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Lemmings Boards => Reviews => Topic started by: mobius on September 19, 2012, 01:54:12 am

Title: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 19, 2012, 01:54:12 am
review thread for Lemmings Revolution.
Why let the reviewing end! I picked Revolution because it’s a game I love and I can’t review L2 or any of the others. (I could review paintball but that appears to have bad beef here. Not a single thread of discussion about that game! :o I’ll have to fix that eventually.)
Go from 4-5 to 4-6 etc.
Rules follow the same as the other reviews. (Except don't count on me to strictly enforce them. I'm easy).

I’m starting out with level 4-4 because all the levels before that are tutorial levels. If anybody really wants to review those levels you can of course. I personally think they’re mostly boring (even for tutorial levels)
I don’t know where to get pictures other than from the game itself. You couldn’t see the whole level from that however.
Thanks to finlay for use of his spreadsheet for much of the level information.
I’d kind of like to talk about general things about the game itself as well when they come up so feel free to do that. There’s a lot of things that bother me. (Despite this being my favorite Lemmings game).

4-4 Seafood Sarnie

Lemmings: 25
Save: 20
RR: <50 [< means RR can only go down, > means it can only go up. If otherwise not mentioned the RR is totally changable]
time: 10 minutes

skills: 20 bombers 20 blockers 20 builders, 20 bashers

good:  A good beginner level with a crab. I like the crab, I don’t really know why.  :D

bad: the laser gate is right by the entrance making it pretty pointless. Unless (as I’m guessing) it was just more tutorial stuff to show off what it does. Kind of an odd skill set for a beginner level.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: ccexplore on September 19, 2012, 11:17:13 pm
I don’t know where to get pictures other than from the game itself. You couldn’t see the whole level from that however.

When I started playing the game last December, I did screenshots of each level before any lemmings come out.  I forgot exactly why but I think partly so it's possible to examine a level at times when I don't want to actually fire up the game (especially at that point before GP's patch, so it's unplayable on Win7).  To account for the cylindrical nature, I always captured 4 screenshots per level.

Of course, I stopped playing after the 8th column and haven't gotten a chance to go back into it yet, so even if I found a good place to post the screenshots to, it won't cover many of the later levels anyway.

I would review the next level, but I don't even have the screenshots with me at the moment, so I don't know what the next level is or what it looks like. :XD: Maybe later tonight.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 20, 2012, 02:13:12 am
When I started playing the game last December, I did screenshots of each level before any lemmings come out.  I forgot exactly why but I think partly so it's possible to examine a level at times when I don't want to actually fire up the game (especially at that point before GP's patch, so it's unplayable on Win7).  To account for the cylindrical nature, I always captured 4 screenshots per level.

Of course, I stopped playing after the 8th column and haven't gotten a chance to go back into it yet, so even if I found a good place to post the screenshots to, it won't cover many of the later levels anyway.

oh cool  :) That's nice. If you'd upload that I'd take it for my own reference as well. That would come in handy. You can put all the pics in or just one. I don't know which would be best, try and see. Maybe we could paste them together into one long horizontal pic. I looked online btw and didn't find much by the way of good quality pics.
Don't worry about after column 8, I can take pics of those if/when we ever get that far. I have a decent screen cap program now.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Akseli on December 16, 2012, 12:16:25 am
Lemmings Revolution levels! I haven't reviewed any levels yet because I guess it may have affected a little that I'd have to run the game and look at the level so I can remember it, whereas levels from other Lemmings games are quickly and easily on display on the Internet or in Lemmix, but I won't let that thing bother me too much.

4-5 - A Long and Lonely Road

Lemmings: 30
Save: 20
Release rate: 10
Time: 10 minutes
Skills: 20 bombers, 20 blockers, 20 builders, 20 bashers

Good: A very straightforward practice level. The most exciting part is at the halfway, where you have various different possibilities to turn the crowd towards the higher platform. Water pools bring some diversity to the layout.

Bad: Maybe a little too long distance to go with too few different obstacles.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on December 16, 2012, 06:35:08 pm
hey Akseli, do you know about finlays+LemSteven’s spreadsheet? (I attached it to this post). It Lists all levels of almost every lemmings game and info on them. You can just use that for reference, (it’s what I’m doing. But I also sometimes play the level too, to refresh)
-----------------
4-6 Lems at Loggerheads

Lemmings: 10
Save: 5
Release rate: 5
Time: 10 minutes
Skills: 10 climbers, 2 floaters, 2 builders

Good: A good beginner level (I guess we’ll be saying that a lot.) Its generic comment but I can’t think of anything else. Thought, I do like having to make them all climbers, something that's not done often in the early levels of older lemmings games.

