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NeoLemmix => NeoLemmix Levels => Topic started by: Armani on July 21, 2021, 04:43:50 AM

Title: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 21, 2021, 04:43:50 AM
I'm happy to announce the official release of my first level pack! :-[


(https://i.imgur.com/w3iCO18.png)

- Featuring new Neolemmix skills including Slider and Laserer!
- 100 levels divided into 5 ranks
- Focus on original L1 and L2 graphic sets and as well as several custom tilesets by various authors.
- Covering wide range of difficulty : From medium-difficulty levels to very challenging levels that require you hard thinking.


1.) Download Links(Dropbox):

Level Pack: Lemmings Uncharted V5.8 (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fbtfls0zxp5630x7s0sam/Lemmings_Uncharted_V5.8.zip?rlkey=jlzhd8e18ryt9aak38odm5f7q&dl=1)
Music: Lemmings Uncharted Music (https://www.dropbox.com/s/h4ulnbokv0hpwl6/Lemmings_Uncharted_Music.zip?dl=1)
Intended Solution Replays: Solution Replays (https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/lpmieja0lytxlhksyp9cw/UnchartedIntendedSolutions.zip?rlkey=4b0d798dz4qqkj2jdxft4q41a&st=1ftbklb2&dl=1)

This pack has all the music files in the subfolder "Uncharted". So do not manually move the music files into the main music folder!
The only thing you have to do yourself is to extract both of them into your main NeoLemmix folder.
(https://i.imgur.com/V2UynZw.png) (https://i.imgur.com/PHEUsy6.png)
            Yes! :thumbsup:                            No! :devil:



2.) Ranks

This pack is divided into 5 ranks:


1. Aries (Medium)

These levels are simple and easy. :D
There are X-of everything levels, mild puzzles with small skillset and even an action-based level with infinite jumpers!
But don't feel too comfortable. It already enters slightly harder territory toward the end of the rank!

(https://i.imgur.com/zw7PdSP.png)
King's Cove

2. Gemini (Medium~Hard)

It's not much harder than the first rank.;)
These levels are still simple and light.

(https://i.imgur.com/XDeW08E.png)
Between Madness and Creativity


3. Leo (Hard~Very Hard)

Now you should be well prepared to use your thinking engine in creative ways. :P
A lot of levels require outside-the-box thinking and unobvious tricks.

(https://i.imgur.com/pjDBDmw.png)
Almost Paradise


4. Libra (Very Hard~Extreme)

From this rank, these levels will give even the top-notch solvers a lot of troubles! :evil:
You sometimes have to find completely new tricks you've never seen before.

(https://i.imgur.com/wO5EzoM.png)
Slip N Slide


5. Aquarius (Extreme~)

Brace yourself for puzzle nightmares! :devil:
These levels are the hardest puzzles I could give you.

(https://i.imgur.com/OkdtxY6.png)
Forgive Us



3.) Music Credits:
List of Music
Uncharted_01: 영웅전설5(The Legend Hero5) OST - The Dark Empire (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVTtTHAWPNA)
Uncharted_02: The End Is Nigh OST - Retrograde (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiwr5WTdlt8)
Uncharted_03: SayMaxWell Helltaker - Epitomize[Remix] (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkBXYy_jOwc)
Uncharted_04: Earth 3 (Lemmings PSP) - Bumpsy Hills (from Lemmings Destination)
Uncharted_05: Thwomp Ruins (Mario Kart 8) - Moon Song Remix (Cave Story) (from Lemmings Destination)
Uncharted_06: Sonic 3 Ice Cap Zone Act 1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYxlqTpZ-24)
Uncharted_07: Self Composition
Uncharted_08: 테일즈위버(TalesWeaver) OST - Reminiscence (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlFDY5TMgeg)
Uncharted_09: Same with Uncharted_08 but raindrop sounds added
Uncharted_10: 데스티니아(Destinia) BGM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOPRHX20FEs)
Uncharted_11: Color Therapy - Wintering (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcrAr9H74KI)
Uncharted_12: Shokugeki no Soma Season 2 OST - The Global Innovator of Taste (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWeWfsUm1KQ)
Uncharted_13: Obliteracers OST Transporter - Iceberg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YFIvyNUBok)
Uncharted_14: PimoLems 1 (from PimoLems)
Uncharted_15: jeux video et des bas - Shadow of the Beast Amiga Intro Remix (from Lemmings United)
Uncharted_16: Mega Man 7 Shade Man (from Lemmings Destination)
Uncharted_17: Silent Partner - Runner (from Lemmings United)
Uncharted_18: Bon Appétit Eurobeat Instrumental version (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXBgjOumRRQ)
Uncharted_19: Emperor: Battle for Dune OST - The Strategist (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqzQl0sffm0)
Uncharted_20: Freedom Planet OST - Freedom Planet Theme (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tei9eGf8tDs)
Uncharted_21: Heartbound OST - Avocado (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZAT31CJblI)
Uncharted_22: LyricWulf Spooky Scary Skeletons MIDI rendition version (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2ED9U5eudI)
Uncharted_23: 요구르팅(Yogurting) OST - Always Piano Cover (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-bRtEnrTlU)
Uncharted_24: Twisted Metal PS3 OST - Shoot to Kill (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bG4Lns1qRU)
Uncharted_25: Doki Doki Literature Club! OST - Ohayou Sayori! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUWuDdfe7v4)



4.) Thanks to:

- Namida for creating and maintaining Neolemmix
- Everyone who created or converted all the tilesets I used in this pack
- Nessy for allowing me to use the butterfly-shaped terrain pieces from his level "Butterfly Cult" in one of my level "Bloodthirster".
- Ichotolot, Strato Incendus, Kaywhyn and NieSch for inspiring or motivating me to make my own level pack
- My lovely girlfriend for making the final level of Lemmings Uncharted
- Lemmings Forum community for general support and being nice and friendly

and most of all, you for playing my pack. :thumbsup:



5.) External Links:
Let's Play Lemmings Uncharted by kaywhyn: Youtube Link (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YMQQeA_czw&list=PLbp2m4KlFpJsrZJRZKTb2AATwWeHNlA2c)
The Tomato Watcher's Lemmings Uncharted by Armani: Part1 - Youtube Link (https://youtu.be/eHyRVENBnns), Part2 - Youtube Link (https://youtu.be/8Ms8QiNo71k), Part3 - Youtube Link (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KH67jfTo5_o)
IchoTolot's playthrough of Lemmings Uncharted: Youtube Link (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsznsB2ZXyk&list=PLKR1N9oJTTlL7NFl9AQcf2KmmUd69XupK&ab_channel=IchoTolot)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on July 21, 2021, 05:05:17 AM
Congrats on your first level pack's release, Armani! :thumbsup: What a great accomplishment. Another pack for me to play and bust my brain through. As such, this pack has been added to my "to-lp" list, a decision I might regret later due to signing up what sounds like a very difficult pack to lp. Nevertheless, I will rise to the challenge and see how far I can get with it in my LP. In case it hasn't been made clear even after almost a year and a half since I first posted publicly on this site, I don't mind hard levels, especially the good kind of hard which is very satisfying to solve and figure out. Hard levels are my type of levels that I like solving, though I like playing and solving levels of all difficulties, especially since I will suffer burnout from playing nothing but hard levels, like with United, and therefore easy levels were a welcome sight in the ensuing months after my very long struggle with United after an entire year.

In any case, I won't be LPing this pack right away, as I have other packs in mind that I been meaning to get to for quite a while but haven't gotten around to LPing yet. So, Lemmings Uncharted will have to wait for a few more months. Rest assured that I will be LPing your pack when I get to it! ;)

Once again, congratulations on the level pack's release, and I will look forward to the challenges within!
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: NieSch on July 21, 2021, 06:18:55 AM
Congratz Armani! I've been looking forward to this pack. It all looks and sounds very promising. I will check it out soon and I will try to solve at least one of your "extreme" levels. :lem-shocked: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on July 21, 2021, 03:18:31 PM
So many packs so little time. ;)

I will play this as I genuinely enjoy soling your puzzles, but first I promised to solve a few other packs first.

But I will 100% get to this! In the mean time other people can then at least sort out the worst backroutes. :devil:

Also, comgratulations on the release! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 24, 2021, 04:29:49 AM
V1.1 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-1 12 Midnight Circus - added some water
-1 16 Cheese in the Trap - added a bit of terrain
-1 19 Yawning Crevasse - added a bit of terrain
-1 20 Renaissance in Lemmingsland - added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 25, 2021, 01:00:21 AM
V1.2 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-1 19 Yawning Crevasse -added some water, added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: NieSch on July 25, 2021, 07:02:33 AM
I'm enjoying the pack, it all looks great. :)

I found a backroute for "Operation Cooperation". And even though I used all the skills in "Crystal Clear", it feels backrouty too.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 25, 2021, 08:20:45 AM
V1.3 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-1 11 Operation Cooperation - added a bit of terrain
-1 19 Yawning Crevasse - replaced 2 builders with 2 platformers

@NieSch
Yep you found a backroute for 1 11. Canceling the miner with the jumper is not intended.
And your solution to crystal level is actually intended. You swapped a builder and a platformer compared to me but that is totally acceptable. :D
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 26, 2021, 02:30:46 PM
V1.4 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-1 19 Yawning Crevasse - remade the solution
-2 03 Heretics of Dune - -1shimmier
-2 05 Simple Aesthetics - added some traps
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 27, 2021, 02:04:34 PM
V1.5 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-2 05 Simple Aesthetics - added some traps, -1 digger
-2 10 Is That All We Have - added a flamethrower, removed a bit of terrain
-2 12 Magic Box - added some water, added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 29, 2021, 10:39:14 AM
V1.6 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-2 15 Gates of Hell - added some flamethrowers
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on July 30, 2021, 08:58:48 AM
@Armani Just a quick tip that you can go ahead and close/lock the development topic for the level pack, since it's no longer in development because you have already released the pack ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 31, 2021, 04:40:20 AM
And done ;) Thanks for the tip!
I first thought to just delete the development topic, but I decided to left as is just in case.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 01, 2021, 05:16:21 AM
V1.7 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-2 19 Steepest Slope -  added a steel block


And I also post the list of musics in the main post. :D
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Turrican on August 06, 2021, 08:50:29 AM
Hi! In the last few days , I have tried the pack , and I have solved some levels from it ( 17 levels from the first rank ) .

So, here are replays for the levels 1-9 , 11 , 12 , 14-18 , and 20 from the first rank.

Very nice and fun levels , and also very good puzzles! Most of the solutions look intended , but there are several that look to be backroutes.

I would like to try more of the pack , but unfortunetly , time is a little tight this period fom me. But when I have more replays to share , I will send them to you.

My favourites of these levels , are 6 and 7.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 06, 2021, 11:56:19 AM
V1.8 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-1 02 Petrifying Gaze - added some water
-1 12 Midnight Circus - added a OWW
-1 14 Trinity Force - added a steel block
-1 15 Conventional Method - locked the RR

@Turrican

Thanks for playing :thumbsup: You actually found intended solutions for most of the levels.
1 12 Midnight Circus: You positioned most of the skilled correctly. And your solution has the main trick I wanted to enforce: increasing the RR to 99 immediately so the worker lemming has enough time to prepare the path for the crowd. I added a little OWW so now you need to use the leftover jumper somewhere.
1 15 I was quite impressed by your solution to this level.:thumbsup: I thought this solution is very clever so I was not sure if I wanted to backroute-fix this level. Sadly, this level requires a core trick which I like, so I decided to fix this level. Very nice solution nontheless. :laugh:
I'm glad that you especially like the level 6 and 7. Here're some fun fact for you:
1 06 is the first first rank level I made for this pack. :laugh:
And 1 07 is also my favourite level of the first rank. It's not that hard since it's quite obvious what you need to do. And I think this level illustrate how the slider skill opens up opportunities of accessing area where lemmings never had access to before quite nicely. And the main trick(slider lemming can cross underside of terrains with multiple shimmiers) will appear somewhere in higher rank levels. ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: NieSch on August 07, 2021, 11:03:34 AM
Well done Turrican. I must admit I was stuck already on quite a few levels of this first rank. For some reason level 4 gave me a lot of problems. Now I see the solution and it's not hard at all. :forehead:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 10, 2021, 02:57:25 AM
V1.9 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 04 Kiwi Pie - added a fire, added a bit of terrain
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Turrican on August 11, 2021, 11:42:20 PM
@ Armani  and NieSch : Thank you for your comments! :thumbsup:

I found the time , and tried some more levels from the pack. I have solved 7 levels from the second rank.

Here are the replays for the levels 4-6 , 11 , 14 , 18 and 20 from the second rank. Very nice levels again , especially 20 , was really fun.

My favourite of these levels , are 4 , 14 and 20.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: LemFan on August 12, 2021, 04:12:16 PM
IchoTolot, in one of your replies you missed out the v is solving.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 13, 2021, 12:00:03 PM
@Turrican

Everything intended or at least acceptable :thumbsup:
(2 05: you clustered 2 lemmings to pass through the rope trap at the top, while the intended solution cluster 3 lemmings to pass through the two rope traps at the bottom of the level. Your solution is more than fine.)
Hehe I knew you would like 2 20, especially you liked 1 07 as well ;)
I always wanted to make such levels and that's why I was craving so much for jumper being implemented to Neolemmix. :laugh:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 16, 2021, 12:41:03 PM
V2.0 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 08 No Devil Lived on - -1cloner, +1basher, -1save requirement
-3 09 Naughty Kids - added some traps
-3 10 Almost Paradise - removed a bit of terrain
-3 14 Triple Trouble in Space! - added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 18, 2021, 04:52:58 AM
V2.1 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 02 Steps of the Rite - fixed a visual error
-3 08 No Devil Lived on - -1basher, -1jumper, +1climber, added some OWWs
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 20, 2021, 04:35:04 AM
V2.2 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 18 V Stands for Victory - added some water, added a steel block
-3 19 Mysterious Circle - added some fire, added a trap, The starting platform is now a steel.
-3 20 Fall in the Dark - added a steel block, removed a bit of terrain
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 24, 2021, 02:59:45 AM
V2.3 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 19 Mysterious Circle - added a bit of terrain, added some fire
-3 20 Fall in the Dark - removed a bit of terrain
-4 02 Medieval Romance - removed a bit of steel
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 26, 2021, 05:52:33 AM
V2.4 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 02 Medieval Romance - added a bit of steel, -1cloner, +1swimmer, -1save requirement, added a stoner pick-up skill and -1 stoner
-4 08 A Dance of Fire and Ice - new talisman "Pure Perfect!": save 21/30(1more than required)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 29, 2021, 11:21:37 AM
V2.5 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 05 Deep Inside the Beehive - added a bit of terrain
-4 07 Return of the Troublesome Trio - -1jumper, +1shimmier
-4 08 A Dance of Fire and Ice - removed a bit of terrain
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 02, 2021, 02:05:08 AM
V2.6 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 08 A Dance of Fire and Ice - added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 22, 2021, 08:37:45 AM
V2.7 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 11 Dungeon of Despair - fixed a visual error
-5 06 RefleXion - -5save requirement, -5total lemmings
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on September 24, 2021, 09:34:08 PM
Hi Armani,

I'm just posting to let you know that I've started my LP of your level pack. Link here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbp2m4KlFpJsrZJRZKTb2AATwWeHNlA2c (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbp2m4KlFpJsrZJRZKTb2AATwWeHNlA2c). It has officially begun: My quest to solve all of Uncharted, or die trying. Figuratively, of course. Wish me luck!

So far, played the first 5 levels, and wow, the difficulty already starts out high. Actually, in my experiences, it starts easy, then hard, then medium, then hard again, then easy. Perhaps the more open-ended levels will come later in the first rank? With the first 5 levels, it already brings back United Pacifism rank vibes, only this pack seems to start harder.

I will likely post again after I finish the Aries rank! ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: joshescue18 on September 27, 2021, 08:24:05 PM
First three ranks completed.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on September 28, 2021, 08:52:20 AM
Hello Armani,

I have completed the Aries rank, so here are my replays.

General Feedback

Wow, I'm really enjoying this pack a lot. There are plenty of difficult levels already in the first rank, but many of these are quite satisfying to figure out and solve. Lots of great tilesets here and custom music. Your great artistry definitely shows a lot in these pretty landscapes you make, although I'm pretty sure there are way more mind-blowing visual ones much later in the pack.

Aries Rank Feedback

I honestly would say the start is already harder than the Pacifism rank of United. However, the level that is way too hard for the first rank is Aries 10 - Detective Milla on the Case. I ended up being stuck there for a few days. Despite that, it is one of my favorites! ;) Also, luckily a lot of the levels are much easier after you get past Aries 10, and that's exactly what I saw.

In my experiences, Aries 1 is easy, Aries 2 is hard, Aries 3 is Medium, Aries 4 hard, and Aries 5 was easy. So really, in just the first 5 levels, the difficulty jumps around quite a bit and hence the difficulty is a bit wonky in the first rank.

More detailed feedback on the levels:

Spoiler

Aries 1 - King's Cove You already told me my solution is a minor backroute. I'm guessing it's simply due to how I have a jumper leftover. Still, this is a great level to start off the pack.

Aries 2 - Petrifying Gaze This level is somewhat difficult, although it took me some time to see to stone the first in such a way so that two can go on ahead to shimmy and the first one stones for the other one to land on to bash towards and beneath the exit. The rest of the level followed easily after that. Quite a nice one here :)

Aries 3 - Lems are Having Fun Not hard but not exactly easy either. I like how everyone needs to jump and climb up the digger tunnel to get to the exit.

