Fun 13: Diggers (see min skills thread for amount, I don't remember)That's 3 diggers.
Fun 16: Builders (see min skills thread for amount)6. Although it might be possible to cut that using Tame 20 and the nuke glitch.
Fun 19: 4 BuildersAgain, the Tame 20 glitch might come into play here and reduce that.
Fun 20: 2 BuildersI'm assuming DOS version here. This means no water, and you don't have to build to the exit platform.
Fun 23: Possibly builders and/or bashers?I think it might be possible to eliminate each (in separate solutions) using multiple Tame 20's.
Fun 26: 2 buildersPossible with none. This was done in my old challenge thread.
Fun 29: Maybe bashers?There's plenty enough skills to just mine and build across.
you can beat fun 29 sans builders?
you can beat fun 29 sans builders?
if that's the case then my head just exploded and I quit Lemmings forever
Here's what I know for the first few Tricky levels off the top of my head:
Tricky 13
Either clam or CC said there's a solution that uses only 5 builders - fewer than this is impossible. Since the level can be beaten with only builders, the result is obviously:
Tricky 13: 5 builders
Tricky 16
1 Basher, and however many bombers are required when using the miner. You can do it without the miner, using more bombers, so the miner isn't needed.
Tricky 13
Either clam or CC said there's a solution that uses only 5 builders - fewer than this is impossible. Since the level can be beaten with only builders, the result is obviously:
Tricky 19
If I'm not mistake, 1 climber, 1 builder, 1 basher, 1 miner, 1 digger. I suspect it's possible without any floaters, but I'll wait for someone else to confirm this.
Tricky 23
As far as I'm aware, there's no solution that doesn't use all three destruction skills, the builder, and one climber... >_>
(By the way, I just noticed that this and Tricky 19 have the same skill set!)
Tricky 23: 1 Climber, 1 Builder, 1 Basher, 1 Miner, 1 Digger
Tricky 26
If I remember correctly, there's an over-the-top solution which shouldn't need bashers (you'd only need to create holes in the bridge maybe, and a miner or digger can do that). You can do it without builders by bashing right next to the post, then making the next lemming mine then immediately bash when he's just about to turn around.
Tricky 26: None
Make a pass-through blocker, build one bridge-length before the pillar, mine when you reach it, make the miner build on the other side if necessary. Once all lemmings are facing right, there will still be lemmings falling from the trapdoor; make one dig then build to release the blocker.
Make a pass-through blocker, bash the pillar, release the blocker as before except (obviously) you bash rather than build to stop the digger.
Also, about ditching the basher on Tricky 16 - I think I know what you're thinking of, and trust me, I've done that idea to death. It doesn't seem to be possible.
Tricky 19: 1 climber, 1 builder, 1 basher. Obviously it can't be done with these skills alone, but these are the only skills common to all the solutions.
Tricky 24
As far as I can tell, at least one blocker is needed for crowd control. You also need two builders to reach the exit.
Tricky 24: 1 Blocker, 2 Builders
Tricky 28
It can be done with only builders, so all other skills are non-essential. It seems the minimum amount of builders you can do it with is 2, so...
Tricky 28: 2 Builders
...couldn't you mine it? And then seperately avoid the climber by going underneath it?
Tricky 23
EDIT: Or maybe not. It can be done without the miner. Thanks Proxima.
Tricky 23: 1 Climber, 1 Builder, 1 Basher, 1 Digger
QuoteFun 23: Possibly builders and/or bashers?I think it might be possible to eliminate each (in separate solutions) using multiple Tame 20's
Let's take a quick step back to Fun 15, which can be done with 4 builders (plus other skills). (zip file includes Lemmix replay and a screenshot of the final result)With a bit of lateral (or is that vertical?) thinking, this level can be done with just 2 builders. And with 100% saved 8-)
[edit: forgot to add screenshot to zip file, fixed now]
Fun 16 can be done with 5 builders, replay attached.Expertly done. I must say, I'm impressed :thumbsup:
EDIT: Tricky 27: 2 builders. All other skills can be avoided.
The key is to bash through the four spikes so that the lemmings don't waste precious time climbing up and down each one of them. This allows the blocker to be freed a tad earlier. If you assign your 20 climbers in rapid succession and then nuke right before the 33rd lemming comes out, the last climber will reach the exit just before he explodes.
Use various steel destruction glitches to dramatically lower the right edge of the steel block you land on from the trapdoor.