Bad: Kind of boring.

this level is very similar in layout to “Let’s play catch”
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Akseli on December 17, 2012, 12:16:10 am
Yes, I know about the spreadsheet and I downloaded it last summer. :P For example, it gave me some help when I posted a list of builderless official levels in "No Builders" topic. Still, I have to play the game so I can recall the details of a level I'm going to review, and I can't even remember every Lemmings Revolution level from the title yet. Level stats can be easily gathered from the spreadsheet, though (but I'll also keep an eye on them in the game so that there aren't any mistakes!). :)

I find "Lems at Loggerheads" decent, basic puzzle for the beginners, and that's one of my favourite easy levels of this game. In my opinion there aren't many good puzzles for beginners in original games, for example in Fun and Tricky ratings, and ONML is tough already right from the Crazy rating.

5-1 - The Abyss

Lemmings: 15
Save: 10
Release rate: 5
Time: 10 minutes
Skills: 15 climbers, 15 floaters, 1 blocker, 15 builders

Good: A quite personal view now, but this level is nostalgic because I remember it from a demo version, too. I like the word "abyss" for some reason. The player needs to take care of lemmings falling from the heights.

Bad: Could be more decorated.

The Abyss has very similar layout compared to 11-4 - Lets get those fingers moving.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on December 17, 2012, 02:58:02 am
^The Abyss. For some reason that level had me stumped when I was a kid. ??? no idea why since I had an easier time with much harder levels.

I find "Lems at Loggerheads" decent, basic puzzle for the beginners, and that's one of my favourite easy levels of this game. In my opinion there aren't many good puzzles for beginners in original games, for example in Fun and Tricky ratings, and ONML is tough already right from the Crazy rating.
yeah I agree. There were few good ones from the old games. Few like Lems at Loggerheads. Btw, do you know what the title means? or where it refers to?


5-2 Kriss Kross

Lemmings: 30
Save: 20
Release rate: 15
Time: 5 minutes
Skills: 40 blocker, 40 bombers

Good: it’s simple and fun. I like the “kriss kross” way the lemming must move about the level. There are also a number of different solutions. This level is fun to do challenge for. It is possible to complete three challenges at once!
[this title also reminds me of my childhood in school. I once had to dance to music that 'tells' you what to do' by singing "sliiiide to the right...sliiiide to the left...kriss kross!]

Bad: it's a little bare looking.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Minim on December 17, 2012, 04:17:58 pm
Hey, I'm pleased that we've got a Revolution review topic to add to our giant collection of reviews. :)

5-3: Sergeant Bash

Number of Lemmings: 20
Save: 10
Release Rate: 15 (fixed)
Time: 10 minutes

Skills: 2 bombers, 2 builders, 10 bashers, 2 miners

Good: Fairly colourful design, introduces a new trap.
Bad: Even with the trap, there's no challenge whatsoever, unless you call timing the bashers to hit the wall a challenge, which isn't hard at all.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on December 18, 2012, 01:37:04 am
yay, somebody else to review. I too, as this is my favorite lemmings game. We must review entire lemming’s library! :P

[quick comment on Sergeant Bash; you can actually totally ignore the saw and only lose 1 lemming!]

5-4 The Crowded House

Lemmings: 10
Save: 5
Release Rate: 39 (fixed (I think))
Time: 10:00

Skills: 5 bombers, 5 blockers, 10 builders, 5 bashers, 10 diggers

Good: I like the symmetric style. It’s also an interesting layout, for an early level. It’s a short step up in difficulty.

Bad: I think the save requirement is a little low. But then the total # of lemmings are low as well. The RR being fixed seems useless here. Plus strange RR of 39? This starts a bizarre trend in this game. Maybe they wanted to annoy people with OCD?  ;P
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Akseli on December 25, 2012, 11:48:27 pm
yeah I agree. There were few good ones from the old games. Few like Lems at Loggerheads. Btw, do you know what the title means? or where it refers to?
I have no idea. :b

5-5 - One Way Ticket

Lemmings: 50
Save: 40
Release rate: 50, not changeable
Time: 8:00
Skills: 5 climbers, 5 floaters, 5 bombers, 5 blockers, 10 builders, 5 bashers, 1 miner, 2 diggers

Good: The layout resembles "4-5 - A Long and Lonely Road", but now here are more different obstacles and (almost) all different types of skills must be used. I think I find this level more interesting than a couple previous ones due to versatility.