Aries 4 - Multi-Angled Approach Ok, I was a huge dummy here for a long time. I had the builder locked at a particular location for a long time, in particular on the first block that you build to the left just a bit to the right of the exit. There's a lot of red herrings that can trip you up here if you're not careful. Turns out the builder goes past the exit to the left of it, and that is where you use the laserer to free the crowd. Then the climber/glider will go at the bottom and then get back up and fence and glide to land just before the exit on the right side. Nice level, especially in the pretty Circus tileset, which happens to be one of my favorites of L2.

Aries 5 - Crystal Clear Easy and a much faster solve for me. I like how the skillset is a 1-of-everything in 7 skill types. That's quite a nice trick with using a stacker so that the climber will be in a higher position to be able to shimmy across the top.

Aries 6 - Rock Climber Quite a nice 1-lemming level here. I like how the level really makes you think about which way to go at every turn. The tall level makes it look intimidating, but it's still not too hard. The Rock tileset happens to be one of my favorites of ONML, but the Bubble tileset would have to be my top favorite.

Aries 7 - Easy as MAS101 Nice level with infinite amount of jumpers and shimmiers. Quite a nice puzzle introducing the slider. I like how the only way to get the basher pickup on the far left is to slide down the right side and then assign a jumper to him so that he climbs up and then jump again to the right to get it. Fortunately, the maze is not very confusing at all, but it's a really good level showing off the basic mechanics of the slider skill.

Aries 8 - BlockChain Company The first of two X-of-everything levels in the rank. Not hard but at the same time not trivial. Since it's a X-of-everything, it's probably an any-way-you-want level. You did pretty good with the Brick tileset here ;)

Aries 9 - Hop, Step, and Jump! Easy one. That's a very nice trick with using a jumper and then bombing him in midair to release the blocker so that he doesn't blow through the floor. It's a nice variant on using a passthrough blocker and then bombing a lemming that falls right on top of him to release him. Well done here :)

Aries 10 - Detective Milla on the Case As mentioned before, I was stuck here for a few days. It's a very deceivingly hard level for such a simple looking one. For a long time, I kept thinking of going through the middle wall. I simply ran into too many problems with thinking about how the solution would go, and you would always be a skill short or you won't save enough. I just dismissed bridging from both sides of the water gap at the bottom on the basis of how can one get a Milla on both sides in order to do so. That turns out due to how I kept doing or thinking the part with the top entrance wrong. In any case, I think we're in agreement here that this level is too hard for the first rank. However, let's wait for further feedback from me so that we can find a suitable level in one of the later ranks to swap positions with it. Still, very nice level that is one of my favorites! :thumbsup:

Aries 11 - Operation Cooperation Another really good one here. Doesn't take too long to stumble upon the solution. The timing to release the climbers can be tricky, but it's nothing too difficult. Nice to see you got inspiration from one of Icho's Polar levels in the Pacifism rank from United.

Aries 12 - Midnight Circus As you have already mentioned, my solution is a backroute. Quite an easy level here :P

Aries 13 - Incomplete Another favorite of mine! Extremely nice puzzle here, especially with the second climber using the builder staircases to shimmy to get into position to turn the miner. As you have said, this is like an easier version of "Polaris Rhapsody." The Sports tileset from L2 also happens to be a favorite of mine, particularly because of the green, as it is my favorite color.

Aries 14 - Trinity Force Another really good one and favorite of mine. Again, nice use of the shimmier to use the underside of the platformer bridge that's in progress so that he can drop down to the steel block at the bottom to stack and then platform to the left for the crowd to make their way back up to the platformer bridge to the exit. Well done here! :)

Aries 15 - Conventional Method Another really good level, although like you said mine is an acceptable alternative. Your intended solution you described to me is quite cool, but I think mine is just as cool, particularly with the bashing in such a way so as to cancel him midstroke with a builder and then with a lemming that goes on ahead build so that he closes off the 1 pixel gap to prevent anyone else from following him. With this, you have to make sure that no one slips to the bottom. The level uses other nice tricks too: backwards basher to make a climber friendly wall, and bashing the wrong way into a OWW to turn around. I also needed the climber to survive so that he can bomb the crowd free. The tricks in your intended solution are great too, in particular bombing a faller to release the crowd trapped at the bottom, which I at one point did consider :laugh:

Aries 16 - Cheese in the Trap Another favorite of mine and really good puzzle with neutrals. The only hard part is figuring out how to get a lemming past the apple worm trap on the right side, but once you do the rest is easy. It simply involves cloning and then turning the right-facing lemming with a walker to achieve that.

Aries 17 - Curiosity Killed the Puppy Another nice slider puzzle here. I pretty much had the solution, I simply used one too many cloners on the left side which prevented me from being able to do the right side correctly.

Aries 18 - Colorful August Can be a hard level, especially if one isn't aware that the pickups do serve a purpose despite none of them being collectable. As a result, it took me a while to realize they serve as hints to the solution. I sometimes think if it's possible to solve the level without realizing they're hints, and I think it is, but that's not certain unless many say otherwise. There's that cloning a fencer trick again, one which you seem quite fond of and one that I think is amazing that you managed to find really good ways to use that trick ;) Nice job here with tripping me with this one :laugh:

Aries 19 - Yawning Crevasse Another difficult one, although this one didn't take me as long. You've already mentioned mine is an acceptable alternative, as my solution is heavy on the precision. It almost doesn't work either, perhaps with even 1 or 2 more layers of terrain then the ceiling would be too thick to be able to step up. That's really cool with the snowman with the word "HELP" on the right side.

Aries 20 - Renaissance of Lemmingland Difficult 2-of-everything level to finish off the rank. This is also the second X-of-everything level in the rank. Took some time due to the large wall in the middle, although it seemed that I had done it correct for the most part, I simply didn't do the left side efficiently enough. It took a while to find a way to spare a basher for the very end to get to the exit. Also making sure that at least one climber survives to get to the right side to mine through the second OWW, as well as making sure the climber is one of the blockers. Getting the spacing necessary so that no one slips past the blocker to the left can be difficult. If intended, that's a nice trick with bombing and then digging further inside the first OWW. Quite a nice level to finish off the rank, especially in a really great tileset by Dexter and tan x.

For the most part, I really enjoyed these first rank levels, especially many of the ones after Aries 10. I look forward to the other challenges of the pack in the other ranks. Once again, nice job Armani! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 29, 2021, 03:40:19 AM
Thanks for all the replays and feedbacks! and also LP videos. I've been enjoying them a lot :thumbsup:
All the feedbacks, I'll keep that in mind and they will be valuable assets for my future projects.

I think I already responded to your solutions on YT comments, but I have several things I forgot to mention:

Aries7 Easy as MAS101: The title came from Namida's level "Easy as A Bee C"(first level of LPO2). And MAS101 is the subject code of calculus at my university.
Aries8 BlockChain Company: This is the only level that has a repeat level in later rank. There will be a level with same terrains, more restricrtive skillset, higher save requirement etc.

I think I'm going to update the pack everytime you finish a rank. And for now, I will wait for your feedbacks on which levels to swap positions with Aries10.

Good luck with your LP on Gemini rank :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 29, 2021, 03:42:04 AM
V2.8 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-1 01 King's Cove - added a steel block
-1 12 Midnight Circus - added a steel block, builders are now pick-ups
-4 12 Sweet Mirages - added a trap
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Ron_Stard on September 29, 2021, 12:20:03 PM
I think the solution for Aries 1 is this, but I'm confused about...

Spoiler

...the fall safe distance of a jumper.

Got me thinking for a while. Nice level, a bit hard -only for me, since I am still not used to the new skills :-[-
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 29, 2021, 02:10:26 PM
Yes you got the correct solution :thumbsup:

Fall distance is measured from the starting point of jump, not the top of a Jumper's arc.
It can be confusing at first I can understand that.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Kingshadow3 on September 29, 2021, 02:31:52 PM
Quote from: Armani on September 29, 2021, 02:10:26 PM
Fall distance is measured from the starting point of jump, not the top of a Jumper's arc.
It can be confusing at first I can understand that.

It actually depends on when and where the lemming goes into the fall state (Uninterrupted, the jumper goes into the fall state at the same height as where he jumped from. If a jumper hits his head then Fall distance is calculated from where the lemming hit his head which would be higher.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 01, 2021, 10:13:25 AM
Completed the second rank, so I'm back with more replays and feedback :)

Gemini Rank Feedback

Levels are harder here, but still plenty of great levels with excellent solutions! The entire rank was slow going, but after much struggling I managed to make it all the way through.

Spoiler

Gemini 1 - Hornet Flight Contest level of yours that I have played during the playing phase of that one. Really good level that I remember backrouting, but it's even better now that it's properly patched up. Very nice trick with the stoner and then using another lemming with a shimmier jump to get on top of it. The rest of the level is easy after that, but I temporarily forgot how to solve it, as it's been a while :crylaugh:

Gemini 2 - Apex Predator Difficult but another good one. It took a while long time to see to use a blocker to turn a digger. Also nice trick with using a bomber to stop the miner going to the left, as it's necessary for both climbers to survive. Nice trick of using a backwards miner to create a climber friendly wall. Then the rest of it is timing it correctly so that the second climber turns around near the end of the first climber's miner tunnel to mine through the obstacles to the left so that the first one has enough time to build over the gap, as well as over the water near the exit. Quite a satisfying one to figure out and solve :)

Gemini 3 - Heretics of Dune Somewhat difficult, although I say the hardest part was getting two sliders to go down the first wall so that they can shimmy along and get to the right side. According to your comment on my YT video, it appears that RR fiddling is necessary in order to achieve that. You also mentioned that my solution is more efficient due to how I was able to spare a basher, as well as it being an acceptable one. Cool! ;)

Gemini 4 - Born to Die Another favorite of mine! The part that took me a very long time to figure out was how to get a stack in both places to keep the digger going. Turns out I was a dummy and failed to realize the crucial placement of the first stacker in order for him to climb and get over the right side to place the other stacker. Very nice solution with digging away two pillars and bombing to break through both sides once low enough :)

Gemini 5 - Simple Aesthetics A little difficult, but not too hard at all. You said my solution is acceptable but is much tighter on time than the intended one.

Gemini 6 - BPM 37093 Backroute as you already mentioned, as well as the first one of the rank I found. This level is the one I asked if it was inspired by a LOA one, as I remember one where it was also a 1-of-everything skillset and needed to get someone into the water pool to forge the path for the others. This level has something similar. The LOA level is "When I Come Around" (by Green Day)

Gemini 7 - Rush Hour Another backroute here as well. You probably already decided how to fix it, either with steel or by making it a save all level. I'm just amazed my solution ended up working while still finishing on time :P

Gemini 8 - Step by Step Another favorite of mine! That is the first time I've seen the use of a blocker to turn a laserer so that both groups of blockers from either side can be released with it. Thanks for the hint of the bright white boxes in the floors to mark where to put the blockers. I'm sure that will save a lot of frustration, but it does require that the player picks up on them being hints.

Gemini 9 - Between Madness and Creativity Hard one, though I had the mistaken assumption that a single bomber isn't enough to get over the final obstacle in the way of the exit. I should really try these things first instead of assuming it won't work :laugh: Certainly it's hard to figure out how to contain and keep the crowd safe at the beginning, as well as getting a worker lemming through the bottom to build over the final gap. Still, another nice level in the Renaissance tileset ;)

Gemini 10 - Is That All We Have? Yet another favorite of mine. Nice trick with building past the steel to make a step for the climber to break his fall, but especially nice trick with building from the left in order to release the crowd from the digger pit! :thumbsup: That's the first time I've ever seen that required in a custom level. Otherwise, the level can certainly be hard, in particular the beginning to keep the crowd safe again. The digger pit near the edge is very important, otherwise you cannot get the level solved. Well done!

Gemini 11 - Look Before You Jump Level which you said is a breather, which I completely agree with. The only hard part is knowing which lemmings to assign a climber and which ones to assign a shimmier. Another favorite of mine, especially with getting one shimmier to go all the way to the far right, while all the other climbers and shimmiers need to be contained in the pit before the exit. This is the hardest part to get correct, as most of the time either a climber was too fast for the first shimmier, or when I finally got the shimmier past but then the next shimmier is too close and therefore won't be contained. Very nice level, I really like it :)

Gemini 12 - Magic Box Deceivingly difficult one. It took me a really long time to figure out the middle part. I didn't see to build from both sides at the top, with the one from the right side to seal off the gap and to be cloned so that you can get up higher and platform to the exit. You've already mentioned that my solution is the first one you've seen that spares two bashers, so this makes the level one of the few in which I was more efficient in skill savings than you :P Very nice level!

Gemini 13 - Welcome to the Woodworld Another hard one but great one as well. I have already played this single level of yours a long time ago, and you told me that I found the intended solution back then, so it was simply a matter of remembering how to solve it. Luckily, it didn't take me very long at all. I especially like building over the top and blocking behind him, as well as digging in such a way so that we can release a climber later and containing both crowds. Also with digging away the wooden pillar so that you can just use one builder to get over the gap instead of two, but then you won't have enough skills to solve the level. Nice work here.

Gemini 14 - Crossover I can see this one being difficult. In particular, I have in effect haven't solved the level the proper way due to the water objects being placed too high. I was very confused why the worker didn't drown. In any case, the backroute resulted due to the design and hence why I had a few skills leftover, the shimmiers.

Gemini 15 - Gates of Hell This was an experimental level when the laserer hasn't made it into the stable release of NL yet. I wasn't able to solve the level back then, I still wasn't able to solve the level for a long time. Turns out I did a couple of parts wrong. That was a very nice trick of using a laser to allow a shimmier to get over the top of the level to bomb the far right side to make the ceiling thin enough for the crowd to get up. To do this requires that the laserer be placed quite precisely. Also the blocker needs to be placed correctly in order to be released and to free the crowd. Once you realize this, the only hard part left is to time the assignment of the laserer and the cloning of the shimmier so that one worker gets far enough ahead to build over the gap in the middle platform the laserer made, as well as platform to the exit. I also had a lot of incorrect assumptions, such as to bash at the top to get to the exit, as well as build to get up on the far right side after either bombing or laserer-ing. All turn out to be wrong. I especially like the 1-of-everything skillset here. Excellent level here! ;)

Gemini 16 - Brakes Failed, Gemini 17 - Secretly, Greatly!, and Gemini 18 - Breaking The Cycle are a recent contest level, single level, and another recent contest level, respectively. I have played all of these already and found the intended solutions to all except for the last one. It seems that you blocked off my backroute and very fiddly solution even though you didn't update the level during the LOTY2020 playing phase. For the last one, I already saw the intended solution from when LOTY2020 was still going on after I solved the level for the first time, so it was really a matter of remembering it here. I really like the trick of mining and cloning to make a hole on either side of the stack so that the crowd can step up on it from either side, thus they're stuck in an infinite cycle and hence the level title of the solution requiring us to "break the cycle." Also, the music track is different for the first two, while the third one still uses the same one.

Gemini 19 - Steepest Slope As mentioned on Discord, this is a level that can be a big roadblock. Indeed, that has proven to be the case, although I have had the solution nearly all figured out in the first video where I played this level. I will have to say this is another favorite of mine! That is super clever with bombing the stoner away so that the shimmier can go all the way to the left side, as well as being able to platform up both sides of the gap. This can be a bit tight, but it's necessary to have the platformer turn around so that you can bomb the terrain away to make a staircase for the crowd to keep going towards the exit later. I also had a wrong assumption here that the lemmings would splat falling over the top on the far left side when they will actually survive. I should had tested this or used the splat ruler :XD: I also used the basher wrong, where I used it so that everyone would be released and turn around in the basher tunnel, while another one bashes out to the right in order to get a head start to platform up the gap, as well as stone a falling lemming to fill up the remainder of the small gap for the crowd to go over the top. This is wrong. Instead, the climber needs to bash in such a way so that the crowd is released later with a basher. Also, the climber can simply drop down and climb out to the left in order to shimmy along. Well done here! :)

Gemini 20 - Never Let You Alone Quite an easy level for the rank finisher. Another action based level due to the infinite amount of jumpers, shimmiers, blockers, and walkers. The route should be very obvious. The only very hard part is getting past the two zombies who are both climbers and gliders. Nice trick of getting ahead of the neutral to block and turn it around to get to the exit. 

40 levels in and I still continue to enjoy your pack very much, Armani! :thumbsup: I might had only been able to generally take on about 2 levels each time per video in this rank, but this shows how the pack is already getting difficult even in the second rank. I expect the third rank to be more or less the same. So, it seems that it's just going to be one long slug to the finish line, but I will keep persevering and try and make it to the very end. So far, I haven't let the difficulty get to me and make me collapse under tremendous pressure.

I'm also very happy to see and read your comments on my solutions on my YT videos and that you're continuing to enjoy my LP of your pack very much :) More to still come later! ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 03, 2021, 02:14:02 AM
V2.9 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-2 06 BPM37093 - added a button to push
-2 07 Rush Hour - added some steel blocks
-2 12 Magic Box - new talisman "Schrodinger's Lemming!": complete using no more than 4 bashers
-2 14 Crossover - lowered the water objects by 1pixel so lemmings can't just walk through the water anymore
- corrected some grammar errors in the pretext of the following levels: 2 16 Brakes Failed, 2 20 Never Let You Alone
-4 15 Help Yourself - added a steel block, added a fire
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 03, 2021, 02:22:12 AM
@kaywhyn :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

I'm surprised that only 5 levels have been backrouted so far. :lem-mindblown:
I expected you to backroute about half of the levels in the worst scenario :crylaugh:
So far I've watched all your vids other than the last one, and yes I've been really enjoying them 8-)
I notice that most of my contest levels are in 2nd rank. There will be 2 or 3 more contest levels in 3rd rank and after that all other levels are brand new levels.
I decided to keep some of your solution that save some skills as challenge solutions and add a new talisman cos I was quite impressed by your solution to that level.