Tricky
8: 10 builders
TrickyAnother overlooked one. It's 9 builders. You definitely don't need a replay for this. ;)
8: 10 builders
Ah - you've missed something too. It might take a replay to convince you that it's possible with just 8 builders
I'll suggest a starting point of 8 builders for Tricky 14, just so we can get a total there (which I will add in shortly).
My question now is: Can you, by placing them with perfect timing, make a basher free a blocker but still turn around on him (by placing the blocker in the mid-bash higher area, the part that you put new bashers in for the trick used to beat Fun 12/14 with bashers only)?
yea I bow out of all challenges like this in the future; these glitches are getting too advanced for me to follow
No chance.
Blockers and bombers (2 of each) for the first wall and for the other I dug the left side of the column, bashed the exit floor, turned round and built a rescue bridge (I've somehow created a gap between the stair and the exit platform. At the start I've decided to create a safety bridge on the right to stop the lemmings falling)
Taxing 1, 6 builders is obvious. Is a basher also nessecary or can it be done without bashers?
[On Taxing 5] 4 is out of the question.
Taxing 4, a normal solution can be done with either miners, or diggers and bashers, to get the two sides together, and apart from that, only builders are needed. So, what's the fewest amount of builders it can be done with? It seems to be... 3, by using almost every other skill, and TONS of glitch abuse (starts with blockers pushing lemmings into walls, then there's steel glitches, lemmings walking through blockers by coming up under a blocker on an edge, and concludes with a good old slide straight up to the exit).
Crazy 1: 1 blocker
Crazy 2: 1 climber, 3 builders, 1 digger
Crazy 3: 2 bombers
Crazy 4: 6 builders
Crazy 5: 7 builders
Crazy 6: 1 climber, 2 diggers, 5 builders
Crazy 7: 1 climber, 1 floater, 3 builders, 1 basher
Crazy 11: 1 builder
Crazy 17 is confusing me. The minimum skills thread says 8, which surely must mean the ceiling route? (I know the ceiling route is possible on Mac, but the time factor made me think it might not convert to DOS.) But if so, why isn't it 7?
If you dig right next to the right wall at the start (ie. at the pixel immediately before the lemming starts to turn left), you can dig through multiple levels, and then start bashing right through the wall without the basher falling.
So you need 2 skills to get through the first wall, 1 to get past the barrel, 2 to build to the brickwork above water, 1 to bash through it and 1 to dig (otherwise the fall is fatal), and finally 1 to release the crowd.
- The 8-skill solution uses only two of the three diggers.
Therefore the final list comes down to 3 builders, 2 bashers, and 2 diggers.
You definitely don't need the basher because the low save requirement allows you to ignore the top right entrance completely. Also, using the same logic, you can ignore the top left entrance and remove the need for the bombers.
So we're now down to just the 6 builders.
I wonder, with things such as new glitches being found (not often) or new backroutes) will these results ever be certain to be final?
Havoc 12 works with 9 builders. ccexplore posted a solution in this post.
http://www.lemmingsforums.com/index.php?topic=98.msg1613#msg1613
Wicked 9 works so far with 1 blocker but I'm sobbing by the fact it can't be done without the floater. I also did it with 9 builders.
I'm getting annoyed with Havoc 13. I tried to take the higher route to avoid the basher but when I'm at the top I get stuck :XD: in the middle of the second bridge and can't get out.
And for Hail 3 (I like this level because the skills are so generous) I did 11 builders with 14 bashers (Sorry about the 14 bashers, I'm sure I can do better than that, that was on my first attempt )
For Havoc 15: 7 builders, 1 blocker, 1 basher and1 digger.
Havoc 16 essentials so far are 5 builders and 1 blocker. Does this level work with the sliding glitch?
What? The no digger Wild 10 makes even less sense to me than the builder only wild 3. At least the latter I can kind of see how to conceptualise.
I give up at Lemmings challenges, I'm going to stick to my bare-bones knowledge of the Lemmings engine and use my weird mind-set to make challenging levels and play from now on.
[On Taxing 5] 4 is out of the question.
Not if you use the right glitch. See attached (screenshot included).
The real question now is whether 3 builders is possible. The main issue is the relative lack of bombers and blockers I think, but you might just barely have enough, I'm not sure. I'll leave that for another time/someone else to try.
19: 4 builders, 3 bashers, 1 miner, 1 digger
[on Taxing 5] 4 is out of the question.
Not if you use the right glitch. See attached (screenshot included).