Bad: Hmm I remember there was an acid pool which could be emptied by pulling the lever, but that's completely unnecessary. Or was that there to introduce beginners how the levers work? :P Then it's ok.


Btw are those ccexplore's pictures of levels yet available anywhere ???
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on December 26, 2012, 06:14:44 pm
Bad: Hmm I remember there was an acid pool which could be emptied by pulling the lever, but that's completely unnecessary. Or was that there to introduce beginners how the levers work? :P Then it's ok.

actually it’s not totally unnecessary—the acid pool cannot be crossed unless you build over it. You’re probably remembering that lemmings will walk “on air” over empty acid pools. This is a phenomenon throughout the entire game. It only happens with acid pools.

Quote
When an acid pool is drained, the lemmings don't fall into the drained pool, but will instead walk across the top.  The exception to this is if an acid lemming is walking on the acid while it is draining, in which case the lemming will go down with the acid. (LemSteven)
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=585.0

I forgot to mention; there’s a good walkthrough for this entire game on youtube. Which is a handy way to get info and pictures too :).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A19J4krb9XQ&list=PL0750E99D04921FDE
(in priohiko’s video he builds over the acid pool… either he just doesn’t know about this or his game is different)
------------------------------

5-6 Swings Both Ways

Lemmings: 20
Save: 16
Release rate: 5 and 10, but changeable
Time: 10:00

Skills: 20 floaters, 10 bombers, 10 blockers, 10 builders, 10 bashers

Good: Despite appearing as a simple early level it can actually be a bit tougher than it seems at first. If you do it the easy way (with blockers) you save only the minimum. I like using two different kinds of lemmings to make contrast.

Bad: this level annoyed me a little when I was a kid. It’s the first one where you need to get some timing right. Also doing challenges for this level is possible but can be frustrating.


Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Akseli on February 03, 2013, 05:44:58 pm
actually it’s not totally unnecessary—the acid pool cannot be crossed unless you build over it. You’re probably remembering that lemmings will walk “on air” over empty acid pools. This is a phenomenon throughout the entire game. It only happens with acid pools.
Haha, of course. :D I remember this, but I guess that I really haven't ever thought this in this kind of easy level, so I built over the pool!

Thanks for the link, I might find this useful when reviewing levels.

5-7 - Wandering Free

Lemmings: 20
Save: 10
Release rate: 50, not changeable
Time: 10 minutes
Skills: 5 of each

Good: The most exciting part of this level is at the beginning where the player has to dig down to avoid lemming knocking his head to the ceiling.

Bad: Apart from what I just mentioned, this level actually doesn't offer anything compared to what we already have had earlier. I might find this one of the least notable levels in this game.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on February 04, 2013, 05:07:29 pm
6-1 The Iron Curtain

Lemmings: 30
Save: 20
RR: 10
Time: 10 minutes

skills: 1 climber, 1 floater, 5 bombers, 5 blockers, 5 builders, 5 bashers, 2 miners, 2 diggers

good: introduces the retractable wall. A number of different possible routes and not real demanding. It’s also fun to dig down and let the water lemmings fall from very high.

bad: You don’t actually need to use the retractable wall at all if you use the right path, making it not really the best introduction level. (That’s the path I used when I first played) An odd skill set for an early level, kind of sparse.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Minim on January 28, 2015, 05:42:13 pm
This must be the level that nobody wanted to review, so I'll give this one a go.

6-2: Make Mine a Large One

Lemmings: 30
Save: 25
Time: 5:00
Skills: 5 climbers, 10 floaters, 5 bombers, 2 blockers, 2 builders, 5 bashers, 5 miners, 5 diggers

Good: At least there are a few steel blocks in the way.
Bad: Even with them, it's still too easy for its position, and not a particularly enjoyable level either, even though there's not much repetition involved, and also, I could easily make this off the Lemmings level editor, as there are no unique elements (switches, acid, etc.) in this bland level.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on June 28, 2017, 11:15:12 pm
I don't think this thread is active anymore, but I'll still give it a go.
- - - - - - - - - -

6-3: Now You’re Stalking

Lemmings: 50
Save: 49
Time: 6:00
Release Rate: 5
Skills:
- Climber: 1
- Floater: 1
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 1
- Builder: 6
- Basher: 10
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 2

Good: Good puzzle level, especially for a beginner where it’s not obvious what has to be done at first.
Bad: Sometimes placing the blocker is a bit tricky as two or three lemmings would be bunched up close together after the digging.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on March 07, 2018, 07:57:53 pm
6-4 Escape to Victory!