Hope you enjoy the rest of the pack as well :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 05, 2021, 08:56:52 AM
Leo, the third rank, has fallen, so I'm back with more replays and feedback :)

edit: Reattached zip file with the correct name, as it should say "up through Leo rank" instead of "up through Gemini rank." Oops :-[

Leo Rank Feedback

Levels get harder but are still manageable given enough time. In particular, Leo 2 was a huge roadblock like you mentioned, as that one took me the longest out of any other level in the rank. Leo 4 was also another one I struggled with, as well as Leo 6, but the latter I was able to get it solved in the same video. It also happens to be one of my favorites! :thumbsup: Needless to say, the Leo rank was also slow going just like the Gemini rank, but I still managed to power my way through the rank despite being super busy and exhausted from work each day.

Spoiler

Leo 1 - Childhood Dreams Already played and solved this level before, and I believe I voted for this level in every round of the voteoffs in the LDC #22. You've already explained to me that there are some parts that were changed since that contest ended, and I definitely noticed that it didn't exactly play out the same way.

Leo 2 - Steps of the Rite I think this was the hardest level of the entire rank. This one took me the longest out of any other level in it. In particular, it was very hard to work out how to get two non-climbers to forge the path for the rest. A digger going to the left to cancel the first digger was very hard to see. I also made the wrong assumption that the only way to turn the athlete near the exit was with a miner and platformer. It took a while to come up with platforming at the top and then blocking to turn the other climber around and then digging the platformer bridge to float down safely on the other side of the OWW in order to bash through it. It's quite tight for the platformer to finish on time before the other non-climber slips through and drowns.

Leo 3 - The Day After Christmas Yet another contest level that I've played and solved before, and so this was another quick one. Even then, before knowing the solution this is a very hard level, as I really struggled with it during the playing phase of the LDC #22. Very nice solution, though. That's especially clever with using a stoner in order for a jumper to turn around and glide into the area to fence and clone. The only thing is making sure that the jumper is given to the third lemming or so.

Leo 4 - Kiwi Pie Deceivingly difficult level. You already mentioned that my solution is acceptable even though I used the second stoner differently from the intended solution. At the same time, you managed to find a backroute to your level. This is a really nice tileset by zanzindorf, and I especially love the touch of the digits of Pi that you put at the top of the level :)

Leo 5 - We Are Super Dogs! Another favorite of mine in the rank. Very nice solution. This one was almost a complete breather. I've never seen the anti-splat and splat pads for this tileset ever. I love the tricks here: bombing so as to avoid landing in the trigger area of the splat pad and therefore they will splat, shimmying with the Milla trapped at the bottom of the level so that you can bomb and then allow the floater to turn around by platforming up the bomber hole gap, and then building so that the crowd doesn't land inside the trigger area of the splat pad. Nice job here!

Leo 6 - Cool Head and Warm Heart Difficult one but another favorite of mine! It was very hard to see bombing a faller before building from the right side to get inside it. I especially love shimmying to get to the bottom of the level so as to make a landing platform for the crowd. Before this, I kept thinking to drop down from the far right side. Very nice red herring there. I managed to solve this with a climber to spare, but this is acceptable, as you said. Also, that's really cool what you did with the fire and snow tilesets to make the design look the way it does :)

Leo 7 - Price of Progress Nice builderless level. Can be difficult, but this one wasn't too bad at all. Here, I did the timing of the climbers so that the climber that turns around in the miner tunnel turns around to free the blocker. I also stopped a basher midstroke with a blocker and then got the crowd compressed by digging next to the blocker so that they bypass the blocker field.

Leo 8 - No Devil Lived on Nearly a complete breather here, although we are in agreement there the trick needed at the end makes it too hard for the Aries rank. Otherwise, this would had been a nice candidate to swap with Aries 10, which is way too hard for that rank. As you already mentioned, my solution is a backroute. The hardest part is making sure the miner doesn't get torched after cancelling him with a jumper.

Leo 9 - Naughty Kids The Lemmings are indeed "naughty" here :laugh: I surprisingly struggled here, but only because of the end part where they kept going in the wrong direction instead of towards the exit due to this property of sliders being most annoying. Then when you finally commented on the video you described an easy way to solve it. I can't believe I completely overlooked that :forehead: You're absolutely right about if lemmings turn twice with sliding then going in the wrong direction is cancelled. That pixel precise miner placement so that the sliders don't end up going the wrong way I would agree is likely not intended. I should probably report it to namida, although I might need help showcasing it when it comes to posting the GIF images.

Leo 10 - Almost Paradise I especially love the design here, with what you did with depicting nature with the flowers, the waterfall, and the bees. The Rock tileset happens to be one of my favorites of ONML, although the Bubble tileset is my top one from that game. Surprisingly struggled with this one too. In the end, I used and found a very tight timing solution in several parts of the level. I definitely see what you mean with getting a floater from the right entrance to sync up with the climber from the left entrance so that he can get past the lizard trap. I can't believe I didn't think of that, though :forehead:

Leo 11 - Marina Bay Sands Another contest level of yours I've played and solved before. Quite a nice one that I backrouted so many times during the playing phase, but in its current version I couldn't get this solved before it ended. I was able to solve it on the first day of voting. The part I kept missing was the miner placement so that the swimmer can get back up to the left and go back to the starting area. I also kept trying stuff on the far right side which ultimately doesn't work.

Leo 12 - Life is Suffering Almost a breather here as well, but can still be difficult. I love the trick of blocking after building twice to turn the other climber around to mine through the other parts to get the crowd to keep moving towards the exit, and also bombing him in order to reduce the height and make it a safe drop. I especially love the blocking at the very end so that you can still build to get to the exit. The only thing to watch out for is to make sure that you mine into the steel to turn around, as if the climber is allowed to go back to the starting area he will climb and get killed by the rope trap.

Leo 13 - Cactus Valley Yet another contest level of yours that I've played and solved. This was probably my favorite of your contest levels in that LDC, with "Brakes Failed" being a close second. I believe I've voted for this level in every round. Very nice solution, with the hardest part to see cancelling a basher midstroke with a builder. I especially love the timing to bash and make sure the climber gets up the terrain before the basher takes away the terrain to prevent that from happening so that he can shimmy along the top again. And of course, my favorite builder/miner combo ;)

Leo 14 - Triple Trouble in Space! As you mentioned, my solution is a very bad backroute. I thought it was, I didn't think it was supposed to be that easy :P

Leo 15 - Art of Puzzle Solving Difficult one, although that's because there were some things I couldn't wrap my head around, such as the only way to the bottom at the right is with a climber, as well as bashing the ceiling from the top. Then, I believe I came up with a solution that likely isn't intended despite using all the skills, so I might have beaten you here again :P Something tells me that one is supposed to use the ceiling route.

Leo 16 - Snow Flower Easier than the previous level, and also a nice one. That was a really good trick with digging and then platforming in the holes in order to extend the basher. The very hard part is timing the climbers in order to bounce the miner with a blocker to get the crowd up, as well as digging in order to leave an overhang to stop climbers and anyone from spilling out to the left and splatting. I'm thinking there are easier solutions than the one I found?

Leo 17 - Polaris Rhapsody This was a single level of yours that I nominated for LOTY2020. I was so amazed at the solution that I told myself that I will nominate this level. I was really hoping this level would go all the way to win the contest, but alas it lost to DireKrow's "Shoestring Operation," which admittedly is a great level, but I was more amazed with this level of yours. Anyway, this is a harder version of the Sports level in the Aries rank, like you said, but they both have in common getting a blocker in place to bounce a miner.

Leo 18 - V Stands for Victory I'm sure this is a huge backroute? I don't think it's supposed to be this easy :P Now that I think about it, the thought of a very long extending a basher sounds ludicrous :laugh:

Leo 19 - Mysterious Circle Another level that I struggled with. Seems like the level is obvious for the most part, but one still needs to watch out for being short on skills. There were times that I kept running short on cloners and builders. Knowing myself, there are easier solutions than the one I found. In particular, the difference between almost succeeding and my success was I built instead of bombed first. I guess this created the spacing necessary in order to bomb and only allow one to go on ahead to make the splatform. Nice level, though.

Leo 20 - Fall in the Dark Nice level to finish off the rank. I also struggled with this one, but that's because I couldn't figure out what to do with the basher. I seem to have made the incorrect assumption that the digger is used to release the crowd when in fact the basher can be used instead, depending on where the platforming underneath is done. I'm not sure if the digger placement is intended here, but if it is it's quite a nice one and a hard one to see. It uses the fact that the digger goes through a bit of the steel, as well as places the platformer brick right underneath him so that he covers the gap completely and is able to go to the left to forge the rest of the path. Before this, I kept running out of skills to stop the climber from going out to the left side and dying.

Well, that's 3 ranks completed and hence 60/100 levels solved. Two ranks and 40 levels remain. I expect to get majorly stumped with the final two ranks. As a matter of fact, I've already had an attempt at Libra 1 and I couldn't solve it. It's so not a "breather" like you claimed in the pre-text :XD: Then again, you did say there's a huge spike in the difficulty going from the third to the fourth rank, and similarly from the fourth to the fifth rank. I guess the spike already hits with Libra 1.

As usual, I'm continuing to enjoy the pack! :thumbsup: Here's hoping that I can make it through the last two ranks too. However, since I managed to get stumped badly at various places throughout in each of the earlier ranks, I don't expect the rest of the pack to be smooth sailing from here at all. Also, thanks again for all the Youtube video comments on my solutions :) Glad to hear my LP is still continuing to be very enjoyable for you to watch.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 05, 2021, 01:45:04 PM
@kaywhyn
Thanks again :thumbsup: I've downloaded and watched all your replays so hopefully I can respond to your solutions after I catch up your LP videos for 3rd rank ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 05, 2021, 01:45:50 PM
V3.0 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-3 04 Kiwi Pie - a basher is now a pick-up, new talisman "Two Lemmings with One Stone": complete using no more than 1 stoner
-3 08 No Devil Lived on - added a OWW
-3 14 Triple Trouble in Space! - added some steel blocks
-3 15 Art of Puzzle Solving - lowered the fire object a little bit, locked the RR
-3 17 Polaris Rhapsody - corrected some grammar errors in the pretext
-3 18 V stands for Victory - added a OWW, added a steel block
-3 19 Mysterious Circle - a climber is now a pick-up
-3 20 Fall in the Dark - added a steel block
-4 15 Help Yourself -  remade the solution
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 05, 2021, 02:14:31 PM
Wow, perfect timing. I've already downloaded v3.0 of the pack, so I'll be good and ready to go for rank 4 when I get home from work just so I don't forget later on. I've had this happen plenty of times where I often forget to download the pack again when there's a new version before I start LPing due to having downloaded the pack so long ago, so when an update is released I forget to redownload. Needless to say, just preparing ahead of time to prevent that from happening ;)

So, it appears I was correct with beating you with 3 15 and 3 18, as I guessed my solutions to those levels were backroutes :laugh: I didn't think 3 19 and 3 20 were at all, so I found more backroutes than I thought I did :P Well, I guess that's a good thing, as sometimes the level/pack designer doesn't always catch them alone. Glad to help in this regard.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 12, 2021, 03:31:17 AM
V3.1 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-4 05 Deep Inside the Beehive - added some steel blocks
-4 06 Mr Lem's Secret Wine Cellar - added a steel block
-4 08 A Dance of Fire and Ice - a miner is now a pick-up
-4 10 Bloodthirster - removed some steel blocks and added some normal terrain and fire there
-4 11 Dungeon of Despair - added a OWW, modified terrain near the exit
-4 12 Sweet Mirages - swapped the positions of a stoner pick-up and a bomber pick-up
-4 18 Moonlight Sculptor - removed a bit of terrain, added a fire
-4 20 Another Hero Time - added some steel blocks
-5 01 Game of the Century - added a OWW, added some steel blocks, added a fire
-5 15 Simulation: FARO - modified terrain a bit in the middle of the level, +10save requirement, +10total lemmings

Positioning change:
- 1 10 Detective Milla is on the Case <---> 3 12 Life is Suffering

New level:

(https://i.imgur.com/JXv9rO0.png)
Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe

- The old 3 18(V Stands for Victory) is replaced by the new 3 18(Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe)


I was not happy with the quality of the old 3 18(V Stands for Victory), so I decided to replace it with a new level.
I can assure you that the new level has much more interesting solution than the old one. ;)
For someone who still want to play the old 3 18, I attached level and solution replay files of it below.
Sorry for the inconvenience to those who already played or are playing the level/pack. :(

There will be no positioning change of the levels and removing the existing levels from now on.

@kaywhyn
I still have to look at your videos and solutions. I will update the pack one more time when you finish 4th rank :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 13, 2021, 07:15:48 AM
V3.2 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - added a bit of terrain near the exit
-4 20 Another Hero Time - added a steel block, added a fire
-5 01 Game of the Century - added some water
-5 02 Overpopulation - added a fire
-5 03 Jumping Bees - added some steel blocks, added a trap, removed some water
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 13, 2021, 02:41:40 PM
V3.3 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 01 Game of the Century - modified terrain near the exit, -1jumper, +1shimmier
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 14, 2021, 04:07:00 AM
V3.4 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - added a bit of terrain
-4 20 Another Hero Time - builders are now pick-ups

seems like the troublesome level has finally been patched out properly :XD:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 15, 2021, 06:24:22 AM
Libra rank finally completed. Replays attached, as well as more feedback. Also, as I forgot to download v3.4 of the pack before I started recording part 44 of the LP, I decided to quickly resolve Libra 20, so the replay in the collection is for v3.4. The solution you see in the video is for v3.1, so quite a ways from the most recent version :XD: It seems to still be a backroute, though :P

Libra Rank Feedback

Now the levels really get to the point where the high difficulty starts showing. Not that it wasn't present in the earlier ranks, but in this rank it's now at the point where the LP slowed considerably where I could pretty much only get one level solved per video, as it was pretty much stumpers back-to-back. This therefore indicates that the pack's quite hard, so it seems the difficulty classification in the OP is quite accurate here. The only time when I was able to solve multiple levels were simply where there were contest levels, as I've already played and solved them. The only ones I haven't played of yours is from LDC #19, although they're probably not in the pack. I have a feeling that the final contest levels of the pack are in this rank.

Already right out of the gate I was stumped with Libra 1, even though you mention in the pre-text that it's a "breather." It's totally not btw, but now that I've read your description of the intended solution via the YT comment it goes to show you that even levels with no fancy tricks needed can still be very difficult. Yes, I agree that the solution itself isn't difficult, but being able to find it is a different matter, which of course varies from player to player. Be assured that you're far from being the only one who underestimates the difficulty of your own levels. This goes for any designer, as it's very hard for one to judge the difficulty of one's own pack, which is why feedback is helpful for the content creator.

Of course, the other saving grace of the levels really showing their brutal difficulty is how there seems to be a lot of levels that can still be solved via backroutes ;P

Spoiler

Libra 1 - Flattening Process As mentioned before, I thought this one was hard. For the start of the penultimate rank, definitely not pulling any punches anymore. As you have seen, I used a lot of pixel precision in my solution, especially with bashing to contain the crowd but climbers can still get over it despite some terrain being overhead. I can't believe I never saw the way to do it the intended way, though. However, it does require very good timing with getting a lemming to turn around at the very end of the basher tunnel, so it's still a difficult thing to pull off, although perhaps what would help make it easier in that regard is delaying the basher assignment.

Libra 2 - Medieval Romance Wow, hard one but this one's great! :thumbsup: Definitely one of my favorites. I especially love the trick of using a blocker to turn a shimmier, as well as using a stoner to connect with the terrain both above and below to extend a digger. My only gripe here is that it's quite difficult to get the digger in such a way so that one lemming falls out to the right and another falls out to the left of the stoner. Even after achieving that, you have to hope that everyone makes it into the digger pit in time before anyone starts splatting. The only thing I can think of that would ease the frustration there is simply reducing the number of lemmings and adjusting the save requirement accordingly, but as it's your level you get the final say in whether you want to make that change or not. Otherwise, the intended solution is just too awesome here! :)

Libra 3 - Unstoppable Another one of my favorites! I would probably say just as difficult as the previous two levels. Once again, another level that features using a blocker to turn a shimmier the other way, although here it also uses the trick of blocking on top of the stack and then using a climber to release it with a digger later. There's also the trick of extending a basher with a platformer, although the timing between the athletes can be tight, but I really love how the solution comes together. Finally, using a platformer to stop climbers from going out to the left later.

Libra 4 - Life of a High Roller Yet another favorite. There were some attempts where I would be close but if you don't do the intended solution you'll always be a skill short or be under the save requirement. This one doesn't seem as difficult, but it's still challenging. Once again, I love the tricks needed here: Containing the crowd between two blockers in such a way that you can bomb a lemming between them to release both, but here both blockers need to be going in different directions, and stoning at such a time so that everyone who's behind one another turns around inside the stoner terrain. That's where the floater is needed in order to achieve this. I also like how you need to time the bomber in such a way so that the platformer that turns around at the top that it nearly syncs up with the left blocker. Finally, blocking a basher midstroke and releasing him with a nearby lemming so that the staircase is left intact for everyone to be able to step up into the exit platform. Nice job here, Armani! :)

Libra 5 - Deep Inside the Beehive Not as difficult as some of the previous levels, but it's still challenging. You've already mentioned my solution is a backroute, in particular mining to get underneath the bee trap isn't intended. Multitasking is definitely needed here, or you'll run out of time. Seems like the middle area needs to be refined in order to get the level resolved.

Libra 6 - Mr. Lem's Secret Wine Cellar Major roadblock of the rank. In the end, it seems like I found nearly the same backroute as josh by going underneath the OWW :P Thank you for not spoiling the blocker trick, as it should be left to the player to "discover" it. Also, as you know I'm one of those people who prefers to solve levels without hints. Hopefully it'll come to me sometime before I encounter the 5th rank level that requires it, but so far I'm not coming up with anything other than a very timing heavy and fiddly thing interaction with a basher. Still, the fact that the skillset is very limited hopefully means it'll eventually be stumbled upon.

