Hey everyone, so I've got a few levels to randomly share that aren't part of any pack but may be a part of Lemmings Plus, a Lemmings Community Pack or Lemmings Cranium 2 if I make such a thing in the future. For now though, play, enjoy and remember for the Level of the Year award if you think they're good enough!
Enjoy! Feedback is welcome.
Changelog
Bashergrum:
V2: Terrain flattened slightly beneath trapdoor to remove backroute by JawaJuice
The Oubliette:
V2: Floor reshaped in rightmost pit and added steel block in order to mitigate effects of Basher/Blocker cancellation trick by JawaJuice.
V3: Leftmost steps moved closer to the exit to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
V4: Plugged up the gap in the left wall to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
V5: Increased height of steel on right side of pit to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
V6: Reshaped the leftmost wall to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
V7: Increased height of steel on right side of pit (again!) to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
The Sphinx' Riddle:
V2: Thickened the sphinx' neck to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
V3: Made the upper platform slope downwards on the left side to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
V4: Increased the height of the overhang near the sphinx to prevent backroute by JawaJuice.
Got three more levels for you. One was a pair of levels for Level Design Contest #32 before I went with my "Ice Cream Cake" levels, while the other is another random one. Coincidentally, they're all brick levels!
@Crane Solved A Step Down With Difficulty - with difficulty ;) Man, your levels are kinda evil if this was anything to go by. Ingenious though! I look forward to playing the rest when I get the time :)
Spoiler
I might have fluked the talisman there as I couldn't really a see a use for the other climber.
Response
Not my intended solution, but the main trick with the Builder/Slider/Shimmier is there, so I'll let it pass; well done. The talisman comes from saving at least 2 tools.
Super-spoiler!
Also... the 2nd Climber is a complete red herring!
I have a reputation of making rather difficult levels, but I'm glad you're enjoying them - I look forward to seeing your solutions to the rest of my levels.
@Crane Bashergrum solved! I found this one a little easier than Step Down, though still tricky.
Spoiler
It actually reminds me of a level from another pack I played a long time ago (I forget which), where the solution involves freeing the blocker at the end and then making the last two lemmings climbers - I guess this is a variation on a classic puzzle really. Since I remembered that one, the general approach was fairly quickly apparent; the hard thing here is working out the best way to contain the crowd so that they can be released with access to the bridges that have been built. A blocker left over, which I suspect might have been intended to interrupt the digger and leave a little splatform, though the nature of the terrain made this unnecessary. I would say hopefully your intended solution this time, but probably not as I didn't have any use for the two floaters.
That is a backroute unfortunately. Here's a fixed version (also modified the post above)... at least I hope it's fixed. Any digger pits you put in that area should no longer have an overhanging lip.
I think I know the level you mean. I did base it off that level as a 'better' way of doing it, since freeing the blockers in that level required some very precise Digger/Builder tricks that the author had overused and were very frustrating to pull off.
Yes, I did wonder about that because I was initially specifically trying to get a digger pit with an overhanging lip and it didn't seem possible - when I did pull it off, it was more by luck than judgement! I'll take a look at your updated level.
In the meantime, here's my solution for The Oubliette.
Spoiler
Funnily enough, I was talking in another topic about one of LemFan's levels utilizing a trick I thought was less-well known; turning around a basher with a blocker at the same time freeing the blocker. If I've done this correctly, I believe the same trick is used here.
I wish I could tell you how much I hate that trick - it breaks so many levels and it's so hard to get the timing down! Still, I've hopefully patched the level to try to mitigate its effects.
Sorry, I seem to keep breaking your levels with backroutes here! :XD: I think I may struggle with this particular update as I couldn't see any other way of doing the level, but I'll take a look.
Let me know if my solution to your updated Bashergrum meets with your approval now!
Spoiler
I get what the floaters are for now, assuming this was intended. It's quite precise in the execution, if it is!
There is a less precise way you can use the second Blocker, but that's an acceptable solution - well done.
Intended use of second blocker
Turn the Basher into a Digger in the same location, then turn another lemming on the right side of the Digger tunnel into a Blocker. The Blocker quickly gets undermined, but the Digger is now facing left instead of right.
Quote from: Crane on November 23, 2025, 05:16:33 PMThere is a less precise way you can use the second Blocker, but that's an acceptable solution - well done.
Intended use of second blocker
Turn the Basher into a Digger in the same location, then turn another lemming on the right side of the Digger tunnel into a Blocker. The Blocker quickly gets undermined, but the Digger is now facing left instead of right.
Spoiler
Ha, yes indeed. I've used that so many times, I don't know why my brain went straight to the more fiddly thing of releasing the basher with blocker via digger! Still, acceptable I think, as you say. Nice level!
I can confirm that your added steel in The Oubliette patch does make a solution using the basher/blocker trick impossible: it means that the 3-bridge way up is a pixel too low. So I think you can consider that backroute fixed. As for my alternative solution, it just required thinking about the problem differently. Hopefully this is what you intended now.
Not quite. Always going to be backroutes with enough playtesters! Let's see how this does. I moved the leftmost steps closer to the exit.
Quote from: Crane on November 23, 2025, 05:42:30 PMNot quite. Always going to be backroutes with enough playtesters! Let's see how this does. I moved the leftmost steps closer to the exit.
Third time lucky? :XD:
Quote from: JawaJuice on November 23, 2025, 06:13:43 PMQuote from: Crane on November 23, 2025, 05:42:30 PMNot quite. Always going to be backroutes with enough playtesters! Let's see how this does. I moved the leftmost steps closer to the exit.
Third time lucky? :XD:
Looks like that I have to plug up that gap after all! 4th time lucky?
