Lemmings Challenges

[ccexplore]

and then since you can't change the RR while pausing in the Genesis version, it looks like you really do need 3 diggers there.

I'm wrong.  Although you still can't change the RR while pausing in the Genesis version, I found that if you pause the game at the earliest moment allowed, then unpause and raise RR immediately, you can raise the RR high enough to allow a 2-digger solution.

It's still the case though that the Genesis version's digger seem to be subtlely different from the Mac version in behavior.  I don't know for sure yet whether the DOS version is one of the two behaviors or a distinct third.

[ccexplore]

I don't know for sure yet whether the DOS version is one of the two behaviors or a distinct third.

Looks like a distinct third.  Neither solution works on the DOS version.

[guest]

I'm wrong.  Although you still can't change the RR while pausing in the Genesis version, I found that if you pause the game at the earliest moment allowed, then unpause and raise RR immediately, you can raise the RR high enough to allow a 2-digger solution.

Good job. I gave up after a while because I couldn't seem to pause it early enough....

Well, I did Lemmings' Ark without the basher in the remake for Cheapo by Isu (StyleTrial I - level 30); in fact, I found this backdoor before I found the intended solution.
Due to some sketching I noticed that it is also possible for the Genesis, but there you have to be precise by one pixel, for Cheapo there were two pixels working.

I should modify the challenge: no mice. (you can't use a mouse)

[LemSteven]

Oooo...On the genesis it is possible to do any of the "We All Fall Down" levels with only 3 diggers. Take that as a challenge.

Wow!  That supercedes my previous challenge at the beginning of this thread, wich allows 1/4 of the diggers given, by a lot!  Good job!  

I've also got another builder challenge:

Havoc 19:  Complete the level using only 3(!) builders.

This requires lots of precision, but it's not as bad as the 9-builder solution to Wicked 13.  Also, most of the precision comes at the very beginning of the level.  No-builder crowd control is required, and this is difficult to execute because you only have a small area to work with.  This is glitch-free, btw.

Here's a small hint:  Stay in the top 1/3 of the level.

[ccexplore]

I should modify the challenge: no mice. (you can't use a mouse)

Um, that doesn't really make sense for either the Genesis or Cheapo version.  Clarify?

[guest]

Um, that doesn't really make sense for either the Genesis or Cheapo version.  Clarify?

I meant you can only do the challenge on the Genesis.

[ccexplore]

Oooo...On the genesis it is possible to do any of the "We All Fall Down" levels with only 3 diggers.

A quick update for two other versions I've tried:

SNES:  3 diggers is possible.  As for 2 diggers, not even close, the RR don't go up fast enough

Amiga:  3 diggers is possible.  But intriguingly, as for 2 diggers, it is close but not quite, I think the RR needs to be just slightly higher.  If the second lemming is 1 pixel closer to the first lemming, I think 2 diggers would've been possible on the Amiga, but I have no luck achieving it, so maybe 2 diggers is impossible on the Amiga.

So it looks like the PC/DOS version stands unique in that the solution fundamentally doesn't work.

Aside:  the reason the 2-/3-digger solution works is also the reason why guest's 47/50 solution for Wild 15 will fail on the Amiga and Mac versions of ONML.

[Deathman48]

Could you PM me how you do that? Maybe because my brain is worn out but I can't see how you can do it with only diggers and nothing to stop them from going right through, and even at 99 RR I can't see how to do it.

Also, you've been grinding down the amount of Lemmings you can lose throughout Lemmings and ONML (I think) and then saying to pass levels with only a few skills. Maybe as another challenge you could try to see how fast you can complete each level/difficulty in those games? Just a thought, don't kill me if you've thought of it before. ^^

[ccexplore]

Sure, I can PM you about the We All Fall Down solutions.

It's true that I haven't focused much on minimizing time.  I still haven't even tried LemSteven's challenge of saving 100% in under 2 minutes for "And then There were Four".  I'll try to do more in the future, although it's only really interesting if it requires doing the level in ways not usually considered.  That is, there needs to be something more than merely figuring out how early you can release the crowd.

[Deathman48]

Well I was just thinking that the fastest time is not always going to be the way that saves the most Lemmings, plus there's a fair few glitches around that can be expoited, even though I don't know most of them. =P

Take Fun 2 for example, the fastest time you could do that in would be to make the first Lemming a floater and let the rest die, that way you would still pass the level and in a much faster time than you can saving all 10 Lemmings. Of course that's a simple example and even that can be refined by cranking up the RR and making the first Lemming a floater right at the bottom of the fall, but it's just to illustrate my point.

[Proxima]

The RR shouldn't affect the first lemming in the slightest.

[Deathman48]

No it shouldn't and doesn't, but if you don't raise the release rate and leave it at 50 then the first Lemming makes it home before the rest of the Lemmings are killed so even though you've saved enough Lemmings to pass the level, it still isn't over. If you raise the RR from the start up to about 80 or so, the last 9 Lemmings will all die before the first Lemming makes it to the exit.

[ccexplore]

Doesn't it count to press ESC after the first lemming exits?

[ccexplore]

new challenge:  pass Havoc 5 without builders

I would argue this is glitch-free, or at most borderline glitchy.  Actually, switching the order of 2 moves will make it completely glitch free, if it still works with the order switched (probably does, but I find it easier with my order).

[Nxau]

How you do this?


thanks