Libra 7 - Return of the Troublesome Trio Very nice level here. Nowhere near as hard as some of the previous levels. As you mentioned, the tight timing I used is not needed. I look forward to seeing the Omega and Omega 2 versions of the level that you were inspired by with this one, as I have only played the LPA version.

Libra 8 - A Dance of Fire and Ice Major backroute as you said. I didn't think it was supposed to be that easy :P It was literally just 2-3 minutes and solved :laugh:

Libra 9 - The Strategist Another favorite of mine! Tricks needed: containing the crowd with two blockers such that you can bomb a lemming trapped between them to release both, timing it in such a way so that a lemming slips by the builder to get below and can start shimmying, as well as bomb a lemming in the crowd so that the platformer that finishes turns back to the left and can survive the fall below, putting the platformers in place to allow a shimmier to keep going, using a stacker to allow a climber to get up to the first platformer bridge to start shimmying, and finally builder/miner combo. I really love how the solution all comes together perfectly! :thumbsup: The crowd nearly arrives before the miner finishes breaking, but if you do the solution correctly it will always work out.

Libra 10 - Bloodthirster Another roadblock. It seems that I had some mistaken assumptions, such as for a long time having the digger locked in place at the very far right of the level. Once I challenged that assumption and used it elsewhere, then I started seeing some things that could help me get the level solved. However, the eventual solution I came up with is quite precise. In particular, the first basher and the builder are, as the other climber needs to turn around, and no one except for the climber can get over the steel. I also used a basher to hit the steel to make the climber turn around so that he doesn't go into the flamethrower. As a result, I have a glider leftover. Needless to say, my solution is a backroute :laugh:

Libra 11 - Dungeon of Despair Hard one, although my solution is a backroute. I did see the new version with the OWW, so that appears to make the solution way more obvious. Also seems that a bomber must be used to get up the final wall to get to the exit. Even then, I have a feeling that the level's still not easy.

Libra 12 - Sweet Mirages Another stumper, as there's so many things that will leave you a skill short. After some time, it should be logical to deduce that every pickup is a red herring save for one or two. I see that the updated version swapped the two pickups at the bottom right, so it might be nearly the same thing, except one would need to have a miner available to destroy the stoner that's assigned to the preassigned blocker. I'm not sure, but I'm guessing it's almost the same as the solution I found. In any case, this is a very deceptively difficult level.

Libra 13 - Dead Lems Society Another hard but excellent level here! This level uses the trick of stoning and then giving a nearby lemming a shimmier so that he can use the short jump to get on top of the stoner. However, that's done near the end, and the blocker needs to be placed in such a way so that the climber from below can get past it. I thought compression was needed with the entire crowd to get past the bear trap, but it seems that you'll always lose more than one lemming to it that way. I couldn't find a way to use the leftover miner and basher to only lose 1 anyway. It was still very hard to see to use the ceiling to bash and mine to get the crowd up.

Libra 14 - Medium Well-Done Not as difficult as some of the previous levels, and I thought it would be a complete breather, but nope! It's still challenging. My solution is a backroute here as well.

Libra 15 - Help Yourself Wow, very hard one but another favorite of mine! :thumbsup: Looks like remaking the solution was for the best. Although both tricks are quite timing heavy, the ones needed here are quite nice: Stack at such a time and place so that a lemming gets on top of the stack to mine for the others to get up and then quickly assigning the laserer to make a dent in the ceiling to stop the basher and for everyone to drop past the grapes and worm trap, and stacking and then building on top of the stack with the glider so that he turns around and then he can climb up the left wall to glide and then start bashing through the ceiling. So, I agree that this level is a roadblock. This level does a great job of showing that limitation of the laserer on the range, and that the only way to make a dent in the ceiling is to get on top of a stack so that a laserer reaches that far.

Libra 16 - Gloomy Silence Another very hard but great level! There's lot of things that can trip you up here. The start can be quite difficult, although losing one due to slipping by the stack will always happen no matter what. One of the platformers is very precise, and also when to assign the shimmier, as there's only one possible position so that the shimmier can go to the very far right. That's a very nice trick of getting a climber into the bottom teleporter in order to get at the top and bomb to stop the shimmier. Also with platforming and then cloning so that you can get a lemming underneath to platform the gap at the bottom, as well as using the climber to airdrop bomb the wall to release the crowd trapped at the start. Finally, stacking near the wall in such a way that only one non-climber gets over the wall to shimmy to the far right. Here, it seems that I made the timing tighter and harder on myself than I needed to. I got the exit to unlock just in time before anyone could slip past it and fall to the bottomless pit.

Libra 17 - Lend a Helping Hand Very hard one but yet another favorite of mine! Tricks needed: platforming to extend a basher, backwards bashing in order to make a climber friendly wall to send a climber out to the left, blocking on a raised slope so that lemmings from the left can go underneath the blocker and be contained on the other side, builder/miner combo, and finally digging and bombing it to blow through the green emerald on both sides to release the left entrance. The timing for the platformer and bashing is tight, but it's a nice one so that it also serves as a splatform for the left entrance. The climbers also need to be timed in a such a way that both the builder and miner meet at the exact same time so that the builder doesn't turn around. This seems to have been inspired by a Genocide level in United ;)

Libra 18 - Moonlight Sculptor Here I should had waited for you to release an update, but it turns out it wouldn't had mattered, as my solution still works for the current version :P In any case, I thought this would be a breather as well, but this is also deceivingly difficult. Once again, my solution is very tight on timing and precision. Something tells me that the builder/miner combo is intended, though.

Libra 19 - Slip 'N Slide By far the hardest level for me in the entire rank, as I was stuck on this level for a very long time. This might even tie with Libra 6 for hardest of the rank, although I can't quite tell since I have yet to find the obscure blocker trick needed for it. Not sure if all the precision skill assignments I did in the solution is needed, as well as the very tight timing to get the blocker released in time before any of the climbers turned around and won't be able to exit later because the miner chipped off the staircase and would result in them falling into the water or ice steam blower trap. Really the only thing I needed to tweak was when to assign the slider, as I kept doing it with the lemming in the front instead of the very tail end. This level can definitely trip one up with so many obstacles that you'll run into when solving. In particular, I kept trying to formulate a solution where I can get the climbers to be contained by the blocker, but either the blocker would be too close to prevent that from happening, or it's only possible to do so by blocking a lemming going to the left, but then this would mean you lose both the blocker and the slider, which you can't afford, since you can only lose 1. A lot of my attempts kept having me be 1 under the requirement. Even then, the fact that I was constantly that close kept me coming back and determined to get it solved ;) Until then, the LP was on hold for a few days due to being stuck.

So, I have a blocker leftover, but maybe that's still acceptable?

Libra 20 - Another Hero Time Nowhere near as hard as the previous level, but the solution in my LP video is an old version, as I forgot to download the new pack version before I recorded part 44 :forehead: So, I decided to resolve v3.4 of the level before I posted my replays :) I think this is still a backroute, as I have a glider leftover :P It's really not that much different from the LP solution, other than how a stacker needs to be used near the start to get shimmiers to go over the top to forge the path. Also I still had spare shimmiers to interrupt a stacker and miner.   

Well, it was a very long and hard struggle through the penultimate rank, but I finally made it through. This was even on top of me being tired from work every day for the past few weeks and hence my time to LP the pack is far more limited. Except for the weekends, where I'm able to upload more videos than I can on the weekdays. Even with the very short work day I had last Friday and the day off I had this week, I didn't make too much progress at all with the LP, so that advantage was nullified. :crylaugh:

In any case, I'm finally on the 5th and final rank of the pack. Already solved Aquarius 1, and again I forgot to download the new version of the pack before recording, and so it's a backroute. Even then, I think I'm all caught up on the most recent versions of every level, so I should be good to go. The rank already starts off quite difficult, so it's bringing back nightmares of being stuck hard on Genocide 1 of United :crylaugh: Likely a sample of things to come, so it'll likely take a really long time to get through the remaining 19 levels of the pack. However, as I'm quite far into the pack now, I'm quite determined to keep going until the very end! :)

Wish me luck, and I know you'll get yourself all caught up on my LP videos in no time! :thumbsup: Thanks again for all the feedback/compliments and support through the entire playthrough.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 15, 2021, 12:29:26 PM
Thanks for all the replays, feedbacks and LPvideos! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
And congratulation for reaching the final rank
:lem4ever:

I've finally catched up some of your LPvidoes.
I won't procastinate watching vids from now on.(hopefully :crylaugh:)

Overall you've found intended solutions for most of the levels until 3rd rank and 4th rank.... is gonna be a backroute-fest. :evil:
Granted, the more a certain level is complicated, the more backroute-prone it is.
But you also found some very interesting solutions that I'm willing to take them as alternative solutions or challenge solutions.

QuoteThe only time when I was able to solve multiple levels were simply where there were contest levels, as I've already played and solved them. The only ones I haven't played of yours is from LDC #19, although they're probably not in the pack. I have a feeling that the final contest levels of the pack are in this rank.

I'm not 100 sure but only about half of my contest levels are in this pack. The main reason why some levels are rejected is that I wasn't too happy with the quality of them. And my two levels from LDC#19(I can't even remember their titles :P) are obvious examples. If you LP previous contest levels in the future, you will see them eventually.(One of them is very very vulnerable to backroutes and I gave up fixing them. And I can't even remember what another level looks like!)

QuoteAlready right out of the gate I was stumped with Libra 1, even though you mention in the pre-text that it's a "breather." It's totally not btw, but now that I've read your description of the intended solution via the YT comment it goes to show you that even levels with no fancy tricks needed can still be very difficult. Yes, I agree that the solution itself isn't difficult, but being able to find it is a different matter, which of course varies from player to player. Be assured that you're far from being the only one who underestimates the difficulty of your own levels. This goes for any designer, as it's very hard for one to judge the difficulty of one's own pack, which is why feedback is helpful for the content creator.

Yeah. (old)Aries10 is an obvious example. The difficulty still jumps around here and their but it's my first pack and I can't expect too much at my first attempt. :crylaugh: Hopefully my next project will have more smooth difficulty curve.

I found it funny that my list of favorite levels and your list have a lot of levels in common though!(Libra3, 9, 13, 15...) I'm really happy that I'm not the only one who enjoy these levels. :laugh:

Some comments on individual levels

Libra 1 - Flattening Process: This level, as the preview text says, is my first dirt level ever made. And it's also the first level I showcase on discord. Back then, Namida backrouted this level so I had to add the steel block. And you managed to backroute this level by abusing that steel block :crylaugh:
Libra 2 - Medieval Romance: Originally the stoner was given from the beginning. I made the stoner a pick-up to block a backroute. I was afraid the stoner pick-up make the solution way too obvious, but fortunately it seems the level is still challenging enough.
Libra 3 - Unstoppable: I recently realized that I've used a lot of extending destructive skills with some constructive skills tricks in my level by watching your LP. I didn't know that I was a big fan of that trick!
Libra 4 - Life of a High Roller: Yeah. I deliberately made the level to have many "one skill short- solutions" :evil: I was smiling when you said "it was somewhat easy level" and then few seconds later "never mind" :evil:
Libra 15 - Help Yourself: Wow, this solution is amazing. The most difficult part of this level is probably figuring out that you need to take the ceiling route. It's hard too see that because you don't have any downward digging tools like bombers , diggers or miners so you don't have any obvious way to "escape" from the ceiling basher tunnel. So you have to find out that you can stack on top of the lemon terrain and use the laserer to make a tiny hole to the ceiling and that's the Aha! moment. Your solution is less efficient than mine at the beginning: If you max out the RR after spawning 2 lemmings, you don't need to make a stacker+basher staircase for the crowd. But your solution is more efficient than mine at the very left part: while a climber lemming bash to the left at the cheese terrain, another climber lemming turn around at the basher tunnel and build+stack to make the wall climbable. But you achieve the same thing without using the basher. So if you combine your solution and my solution, you can actually save a basher and with that, you can save one more lemming who stuck inside the cheese wall. I made it a talisman and decided to tribute you with the name of the talisman(check the update log below ;))
Libra 16 - Gloomy Silence: And this!! Your solution is not at all intended, but I will take it. The intended solution is all about teleporting the shimmier lemming and that's how you can send a non-climber lemming to where the buttons are. Your solution is as hard as the intended one and I really like the trick you used, so I will happily take it as an alternative solution. :thumbsup:
Libra 19 - Slip 'N Slide: It's so sad that this level was backrouted :( I'm quite sure if you figure out the intended solution, this level will be included to your favorite levels list!

Good luck with your LP on final rank ;) It won't be easy but I believe you will complete it eventually if you don't give up. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 15, 2021, 12:31:21 PM
V3.5 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 01 Flattening Process - moved the steel block slightly to the left
-4 14 Medium Well-done - added a OWW
-4 15 Help Yourself - new talisman "Don't Try This at Home if You are Not kaywhyn": save 35/40(1more than required) using no more than 2 climbers
-4 18 Moolight Sculptor - added a fire
-4 19 Slip 'N Slide - added a steel block
-4 20 Another Hero Time - added some steel blocks
-5 03 Jumping Bees - added a steel block
-5 09 IRON JUGGERNAUT 2 - jumpers are now pick-ups
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: NieSch on October 15, 2021, 12:46:36 PM
Quote from: Armani on October 15, 2021, 12:31:21 PM
-4 15 Help Yourself - new talisman "Don't Try This at Home if You are Not kaywhyn": save 35/40(1more than required) using no more than 2 climbers

:crylaugh:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 22, 2021, 12:00:40 PM
BIG update 8-)

V3.6 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-5 04 Rhythmical - added some water, locked the RR
-5 05 Abandoned Library - added some fire, added a button
-5 06 RefleXion - added a bit of terrain, added a time limit of 2:10
-5 07 Double-Edged Sword - added a bit of terrain, added a steel block, increased the save requirement by 1
-5 08 Purity and Industry - added a steel block
-5 09 IRON JUGGERNAUT 2 - modified a bit of terrain, moved the position of a jumper pick-up
-5 10 Triple Lutz - added some fire, added a steel block, a blocker is now a pick-up
-5 11 Lost in an Ice Cave - added some steel blocks
-5 12 Butterfly Effect - removed a bit of terrain, added some traps, added a steel block
-5 13 System Malfunction - added a steel block
-5 15 Simulation FARO - swapped the positions of a basher pick-up and a platformer pick-up
-5 16 Facade of Indifference - modified terrain a bit in the left side of the level
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 22, 2021, 02:18:57 PM
Oh dang, I found so many backroutes! :P Practically every level in the final rank has been one except for the first three levels. Woot woot, go me! :laugh: Bet you're thankful for this, especially since the last two ranks have mostly been untested. Well, as you may have seen, down to the final 5 levels of the pack now, and I have every intention to finish it/the LP up :)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 25, 2021, 09:55:45 AM
And, the Aquarius rank has fallen and hence I have solved the entire pack! If I'm not mistaken, I'm probably the first person to do so :) My entire replay collection is attached. Also, I decided to resolve Aquarius 1, since the one in the LP is for an unpatched version. Everything else in the LP for the Aquarius rank should be up-to-date.

Aquarius Rank Feedback

The hardest levels of the entire pack are found in this rank, and hence it was a very long struggle, even more so than the Libra rank. Pretty much the entire rank was very hard, and it definitely shows in my LP, as most of the time I could only solve one level per video. There were only a few videos where I was able to solve two levels in one, and there was even one where I could had been able to take down 3 in one, but alas that wasn't the case. It also happens to be the longest video in the entire LP, over 1.5 hours :crylaugh: Sorry about that, I guess I was very determined to get Aquarius 14 solved, but I gave up in the end and my brain was just hurting :XD:

However, the saving grace in this rank is how I managed to backroute pretty much every level! :P Last I checked the update patched up through 5 16, so pretty much the only levels that weren't were 5 2, 5 3, and 5 14. Sorry to disappoint you, but I think I might have found a backroute in each of the final 4 levels of the rank as well :laugh: So, that pretty much makes every solution a backroute except for the three levels mentioned, but let's wait for your feedback on 5 17 - 5 20.

The fact that I've even managed to solve levels in this rank is just beyond belief for me here, particularly since the difficulty is described by you as "extreme~" :crylaugh: Which I think is appropriate, as practically every level in the rank was a very big struggle for me.

Spoiler

Aquarius 1 - Game of the Century Wow, this is quite a hard level to start off the rank. I've played plenty of levels where the word "Lemmings" is spelled out in the terrain, and they have pretty much have all been challenging for the most part, but even they're nowhere near as hard as this! :XD: As mentioned before, I decided to resolve v3.3 of the level, as the one in the LP is an outdated version due to how I forgot to redownload the pack before I recorded myself solving the level. Therefore, I think it's only fair that I do so. Even then, the LP should make it obvious how much I struggled with the level. v3.3's is even harder, I feel. Unfortunately, I think it's still a backroute, as I still don't use the climber pickup :P However, let me say that it took me a really long time to make the solution work out. Timing the climbers so that they all make it through before they got blocked by the builder staircase, for example. In this way, it would save me a cancelling skill with a shimmier/jumper so that lemmings can still escape later, such as the miner at the very end. This was very frustrating to get to work, but again likely not intended, as the intended one is probably far easier and less fiddly than mine.