40 Lemmings -- Save 40

8:00 -- 10 of each skill

Good:

Introduces the weasels; [sort of like NeoLemmix zombies] moving single kill traps that move and function pretty similar to lemmings. They actually did a decent job of making a level that forces you to deal with the weasels not just ignore them altogether. Simplest way is to sacrifice a lemming to set up a trap for them. But there are other ways to avoid killing one like here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4xNM5cJfZI&index=22&list=PL0750E99D04921FDE

Bad
The RR is fixed (so that you can send everyone out quickly and get home before the weasels reach you) but that means you might have to wait at the end for everyone to come out which is a tad annoying.

I'm anxious to get through this middle chunk of imo lesser levels and get to the good ones!
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on March 07, 2018, 09:40:18 pm
6-5: Let's Play 'Catch'

Lemmings: 10
Save: 5
Time: 5:00
Release Rate: 1
Skills:
- Climber: 10
- Floater: 1
- Bomber: 4
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 1
- Basher: 0
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 0

Good: Overall an interesting "fall survival" puzzle as it isn't as straightforward as one would think and requires some careful thought and planning.
Bad: Destroying the terrain to reach the exit can be a tad annoying at times. You have to time your bombers and make sure that you leave some kind of small platform at the bottom of the terrain you bomb through, otherwise the lemmings won't survive the fall even with a well placed builder.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on March 11, 2018, 02:41:41 am
^ 6-5 is probably my second least favorite level in the game. For the reasons mentioned and because it doesn't use any new features, feels like an L1 level but somehow less forgiving.

6-6: Two Sides to Every Story

Lemmings: 50
Save: 40
Time: 10:00
Skills:
- Climber: 10
- Floater: 1
- Bomber: 50
- Blocker: 50
- Builder: 50
- Basher: 10


Good: Relativity complex level, some thought needed to make a path; decent use of gravity changers. And interesting use of multiple lemming types. There's several different ways of solving it.

Bad: the saw doesn't seem to serve much purpose (other than an amusing way to kill lemmings if you've failed). The side of the level feels bare.

btw: for any unaware; if you'd like to look at the levels but can't/don't feel like firing up the game:
playlist of every level

https://www.youtube.com/user/pirohiko/playlists
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on March 12, 2018, 12:34:41 am
6-7: Wood you believe it?

Lemmings: 50
Save: 40
Time: 5:00
Release Rate: 18
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 5
- Builder: 3
- Basher: 10
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 10

Good: Interesting puzzle with figuring out how to use water lemmings to save non-water lemmings and get them both to the exit. Also, the pun?! How can that not be a thing to put here under "Good" :P :P
Bad: I really can't think of anything bad to say about this level to be honest, so I'm going to be nitpicky here and say that the building for the splatform to save the non-water lemmings and the tank can be a bit too precise at times. At least for me those were the reasons why I failed the level when I was younger.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on March 16, 2018, 01:56:15 am
6-8: Wheelbarrows of Doom

Lemmings: 100
Save: 98
Time: 4:00
Skills:
- Climber: 2
- Floater: 2
- Bomber: 2
- Blocker: 2
- Builder: 30
- Basher: 2
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 0

Good: An interesting and tough puzzle, especially for a beginner.
Bad: The time limit can be very tight at times, and it can be very intimidating for a new player (plus you waste a lot of this time trying to hit the switch on the far right). You can also backroute the level by using the large quantity of builders to go over the top of the level and bomb your way into the exit :D
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on March 16, 2018, 09:18:50 pm
7-1 Designed with Love

Lemmings: 99
Save: 85
Time: 10:00
Skills:
10 of each

*one of my favorites in the game* :D

Good:
It's a relatively complex and good exploration type level using lots of elements; laser gates, pools and weasels. It may take a while to figure out but there's plenty of room for error and it offers many solutions.

