fiddly by default). :thumbsup:

If my criticism in the spoiler tab sounds a little harsh here and there, that's not intended to detract from the generally very good first impression that I got from this pack! :) It's merely that the pixel precision in some of these levels makes them artificially harder than the conceptual solution actually is.

Also, thanks to the specific tricks you used, these five levels already provide a sufficient amount of information for me to compile a Gronkling-style level for Lemmings World Tour. ;)

I strongly encourage you to keep going with this pack, especially since you seem to be so close to the finish line!
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on July 18, 2018, 05:53:44 pm
level 5 on the demo is actually on incredibly thin ice on whether i replace it, its incredibly ugly and very backroutable, and looking at the solution with fresh eyes its not that impressive (also the traps not working is just a mistake, id never use that as a solution). theres another level in the exact same situation too, so I may end up replacing 5 levels

ill change level 3 a bit as it is a bit unfairly un-obvious that you can do the thing you mentioned (SPOILER!!!)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Strato Incendus on July 18, 2018, 07:57:13 pm
To be fair, I actually like level 5 as a whole. If you make the fire traps working as intended, I'd have to go back to the drawing board completely, because I don't have any clue on how to do it differently. My solution required all the skills, so the only two reasons I thought it was a backroute were 1) me saving everyone, as I said before, and 2) the fire traps at the ceiling which were not working.

With regard to level 3...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on July 18, 2018, 08:47:32 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Nessy on July 22, 2018, 03:35:17 pm
Hi Gronkling!

I took a quick look at the demo you still had at the beginning of this thread and I have attached my replays below :)

Comments (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: joshescue18 on July 27, 2018, 01:56:32 am
I liked your pack, Gronkling, because these levels look great. In 2016, I played the 5-level demo. I was so excited about to play this pack. I should've test it sooner, but it is too late. I felt jealous that I'm waiting forever for the release. :(
Title: Re: Lemmings Evolution {In Testing, 100% complete!}
Post by: Gronkling on July 27, 2018, 03:09:00 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/1duRWMo.png)