Aquarius 2 - Overpopulation Another very hard one but quite a good one. I learned a new trick here, which is the interaction of a stoner and slider. This is the easiest way to contain a slider, as they're stuck in an infinite loop due to the small holes on either side. In other words, it's almost the same as containing sliders with a stacker, except for the stacker you need to spend at least one skill to achieve the same thing. I believe the easiest would be mining and cloning it. For this level, I especially love the shimmier/bomber trick at the very end to blow through both floors so that the sliders can fall through without sliding and going out in the wrong direction. I think the funny thing was that I tried stretching out the platformer but unfortunately the sliders all wouldn't be close enough to fall through the bomber hole at the very end. Hence, that's why I needed to use the shimmier to get the builder to sync up with the rest. Otherwise, the solution is very hard to see. In particular, finding the correct RR to make everyone stack behind one another took a really long time. I apparently don't understand the RR mechanics too well :laugh:

Aquarius 3 - Jumping Bees Not as hard as the previous two but I still struggled a lot. That was a very nice trick of platforming and blocking at the end of it in the starting area to allow a lemming to go over the top to prepare the right side. Here, I have a jumper leftover, but that's because I timed it in such a way so that only one lemming slips by the platformer while he's in progress and he closes off the gap in time before anyone else can slip by. Therefore, it's really to make the timing much easier by simply having one from the crowd jump over the blocker. Also, that's a very nice trick with bombing a faller in order to get the swimmer to jump into the pool, as well as bombing the top to get him out. Finally, jumping and bombing to make a hole that everyone can get into after the platformer is done in order to make a safe drop down close to the exit. Overall, quite a nice level here! :) I honestly don't know why I struggled so much with this level after solving it and seeing that it's not very hard :forehead: In particular, I kept thinking that the platformer bridge needed to be bombed or destroyed with a skill to isolate the swimmer when it was really simply getting one to slip by. As you already mentioned, my solution isn't intended, but it is acceptable. From what I remember, you said that the intention was to send a worker out to the left.

Aquarius 4 - Rhythmical Another hard one but unfortunately my solution was a backroute. I really love what you did with the design there by putting in a lot of musical symbols: two eighth notes joined I think it's called a stem, an eighth note with a flag, a treble clef and a bass clef. I've been interested in music for a very long time, as even before I took choir in school as an elective I've been singing a lot and hence I know a lot of music theory :)

Aquarius 5 - Abandoned Library This is a level where the solution is obvious, so the challenge is getting it to work. Even then, it's still a challenging level. It was extremely annoying that the solution I tried for the left entrance always failed by a pixel or two, as well as being a builder short :evil: This is the builder I would have had had it not been for the fact that I needed a builder to keep a miner going where the lemming is trapped in the middle >:( In the end, I found a hackish way to release the right crowd with, which there are now fire traps to prevent. However, with the addition of a button, I think it's clear that you intended a falling bomber to release the blocker.

Aquarius 6 - RefleXion Very hard level, and one that you guess is a roadblock. Indeed, I agree with you here, as I really struggled here. In the end, I found a solution that simply involved holding the crowd back, which you decided to block off by putting in a time limit and adding some terrain so that the blocker can't be released as easily with a laserer :crylaugh: So, it seems that the intention is to keep the crowd moving, although I honestly have no idea how to solve the level now :( This isn't the only one, though. There's plenty of others that I don't really have a clue anymore.

Aquarius 7 - Double-Edged Sword Somewhat an easy one for the rank, although it's pretty much the only level that I considered quite close to a breather for rank 5. I have two bashers leftover, because apparently turning a lemming around with a walker as soon as he touches the ground after breaking through is enough of a lead for him to build over the gap at the bottom. Again, my level was considered a backroute, so apparently you're not taking this solution for an answer :laugh:

Aquarius 8 - Purity and Industry Another very deceivingly hard level. In the end, I found a solution that involves a lot of precision, especially with the platformers both going at the same time so that no one gets interrupted and turns around. It also uses the extending the very first basher at the very first start with the builder staircase going in the same direction as the basher, but it's a very precise skill assignment, as you need to do it at a time so that the basher doesn't stop but at the same time the builder doesn't overtake him and hence gets contained by the tunnel. With the backroute fix, seems that the trick isn't the intention. My guess is that the intended solution somehow has the glider go through both the middle and bottom of the level, but so far all my attempts is always running a skill short. This level definitely reminds me of "The Gaema Plateau" due to how if you take the obvious you'll always be a skill short. Seems to be working here very well! :-\

Aquarius 9 - IRON JUGGERNAUT 2 Wow, this is a really good level and one of my favorites! :thumbsup: You really did justice with Icho's level from United here. This one still ended up being a difficult one for me, although it wasn't anywhere near as hard as the original, at least for me due to how there's no stackers here, and I tend to be very bad with them. I do like the solution concept, involving both a climber and a slider working their way through various parts of the level to have the path set up. The slider/shimmier goes through the bottom, while the climber that frees the slider so that he doesn't go out in the wrong direction goes back up to the middle of the level after the OWW is bashed through. However, you have deemed my solution to be a slight backroute due to how one of my miner and blocker placements are unintended, I believe.

Aquarius 10 - Triple Lutz This one doesn't seem as hard as some of the previous ones in the rank, but it's still challenging. Now that you blocked off my solution with a lot of fire traps, I'm not sure how to go about solving the patched up version either :XD:

Aquarius 11 - Lost in an Ice Cave Backroute here as well, as I'm certain the solution is supposed to be far harder than that. Whereas an easier version of "Polaris Rhapsody" was in the Aries rank, this is the level you stated is pretty much a far harder version of "Polaris Rhapsody." Therefore, that likely means the solution involves getting a blocker in place to bounce off a miner, as those two levels both involve such a thing. Not sure how to go about doing that with the fix :8():

Aquarius 12 - Butterfly Effect Another level that you guessed would be a roadblock, which I also believe. Hence, my solution is a very bad backroute. With the patch, once again I don't have the slightest clue to go about it.

Aquarius 13 - System Malfunction Another very bad backroute and a level which you also guessed would be a roadblock. Not sure how to go about solving this patched up version either :sick:

Aquarius 14 - BlockChain Company Revisited A repeat of Aries 8 but far harder due to having 5 less of every skill. In other words, both are X-of-everything but with the challenge much higher with the repeat version due to the buttons. You already mentioned that my solution is more efficient than yours, where I had some skills leftover but you used all the digging destructive skills. Pretty much an anything goes level just like the original, hence we finally get to a level that doesn't need a fix after I have backrouted every single one of the previous 10 levels :P

Aquarius 15 - Simulation: FARO Yet another one that you listed as a roadblock, and I certainly believe that after a lot of struggling here despite finding a very hackish and super bad backroute :P Indeed, that solution has now been patched out by switching around the pickups. So, once again no clue how to go about solving the patched up version :-\

Aquarius 16 - Facade of Indifference Another level you listed as a roadblock, and I can definitely see how, but honestly this one isn't so bad, now that I think about it. I was simply a dummy with the right side, where I never though about using compression to get past the masher trap in order to save a skill that is useful elsewhere :forehead: This level is interesting, as this was patched up before I managed to solve it on camera. Thus, you'll see two different versions in the LP, an unpatched version and the current v3.6 one. The changes on the left side definitely made the solution more obvious :P Even then, this is quite a nice one, although admittedly it's annoying with how the shimmier has to be repeatedly assigned with the rough terrain in the middle with the slider. No fault of yours, though, as that's just how the skills work.

Aquarius 17 - Forgive Us Third level in a row that you guessed to be a roadblock, and yes I believe that. Once more, the problems usually lie in being a skill short. I'm not sure if being able to glide onto the mass of terrain is intended, but that's how it allowed me to have enough skills to solve the level. It even allowed me to have a shimmier and jumper leftover :P So, perhaps another backroute?

Aquarius 18 - One Lemming to Rule Them All The final level you guessed to be a roadblock, and indeed it was very so here, as I really struggled here. This was another level that needed off-camera time to solve. In the end, my solution is probably a backroute, as I have a blocker leftover. For some reason, it took me a really long time to see to use a jumper to interrupt the digger after he's gone low enough to stop any of the crowd from spilling out to the right. Also, as this is one of your favorites, you mentioned that they usually don't have anything fancy or advanced required, so I'll keep that in mind. Indeed, there wasn't really any of that, so it's likely I struggled due to really overthinking and overcomplicating the solution.

Aquarius 19 - Immoral Society I believe this is only the second level of the pack to have at least one neutral. He turns out to be very important in the solution, as he needs to disarm the traps and swim over to get the final button right where the exit is. This wasn't guessed to be a roadblock, but I thought this level was still hard. I'm not sure if getting those compressed lemmings past the traps is intended. I also used the odd shimmier can still go through a platformer bridge mechanic to save the lemming who platformed over the water to allow the right entrance to land down safely, as I wouldn't save enough otherwise. I also don't know if it's intended to punch a hole in the stack to allow everyone to be contained on the right side, as well as the super precise stacker placement to allow the neutral to turn around to get the top button. I also constantly kept forgetting the neutral is a preassigned climber, swimmer, and disarmer all in one :XD: As for the zombie, he simply seems to be a "keep away at all costs" and therefore there is absolutely no need to come anywhere near him.

Aquarius 20 - Lovebirds Duet To round off the pack, we have a wonderfully designed level by Armani's gf. I especially love all the hearts everywhere in the level, signifying their love for one another ;) She did quite good with the design. In the end, this seems like a very bad backroute :P I still like some solution parts in my earlier attempts, particularly the builder/miner combo, so I honestly don't mind my solution being blocked here, as it deserves to be quite special due to your gf making it and you coming up with the solution via the skillset. It's just that there's still the problem of skill shortages again :-\ All in all, still a very hard level, although certainly nowhere near the hardest of the entire pack like with most level packs I've played and completely solved.   

What can I say that hasn't been said yet? This is quite a well-done pack despite all the numerous backroutes I've found in the later ranks :thumbsup: I definitely enjoyed it a lot, and I'm still in disbelief that I managed to make it through to the very end with the LP. Before starting it, you will recall that I had fears that I was going to regret the decision to LP it due to signing up what sounds to be quite a difficult pack. However, since I managed to make it through to the very end after 66 videos, I don't have any regrets whatsoever :P What's even more amazing is how I managed to solve both United and Uncharted, something not many people will be able to say. Hence, I consider this quite a wonderful accomplishment to have done both :)

To the others, beware that Uncharted is a very hard pack, almost up there with United, but after having played through the entire thing, I definitely agree that it isn't as hard as United. However, it starts off harder than United IMO, and manages to stay more or less the same in difficulty, with the occasional odd level that's considerably harder than most of the other levels in the rank, up through the Leo rank. Then, once you get into the 4th rank, the difficulty really steps up. In my experiences, it was a very hard and long struggle, and even more so with the 5th and final rank. Even then, don't let the very high difficulty intimidate you. I certainly didn't when I played through United most of last year. However, it is a large time commitment, and you have to be willing to take on the levels and allow yourself to struggle and be stuck on them if you are to make any kind of progress. Admittedly, a lot of the patched up versions I don't have a clue as to how to go about solving them, but I'm one of those people who usually doesn't go back and resolve backroute fixed levels. I might do it for this pack, but I'm not sure. I'm almost certain that I won't, though.

Overall, wonderful job with your first level pack, Armani! :) I look forward to your next project that you're working on, as well as any future levels of yours. Good luck to anyone who's willing to take up playing and solving this pack! ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 25, 2021, 01:13:14 PM
Thanks again for feedback, replays and LP videos! :thumbsup: I've tried to watch at least one video everyday so now I only have 3 or 4 videos to watch. ;)

Unfortunately, most of the solutions to 5th ranks are backroutes. :( So not much things to mention for individual levels.. but here we go! :)

comments on several levels

5 01 Not quite intended. I decided to do some aggressive update, so now the intended solution is strongly enforced but it's easy to see now.
5 02 As I already commented on YT video, your solution is intended and I gave a spare shimmier so the player can make the timing part easy. But I recently found a backroute that abuse the spare shimmier.(it basically bypass the shimmier+bomber trick to destroy both platforms and let the sliders don't turn around at the end)
5 03 One of the very few intended solution :crylaugh: well done!
5 04 This level also has a core trick I want to enforce so.. update time.
5 06 I would accept some alternative solutions unless it contains the crowd and plays with a single lemming :(
5 10~13 These levels also require some obscure tricks, and I really want to enforce them
5 14 Again really nice solution :thumbsup: I'm planning to upload my intended solutions replays pack once every level is solved in intended or at least acceptable ways, and I think I'm gonna attach this solution as well as a challenge solution :thumbsup:
5 15 I think this is a strong candidate for the hardest level of the pack(along with 5 17 and 5 18) if the intended solution is properly enforced. I have no clue why I missed the possiblity of ignoring the left part completely. :XD:

QuoteAnd, the Aquarius rank has fallen and hence I have solved the entire pack! If I'm not mistaken, I'm probably the first person to do so :)
Yeah I know what you mean but I want to keep the title "First person to complete Lemmings Uncharted" for someone who will solve every level of the pack with intended or at least acceptable solutions in the future.

QuoteTo the others, beware that Uncharted is a very hard pack, almost up there with United, but after having played through the entire thing, I definitely agree that it isn't as hard as United. However, it starts off harder than United IMO, and manages to stay more or less the same in difficulty, with the occasional odd level that's considerably harder than most of the other levels in the rank, up through the Leo rank. Then, once you get into the 4th rank, the difficulty really steps up. In my experiences, it was a very hard and long struggle, and even more so with the 5th and final rank. Even then, don't let the very high difficulty intimidate you. I certainly didn't when I played through United most of last year. However, it is a large time commitment, and you have to be willing to take on the levels and allow yourself to struggle and be stuck on them if you are to make any kind of progress. Admittedly, a lot of the patched up versions I don't have a clue as to how to go about solving them, but I'm one of those people who usually doesn't go back and resolve backroute fixed levels. I might do it for this pack, but I'm not sure. I'm almost certain that I won't, though.
The intended solutions of the levels from the last two ranks are still hidden. And almost all the best and the hardest puzzles and new tricks of the pack are there. So I think it's hard to judge the difficulty of the pack at this point, especially since majority of the backroutes so far were major ones. ;)

QuoteOverall, wonderful job with your first level pack, Armani! :) I look forward to your next project that you're working on, as well as any future levels of yours. Good luck to anyone who's willing to take up playing and solving this pack! ;)
There were some mind-boggling solutions.(your solutions to "Magic box" and Help Yourself" come to my mind. Especially my mind got blown by your solution to "Help Yourself" so I thought I have to pay some kinds of tribute to you and added a talisman. XD)
Can't thank you enough for playing the pack and all the backroutes! You've been a GREAT help to improve the pack! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:





------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
V3.7 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-5 01 Game of the Century - moved some fire, added a OWW
-5 02 Overpopulation - -1shimmier
-5 16 Facade of Indifference - modified terrain a bit
-5 17 Forgive Us - added some fire above the hatch
-5 18 One Lemming to Rule Them All - removed the background, a basher is now a pick-up
-5 19 Immoral Society - modified terrain a bit, added a trap
-5 20 Lovebirds Duet - corrected some grammar errors in the pretext, added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 25, 2021, 10:40:53 PM
Quote from: Armani on October 25, 2021, 01:13:14 PM
Yeah I know what you mean but I want to keep the title "First person to complete Lemmings Uncharted" for someone who will solve every level of the pack with intended or at least acceptable solutions in the future.

Fair point, although keep in mind that not everyone is like you in resolving patched up levels :P What is considered a level pack "solved" seems to mean different things to different people. For example, despite a lot of backroutes still abound, Strato still considers me the first one to have completed all of Lemmicks and Old Formats LWT.

For me, it simply means solving every level of the pack at least once, and so most of the time I don't bother to go back and resolve backroute fixed levels. Once I've gotten through a level pack, I consider myself done with that particular level pack and generally move on to other ones and usually don't look back. For your pack, I may or may not do it, but I think I will, for the most part, won't. From my understanding, I'm not the only one who does this, although there's still some number of people who are like you as well in resolving patched up levels even after having solved the entire pack.

Quote
The intended solutions of the levels from the last two ranks are still hidden. And almost all the best and the hardest puzzles and new tricks of the pack are there. So I think it's hard to judge the difficulty of the pack at this point, especially since majority of the backroutes so far were major ones. ;)

Your pack is less than half as long as United, as well as having about only half the number of levels per rank that United does. So, the difficulty of the levels of Uncharted increasing much faster than United is kind of justified. At the same time, your pack does make use of both of the two new NL skills that just got added to the stable release earlier this year, and because most of us seem to still be getting used to their mechanics, that's why the levels featuring them can feel quite hard, but if one is familiar with them then they won't seem or feel as hard. Similarly, I have an inkling that United could possibly be much harder had there been levels featuring both the shimmier and the jumper skills in the main ranks, but the only reason they don't is due to how the level pack was made before they were in the stable release. Even more, you only see levels featuring the shimmier skill in the Bonus rank of United, but no levels featuring the jumper.

For now, I still consider your level pack not as difficult as United, so I'm in a bit of agreement with your supposed prediction of the difficulty compared to it, although I think I can confidently say that the 5th rank's difficulty seems to exceed that of United's Genocide rank. At least it feels like it, just because of how it was a very long struggle throughout the entire rank. I even look back on some of the Aquarius levels and I still don't understand why I struggled on some of them, as I see now that some of the solutions aren't that hard at all. I still think it's something that goes on while one is LPing. Doing that and solving on camera doing both well is far harder than it seems! :laugh: However, it's not all bad, as it at least allows a glance into how one approaches level solving in real time.