The real question now is whether 3 builders is possible. The main issue is the relative lack of bombers and blockers I think, but you might just barely have enough, I'm not sure. I'll leave that for another time/someone else to try.
Looks like it's "another time" then. Here's a 3-builder solution for Taxing 5.
5: Possible with no builders, which I long thought was impossible but just achieved today. (Personally, I wouldn't recommend trying this one - once you've got the general strategy, the rest is a total crapshoot, and seriously unfun.)
You forgot to update the first 8 Havoc levels I've posted. Anyway, I'll do Frost.
Havoc 8 is possible with one less builder. That leaves 1 climber, 4 builders, 4 miners and 1 digger.
9: 14 climbers, 5 builders, 3 miners
[Havoc 8] Possible with either 3 miners or without the digger.
Wicked 13: We know the level can be done with builders only, so the question is what is the fewest number of builders possible? Right now I've got it down to 8 builders, but I certainly wouldn't rule out seven.
Taxing 14: 18 builders
I can do Mayhem 22 with 6 builders (all other skills are not necessary, including the basher). If the first chandelier was one pixel closer, I would have been able to reduce it to five.
Here are the Xmas demo levels:
Xmas 91 for both levels: 3 builders
Xmas 92
1: 1 basher
2: None
3: 10 builders, 1 floater
4: 1 climber, 9 builders, 3 diggers.
Anyway here's what I have for Flurry:
8: 5 builders, 1 basher
10: 4 builders*
13: 2 builders
14: 1 builder
15: 5 builders
16: 2 floaters, 2 bombers, 2 blockers, 3 builders, 1 basher.*
Rest: none
I don't have access to Flurry, so I can't verify, but according to this thread, you can beat that level [Flurry 15] with one skill.
Meanwhile, I've got Mayhem 17 down as 1 builder. This is the first time i've ever managed to pull off the sliding trick.
Did you do this on my dirt version?
Wicked 11:
[...]
The minimum number of builders I've managed is 3. I highly doubt this is beatable.
Also, I haven't tested it yet, but Wicked 15 almost certainly comes down to a floater and several builders, although I'm not sure exactly how many...
6 builders. And that's the last of Wicked and ONML. I'll hold off on posting a total score for ONML until I've checked through again, since I noticed that some of the Wicked scores in particular are beatable. For now, I'll mention 19 (5 builders, 2 bashers) and 20 (1 builder only).
Wicked 11:
[...]
The minimum number of builders I've managed is 3. I highly doubt this is beatable.
You need 3 builders to cross two builder-sized gaps? I don't buy that for a second.
Here's a replay with 2 builders.
Here are the first 9 levels of Blitz:
1: 1 climber, 1 floater, 1 blocker, 8 builders, 1 basher, 1 digger
Taxing 23 and 24 can be taken straight from the minimum skills topic, since both of those only give you builders...
Mayhem 13 can be done with 1 builder. I've tried for ages to find a no-builder solution, but it just isn't working for me due to a lack of diggers. You can also beat this level without using any climbers, floaters or bashers.
25: 3 builders, thanks to my patented "slingshot" technique (at least that's what I call it :))Hmm.. that's a really good trick. I wonder if it can be used to reduce the number of builders I use on Mayhem 23.
You're saying it can be done with builders only? I'm sure someone would have found it by now if it was possible.
Hmm.. that's a really good trick. I wonder if it can be used to reduce the number of builders I use on Mayhem 23.
Edit: IT WORKED!!
So Mayhem 23 is now reduced to 4 builders & 1 basher.
Wicked 10 <snip>The floaters can be avoided completely using a backroute. This backroute also only requires eight builders, which I doubt can be improved on.<snip>
steel-canceling
EDIT: Even better - just 2.
[Mayhem] 10: 10 builders, 1 floater.
[Mayhem] 9: 7 builders, 5 bashers
[Mayhem] 10: 10 builders, 1 floater.
I've reduced the number of builders to 6, so at the moment, it's 6 Builders & 1 Floater.
[Mayhem] 9: 7 builders, 5 bashers
I've got the minimum number of bashers down to 2. Now to see if any improvements are possible on the builders...
EDIT: Yes! Minimum builders is now down to 5, glitch-free. So for Mayhem 9 we now have 5 builders & 2 bashers.
Xmas 92
1: 1 basher
2: None
3: 10 builders, 1 floater
4: 1 climber, 9 builders, 3 diggers.