Bad: Pirohiko exposes a very lame backroute which bypasses the entire level. Though this might actually be a little harder to pull off then most other ways

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKAnJ2eLqzk&list=PL0750E99D04921FDE&index=28
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on May 08, 2018, 12:20:31 am
7-2: Penelope Lem Stop

Lemmings: 32
Save: 32
Time: 6:00
Skills:
- Climber: 10
- Floater: 10
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 1
- Basher: 8
- Miner: 4
- Digger: 0

Good: A very intimating quick-as-you-can level where two lemmings are the last hope of a large crowd of lemmings trapped in a pit with a slicer slowly getting lower, and lower, and lower until it slices all the lemmings one by one in horrible carnage and...... but anyway it is an interesting puzzle that requires crafting the fastest route through the level to free the lemmings out of that death pit.
Bad: You can easily backroute this level and skip having to go through the entire left and bottom part of the level.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on June 01, 2018, 02:01:31 am
7-3: How do we get up there!

Lemmings: 50
Save: 50
Time: 4:00
Skills:
- Climber: 2
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 1
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 8
- Basher: 1
- Miner: 2
- Digger: 2

Good: Interesting "Just A Minute"-type level concept where the main obstacle is getting to a hard-to-reach area of the level as fast as possible. Forward planning and timing are essential and the only way to pass this level.
Bad: But oh my goodness the time limit in this level is so incredibly tight. Sometimes you can have the solution craved out but because of a few little details you got wrong you run out of time. Sometimes you can do everything as optimal as possible and you still run out of time. Sometimes you do everything correct and yet to add salt to injury there is a freakin' switch next to the exit that closes a door. If the crowd does not pass this door by that time then you are s**t out of luck even if you reached the exit before time runs out. I mentioned that this was an interesting "Just A Minute-type" level and it is, but not even the time limit in the "Just A Minute" levels were this brutal. To make matters worse this level is very early on in the game, which makes it more frustrating to new players to come across this level so early on in their playthrough. Even the most patient people in the world would rage at this level or at least skip it (like I did). To summarize: this one isn't a winner in my book :( :(
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on June 01, 2018, 02:18:38 am
7-3: How do we get up there!

Lemmings: 50
Save: 50
Time: 4:00
Skills:
- Climber: 2
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 1
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 8
- Basher: 1
- Miner: 2
- Digger: 2

Good: Interesting "Just A Minute"-type level concept where the main obstacle is getting to a hard-to-reach area of the level as fast as possible. Forward planning and timing are essential and the only way to pass this level.
Bad: But oh my goodness the time limit in this level is so incredibly tight. Sometimes you can have the solution craved out but because of a few little details you got wrong you run out of time. Sometimes you can do everything as optimal as possible and you still run out of time. Sometimes you do everything correct and yet to add salt to injury there is a freakin' switch next to the exit that closes a door. If the crowd does not pass this door by that time then you are s**t out of luck even if you reached the exit before time runs out. I mentioned that this was an interesting "Just A Minute-type" level and it is, but not even the time limit in the "Just A Minute" levels were this brutal. To make matters worse this level is very early on in the game, which makes it more frustrating to new players to come across this level so early on in their playthrough. Even the most patient people in the world would rage at this level or at least skip it (like I did). To summarize: this one isn't a winner in my book :( :(

I kept wanting to review but forgetting. XD A lot of things can be said about this level.

This is imo the hardest and worst level in the game. It's the worst example of a poor time limit. I'm actually half convinced that was a mistake and they intended on 5:00 or more. It wouldn't be the only mistake in the game.

The level minus the time limit is actually decently difficult (especially considering its spot in the game and it's relative simplicity). It makes good use of doors. The beginning area is more complicated than it looks at first. There seem to be multiple approaches but actually only a few really work.
The door near the exit forces a unique approach where as Nessy said you need to get the crowd caught up to the worker in time, which is sort of novel.

So the level would be fun and tough enough with out the time limit shenanigan. It spoiled what was otherwise a very good level.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on June 02, 2018, 07:01:48 pm
7-4 There's Only One Way Down!

Lemmings: 25
Save: 10
Time: 5:00
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 5
- Blocker: 5
- Builder: 5
- Basher: 0
- Miner: 5
- Digger: 0


Good: I like the wood textured background

Bad: Why does this level exist? Especially at this spot!? This would work on the first or second column. There's no challenge what-so-ever and it's not the least bit interesting. It doesn't even work as a breather level; it just feels silly and pointless especially after the last level which was the hardest in the game!