Quote
There were some mind-boggling solutions.(your solutions to "Magic box" and Help Yourself" come to my mind. Especially my mind got blown by your solution to "Help Yourself" so I thought I have to pay some kinds of tribute to you and added a talisman. XD)
Can't thank you enough for playing the pack and all the backroutes! You've been a GREAT help to improve the pack! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

It was my pleasure to LP your pack and to help you along with finding horrible backroutes to many of these levels :thumbsup: I think, by my approximation, I helped to find backroutes to about half the number of levels in the pack, which, all things considered, is quite a lot, although it definitely could had been worse :P I thought I would find way more than that, though honestly sometimes I think I'm not as good at backrouting levels as I think I am :laugh: Rather, I seem to be really good at overcomplicating and finding quite messy and fiddly solutions.

Thanks again for the tribute for the talisman for Libra 15! :thumbsup: However, while I was recording the outros in the final LP video, I noticed something very strange, and that is when I clicked to display the talisman for the level my name is completely cut off, i.e, you don't see it at all. It simply says "Don't try this at home if you are not" and then it stops there without displaying my username. That kind of ruined a special moment for me in the video, but I explained to the viewers what it's really supposed to say. I wonder if that is due to a character limit or a bug. I'll make sure to report this as a bug if it is one.

edit: Ok, I investigated further and it is not a bug but due to the character limit. When typing the name of the talisman, it simply stops at the word "not" and therefore doesn't allow you type my username. The only workaround I can think of at the moment is that it's simply called "Don't Try This If You Are Not Kaywhyn." This would allow you to get my username on there, though maybe there can be a suggestion to increase the character limit for talisman names.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 30, 2021, 01:19:54 AM
Ah yes, it seems like there's the character limit for talisman names.
At first I wrote the talisman name in window default text program and copied&pasted it to the NL editor and it worked well.
But it seems like it doesn't display in NL player properly.

I personally prefer the original talisman name but for the time being, I made the talisman name "Don't Try This If You Are Not Kaywhyn" as you suggested.
If there'll be some kind of updates on increasing the character limit for talisman names, we can go back to original name. ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on October 30, 2021, 08:18:53 AM
Quote from: Armani on October 30, 2021, 01:19:54 AM
I personally prefer the original talisman name but for the time being, I made the talisman name "Don't Try This If You Are Not Kaywhyn" as you suggested.
If there'll be some kind of updates on increasing the character limit for talisman names, we can go back to original name. ;)

Yes, I agree that what you named the talisman originally is the better one. My suggestion is simply a workaround in the meantime :P In that case, I'll likely report a suggestion for allowing more characters for talisman names then. Since it's for the NL editor, I think this should be fine, since there's no hard deadline for it to reach a "final" version.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 01, 2021, 06:04:51 AM
V3.8 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 06 RefleXion - repositioned one of the trap, added some water, changed the skillset a bit
-5 13 System Malfunction - added a OWW
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on April 02, 2022, 11:52:41 AM
V3.9 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - modified terrain a bit
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on April 19, 2022, 08:25:20 AM
V4.0 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 04 Kiwi Pie - added some fire, added a time limit of 3:30
-3 08 No Devil Lived On - a blocker is now a pick-up
-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - added a steel block
-3 20 Fall in the Dark - removed a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on July 23, 2022, 10:22:28 PM
Finally found some time, mood and energy to start and I finished the first rank. :)

Replays attached and I have some backrouty feelings for level 12. :evil:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 24, 2022, 05:30:28 AM
@Ichotolot
Thanks so much for playing through and great job solving the first rank! :thumbsup:
Yeah you were right about there being only one backroute in your replays!(of which I already aware from The Tomato Watcher's steram but I was too lazy to fix right away :XD:)

Pretty much all your solutions are exactly identical to my original solutions but you found some interesting alternatives to 1 19 and 1 20 that I'm happy to accept. Your solution to 1 12 is a backroute and I extended the water a bit so you cannot dig through the edge anymore.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 24, 2022, 05:31:16 AM
V4.1 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-1 12 Midnight Circus - removed a bit of terrain, extended the water by 1 pixel
-1 16 Cheese in the Trap - added a bit of terrain
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on July 24, 2022, 08:57:07 PM
And to finish off the weekend here is Aries resolved + Gemini. :)

I don't know how much time+energy+motivation I find during the week, but as a certain machine once said: I'll be back! 8-)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 27, 2022, 05:29:01 AM
Nicely done! Everything intended :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on July 31, 2022, 05:56:14 PM
Here is Leo! :lemcat:

I suspect a backroute in level 14 and either another backroute or a possible tailsman solution in level 19.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 01, 2022, 01:43:12 PM
Only 3 backroutes in this batch, so far so good :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
3 02 Glad to see this level working as intended. :D
3 07 Clever alternative solution! I've received multiple acceptable solutions to this level that are equally challenging.
3 14 All the main tricks are missing!! :XD: Clearly the jumper is one of the most versatile skills in this game! I removed a bit of terrain and added a fire. I'm afraid these changes might give away the solution too much but lets see... :laugh:
3 15 Also glad too see this level finally working as intended :thumbsup: Not the hardest level of the rank but it's one of my favourite levels of this rank :laugh:
3 18 Almost intended but one last trick isn't there yet :XD:
3 19 This level is one of the very early levels I made and they tend to be very vulnerable to backroutes. :( Hope this fixes are enough!
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 01, 2022, 01:43:58 PM
V4.2 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 14 Triple Trouble in Space! - removed a bit of terrain, added a fire
-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - increased RR to 90, locked the RR
-3 19 Mysterious Circle - moved the hatch a bit to the left/downward
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 06, 2022, 08:23:46 PM
Solved Libra and resolved Leo! :)

Feddback will come when I am through the pack + alll of my backroutes have been patched. ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 07, 2022, 10:35:40 AM
The first 3ranks have been quite solid as I expected.
But I absolutely have no clue on how many backroutes are lurking in 4th and 5th ranks as they pretty much haven't been solved yet.
:crylaugh:
4 07 Well done on saving a blocker :thumbsup: Your solution has all the core tricks in it so I'm not gonna fix the level to strictly enforce my solution.
4 08 bashing under the OWW... classic :XD: easy enough to fix!
4 10 half intended, half backrouty. The newly added OWW should do the trick now!
4 19 Awesome solution! I could put your solution as a talisman.
4 20 I honestly had no idea how to properly fix this level... This level has already gotten multiple backroute fixes and I don't think they were entirely worth it. So I decided to just scrap it and add a new level instead. I hope you like the new level as it's a kind of level you like the most afaik! :laugh:
Spoiler
Fake Disjoint Union

I attached my intended solution to 4 19 so you can compare it to yours if you want! ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 07, 2022, 10:43:03 AM
V4.3 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - added a steel block
-3 19 Mysterious Circle - completeply remade the solution, reskined the level with dune tileset
-4 08 A Dance of Fire and Ice - added a steel block, removed a bit of terrain, added some water
-4 10 Bloodthirster - added a OWW
-4 19 Slip 'N Slide - new talisman "Beautiful Timing": complete using no more than 1 digger

New level:

(https://i.imgur.com/jLxllIg.png)
Red Queen Hypothesis

- The old 4 20(Another Hero Time) is replaced by the new 4 20(Red Queen Hypothesis)


Sorry for taking my words back, but I can't think of any ways to fix the recent backroute to Another Hero Time. So I decided to just scrap it and add a new level instead. :( For those who still want to play the old 4 20, I attached the level file and the solution replay of it below. ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 07, 2022, 02:12:48 PM
As it seems this isn't the first time this happened to a level: How about a seperate rank for gathering those "unrecoverable" levels? ???

Also, I attached a nasty one for the new Libra 20 candidate. :devil:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 07, 2022, 08:04:52 PM
And I resolved Leo+Libra to end off the weekend. 8-)

Seems like either a builder or a shimmier are not needed on Leo 18 currently.

But I have a good feeling that at least a few more are intended now. :)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on August 11, 2022, 12:23:09 AM
Hello, I have resolved levels up through the Libra rank. I have my entire Uncharted replay collection attached, but you just need to check Aries 1, Aries 12, Gemini 6, Gemini 7, Gemini 14, Leo 8, Leo 14, Leo 15, Leo 18, Leo 19, Leo 20, Libra 1, Libra 5, Libra 6, Libra 8, Libra 10, Libra 11, Libra 12, Libra 14, Libra 18, Libra 19, and Libra 20. I feel that Leo 8, Leo 15, Leo 19, and Libra 5 are still backroutes, though :P Also the new Libra 20 doesn't feel intended either :P The rest should be intended or at least acceptable now ;)

In particular, Gemini 14, Leo 14, Leo 20, Libra 8, Libra 10, Libra 11, Libra 12, Libra 14, Libra 18, and Libra 19 have all become so much better levels as a result! :thumbsup:

Spoiler

Leo 14 - Triple Trouble in Space That was very neat with a variant of the Forgotten Refinery trick from United, where a builder wall is used to contain the lemmings after they spawn from the receiver. I think the funny thing was that I was thinking of making a level using this trick but from the entrance instead of the receiver :laugh:

Leo 20 - Fall in the Dark Very neat with using a platformer to stop the climber from getting into danger :)

Libra 8 - A Dance of Fire and Ice Using falling bombers to make a path for the climber in the bottom part of the level to bash and mine the crowd out was clever. The only thing here is that it can get quite annoying with the timing and is a bit too repetitive for my liking, but that's just me :P

Libra 10 - Bloodthirster Ah, there's that trick from Godlems with the RR thing where the lemmings will stack behind one another. The hardest part was getting one lemming ahead of the others to build to the left before anyone arrives and drowns, as well as bashing away the staircase so that they fall out to the right. As mentioned before, the bomber assignment is quite precise.

Libra 11 - Dungeon of Despair I love the shimmier skill a lot, and the blocker on the platformer bridge to get released by a basher was very clever. There's that trick again of using a miner to get the basher lower so that he continues and doesn't stop because of the steel from The Gaema Plateau level ;) I will note that this is quite tight on the timing, as sometimes I had the other lemming walking around so that he either wouldn't mine a path to the thin floor to bomb, or he would interrupt the basher. I kept thinking to send the climber along with two more shimmiers at the start, but that turned out to be wrong, as he can use the bahser tunnel to do so on his own later and hence save up a shimmier.

Libra 12 - Sweet Mirages This is quite hard, as I kept running into problems with turning a lemming around, particularly the climber, so that he can mine the crowd out. I thought there was supposed to be some very timing heavy element here, but that turns out to be mostly wrong. In particular, I had almost the solution down, I was just simply using the stoner pickup wrong. What makes this level very hard is the extremely obscure stoner/miner trick, where if you mine immediately after turning around on a stoner you actually make a climber friendly wall! Yet, it didn't automatically transfer after the first instance, where you stone with the lemming immediately after appearing from the trapdoor. Turns out that you need a certain location for the second stoner. That I missed for a very long time. I would even argue that this is harder than Libra 19, but they both have a bit of an obscure trick. I guess the stoner/miner thing is more obscure IMO.

Libra 14 - Medium Well-Done I love all those shimmiers that go around to carve the path for the others :laugh: I especially love that builder at the bottom to keep a shimmier going. Also uses the checkerboard with the miner to get another climber into the middle area to achieve that. Pretty much all about using miners efficiently here. Well done indeed! :laugh:

Libra 18 - Moonlight Sculptor The hardest thing to see here was to interrupt a basher before he breaks the last pixel of wall in order to block and hence turn two climbers around in the middle area. Kind of reminds me of Vertigo from United in a way, except it doesn't use a builder past a thin wall, although similar concepts.

Libra 19 - Slip 'N Slide Ah, yea now that I have resolved this, I honestly have no idea why I struggled so much with this level. Indeed, it's because I completely overlooked the slider using a builder staircase to slide and then bounce off a blocker to go to the right and forge the rest of the path :forehead: This is the trick I'm thinking is obscure on this level, although maybe not as obscure as the one for Libra 12. Two solutions, one of them is very similar to yours, the other is the talisman solution all thanks to Icho. It's definitely a gold one, I'm in agreement there.

Libra 20 - Red Queen Hypothesis I'm certain this isn't intended, especially since I used shimmiers as delays and didn't use the slider :P   

I'll try and get the Aquarius rank resolved within the next day or so, although looking at the entire rank 18 orange check marks :lem-mindblown: That's a bit intimidating, particularly since I struggled so much with the final rank. Wow, I seriously backrouted 90% of the rank :laugh:     
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 12, 2022, 07:30:05 AM
Thank you both :thumbsup:
I'll look into them closely this weekend :laugh:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 14, 2022, 11:40:23 AM
@Ichotolot

QuoteAs it seems this isn't the first time this happened to a level: How about a seperate rank for gathering those "unrecoverable" levels? ???
Actually I'm preparing a mini-pack(or just a bonus rank of future pack? not sure atm) containing all the rejected levels I've made so far after I revisit and make them into somewhat decent quality. Probably these unrecoverable levels could fit in there too. :laugh:

3 19 This is starting to look ugly :XD: but let's try one more fix :crylaugh:
4 08 Good job on finding no-blocker solution to this level! The 3 given blocker can be used to ease the timing but it seems like you didn't need them :thumbsup:
4 10 100% intended :thumbsup: This level was inspired by one of Duuddu's levels(other than one Nessy's level of course ;P) Do you recognize which level is it? :laugh:
4 20 Interesing solution but not interesting enough to be intended :evil:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 14, 2022, 11:41:13 AM
@kaywhyn

3 14 Yeah "Forgotten Refinery" is one of the final levels I was able to solve in United and I fell in love with that trick! I myself made some levels using several variations of the trick for this pack and this level is one of them!
3 20 Also intended!
4 10 Yep this level was inspired by the one you mentioned ;)
4 12 Intended :thumbsup:
QuoteWhat makes this level very hard is the extremely obscure stoner/miner trick, where if you mine immediately after turning around on a stoner you actually make a climber friendly wall!
Yes this is due to how miner's destruction mask looks like.(it also works with basher!) So you have to be very careful with where to put the stoner so you can turn the climber around and immediately start mining from there after he turns around.
4 14 Close enough! Abusing checkerboard mechanic is the main key to this level. And you also have to see that builder positioning to keep the shimmier going.
4 18 intended!
4 19 :thumbsup: :thumbsup: Intended solution and same talisman solution to Icho!
The main puzzle of this level is to make sure the worker lemming who travel around the level is a slider with a climber skill in the skill-panel. Also the blocker is there not only to turn the climber around but also the shimmier/slider worker lemming!
4 20 exactly same backroute to Icho :XD: The newly aded OWW will do the trick!
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 14, 2022, 11:42:02 AM
Thanks Icho, kaywhyn and josh :thumbsup: I really love watching your replays.
Any backroutes are welcome and any intended solution replays are more than welcome :thumbsup:

V4.4 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-3 08 No Devil Lived on - added a OWW
-3 15 Art of Puzzle Solving - added OWWs
-3 18 Meanwhile in a Parallel Universe - completely flatten the starting area of the right hatch
-3 19 Mysterious Circle - a jumper is now a pick-up
-4 05 Deep Inside the Beehive - added a OWW
-4 20 Red Queen Hypothesis - added a OWW
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 20, 2022, 09:09:54 PM
Resolved Leo+Libra. :)

I think there should be quite a few more intended ones.

The hardest one out of the 4 ranks so far for me was the newly fixed Leo 19. I think I exhausted pretty much every other possibility before seing a detail and combine 2 previous attempts. I can see people getting the solution a lot faster though. But well if this is intended, I doubt there is another backroute in there - I tested it intensively ;P
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 21, 2022, 10:12:28 AM
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
intended solutions to both 3 18 and 3 19 :thumbsup:
Spoiler

3 18 You pretty much already had the correct solution but I wanted that final platformer bridge from the top left to release the right crowd. That's not how we release the crowd very often :laugh: I put most of the time spent to this level to work on the visual part but I'm quite happy with the puzzle part of this level too. Thank you for your patience and persistence in resolving every version of this level :XD:
3 19 Also intended :thumbsup: I somehow made a weird looking random architecture and carved out my own solution around it. I was remotely inspired by your level Sanctuary In Dying Light. I loved how the pioneer lemming prepared the path inside the weird looking structure and all the crowd marching through it. I hope you like this level and all the fixes have been worth it :laugh:
4 20 These fixes will make saving left crowd more difficult and expensive :evil:

Now there's only one level left in 4th rank. 8-)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on August 21, 2022, 10:12:53 AM
V4.5 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 20 Red Queen Hypothesis - added a steel block, added a fire
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on August 23, 2022, 04:02:08 PM
Hi Armani,

I finally managed to resolve every backroute patched level, including all 18 levels of the Aquarius rank. My entire replay collection for v4.5 is attached. However, you just need to check Leo 8, Leo 15, Leo 18, Leo 19, Libra 5, Libra 20, and every level of Aquarius except for Aquarius 3 and Aquarius 14. I feel everything is intended now except for Aquarius 6, Aquarius 10, Aquarius 15, and most certainly not Aquarius 20, as I unfortunately backrouted your GF's level again :P Maybe Aquarius 11, Aquarius 13, Aquarius 17, and Aquarius 19 aren't exactly intended either and possibly minor backroutes, but probably still acceptable despite the leftover skills? So, I feel we are very close now to having a 100% backroute proof pack! :thumbsup:

Spoiler

Leo 8 - No Devil Lived On Yea, now that I'm certain that my solution is the intended one, I agree that it was the right decision to not swap "Detective Milla is On the Case" with this one. Like you said, that blocker trick right by the exit to stop anyone from jumping into the exit on either side is quite obscure. Also, the timing is super tight, as you need a lemming from both side of the exit to turn around on the blocker at about the same time so that the one on the left can dig him free.