Four builders are needed at the start to reach the top of the steel. Four more are needed to navigate the two sets of hanging vines between the steel walls, and the last is used to free the crowd. The exit is reached via direct drop.I'm also not going to rule out the possibility of getting it down to 8 builders by using the release rate as a means of crowd control. It would get really hairy, though, and I'm not sure I'd have the patience for it.
Your solution reads so much like the ceiling route for that level I know for the min-skill thread (ie. everything you said in spoilers match that solution, at least from what I remember), I'm going to have to take a look later tonight and see if/how it differs. Might just be a level where no one at the time cared to improve because it seemed tedious?
What I did towards the end with the crowd on the right: the blocker is set to temporarily "disable" portions of the exit, allowing another lemming to mine without exiting, yet still leaves exit- triggering terrain (after freeing the blocker of course) on the path he creates for the left crowd.--------
Just goes to show, the old challenge threads are still very much alive, and it's good to see challenges in general are active again .
I found a 3-builder solution to Crazy 8. I've tried various ways of saving another builder, and also the basher,but no success on those so far.
I'll be the first to admit you're the star of the Lemmings 1 and ONML challenge threads here, no questions about it.
I revisited Mayhem 18 (previous result: 8 builders), and found a solution using only 6 builders. This is definitely a must-see, and like Wild 17 no-bashers it only barely works with the available skills and % requirement.
It is possible to gain a walkable height of 9 pixels via the following skills: basher, bomber, miner, climber, bomber. Use this in two places, and then for each place, make up for rest of needed height via other means.
Some preliminary testing also suggests that no-builder might be plausible
Fun 28 improved to 4 builders. Sadly, 100% doesn't seem likely, since the key builder-saving move involves using a basher or miner on a bridge in progress, and either way it looks like that lemming is toast (literally ) due to the lava below.
It is possible, with better timing, to make the miner glitch-cross the gap into the pillar, but that leaves a gap in the bridge, which presents its own problems. But still, that's probably the only hope of 100% here.
Tricky
18: 1 bomber, 1 digger
The first lemming builds as soon as he lands, and the second climbs and builds up ahead, such that he lands on the platform above the right exit. Meanwhile the third and fourth lemmings build such that they reach the post on the right, but don't turn around. Three lemmings will reach the post before the bridge is done, so they all climb up. If the rightmost bridge is placed properly, none of the climbers will fall short of the platform above the exit. One final blocker turns everyone around by the exit.
So, nine years after we agreed on the necessary skills for Tricky 19, and three years after we thought the entire topic was finished, Nessy points out (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPvb2nJxteM) that it can be done without the digger.
So, nine years after we agreed on the necessary skills for Tricky 19, and three years after we thought the entire topic was finished, Nessy points out (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPvb2nJxteM) that it can be done without the digger.
So, nine years after we agreed on the necessary skills for Tricky 19, and three years after we thought the entire topic was finished, Nessy points out (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPvb2nJxteM) that it can be done without the digger.
Nice one! I just solved it without watching the video. I'm truly shocked nobody found this one earlier, especially since I had experimented with a similar solution for the "Under 1 minute" thread.
Tricky 19 "Stilt Walkers" - 4 turners, 2 builders
Taxing 11 "Chaos Maze" - 3 turners, 1 digger, 1 climber
[Stilt Walkers] Reduced to 2 turners, 1 builder
But wait a minute... your two-turner solution saves 57 lemmings. The record at the time of posting is 56. That is a new record!
Taxing 15 "Birthday Cake" - 1 climber (click to show/hide)
Taxing 16 "The Arena" - 1 turner, 1 bomber, 1 builder maybe? (I didn't solve this - but the record is lose-2, and I'm pretty sure this level can't be done without the turner and builder, meaning 1 bomber?)
Taxing 16 "The Arena" - 1 turner, 1 bomber, 1 builder maybe? (I didn't solve this - but the record is lose-2, and I'm pretty sure this level can't be done without the turner and builder, meaning 1 bomber?)
So namida. Is this your confirmed result so far for this level, or have you not solved it at all yet?
Mayhem 15 "Hole in One, Two, Three!" - 4 builders, 3 bashers, 1 digger (click to show/hide)
Tricky 7 "Follow The Yellow Brick Road": 6 turners, 4 builders, 1 basher, 1 digger
[L3D] Mayhem 16 "Fun Fair" - 1 blocker, 5 turners, 4 builders, 1 miner, 1 digger, 6 climbers