Quote from: Crane on November 23, 2025, 06:26:09 PMLooks like that I have to plug up that gap after all! 4th time lucky?
Probably not lol ;)
Spoiler
Given that this solution now utilizes the steel that wasn't there before and also relies heavily on precise timing/blind luck, I'm guessing this isn't want you're looking for either! I'm just not doing what you want me to do here, am I? Something tells me that trap on the right should be involved (otherwise what's it there for?), but I don't see how.
Not to worry - that's what playtesting is for. This was an easy enough fix. And maybe that trap is involved, or maybe not.
Quote from: Crane on November 23, 2025, 07:05:25 PMNot to worry - that's what playtesting is for. This was an easy enough fix. And maybe that trap is involved, or maybe not.
We could do this all night :D
Yes, yes we can!
Well, you got me beat this time! I can no longer backroute the level but neither can I see what you're trying to get the player to do here - I think I'll have to leave it to someone better than I to solve and move on to your other levels :)
Don't worry too much - it may suddenly click for you! Thanks so much for helping me to patch it.
I'm not gonna beat myself up too much - I know you and your devious levels by reputation ;) You're right, sometimes I find a solution can pop into your head when you're not even consciously trying to solve it (a sure sign you play too much NeoLemmix!)
I've just done The Sphinx Riddle. You're going to tell me this is a backroute as well, aren't you? :)
Quote from: JawaJuice on November 23, 2025, 09:46:26 PMI'm not gonna beat myself up too much - I know you and your devious levels by reputation ;) You're right, sometimes I find a solution can pop into your head when you're not even consciously trying to solve it (a sure sign you play too much NeoLemmix!)
I've just done The Sphinx Riddle. You're going to tell me this is a backroute as well, aren't you? :)
Absolutely! Good find.
Ha OK, I'll have another look!
In the meantime, I think I squeezed another backroute out of The Oubliette (hard to believe this was your intended solution!). If not, gimme a hint - have I ever been on the right track?
Definitely not intended, so now the steel on the right wall is higher up, probably giving away the intended solution more and more - oh well!
Clue
Try climbing to the right instead of the left.
Can you double-check that the Basher/Blocker trick still doesn't work? I ask because I shifted the steel plate on the far right down by 1 pixel so the miner doesn't hit it but still break through - I figure it's safer.
OK, will have another look and check that previous backroute. Cheers for the clue! I'm curious, not having been involved in playtesting levels before, when you're getting folks to playtest a pack, is it normal to have this many iterations of a level or are other players simply less obtuse? XD
Spoiler
I took a different approach to The Sphinx. This feels more intentional to me, except for having a couple of floaters left over again.
Quote from: Crane on November 23, 2025, 10:39:19 PMDefinitely not intended, so now the steel on the right wall is higher up, probably giving away the intended solution more and more - oh well!
Clue
Try climbing to the right instead of the left.
I can confirm that your change does not re-enable the basher/blocker trick. You also fixed my previous backroute. I'm really at a loss with this level though, despite the clue. It seems crazy hard! Either it utilizes an obscure trick I'm unaware of or I'm just blind to this particular level! You might need a new pair of eyes on it I think.
@JawaJuice: I'm sure you'll get it eventually.
Clue 2
The first thing the Climber does after ascending the wall is bash.
Sometimes, yes, one does get many iterations of a level in public playtesting. Privately there may be lots of versions too when you have a single playtester, and they often try variations of the same backroute until stumbling upon the intended solution (if they don't find it first). Admittedly I didn't playtest The Oubliette level much before publishing it.
In the case of The Sphinx' Riddle, there are many red herrings and sometimes a player find something that no-one else has ever thought of, which is what you're doing now!
Dang! I was pretty pleased with that Sphinx solution! I tried again - this is maybe a variation on my previous backroute though.
I guess this topic is accepted as a kind of sand pit then? I'm happy to take these back and forths to DM if they might annoy any other members.
Spoiler
RE: Oubliette, it did occur to me to bash as soon as the climber had ascended to the right (just in trying anything mode!), but it didn't seem to lead anywhere useful.
It might be a good idea to move it to DMs since the topic with all the levels gathered together, as well as other people's levels, will start getting buried (P.S. they're on page 18 (https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=3743.msg106961#msg106961) everyone!)
I should have seen that one coming with the miner into the steel. Made a fix! Hopefully the levels are almost completely patched!
I dare say, you should give the recent Level Design Contest levels a try. We'd welcome any backroutes or intended solutions you find.
Quote from: Crane on Today at 12:26:31 AMIt might be a good idea to move it to DMs since the topic with all the levels gathered together, as well as other people's levels, will start getting buried (P.S. they're on page 18 (https://www.lemmingsforums.net/index.php?topic=3743.msg106961#msg106961) everyone!)
I should have seen that one coming with the miner into the steel. Made a fix! Hopefully the levels are almost completely patched!
I dare say, you should give the recent Level Design Contest levels a try. We'd welcome any backroutes or intended solutions you find.
Another thing you can do, which some have done (Turrican, Niesch, etc.) and are somewhere on the in-development board in their own personal topic and are now pretty much part of a level pack that has since been released, is make your own personal topic where you post your own levels, e.g, a topic called
Cranes' Levels.
I probably should do, yeah. I didn't think I had enough levels this year to justify it - sorry for flooding the board!
Quote from: Crane on Today at 01:05:33 AMI probably should do, yeah. I didn't think I had enough levels this year to justify it - sorry for flooding the board!
No worries! I've went ahead and done that now. Looks much better and tidier now! :thumbsup: Feel free to edit the topic title in the OP by the way, this is just merely a suggestion :)