Leo 15 - The Art of Puzzle Solving Wow, this one is really good! :thumbsup: I honestly have no idea why I struggled so much with this level in my LP but I had a much easier time with it this time around when I resolved it. The biggest problem was figuring out how to platform on the right side while being able to get a climber up the left side at the top to bash through the ceiling. Then I realized, oh wait, I can use the jumper to make him temporarily climb the stack and then quickly assign another jumper to achieve that. It kind of helps that your "Insert Coin, Choose Lemming" uses the exact same trick, so when I remembered that that was the lightbulb moment for me :)

Leo 19 - Mysterious Circle I had the exact same experience as Icho, where I also found this one to be quite hard. It took me a very long time to see that one must send out two lemmings, one who is the climber and jumps, while the other one glides to the bottom area. I kept thinking I needed to release the crowd with two bombers but then that would mean I wouldn't have a spare bomber to build a landing platform near the exit area. Also the big problem was sending a glider back to the starting area to release the crowd with a bomber. So for a long time, I couldn't wrap my head around the solution. Then I realized that I was going about the level incorrectly, especially with the way I was using the cloners. The way to get a climber/glider back to the starting area is to clone the builder later so that he doesn't use the builder staircase going to the left. The other hard part was figuring out how to get the right-most builder pickups. It was very hard to see to drop the climber down the right side and then make him a glider when he can land at the bottom and clone him when he's gliding to the right so that you get one to collect the pickup that's almost at the very edge.

In any case, the intended solution finally seems enforced here. It might had taken you so many fixes, but you've finally did it! ;) And yea, I can see how you got inspiration from Icho's "Lemmings Dying in Sanctuary Light" here.

Libra 5 - Deep Inside the Beehive Another great one whose intended solution seems enforced now. I was a big dummy here for a very long time, especially with how to get multiple workers to do the route so you don't run out of time. I kept thinking to send the one that does the work on the right side back to the left side to platform the remaining gap, which wasn't what I wanted, as I wanted him to run into the bee trap before the worker on the left side so that it would be level solved. However, the left worker would always reach it first, so you would therefore lose too much time this way. Then once again after a long time I realized the stacker jumper trick again. However, I kept placing the stack at the extreme edge so that there's an overhang that prevents the climber from actually climbing it :forehead: In any case, this was a very satisfying solve with a great puzzle and being able to beat the timer here! :thumbsup:

Libra 20 - Red Queen Hypothesis This should be intended now as well. It seems that I found the same backroute as Icho in the previous version, as the place where you added a fire trap was the exact same place I released the left crowd with. It seems that the trickiest part here was to know when to send out a worker on the left side. In earlier attempts, I sometimes had one lemming falling out to the left when I used the slider to laser them free at the bottom. I was also a dummy here for a while in that I kept thinking to use a builder in the pit at the top left to ensure no one will fall out to the left after using the laser. I also kept thinking to use a laser to get the right crowd up when it's clear you need a miner to do get them up. The hardest part to see here was to build twice to turn the worker back to the right in order to shimmy to get to the top. It was also hard to see to interrupt the laser before the floor can be destroyed by having him build but it still leaves a nice staircase for the worker to step up and out. So, not the hardest of the rank despite being the final level, but it was still deceiving tough.

Aquarius 1 - Game of the Century Definitely a roadblock, but again I was a big dummy. I kept thinking to send everyone over the top, but no matter what you do you won't have enough skills for the end. The hardest part was with the G and S near the exit. After a while, I gave up, but then a key realization came to me while I was brushing my teeth: Shimmying under the entire level! I quickly loaded up the level in NL to check, and yup, that was the key! The rest of the solution came easily to me from there, although it still took a while to solve because the most frustrating part was getting the correct spacing so that no one falls and splats before the builder gets over each gap, as well as no one turns back on the N before you get a chance to get one bomber off. This took a very long time to get correct, involving a lot of RR tweaking. Maybe that's what the blocker is for? So, I'm actually curious as to the intended solution here and how to make it less frustrating. Also, that bomber on the L is super precise. Unless there's an easier way there that I somehow missed ???

Aquarius 4 - Rhythmical Another great level. That was neat to block near the trap so that you can bomb the disarmer free with a lemming from above. I definitely had an easier time with this level this time around.

Aquarius 5 - Abandoned Library Ugh, this one was so frustrating. So much rewinding in order to get all the timing correct. If this is intended, I'm very curious as to the intended solution and whether there is once again a much easier way that I completely missed. My solution is very timing heavy in order to get a climber to climb the miner tunnel in order to hit the button on the right side. I'm certain that's what the blocker is for so that you can avoid any timing needed, but then I kept running into problems with the gap at the top where lemmings can fall in and can't get back out later. I tried to make do without the blocker at the top, but I couldn't get the right number of lemmings past the miner and also sealing off the gap. The top left was also frustrating to get right, as many times I kept coming up a pixel short so that the lemmings couldn't get past the wall at the top. So yea, I'm very curious about your solution here, because I'm very certain I made it far harder than I needed to.

Aquarius 6 - RefleXion Sorry, must be another backroute, as I have some skills leftover. Also, 1 second remaining :D This was one of the last levels I resolved, as I knew this was going to take a while, because it certainly seems to be one of the hardest of the pack.

Aquarius 7 - Double-Edged Sword Deceivingly difficult, but another great one. Nice trick with bashing and then a lemming gets ahead to build and the basher also cuts off the terrain/bridge so that no one else can use it. I like how the builder needs to punch a hole in the top wall with a basher, as well as bomb him when he's falling to make a hole in the bottom wall for a climber to get into each of them. I also kept running into the problem of a lemming catching up to the builder at the bottom before he makes it across, but that's because I had the misconception of when to give the worker a walker. Instead, the answer is to immediately give the first lemming that reaches the bottom the walker skill to turn instead of the floor immediately above, as the spacing is bigger at the bottom so that he has enough of a lead to bridge the gap in time. However, there is another very frustrating part here in that there is very little leeway in how to place the miner so that he frees the blocker on the builder staircase and also hits the steel to turn around. I would definitely ease the precision here, as lot of the time even when I kept framestepping the miner wouldn't do what I wanted him to. Easy fix by moving the wall closer to where the builder finishes.

Aquarius 8 - Purity and Industry Yup, that was one overcomplicated backroute last time I used. One of my favorites now that the intended solution is enforced here :thumbsup: Again, I was a dummy here and didn't realize to block on the platformer bridge so that the glider bounces off him to reach the bottom. I kept thinking to come from the right side instead, like what is used on Libra 18. Other than this, the only other hard part is timing the workers so that the basher uses the builder staircase to keep going but it also allows the builder to keep going to the left to bridge up the remaining gaps. Very nice level here!

Aquarius 9 - Iron Juggernaut 2 Ah, now I see where the unintended part was. It was a great level before the patch, but it's even better now!

Aquarius 10 - Triple Lulz Another very hard one that took a while. In the end, I think this is a slight backroute. The very hard part was getting someone to get over the top to dig down the wall, but I couldn't find a solution there. So, I resorted to using the neat trick of using a blocker on the other side of the builder staircase so that no one can follow the 3 lemmings, one to stone and the other two to get on top and dig the wall away. It's a slight backroute due to how I don't even use the blocker pickup :P

Aquarius 11 - Lost in an Ice Cave Definitely a better level now. Maybe a slight backroute? Or maybe acceptable despite the leftover skills? I have a feeling that the basher I used at the end is not intended, but at the same time that was the only way for me to save the climber from going to his doom.

Aquarius 12 - Butterfly Effect Wow, I'm just blown away by the solution here! :lem-mindblown: Super clever with the "Fence and Forget" United level trick of using a fencer tunnel to keep a basher going. Here's how the solution came to me: I thought to myself ok, it would had been nice if I had had two bashers, but I only have one. Then I remembered how a basher can use a fencer tunnel to keep going, so that was the lightbulb moment for me. Not only that, he uses a platformer to keep going too in order to release the blocker! I would probably say this is the best level of the pack. Well done here! :thumbsup:

Aquarius 13 - System Malfunction Probably a minor backroute here as well, but then again it might be acceptable despite the leftover jumpers.

Aquarius 15 - Simulation: FARO I know you already spoiled that this uses the nuke on Discord, but I unfortunately backrouted the level again, as I was able to solve it without the nuke. As a suggestion, when in doubt, just spoiler tag it :P Along with that, you quoted my spoiler in the previous post incorrectly again. When doing so, leave the spoiler tags in brackets that you see at the beginning and end alone so that the quoted stuff will simply appear in a spoiler rather than be revealed. I'm just one of those people that gets upset whenever any part of the solution gets spoiled, but that's just me personally :P At the same time, I wasn't sure if you were trying to ignore me on Discord after I got upset, and I wasn't sure if the incorrect 15 hour difference between our time zones was out of spite when I corrected you there that we're actually 16 hours apart :P

Aquarius 16 - Facade of Indifference This one took a while to resolve, but that's because I was a very big dummy on the right side. I kept thinking to use a jumper to turn the worker around to build over the water gap, when in fact a builder is used to turn him around instead. It also took a while to figure out how to use the blocker on the left side in order to build the crowd at the bottom out later. Even for a heavy builder level, this was deceiving difficult. Once again, it was very frustrating figuring out the correct timing to release the right crowd in order to sync up with the glider so only two go on ahead and the non-glider gets killed by the trap, while the third one blocks before it. So much rewinding here. Still, nice level though!

Aquarius 17 - Forgive Us Another very hard level that took a while. At one point, I had a solution that nearly worked but the glider wouldn't reach the bottom platform and instead would glide to the bottomless pit. This was the hardest part to figure out, how to get a worker to shimmy through the bottom. Eventually, I came up with the idea to use the RR tweaking to my advantage to get two lemmings close enough to stone so that the other one falls inside the stoner terrain and turns to glide onto the stoner below the steel ledge. That's how I got the shimmier for the left side of the middle area. The rest was easy from there. Maybe a slight backroute, but then again maybe acceptable despite the leftover jumper?

Aquarius 18 - One Lemming To Rule Them All Wow, I will have to agree with you here with this being your favorite, as I also like this level! Almost the same as before, except a much better way to do the digging part. After that, I still had the problem of stopping everyone from walking and drowning in the water where the trap is. Then I realized, wait, that disarmer/blocker trick from The Wine Cellar level in the Libra rank. Super clever with the rope trap busy killing a lemming and then you use the disarmer to block on top of the trigger area, giving enough time for everyone to turn around before he "unblocks" and disarms the trap. The other problem was figuring out how to get the lemmings compressed enough, and after a while I realized in the digger pit and using a blocker so they're stuck facing in one direction only. Even after all that, the timing in my solution was super tight, as the crowd almost turns around before the final basher gets through the last wall. Nice job here! :thumbsup:

Aquarius 19 - Immoral Society This was another difficult one that took a while, but this one is quite a fine level. The only thing I think I did unintended was use a shimmier as a stall so that he exits rather than get past it like the first one to platform the water gap. Otherwise, this seems to be intended. I'm not sure that RR tweaking to make holes on either side of the stacker is intended, but I think that's quite clever to turn the neutral to hit the top button. Also nice trick with using a backwards basher to make the stack climber friendly for the neutral to go on ahead to disarm the traps on the left side.

Aquarius 20 - Lovebirds Duet Sorry to say it, but I backrouted your girlfriend's level again :P Somehow something tells me that the intention is to use a builder/miner combo, as well as the far right side to get up the level. If it is, then I'm not sure how to effectively get into the lattice to do so. Maybe that's where the bombers come in.

So, I believe the first 4 ranks are now solid and so it's just a few levels left in the Aquarius rank that need more fixing, and then I think your Uncharted pack is good to go in getting backroutes all patched up! :thumbsup: We're almost there!

Also since I'm certain that I pretty much have Aquarius 1 and Aquarius 5 intended, to reiterate, I'm very curious and would love to see your solutions to these two levels, as I'm certain more than not that I really overcomplicated these two, especially the latter. That was a lot of timing madness I did for Aquarius 5 :XD:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 28, 2022, 08:04:19 PM
Resolved Libra 20 today and also got a solution for Aquarius 1. :)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on September 09, 2022, 01:40:10 PM
Solved further until Aquarius 11.

I don't know if that route on level 5 is now intended or a complete backroute. :XD: 

It at least does not use that frame precise method like the solution in kaywhyns replay that I also found before.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 11, 2022, 05:22:59 PM
A lot of intended solutions and also many backroutes. :forehead:

@kaywhyn

Leo 8 No Devil Lived On: Acceptable alternative. 8-) The intended solution uses the fact that the trigger area of the blocker field is wider than it looks. So you can place a blocker right next to the trigger area of the exit and turn the lemming around coming from the opposite side of the exit. But your solution is also cool and I decided to take it.
Leo 15 The Art of Puzzle Solving: Excellent! I first learnt this trick from one of NieSch's level.(Jolly Jumper from LLL) So the credit goes to him! I like that trick a lot and that's why I've made several levels using it.
Leo 19 Mysterious Circle:
QuoteThe way to get a climber/glider back to the starting area is to clone the builder later so that he doesn't use the builder staircase going to the left
Yeah, I also think that's the most difficult part of this level. You have to clone early enough so the cloned builder can reach the higher platform but late enough so the climber/glider athlete doesn't use the builder staircase and come back to release the crowd! Now both you and Icho solved this level in intended way, I can finally say the intended solution is properly enforced. :thumbsup:
Libra 5 Deep Inside the Beehive: Also intended! First you have to realize you can't sacrifice a lemming to the single-use bee trap at the very early stage of the level otherwise you'll be running out of time! Plus, you have to place the stacker precisely to makes the straight wall higher so when the worker lemmings comes back and climbs it, he can use jumper+shimmier combo to reach the ceiling.
Aquarius 1 Game of the Century: Close enough! I've received several acceptable solutions and they all somehow send some lemmings below the thin floor so they can do their job from the opposite side. I think it's funny that the most important realization to this level came to you while you were brushing your teeth :laugh: The RR manipulation is not necessary in my solution. I will attach mine so you can compare it to yours! This update will break your replay but you only have to use the final builder from few pixels further back and that's it. ;)
Aquarius 5 Abandoned Library: I can feel your pain :XD: :XD: The intended solution requires one or two precise skill assignments but doesn't involve any crazy timing-heavy things at all.
Aquarius 6 RefleXion: Ah that was my mistake. The glider/disarmer athelte aren't supposed to be able to land before the trap and disarm it at the exit area. :forehead: Now the athelte will land after the trap or he just glide into the trap and die. :evil:
Aquarius 7 Double-Edged Sword: 100% intended :thumbsup:
QuoteHowever, there is another very frustrating part here in that there is very little leeway in how to place the miner so that he frees the blocker on the builder staircase and also hits the steel to turn around. I would definitely ease the precision here, as lot of the time even when I kept framestepping the miner wouldn't do what I wanted him to. Easy fix by moving the wall closer to where the builder finishes.
Yeah fair enough. I will keep your words in mind and will ease the precision when I have to fix a backroute for this level. ;)
Aquarius 8 Purity and Industry: Thanks! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: There are two key points to this level: 1)You have to bounce off the glider with the blocker/2)You have to extend the basher with a builder. Both of them are not easy to see but I think it's quite satisfying when you figure out. It's one of my favorite level for me too.
Aquarius 9 Iron Juggernaut 2: Nothing to complain! 100% intended :thumbsup:
Aquarius 12 Butterfly Effect: You got the main trick of this level ;) I still did some fixes so you have to use that leftover blocker! But you already figure out the most difficult part(trick) of this level, so it won't be too much of a problem for you ;)
Aquarius 18 One Lemming To Rule Them All: Same with Aquarius 12. Your solution is 90% intended and you got the main trick. But I did apply a fix to enforce my solution even stronger.(And it's more cool and dramatic I promise!)
@IchoTolot

Libra 20 Red Queen Hypothesis: Still not intended :evil: Now the skillset is more limited!
Aquarius 1 Game of the Century: The main theme of the level is still missing! Now you need to invest a builder at the exit area!
Aquarius 3 Jumping Bees: Not 100% intended but somewhat close. I changed the level a bit to enforce my solution but it's not very different from yours. ;)
Aquarius 4 Rhythmical: Now you have to send at least two lemmings to the top area ;)
Aquarius 5 Abandoned Library: I added addtional group of lemmings to save! Now you have to use your miner and cloner more carefully.
Aquarius 6 RefleXion: Ah that was my mistake. The glider/disarmer athelte aren't supposed to be able to land before the trap and disarm it at the exit area. :forehead: Now the athelte will land after the trap or he just glide into the trap and die. :evil:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on September 11, 2022, 05:25:33 PM
Thank you for your patience and the new update is finally here. 8-)

V4.6 is out! ;)

Level fixes:
-4 20 Red Queen Hypothesis - +1jumper, -1builder, -1shimmier, added a bit of terrain
-5 01 Game of the Century - made the exit platform higher so 1stoner is not enough to reach
-5 03 Jumping Bees - 5platformers are now pick-ups
-5 04 Rhythmical - shimmiers are now pick-ups
-5 05 Abandoned Library - made the pillar at the starting area higher, repositioned one of the buttons, -1platformers, added one more hatch, increased total number of lemmings and the save requirement by 10
-5 06 RefleXion - moved the trap at the exit area 3pixels to the left
-5 10 Triple Lutz - 4builders are now pick-ups
-5 11 Lost in an Ice Cave - corrected a grammar error in the pretext, modified terrain a bit, locked the RR
-5 12 Butterfly Effect - moved the wall-trap a bit downward, a fencer is now a pick-up
-5 13 System Malfunction - added a OWW, replaced a steel block with a smaller one, locked the RR
-5 15 Simulation: FARO - added 2more splitters
-5 16 Facade of Indifference - added a bit of terrain
-5 17 Forgive Us - removed a bit of terrain
-5 18 One Lemming To Rule Them All - added a steel block
-5 19 Immoral Society - repositioned the blocker pick-up
-5 20 Lovebirds Duet - added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 03, 2022, 06:53:25 AM
V4.7 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-4 19 Slip 'N Slide - removed a steel block, removed a bit of terrain, added an iceblower
-5 04 Rhythmical - made all the crystal pillars hollow
-5 06 RefleXion - added an additional trap at the exit area
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on October 07, 2022, 09:28:34 PM
Was in the mood of resolving a bit this evening. And here are the results.