Sadly this is an example of the pattern that spoiled other games of similar nature (imo) like Oh No More Lemmings, Chips Challenge, etc: A poor selection of levels.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on June 03, 2018, 12:08:58 am
7-5 What a Fantastic Pair of Birds

Lemmings: 20
Save: 20
Time: 5:00
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 0
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 4
- Basher: 2
- Miner: 4
- Digger: 1


Good: This was a great level in my opinion where the limited skillset makes figuring out how to control the crowd, getting to the bottom of this level, and bypassing the bird traps a nice challenge.

Bad: The level requires a bit too much terrain to mine through near the exit which is okay for me on its own but combined with the time limit it makes this level an unnecessary time cruncher. Honestly that's it. Another thing I wanted to throw in is that I personally dislike the bird traps because when I was little the sound they made when a lemming got caught in them would scare me so much :scared: To this day I still can't hear it :XD:
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on September 06, 2018, 12:32:19 am
Let's get this rolling again! :)


7-6: The Lone Ranger

Lemmings: 100
Save: 90
Time: 10:00
Release Rate: 50
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 2
- Bomber: 20
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 5
- Basher: 0
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 0


Good: There is an interesting puzzle aspect to this level where you need to figure out how to create a splatform for a crowd of lemmings that are making their way towards this fatal fall through multiple teleporter rooms. There are multiple ways to go about this.

Bad: Making the splatform is the only true puzzle in this level. The final bit of this level is the bottom floor which contains four walls that need to be taken out with well-timed bomber placements because you don't really have any other skill to help with that. Fortunately, the level does give you a margin of error and messing up once isn't the end of the level.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 06, 2018, 01:01:04 am
7-7: Swarthy Seadogs!

Lemmings: 100
Save: 99
Time: 10:00
Release Rate: 1
Skills:
- Climber: 1
- Floater: 1
- Bomber:
- Blocker: 10
- Builder: 10
- Basher: 10
- Miner: 10
- Digger: 10


Good: Lots of gadgets around and used in a good way. This level demonstrates the uniques of this game well. Was pretty hard for me first time. But the beginning area has multiple ways of dealing with the initial puzzle of containing/saving the crowd. One of my favorites.

Bad: when the buzz saws are not moving they are not harmful; this is a bit misleading and confusing and isn't demonstrated well.

Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on September 13, 2018, 12:20:49 am
7-8: Build 'em up ....then bring em down

Lemmings: 50
Save: 45
Time: 10:00
Release Rate: 18
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 10
- Builder: 50
- Basher: 0
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 10


Good: An interesting puzzle that teaches players how to build across large gaps without accidentally building too high to create lethal falls. It also teaches players how to use destructive skills to stop builders midway to land on the multiple safe platforms.

Bad: I don't think the level itself is bad, but it is a level that would have worked better a bit earlier in the game than its current position. I would have preferred these types of levels before 4-4 than the more dragged out tutorial levels that got boring after a while.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 13, 2018, 09:36:11 pm
7-9: Love Train Boogie

Lemmings: 25
Save: 25
Time: 10:00
Release Rate: 80
Skills:
- Climber: 10
- Floater: 10
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 10
- Basher: 20
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 10


Good:
It's an interesting challenge of get a worker (or workers) to open the path to the exit before the crowd gets there because you're not supposed to hold them back.
This level seems inspired by or homage to 'Lemming Express' from ONML.
Despite some downsides I liked this level overall, it stumped me a little bit as a kid.


Bad:
There are several things about this level that confuse me like the many water tanks which seem to serve little purpose (draining them doesn't save time or skills you still need to build over them) and the placement of the switches makes no sense at all. I'm not sure what the intended solution is but it seems that you aren't supposed to contain the crowd; but you can, and actually that is only one of a few backroutes. Another silly method is simply going under the one way wall, and yet again the game almost seems to encourage this by giving you unnecessary amount of 20 bashers. This isn't the first or last time the game seems to have almost purposefully left in silly backroutes.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on September 14, 2018, 03:06:32 am
"Love Train Boogie" is a classic Lemmings Revolution level in my opinion and I think you did it justice with your Good and Bad explanations :) I honestly don't know what is up with those water tanks and I don't think it was meant to be part of any type of intended solution. Maybe they should have focused more on preventing backroutes :evil:

- - - - - - - - - -

8-1: Bounce around the world!