Aquarius 5 is still VERY precise though and I think I still found only one single pixel where this works out.

I think I have 3 intended solutions though! :)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 09, 2022, 06:50:34 AM
Indeed they are :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on October 12, 2022, 09:29:01 AM
Whole pack completed! 8-)

Replays attached and I expect at least some more intended rank 5 solutions. A couple still feel backrouty though.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 13, 2022, 05:41:28 AM
half intended half not :XD: :XD:

Spoiler

5 01~5 05 intended
(5 04 Rhythmical is an acceptable variant! You found the exactly same solution to josh. :laugh: Have a look at the attached replay of mine ;))
5 06 RefleXion: Saving the leftmost glider lemming should be the most challenging thing about this level! I added an obstacle so now it's harder to save that lemming ;)
5 07~5 10 intended
5 11 Lost in an Ice Cave: You are supposed to invest a miner and a basher at the exit area to release the crowd! I didn't notice that one miner is enough to do so..
5 13 System Malfunction: You got the one of the two main tricks! :laugh: I think this fix is enough to enforce the another one.
5 14 BlockChain Company Revisited: acceptable ;)
5 15 Simulation FARO: Your solution is cool! But I want you to use both exits :laugh:
5 16 Facade of Indifference: Almost intended. You only need to find another way to send the slider lemming to the top part ;) Also the intended solution contain the crowd a bit differently.
5 17 Forgive Us: Wow amazing solution! But I still want you to use every part of the level. So here's the fix!
5 18 One Lemming to Rule Them All: 90%+ intended :thumbsup: You only need to tweak your solution a bit to send the disarmer lemming to the right side of the level.
5 19 Immoral Society: The zombie lemming(who once was a savior of the lemkind :() is supposed to block the lemmings comming to the exit area. Other than that your solution is almost intended.
5 20 Lovebirds Duet: not intended at all :(

5 12 Butterfly Effect is also a huge backroute, but I can't find any proper way to patch up your backroute. The main trick is quite expensive to pull off in terms of skills so it's not easy to enforce the intended trick.
I think it might be better to take my time before I do something to this level :XD:

Thanks for the resolves  :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 13, 2022, 05:42:03 AM
V4.8 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 06 RefleXion - added a bit of terrain & spike traps
-5 11 Lost in an Ice Cave - added a steel block
-5 13 System Malfunction - added some traps, +1platformer, made the gap to the bottom exit wider
-5 15 Simulation FARO - added limited count to both exits
-5 16 Facade of Indifference - made the ceiling higher
-5 17 Forgive Us - added a flamethrower
-5 18 One Lemming to Rule Them All - added a steel block
-5 19 Immoral Society - modified the steel block near the exit
-5 20 Lovebirds Duet - added a OWW
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on October 17, 2022, 09:27:43 AM
V4.9 is out! ;)

New level:

(https://i.imgur.com/JU2yBzA.png)
Wish Upon a Shooting Star

- The old 5 12(Butterfly Effect) is replaced by the new 5 12(Wish Upon a Shooting Star)


I've recently received 3 different backroutes to Butterfly Effect and I can't seem to find a way to patch them all properly. Also I was not happy with that level since it was a trick based level which means it's an easy solve if you know the trick and you'll struggle a lot if you aren't aware of that certain trick. I'm definitely not a fan of it tbh. The new 5 12 Wish Upon a Shooting Star might be farily easy for its position but is better than the old 5 12 in every way possible(at least I believe so :laugh:) As always, I attached level and solution replay files of the old 5 12 below for someone who still want to play or check the solution of the old 5 12. ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on November 04, 2022, 04:32:10 PM
I resolved the Aquarius rank with the new level. :)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on November 13, 2022, 07:27:58 AM
@Ichotolot

Intended:

-5 11 Lost in an Ice Cave - Yeah now your solution is 100% intended :thumbsup:
-5 16 Facade of Indifference - Well you already had the main trick(glider+jumper+bomber to remove a bit of terrain so the slider lemming can get to the exit area with multiple shimmiers) but some of the details had been missing. This one is also 100% intended now. :D
-5 18 One Lemming to Rule Them All - Intended :thumbsup: :thumbsup: The disarmer lemming have to jump early enough so he can start shimmy under the platformer bridge before the gap is closed by the builder bricks. Also the blocker inside the digger tunnel to turn the shimmier around and the disarmer trick from 4 06 Mr Lem's Secret Wine Cellar is also intended.
-5 20 Lovebirds Duet - I'm glad this level is finally solved in intended way and I don't have to fix it anymore. Your solution is exactly intended! Probably the trickest part of this level is that you have to store a lemming at the bottom left side of the level so he can release the blocker lemming at the top later. Thanks for keep playing and finding the intended solution to this level. :D


Backroutes:

-5 06 RefleXion - That jumper to turn the glider around is not what I intended! I added a spike trap to block this...
-5 12 Wish Upon a Shooting Star - I think more one way force fields will do the trick here.
-5 13 System Malfunction - not 100% intended but you got the both main tricks!(The stacker at the reciever/3 consecutive jumpers to send a normal lemming)
-5 15 Simulation FARO - not quite intended yet :(
-5 17 Forgive Us - I didn't want to do this but I had no choice. Now the terrain under the starting area is not shimmiable which reveals the intended solution a bit in my opinion. But sometimes it is what it is. :D
-5 19 Immoral Society - The stacker+double basher is intended but other than that it's still far from the intended solution.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on November 13, 2022, 07:28:24 AM
V5.0 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 06 RefleXion - removed a bit of terrain, added a spike trap
-5 12 Wish Upon a Shooting Star - added additional one-way force fields
-5 13 System Malfunction - added a bit of terrain
-5 15 Simulation FARO - reverted the latest update, added&removed a bit of terrain
-5 17 Forgive Us - removed a bit of terrain
-5 19 Immoral Society - added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on December 19, 2022, 08:53:35 PM
Found some resolving time!

Resolved 2 levels (5 12 + 5 13) and they feel intended! :)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on December 20, 2022, 08:41:37 PM
2 more down! (5 15 + 5 19)

5 15 should be another backroute, but I am certain that 5 19 is now intended! :)

I have spent some more tries at 5 06 and 5 17 and I see what might be intended just haven't found the exact way yet.

I have to admit that 5 17 becomes a bit annoying to play over time because of all possible precise stoner/shimmier/jumper inside turns and other possibilities.

Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 21, 2022, 04:50:02 AM
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
@Ichotolot

12 13 19 - intended
15 -backroute

-5 12 Wish Upon a Shooting Star - Perfect! :thumbsup: The title refers to that falling bomber from above that carves out the stacker stacks which is the key trick to this level. :D
-5 13 System Malfunction -  That's it! You have to turn two climbers around with a single platformer and you pretty much had the rest of the solution already ;)
-5 19 Immoral Society - Also intended :thumbsup: Ironically the disarmer guy has to be sacrificed to the trap and that's the only way to solve this level. The stacker trick at the beginning is also intended. ;)

+

- 5 17 Forgive Us - Yeah I have to admit this level can be a bit annoying since it requires some RR fiddling and precise stoner positionings. I think once you find out the correct RR manipulation rest of the level isn't that precise though. All the key tricks already have been showcased beforehand in this pack. (not in exactly same way. This level needs advanced variation of them ;))
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 21, 2022, 05:18:07 AM
V5.1 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 15 Simulation FARO - now both exits have thicker trigger areas(2pxs->3pxs)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on December 21, 2022, 07:51:28 PM
No replays for any patched up levels on my end, as well as haven't looked at any for that matter, but I'm posting in response to Icho regarding 5 6 and 5 17. For the former, it's definitely one of the hardest of the entire pack, and I would suspect that I would likely take an eternity or possibly not be able to solve the most recent version myself. For the latter, I completely agree there with the annoyance of the movement skills provided on that level. I remember getting very aggravated at how things kept failing by single pixels! Again, I haven't looked at the patched up version yet, but based on Icho's remarks on that level there's probably going to be a lot of pixel precision stuff when I eventually do take a look. Kind of reminding me of Jungle World 10 from LemRunner in a way, but thankfully the precision has been reduced considerably there in future updates :P
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on December 21, 2022, 08:35:13 PM
Backroute for 5 17 - I managed to use your fix against you. :evil:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on December 21, 2022, 09:55:39 PM
And another solution for 5 06 - everything is in motion, but I have a spare blocker sadly.
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 22, 2022, 04:58:55 AM
-5 06 Saving the cloned glider lemming have to be the most difficult challenge in this level and the walker skill is too powerful in that regard! :evil:. Now you can get the walker skill only at the very end.

-5 17 Those jumper+stoner shenanigans to get to the top platform is not intended at all. I added the steel block beneath the starting platform so the shimmier(or shimmier+glider) is not enough to reach the bottom. Hopefully this will enforce the left part of the solution hence all the jumper+stoner shenanigans at the middle part of the level is also blocked. (You won't have any spare jumpers for the middle part now!)

My initial gut feeling was that 6,15,17,18 would be the hardest levels of the pack when they are properly enforced and I think I was right to a certain extent.



V5.2 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 06 RefleXion - a walker is now a pick-up
-5 17 Forgive Us - reverted the latest update, added a steel block
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on December 22, 2022, 08:45:08 PM
Solution for 5 15 - this madness has to be intended! :lem-mindblown:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 23, 2022, 03:14:12 AM
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
@Ichotolot

Yes that's the intended madness.
The title came from faro shuffle which is one way of shuffling trump card - divide the deck into two parts and let them fall on to each other alternately.
Now you know what does this have to do with this level. :laugh:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on December 29, 2022, 06:20:28 PM
Solution for 5 17. I have a bit of confidence that this might be intended, because of the following:

Spoiler

- Used all skills
- Used RR manipulation
- Did not use the backroute-fixed area at all
- 2 on bottom, 1 on top
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 30, 2022, 05:06:03 AM
Ichotolot

Seems like the stacker may have been causing all the problems. :(
While your solution is incredible it still misses some core tricks.
I would not say the intended solution is super clean and straightforward but at least it's a lot more elegant than that.
Probably this update will block the stacker things at the beginning and is enough to enforce the intended soluton! (hopefully :laugh:)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on December 30, 2022, 05:06:41 AM
V5.3 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 17 Forgive Us - added a steel block, -1 builder, +1 platformer
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on June 17, 2023, 08:14:35 PM
After months of trying nearly every possible way in Aquarius 6 (with longer breaks in between) - I think I sadly found another dumb backroute that bunkers the crowd a little again. :evil:

Still I would declare it the hardest level of the pack (and hardest level that I played in a long time) so far!
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on June 21, 2023, 06:56:19 AM
@Ichotolot
In fact your solution is very close to intended now!
Spoiler

The way you save the first cloned lemming with platformer+jumper is something I missed :forehead:
Other than that your solution is pretty much intended!
If I remeber correctly, this is the only level left for you, right?
You are almost there now :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on June 21, 2023, 06:57:23 AM
V5.4 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 06 RefleXion - moved the spike trap a bit higher
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on June 21, 2023, 07:30:37 PM
QuoteIf I remeber correctly, this is the only level left for you, right?

No, I also still need to resolve 17 again beside 6.

But well, back to the drawing board...
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on June 25, 2023, 06:17:27 AM
V5.5 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 06 RefleXion - convenience patch to reduce precision and execution dificulty
(intended solution remains unchanged)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: MASTER-88 on July 02, 2023, 01:58:44 AM
Finally load this pack. I am two years to late. I´ll  see this topic first time right now. I have still work progress another "Extreme" difficult pack by Crane.

I´ll always enjoy play extreme levels. Most peoples like my brother enjoy play just easier levels and dislike extreme levels.

I am one most TOP 10-20 most genius lemmings players in the world but i am also extremely scatterbrained.

My style completed levels is just aggressive and i am usually very good to find backroutes and ETC..... I´ll post replays sometimes. Let see did i can beat your Aquarius. Im at least very curious to try attempt it. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 31, 2023, 06:24:37 AM
V5.6 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 17 Forgive Us - several backroute fixes



Also congratulations to Ichotolot for completing the whole pack! :D
Every solution is intended or acceptable.
A huge thanks to him for playing the pack and being persistent! :thumbsup:
I've had great fun following the journey! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on July 31, 2023, 06:35:14 AM
Now since the whole pack is fallen, I will see if I can make some kinds of creator's commentary series. Commentary video series would be ideal but if my lack of English skill strikes back, I may instead consider simple posts on forum about thought process while I was making levels, some random fun facts about titles&level themselves, my level making process in general etc...
We will see...:laugh:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on July 31, 2023, 07:57:25 PM
Quote from: Armani on July 31, 2023, 06:35:14 AM
Now since the whole pack is fallen, I will see if I can make some kinds of creator's commentary series. Commentary video series would be ideal but if my lack of English skill strikes back, I may instead consider simple posts on forum about thought process while I was making levels, some random fun facts about titles&level themselves, my level making process in general etc...
We will see...:laugh:

I would love to watch it! ;)
Give it a try!

Anyway, I can say this was the hardest pack to solve for me so far and I am very glad I finally finished it. Especially Aquarius 6 and 17 were the biggest roadblocks!
I will probably start uploading my solutions after I am done uploading Unusual Lemmings.

This pack definitely is an amazing one and ranks among my all time favorites! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: kaywhyn on July 31, 2023, 09:38:05 PM
I too would watch your creator's commentary and encourage you to give it a try! :) I would say don't worry too much about errors in the presentation, especially when speaking. Even though I'm a native English speaker myself, I still slip up a lot on camera. If anything, I feel it has helped me tremendously in building up my confidence in speaking whenever I record my LP's or anything whenever I'm talking, such as the level solving commentary series and my recorded solutions of the LDC's and LOTY's. This is especially huge for someone like me, where I tend to be very introverted and have generally always been shy. At the same time, I don't think anyone has noticed any problems with me about being shy, especially when I have taken part of in some gaming in the community.

This was especially the case when I recorded my series for Icho's United pack, and watching it back from time to time, there were definitely other issues present, such as the sound quality in the earlier videos of the series and my often incoherent flow of thoughts. However, as I made more videos for it I enjoyed it very much, and the resulting product was something Icho really enjoyed watching and the resulting mini-discussions we had via the comments :thumbsup: It was all for the best too, I thought, especially as I did it in tandem with Icho's creator's commentary and it really helped promote his pack. I remember while making the first video I was really dying with excitement to share the video series with Icho, as it was his pack that I was showing off on camera :thumbsup:

Anyway, my congratulations to Icho for getting all of Uncharted solved. Given that he's possibly considered the best solver in this community, I thought, in contrast to me where I really struggled with your pack, he would breeze through Uncharted very easily and that the high difficulty wouldn't be a problem for him. Nope, turns out I was very wrong. Like him, I agree that this is most definitely one of the hardest packs I have ever played, with it surpassing even United's difficulty at some points, especially in the final rank, but it is also one of the best packs I've ever played too.

At the same time, I'm happy to hear that many of our roadblocks were similar, therefore confirming that I at least wasn't a dummy on a lot of these levels. Most importantly, I was very honored that Icho saw me as a partner and allowed us to combine our brains and work together to get some extremely very hard levels of the Aquarius rank solved! :thumbsup: I'm also happy to hear that my comments/feedback helped so that he could avoid wasting time with fiddly ways of solving them like I did on some select few :laugh: I absolutely enjoyed watching his journey/quest in solving all of Uncharted for the last several months. It might had taken a while, but eventually he did it. At least he knows what it's like to play a really hard pack from you, though he already has a fair share that he's played from others, such as Nepsterlems and Lemmings Plus Omega 2.

Icho

Finally, not the place for it, but I think you would like Armani's Xmas 2021 pack as well. As I was one of the pre-testers, I can definitely recommend it. It was a pack that I recommended to Swerdis to play through, which he did and was able to solve all of it from several months ago :thumbsup: It isn't anywhere near as hard like Uncharted, but it's still quite tough in many places and is definitely of excellent quality, after taking my suggestions onboard to make some levels better in terms of execution, for example ;) It's also a lot shorter, at 31 levels, but again it's no complete pushover. Maybe it'll be better for the end of the year, for the holidays, but well, no one says you can't play a Christmas pack at any other time of the year :P
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 01, 2023, 03:27:22 PM
Quote from: kaywhyn on July 31, 2023, 09:38:05 PM
Finally, not the place for it, but I think you would like Armani's Xmas 2021 pack as well. As I was one of the pre-testers, I can definitely recommend it. It was a pack that I recommended to Swerdis to play through, which he did and was able to solve all of it from several months ago :thumbsup: It isn't anywhere near as hard like Uncharted, but it's still quite tough in many places and is definitely of excellent quality, after taking my suggestions onboard to make some levels better in terms of execution, for example ;) It's also a lot shorter, at 31 levels, but again it's no complete pushover. Maybe it'll be better for the end of the year, for the holidays, but well, no one says you can't play a Christmas pack at any other time of the year :P

It's on the list, but first a breather, then the current contest levels and after that I will give it a shot. ;)
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: IchoTolot on August 20, 2023, 08:51:21 PM
I recently started uploading my solutions to my YouTube channel! :)

Link to the first video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsznsB2ZXyk
Title: Re: [NeoLemmix] Lemmings Uncharted [Difficulty: Medium-Extreme]
Post by: Armani on November 28, 2023, 03:46:46 AM
V5.7 is out! ;)

Level fixes:

-5 11 Lost in an Ice Cave - added a steel block


No accepted replays will be broken by this update ;)

And congratulations to joshescue18 for completing the pack :thumbsup:
Thank you very much for playing the pack so far 8-)