Lemmings: 50
Save: 46
Time: 5:00
Skills:
- Climber: 1
- Floater: 2
- Bomber: 4
- Blocker: 4
- Builder: 6
- Basher: 0
- Miner: 0
- Digger: 2


Good: This was one of my favorite levels as a kid and it continues to be one of my favorite levels to this day. It's a puzzle involving splatforms but it is much more unobvious on how to do it and it has a tighter skillset that didn't allow for just a "build anywhere and anyway" you want type of solution. The level title is so awesome as well :) and a classic. It also has two entrances which the regular forum members around here know I love <3 although the fact that the lemmings pass the destructive terrain on the level from both sides does add a extra layer to the puzzle.

Bad: It is very easy to fall victim to super precise and finicky solutions. I don't really think it's the level designer's fault though. It's just one of those levels that has a good solution to it but it just falls victim to unintended "stuff" that can't always be patched out.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 15, 2018, 02:19:51 am
I agree Bounce around the world is harder than it looks. It looks very simple but turned out to stump me for a while at first.

8-2 Lock In

Lems: 14
Save: 11
10:00 minutes

2 climbers
2 floaters
3 bombers
20 builders

Good: Another level that looks rather simple (and sparse) at first but turned out to be quite a bit harder. 20 Builders seems like 'you basically have infinite builders' :P but it is actually quite a challenge to ration them out. The main idea is a group of lemmings getting traped in an area and how to save them from outside (somewhat similar to but different then Penelope Lem Stop).

Bad: I found this level somewhat annoying because my solutions (I found at least two) always seem to rely on a lot of precision.  But that tends to happen a lot with builders in this game. I remember trying a lot of things that failed on this level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8oeHw677ek&list=PL0750E99D04921FDE&index=38
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on September 18, 2018, 11:34:53 pm
"Lock In" for me was one of the first WTF puzzle that had me super stumped when I was a kid! I agree with your comments and despite needing a lot of polishing it was one of the most memorable levels for me.

- - - - - - - - - -

8-3: Under and Up

Lemmings: 50
Save: 48
Time: 5:00
Release Rate: 40
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 0
- Builder: 9
- Basher: 1
- Miner: 2
- Digger: 1


Good: This level was strange to say the least. I feel like there was supposed to be a decent puzzle somewhere in here and I'll say that is enough information to put that under the "Good" section.

Bad: But I don't understand this level: 1) There is a giant lava pit in the middle of the level that a weasel on top lowers by hitting a laser switch. This allows you to just build over the teleporters, walk through the now empty lava pit, and then build over the next teleporter to the exit. Was this intended? If not why lower the lava pit instead of having it as a solid backroute blocker? 2) If you try to solve the level intentionally there seems to be something very wrong with the way builders behave when you build through those doors and platforms that have been opened through switches. This makes it really hard to build out of the pit that I think is the part of the level you go under and up in represented in the level title. 3) The time limit is super tight and it is unnecessary.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 19, 2018, 12:11:11 am
Under and Up is one of the main candidates (which I mentioned earlier) as seeming to indicate that they intentionally created backroutes in some of these levels. As to why; I have no idea. While it sounds silly, given the number of glitches in the game and the shaky nature of the game's development I wouldn't be surprised if they went though the levels (as intended) and because of glitches (like what Nessy mentioned about this level) instead of fixing them, just decided to make fixes to the levels to make them easier, but who knows.
---------

8-4 Nice Shootin' Tex!

50 Lemmings
Save 42
4:00


floaters: 1
bombers: 6
blockers: 3
builders: 7
bashers: 1


Good: I assume the shooting in the title refers to getting the timing right on bombers. Aiming the builder is not really a problem as it there is a steel block as a marker (which is nice).

Bad: Other than that there isn't much to this level. It's just 1 long builder bridge, some timed bombers (blah) and sacrificing some lemmings to close the door at the top. I found this level sort of bland.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on September 19, 2018, 11:57:29 pm
8-5: Water way to go.

Lemmings: 30
Save: 25
Time: 10:00
Release Rate: 50
Skills:
- Climber: 10
- Floater: 10
- Bomber: 10
- Blocker: 10
- Builder: 10
- Basher: 10
- Miner: 10
- Digger: 10


Excellent: The pun in the title of course! :P

Good: I found this level to be quite an interesting puzzle. The top layer of this level is pretty straightforward... until you reach this certain switch in the middle layer that frees a crowd of Water Lemmings nearby. The catch is that it also activates a killer saw that will slowly start to kill the Water Lemmings one by one. In order to save them the normal Lemmings have to hit another switch that is too far away and it's pretty much impossible to hit it on time. The main puzzle revolves around going about the level in a more non-linear way.

Bad: Nothing to be honest. I guess it is pretty easy for its place and you don't really know the switch is a bad switch at first until you hit it but that's with anything in any game with stuff like this I guess!

Fun fact: I remember playing this level with my dad and when I found out what that killer switch did I refused to hit it ever again. My dad would ask me how I was going to free the Water Lemmings but I just told him I will find another way... I never did :P
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 20, 2018, 12:32:12 am
Water Way to Go: one of my favorite levels in the game. During my first play of this game this was the only tier 8 level that I could solve early on and I subsequently solved (if memory serves) 9-6, 10-7, then a little later 11-6 which are both way easier then those around it as well.
I like that this level isn't too hard but isn't trivial; it's a pretty decent challenge using exclusive Revolution gadgets.
Only bad things I'd say are it's position; it's quite a bit easier then levels around it. Some of the things in the level may be a bit pointless, (like the teleporters) but they serve a nice decorative feature, as well as the crab.

fun fact: this is the only level where the teleporters make an actual sound. For whatever reason they make no sound anywhere else in the game.

This level also has some interesting challenge solutions to it.
https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=1059.msg39018#msg39018
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 22, 2018, 12:46:48 pm
8-6 As Quick as you Can!

Lemmings: 101
Save: 96
4:00


[I'm no longer going to carry on writing out the skills, since we can't post pictures it doesn't do much good imo]

Good:
The title refers to the theme of a race; the worker needs to make it to the switch in time to save the others. It seems very simple in retrospect but stumped me at first.

Bad:
Not a bad level idea but the idea is used several times now (Penelope Lem Stop..).  The two hatches make the solution sort of obvious when you realize that part of it and a bit trivial. I just wasn't real impressed with this level.
I don't like how building out of the pool requires two builders but it looks like 1 should be sufficient (or almost sufficient)
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: Nessy on September 28, 2018, 07:09:36 pm
8-7: Watch Out! Evil about!

Lemmings: 50
Save: 45
Time: 6:00
Skills:
- Climber: 0
- Floater: 0
- Bomber: 2
- Blocker: 2
- Builder: 12
- Basher: 10
- Miner: 3
- Digger: 0


Good: There seems to be an interesting puzzle with making sure the weasels head out ahead of the lemmings into the teleporter that leads straight into a lava trap, and there seems to be an interesting puzzle involving a careful navigation to hit the correct switch on top to open up the platform to get into the exit.

Bad: But I stress the word "seems" a lot under the Good explanation because there is a horrible backroute where you basically just build to the exit from the right side after the weasels have fallen. You skip the entire level like this! Even if this backroute didn't exist I'm not even sure if the intended way is possible as I remember always running out of builders and having no idea what to do to converse them in that tight space that the switch needed to open up the platform to the exit was.
Title: Re: Level Review--Lemmings Revolution
Post by: mobius on September 28, 2018, 11:55:16 pm
Good: There seems to be an interesting puzzle with making sure the weasels head out ahead of the lemmings into the teleporter that leads straight into a lava trap, and there seems to be an interesting puzzle involving a careful navigation to hit the correct switch on top to open up the platform to get into the exit.

Bad: But I stress the word "seems" a lot under the Good explanation because there is a horrible backroute where you basically just build to the exit from the right side after the weasels have fallen. You skip the entire level like this! Even if this backroute didn't exist I'm not even sure if the intended way is possible as I remember always running out of builders and having no idea what to do to converse them in that tight space that the switch needed to open up the platform to the exit was.

I too wondered for a long time if the apparent intended solution was even possible; and I can say it is. :D It is quite a challenge though. It was a fun to figure out how to conserve builders but at the same time sort of feels like it wasn't intentional...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

 This is a case where it almost seems to me like the level was designed as a ruse and the 'backroute' was actually intentional. It's just another one of many levels here where I really don't know what to make of it; or what they were thinking when designing it.